MTG Salvation

I have yet to get one.
But if I have it, it will mostly be used to get Wurmcoil Engine.
It's basically a way to keep 6 power in play through a lot of removal.

Quote from Zygous »

How has the Protean Hulk unban been treating everyone?

I still have yet to see one in a game.

I started playing it. I've seen a few games with it under other people's control. Basically replaced Boonweaver Giant, and it is an instant-win just as Boonweaver was.

I like it. Hasn't damaged the format in any way.

I've had games so far where I had a Karmic Guide on hand and a Hulk in the grave and I still opted for other targets. Hulk is solid value but in most decks he really just isn't as game breaking as people feared, while competitive decks got a new (and improved) toy but those aren't the decks the banlist is designed for anyway.

So what's the deal with Ad Nauseum?

It always wins the game on the spot. No casual decks play it, unless they have Phyrexian Unlife (or similar) as part of their combo. Was with competitive players last night. If someone ramps and plays it on turn 2, they win.

Doomsday is similar, but they need to draw into the pile.

I just don't see a situation where it is used "fairly". It always wins the game when it is cast.

It's not ubiquitous enough to be banned, but it seems like Yawgmoth's Bargain. Why should it be in the format?

Quote from Dunharrow »

So what's the deal with Ad Nauseum?

It always wins the game on the spot. No casual decks play it, unless they have Phyrexian Unlife (or similar) as part of their combo. Was with competitive players last night. If someone ramps and plays it on turn 2, they win.

I run it in Toshiro Umezawa, where it's generally "5 mana, draw 5-7 cards and lose a bunch of life at instant speed". Then I swap life totals with someone and flash it back.

I totally run it as just a draw spell and not a "draw a third of my deck at EOT, untap, and win". Any deck with a reasonable curve and normal-chunky mana base can use it as an instant speed draw a few cards.

I ran it it Cao Ren but it was too dangerous. It's a deck that leverages life loss by using mirror of fate effects to swap life totals, letting you generate absurd value while ******* one player in particular. There are too many high CMC cards in it that it's too risky to keep revealing when you get low on life, but not yet low enough to kill someone with it. Necrologia was much safer as a 5 mana draw spell, Minion of the wastes was better as a way to reliably lower you life total, and necropotence was best at both.

Quote from Dunharrow »

So what's the deal with Ad Nauseum?

It always wins the game on the spot. No casual decks play it, unless they have Phyrexian Unlife (or similar) as part of their combo. Was with competitive players last night. If someone ramps and plays it on turn 2, they win.

Doomsday is similar, but they need to draw into the pile.

I just don't see a situation where it is used "fairly". It always wins the game when it is cast.

It's not ubiquitous enough to be banned, but it seems like Yawgmoth's Bargain. Why should it be in the format?

You are describing specific decks that cards are not banned around

Quote from Taleran »

Quote from Dunharrow »

So what's the deal with Ad Nauseum?

It always wins the game on the spot. No casual decks play it, unless they have Phyrexian Unlife (or similar) as part of their combo. Was with competitive players last night. If someone ramps and plays it on turn 2, they win.

Doomsday is similar, but they need to draw into the pile.

I just don't see a situation where it is used "fairly". It always wins the game when it is cast.

It's not ubiquitous enough to be banned, but it seems like Yawgmoth's Bargain. Why should it be in the format?

You are describing specific decks that cards are not banned around

I have only ever seen it cast to draw an entire deck and win the game. I have never seen it played by non-competitive players.

The examples above are interesting. Happy to hear people are using it in other ways.

Quote from Dunharrow »

Quote from Taleran »

Quote from Dunharrow »

So what's the deal with Ad Nauseum?

It always wins the game on the spot. No casual decks play it, unless they have Phyrexian Unlife (or similar) as part of their combo. Was with competitive players last night. If someone ramps and plays it on turn 2, they win.

Doomsday is similar, but they need to draw into the pile.

I just don't see a situation where it is used "fairly". It always wins the game when it is cast.

It's not ubiquitous enough to be banned, but it seems like Yawgmoth's Bargain. Why should it be in the format?

You are describing specific decks that cards are not banned around

I have only ever seen it cast to draw an entire deck and win the game. I have never seen it played by non-competitive players.

The examples above are interesting. Happy to hear people are using it in other ways.

Bolded why it isn't banned or a problem for the RC.

I also run it in a few decks that either have life gain as a central or sub-theme. As others have said, it can draw a good chunk of cards for 5 cmc and some life.

Quote from Lithl »

Of the times I've personally seen Hulk's trigger put on the stack, there has been one time it hasn't ended the game on the spot. And that was because there was an It That Betrays in play.

How many times have you seen it? What are people doing with it? Would you consider it a combo-heavy meta?

I haven't even seen hulk except for my deck that's played it for years.

The RC had some extensive discussions internally, and with WotC, about the future of the format. We've got pretty good consensus on what we're trying to achieve, but have established some additional process for calibrating and communicating our opinions of individual cards and general mechanics.

Sheldon and/or Papa Funk, is there anything additional you can say about this publicly? This part of the announcement is ripe for misinterpretation and wild speculation.

I'm actually unclear about what misinterpretation or speculation it might cause. We've opened new lines of communication with our friends in R&D and will continue to consult with them regarding the format.

Wait there's a new banlist update? Where is it?

Quote from Schreckstoff »

Quote from Sheldon »

I'm actually unclear about what misinterpretation or speculation it might cause. We've opened new lines of communication with our friends in R&D and will continue to consult with them regarding the format.

Saw people on reddit think there's been conflict on eminence or that wiards is going to take over and similar.

Okay, that's really straining the logic there. Gavin simply took extra words to say that we're working even more closely with the folks in R&D than we ever have.

Quote from Sheldon »

Okay, that's really straining the logic there. Gavin simply took extra words to say that we're working even more closely with the folks in R&D than we ever have.

Is it possible that means that their design team plans to break our format a little less? Nobody likes new cards that have to be banned immediately after all (stares at G Brand).

Quote from ISBPathfinder »

Is it possible that means that their design team plans to break our format a little less? Nobody likes new cards that have to be banned immediately after all (stares at G Brand).

While your point has some validity, it's worth noting that Griselbrand is 5 1/2 years old now.

Quote from papa_funk »

While your point has some validity, it's worth noting that Griselbrand is 5 1/2 years old now.

Yea I guess time flies... I guess Leovold, Emissary of Trest would have made a better example.

Still, I think its still healthier if we can get more cards that open new avenues of play rather than products that just power creep the existing options (Prossh).

More Mathas less Breya.

It's also worth noting that Griselbrand and Leovold both see extensive legacy play (debatable whether that's a good thing, but not for this thread) and that a creature being legendary doesn't mean it's solely targeting EDH.

Will the annual MTGSalvation Dream banlist poll be returning this year?

Longest-Banned-List-Ever

I was hoping for 1000 cards.