It doesn't change the fact that it is no more "I win" than any other two card combo. Kiki-mite? Curiosity + Niv-Mizzet? Hermit Druid + Deck?
Yes, this is obviously the point Fponkdamn was making. There are just more efficient two-card combos. At least this one comes late enough in the game to be responded to and prevented.
Plus, every argument Sinfire made about T&N into Iona+Painter applies to Kiki+Pestermite. I suppose Kiki-mite still lets you respond with spot removal, but it's also a combo where the pieces are much cheaper and better on their own. If there is a problem card here, it's T&N rather than Painter's Servant (though I don't think either card is banworthy).
I'm just curious. The obvious answer is because of the Grindstone combo, but why not ban Grindstone instead? Servant has some interesting combos besides that, whereas Grindstone does one thing.
Iona, Shield of Emeria is also an issue. It became obvious that the problem card was going to continue to be the servant. So instead of making a longer list and banning everything that the servant was broken with they just banned the servant as it was the one enabling a few other cards and they probably assumed that in the future they would hit more cards yet.
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It does not make infinite but it can continuously cycle them if you have an ETB trigger or something that would operate with them.
But yes you can exile everything else with her. There is no infinite tokens though.
How doesn't it? You name black have and have any creature die, you then get 3 white black tokens, which you can sacrifice to exile something, triggering the second ability 3 times netting you 9 tokens. So you can exile every creature you want to, then start exiling your own tokens so you would lose 4 tokens and gain 9 I don't see how that isn't infinite as long as there is one creature you can make die and one creature to exile.
How doesn't it? You name black have and have any creature die, you then get 3 white black tokens, which you can sacrifice to exile something, triggering the second ability 3 times netting you 9 tokens. So you can exile every creature you want to, then start exiling your own tokens so you would lose 4 tokens and gain 9 I don't see how that isn't infinite as long as there is one creature you can make die and one creature to exile.
Teysa removes a creature from the game it does not destroy it so the creature wont go to the graveyard to trigger Teysa's second effect.
If you want to ban powerful cards, why not Islands? They have been proven to be fairly unfair in most cases.
The worst turn 1 play you can face down is Draw, play basic Island and say, "go"
How doesn't it? You name black have and have any creature die, you then get 3 white black tokens, which you can sacrifice to exile something, triggering the second ability 3 times netting you 9 tokens. So you can exile every creature you want to, then start exiling your own tokens so you would lose 4 tokens and gain 9 I don't see how that isn't infinite as long as there is one creature you can make die and one creature to exile.
Woah, woah woah, where are you getting your numbers from? Yes, Teysa will trigger 3 times, but she only makes a single new creature when each trigger is resolved. If you sac 3 creatures to exile something, you will only get 3 new creatures to replace them, not 9 new tokens! You do not get infinite creatures.
Honestly, I don't think the interactions with Teysa are all that bad. You can already do perform all the degenerate combos with Darkest Hour, and black has a ton of tutors. As for exiling all the creatures, I don't see much problem with this. It doesn't win you the game and it requires you to keep 5x creatures on the board just to pull it off, plus the effect isn't much worse than any wrath effect.
I think it's pretty clear, in general, why Painter's Servant is banned. It is part of a couple degenerate 2-card combos, one of which is colorless and notorious in eternal formats. The real question is "which combo pieces do we ban?"
In my opinion, Iona and Grindstone are the problem cards, rather than Painter's Servant, but that's not exactly the RC's opinion on the matter.
Woah, woah woah, where are you getting your numbers from? Yes, Teysa will trigger 3 times, but she only makes a single new creature when each trigger is resolved. If you sac 3 creatures to exile something, you will only get 3 new creatures to replace them, not 9 new tokens! You do not get infinite creatures.
Honestly, I don't think the interactions with Teysa are all that bad. You can already do perform all the degenerate combos with Darkest Hour, and black has a ton of tutors. As for exiling all the creatures, I don't see much problem with this. It doesn't win you the game and it requires you to keep 5x creatures on the board just to pull it off, plus the effect isn't much worse than any wrath effect.
I think it's pretty clear, in general, why Painter's Servant is banned. It is part of a couple degenerate 2-card combos, one of which is colorless and notorious in eternal formats. The real question is "which combo pieces do we ban?"
In my opinion, Iona and Grindstone are the problem cards, rather than Painter's Servant, but that's not exactly the RC's opinion on the matter.
well some how when I read teysa, I got put 3 tokens into play not one......so reading ftw.
The problem with Painter's Servant is that while yes, it's an interesting card, it's the kind of card that will have interactions with cards from sets that haven't even been printed yet. Any time any card gets printed that mentions a specific color, the RC would have to look at that card and say "Would PS make this card so broken that we need to ban it?". The RC's view on the banlist - which some people agree with, and some people don't - is that shorter is better. So, instead of banning 2 cards right now (Iona and Grindstone), along with a countless number of cards in the future, they decided instead to deal with that problem by taking out Servant instead.
I think it's pretty clear, in general, why Painter's Servant is banned. It is part of a couple degenerate 2-card combos, one of which is colorless and notorious in eternal formats. The real question is "which combo pieces do we ban?"
But isn't the same true of recently-unbanned Worldgorger Dragon, except the colorless part?
It's really probably not too problematic, and is a decent candidate for coming off of the ban list.
Yes, it's part of a two-card combo that can kill one player per turn. However, so is Leyline of the Void and Helm of Obedience, and no one is clamoring about either of those cards being banned. Plus, with the prevalence of Eldrazi titans, it doesn't even guarantee a kill on your target.
You sac 3 creatures to get 3 tokens. You're running a net 0 on tokens.
Edit: Majorly nath'd.
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Counter spells stop everything. It's the condom Trojan dreams of making. But like condoms, if you don't have one, you still keep on playing and take the risk. Most of us wouldn't be here if this wasn't a fact.
The problem with Painter's Servant is that while yes, it's an interesting card, it's the kind of card that will have interactions with cards from sets that haven't even been printed yet. Any time any card gets printed that mentions a specific color, the RC would have to look at that card and say "Would PS make this card so broken that we need to ban it?". The RC's view on the banlist - which some people agree with, and some people don't - is that shorter is better. So, instead of banning 2 cards right now (Iona and Grindstone), along with a countless number of cards in the future, they decided instead to deal with that problem by taking out Servant instead.
Do we really need to ban Iona and Grindstone if Painter is unbanned? Iona is very expensive and no better than Eryo + Arcane Lab, except she costs far more to cast, requires another creature in play, and that creature is also an artifact... As for Grindstone, it's far less broken than Helm+Line as any Eldrazi counters it and once again it's dependant on two artifacts, one of which is a creature. Not to mention Worldgorger Dragon and Hermit Druid are vastly stronger.
Really I don't get the ban on Painter, it's a two card combo that isn't exactly better than other similar combos and is out classed by other combos in the format. Banning cards for fear of future cards is amazingly silly, it's better to keep things unbanned and reassess things later on, especially with the niche case of cards that care about card colours, than it is to ban cards early on.
I think Painter was well banned early on, but now that the format has progressed it's time to take the little fellow off of the ban list as he doesn't create degenerate combos in the format but he does allow for certain decks to emerge...
Ah I thought it made a whole bunch of tokens since people try and combo it with Darkest Hour which shuts off her first ability and I couldn't remember what the combo actually was.
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Do we really need to ban Iona and Grindstone if Painter is unbanned? Iona is very expensive and no better than Eryo + Arcane Lab, except she costs far more to cast, requires another creature in play, and that creature is also an artifact... As for Grindstone, it's far less broken than Helm+Line as any Eldrazi counters it and once again it's dependant on two artifacts, one of which is a creature. Not to mention Worldgorger Dragon and Hermit Druid are vastly stronger.
Really I don't get the ban on Painter, it's a two card combo that isn't exactly better than other similar combos and is out classed by other combos in the format. Banning cards for fear of future cards is amazingly silly, it's better to keep things unbanned and reassess things later on, especially with the niche case of cards that care about card colours, than it is to ban cards early on.
I think Painter was well banned early on, but now that the format has progressed it's time to take the little fellow off of the ban list as he doesn't create degenerate combos in the format but he does allow for certain decks to emerge...
I sort of think Iona + Servant would really hurt the casual gamers because it is a fairly obvious combo. The RC does not like really really obvious shutouts and that one is sort of blaring. The second it is set up the game is over essentially. I dont know if I can think of a total lockout combo that is easier to assemble than that and the fact that Iona could be a commander makes it a bit worse.
I think the key comes down to how easily identifiable the combo is for new players. Obscure and difficult to assemble or set up combos are less likely to happen in more casual metas. Iona + Servant is one that I identified quite early in my own EDH play.
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I sort of think Iona + Servant would really hurt the casual gamers because it is a fairly obvious combo. The RC does not like really really obvious shutouts and that one is sort of blaring. The second it is set up the game is over essentially. I dont know if I can think of a total lockout combo that is easier to assemble than that and the fact that Iona could be a commander makes it a bit worse.
I think the key comes down to how easily identifiable the combo is for new players. Obscure and difficult to assemble or set up combos are less likely to happen in more casual metas. Iona + Servant is one that I identified quite early in my own EDH play.
So what though? Iona is still 9 mana, and most casual players highly under estimate the importance of mana ramp. More so, if she's an obvious combo that is so dangerous than casual players should be able to pick up on it early enough and stop it or hold back removal for one of the pieces so that they can avoid the lock out... Not to mention that it's only a lock out and not a game win, so anything like Oblivion Stone, N-Disk, and so forth also break the lock.
In other words, cool it's an obvious powerful combo that can introduce more casual players to some finer points of magic, it's higher level magic for dummies on all ends from holding removal to utilizing synergy. However, it's still a very cumbersome combo that's clunky unless it's very well tuned, at which point it's still better to play other combo builds. Why do we have to baby casual players, they're casual not stupid, and why do we have to hurt better players as a result of this who would enjoy using Painter for other things?
So what though? Iona is still 9 mana, and most casual players highly under estimate the importance of mana ramp. More so, if she's an obvious combo that is so dangerous than casual players should be able to pick up on it early enough and stop it or hold back removal for one of the pieces so that they can avoid the lock out... Not to mention that it's only a lock out and not a game win, so anything like Oblivion Stone, N-Disk, and so forth also break the lock.
In other words, cool it's an obvious powerful combo that can introduce more casual players to some finer points of magic, it's higher level magic for dummies on all ends from holding removal to utilizing synergy. However, it's still a very cumbersome combo that's clunky unless it's very well tuned, at which point it's still better to play other combo builds. Why do we have to baby casual players, they're casual not stupid, and why do we have to hurt better players as a result of this who would enjoy using Painter for other things?
I agree it isnt the most spectacular thing ever. In fact I wouldnt run here in any multiplayer decks anymore but when players are new they tend to run more mono colored decks from my own experience. Iona crushes the living crap out of mono colored decks and not every new player understands the importance of colorless answers like O Stone or Duplicant.
Realistically though I think they banned the Servant because it is a problematic ability that just will continue to be more problematic with every new set released as there can always be a new card to break him. Iona coming out just showed them that there were going to be plenty of additional cards to break the servant with. Nail in the coffin more than the reason for banning.
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Painter's Servant was banned for creating terribly unfun degenerate combos. The main combo, and the highlight of its banning - was the famous Grindstone combo. Oh look, I won.
While there are cool things you can do with it in decks like Teysa - Painter's Servant will never be unbanned for the simple reason that Iona, Shield of Emeria exists. It's not that this combo is overpowered or unbeatable (though you almost always automatically win once you cast Tooth and Nail for these two) - but that it is unfun. "Fun" is the reason for most of the RC's bannings. Painter's Servant will never be unbanned for this reason. While it does have fun applications (like Braids has applications with some sort of bizzare self-hate deck) ...most would agree the reason to run servant (or braids) is not for "fun" ...but because you can do really degenerate unfun things with it, and that is the first reason you run them.
If servant was unbanned, i'd run the grindstone combo in Hanna in seconds.
Servant is banned simply because it does unfun things. Now hurry up and ban Hermit Druid.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
I agree it isnt the most spectacular thing ever. In fact I wouldnt run here in any multiplayer decks anymore but when players are new they tend to run more mono colored decks from my own experience. Iona crushes the living crap out of mono colored decks and not every new player understands the importance of colorless answers like O Stone or Duplicant.
Realistically though I think they banned the Servant because it is a problematic ability that just will continue to be more problematic with every new set released as there can always be a new card to break him. Iona coming out just showed them that there were going to be plenty of additional cards to break the servant with. Nail in the coffin more than the reason for banning.
Again, so what? Shouldn't we teach new players this? I know casual players understand this fact, and in multiplayer Iona can only lock out one player so another player can always answer her if needed, such as a Painter going on the stack. Even blinking things works in all honesty, as long as you have a card that can remove things from play. There are so many answers, from counters to removal, even things like Nevermore... Even so, she can still lock a player out without Painter if mono coloured is so popular, at least Painter adds to the need to kill her meaning that another player would answer her as opposed to letting her keep a different player locked out. Hey, wait, that means Painter helps players keep from being locked out as Iona locking out one player that isn't you is generally a good thing, but her locking out you is bad, so you'll answer her when another can't due to her ability... Painter increases interactivity...
I just don't agree with that. The number of cards that care about colours and have strong enough abilities aren't common enough to justify such actions... Iona is an example of this, even though she's powerful she costs 9 mana to cast. By that logic we should ban Laboratory Maniac because we never know when another Leveler will be printed.
Sorry as far as the RC's banned list there are just going to be a lot of inconsistancies. What they consider to be "Unfun" for the format goes to the banned list whereas combos more degenerate or equally powerful will stay off of the list. They arent trying to ban everything out there. If it is a big unjustice to your deck you might bring it up to your meta and see if they will allow you to play with the card.
Believe me plenty of people have voiced opinions about inconsistancies in the ban list. This is probably the first time I have ever heard of anyone complaining that the servant is banned but if it bothers you you could bring it to your meta and see if they will let you play it. Sadly I dont think there is a big outcry for the servant to come off the list from commander players as a whole though so I wouldnt hold my breath for it to come off due to popular demand.
If it comes off the list it will be the way that worldgorger came off the list. Until then though sry bud its on the list.
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Painter's Servant was banned for creating terribly unfun degenerate combos. The main combo, and the highlight of its banning - was the famous Grindstone combo. Oh look, I won.
While there are cool things you can do with it in decks like Teysa - Painter's Servant will never be unbanned for the simple reason that Iona, Shield of Emeria exists. It's not that this combo is overpowered or unbeatable (though you almost always automatically win once you cast Tooth and Nail for these two) - but that it is unfun. "Fun" is the reason for most of the RC's bannings. Painter's Servant will never be unbanned for this reason. While it does have fun applications (like Braids has applications with some sort of bizzare self-hate deck) ...most would agree the reason to run servant (or braids) is not for "fun" ...but because you can do really degenerate unfun things with it, and that is the first reason you run them.
If servant was unbanned, i'd run the grindstone combo in Hanna in seconds.
Servant is banned simply because it does unfun things. Now hurry up and ban Hermit Druid.
But if this is the reasoning, why was Worldgorger Dragon unbanned? I think Painter's Servant has far more "fun" applications than Worldgorger.
But if this is the reasoning, why was Worldgorger Dragon unbanned? I think Painter's Servant has far more "fun" applications than Worldgorger.
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I don't actually agree with the unbanning of Worldgorger, however easy it can be to disrupt. Use more removal and the problem of Worldgorger pretty much goes away.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
Painter's Servant with Iona lock the board... You cannot play colorless spell because they gain the color. The only thing you can play for dealing with this lock was land... And Iona wasn't the only card, the circle of protection, Deathgrip, Lifeforce, Douse every hate color card and the crazy Grindstone was a amazing combo easy to tutor in BU. You can win in less than 4 turn without a godly hand. You have so many card that can be really amazing so i'm pretty sure it's for that they ban it.
And I think the big problem was you can cast spell isn't in your color. So it's can be problematic in a format where you have colors identities...
For Worldgorger Dragon... You have so many cards to destroy the board of someone who try to play Worldgorger Dragon combo.
If you counter the triggering ability of leaving the battlefield he lose everything and if you cast removal when the enter the battlefield ability was on the stack, the last triggering ability is resolve before the first and in result you lose all your permanents...
Yes, this is obviously the point Fponkdamn was making. There are just more efficient two-card combos. At least this one comes late enough in the game to be responded to and prevented.
Plus, every argument Sinfire made about T&N into Iona+Painter applies to Kiki+Pestermite. I suppose Kiki-mite still lets you respond with spot removal, but it's also a combo where the pieces are much cheaper and better on their own. If there is a problem card here, it's T&N rather than Painter's Servant (though I don't think either card is banworthy).
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It does not make infinite but it can continuously cycle them if you have an ETB trigger or something that would operate with them.
But yes you can exile everything else with her. There is no infinite tokens though.
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How doesn't it? You name black have and have any creature die, you then get 3 white black tokens, which you can sacrifice to exile something, triggering the second ability 3 times netting you 9 tokens. So you can exile every creature you want to, then start exiling your own tokens so you would lose 4 tokens and gain 9 I don't see how that isn't infinite as long as there is one creature you can make die and one creature to exile.
UWRasputin DreamweaverUW
UWBSen TripletsUWB
Teysa removes a creature from the game it does not destroy it so the creature wont go to the graveyard to trigger Teysa's second effect.
BaconoftheArk speaks the truth:
but the 3 you sacrifice do
UWRasputin DreamweaverUW
UWBSen TripletsUWB
Woah, woah woah, where are you getting your numbers from? Yes, Teysa will trigger 3 times, but she only makes a single new creature when each trigger is resolved. If you sac 3 creatures to exile something, you will only get 3 new creatures to replace them, not 9 new tokens! You do not get infinite creatures.
Honestly, I don't think the interactions with Teysa are all that bad. You can already do perform all the degenerate combos with Darkest Hour, and black has a ton of tutors. As for exiling all the creatures, I don't see much problem with this. It doesn't win you the game and it requires you to keep 5x creatures on the board just to pull it off, plus the effect isn't much worse than any wrath effect.
I think it's pretty clear, in general, why Painter's Servant is banned. It is part of a couple degenerate 2-card combos, one of which is colorless and notorious in eternal formats. The real question is "which combo pieces do we ban?"
In my opinion, Iona and Grindstone are the problem cards, rather than Painter's Servant, but that's not exactly the RC's opinion on the matter.
well some how when I read teysa, I got put 3 tokens into play not one......so reading ftw.
UWRasputin DreamweaverUW
UWBSen TripletsUWB
But isn't the same true of recently-unbanned Worldgorger Dragon, except the colorless part?
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Yes, it's part of a two-card combo that can kill one player per turn. However, so is Leyline of the Void and Helm of Obedience, and no one is clamoring about either of those cards being banned. Plus, with the prevalence of Eldrazi titans, it doesn't even guarantee a kill on your target.
Yes, it's really good with Iona - "no opponent can play spells ever again" good, even. But Iona is a monowhite general, meaning there are very few ways to search for the Servant (basically just Planar Portal, Citanul Flute, and Enlightened Tutor). Iona is also very expensive, making her a fairly poor choice. This is also not the only one card + general autowin/lockout combo, there's things like Azami, Lady of Scrolls + Mind over Matter, Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind + Curiosity/Ophidian Eye/Mind Over Matter, Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir + Knowledge Pool, etc.
Yes, it's pretty good with Teysa, Orzhov Scion. But it doesn't do anything for her that Darkest Hour doesn't. And Darkest Hour is marginally easier to search for (Idyllic Tutor + Academy Rector find it, and so does Enlightened Tutor. The only tutor that finds servant but not Hour that the deck might run would be Shred Memory.) And this is even a three card combo (Teysa, Servant, Free sac outlet that does something meaningful like Blasting Station) to do more than just a one-sided Final Judgment at will.
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You sac 3 creatures to get 3 tokens. You're running a net 0 on tokens.
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Do we really need to ban Iona and Grindstone if Painter is unbanned? Iona is very expensive and no better than Eryo + Arcane Lab, except she costs far more to cast, requires another creature in play, and that creature is also an artifact... As for Grindstone, it's far less broken than Helm+Line as any Eldrazi counters it and once again it's dependant on two artifacts, one of which is a creature. Not to mention Worldgorger Dragon and Hermit Druid are vastly stronger.
Really I don't get the ban on Painter, it's a two card combo that isn't exactly better than other similar combos and is out classed by other combos in the format. Banning cards for fear of future cards is amazingly silly, it's better to keep things unbanned and reassess things later on, especially with the niche case of cards that care about card colours, than it is to ban cards early on.
I think Painter was well banned early on, but now that the format has progressed it's time to take the little fellow off of the ban list as he doesn't create degenerate combos in the format but he does allow for certain decks to emerge...
I sort of think Iona + Servant would really hurt the casual gamers because it is a fairly obvious combo. The RC does not like really really obvious shutouts and that one is sort of blaring. The second it is set up the game is over essentially. I dont know if I can think of a total lockout combo that is easier to assemble than that and the fact that Iona could be a commander makes it a bit worse.
I think the key comes down to how easily identifiable the combo is for new players. Obscure and difficult to assemble or set up combos are less likely to happen in more casual metas. Iona + Servant is one that I identified quite early in my own EDH play.
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In other words, cool it's an obvious powerful combo that can introduce more casual players to some finer points of magic, it's higher level magic for dummies on all ends from holding removal to utilizing synergy. However, it's still a very cumbersome combo that's clunky unless it's very well tuned, at which point it's still better to play other combo builds. Why do we have to baby casual players, they're casual not stupid, and why do we have to hurt better players as a result of this who would enjoy using Painter for other things?
I agree it isnt the most spectacular thing ever. In fact I wouldnt run here in any multiplayer decks anymore but when players are new they tend to run more mono colored decks from my own experience. Iona crushes the living crap out of mono colored decks and not every new player understands the importance of colorless answers like O Stone or Duplicant.
Realistically though I think they banned the Servant because it is a problematic ability that just will continue to be more problematic with every new set released as there can always be a new card to break him. Iona coming out just showed them that there were going to be plenty of additional cards to break the servant with. Nail in the coffin more than the reason for banning.
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While there are cool things you can do with it in decks like Teysa - Painter's Servant will never be unbanned for the simple reason that Iona, Shield of Emeria exists. It's not that this combo is overpowered or unbeatable (though you almost always automatically win once you cast Tooth and Nail for these two) - but that it is unfun. "Fun" is the reason for most of the RC's bannings. Painter's Servant will never be unbanned for this reason. While it does have fun applications (like Braids has applications with some sort of bizzare self-hate deck) ...most would agree the reason to run servant (or braids) is not for "fun" ...but because you can do really degenerate unfun things with it, and that is the first reason you run them.
If servant was unbanned, i'd run the grindstone combo in Hanna in seconds.
Servant is banned simply because it does unfun things. Now hurry up and ban Hermit Druid.
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Again, so what? Shouldn't we teach new players this? I know casual players understand this fact, and in multiplayer Iona can only lock out one player so another player can always answer her if needed, such as a Painter going on the stack. Even blinking things works in all honesty, as long as you have a card that can remove things from play. There are so many answers, from counters to removal, even things like Nevermore... Even so, she can still lock a player out without Painter if mono coloured is so popular, at least Painter adds to the need to kill her meaning that another player would answer her as opposed to letting her keep a different player locked out. Hey, wait, that means Painter helps players keep from being locked out as Iona locking out one player that isn't you is generally a good thing, but her locking out you is bad, so you'll answer her when another can't due to her ability... Painter increases interactivity...
I just don't agree with that. The number of cards that care about colours and have strong enough abilities aren't common enough to justify such actions... Iona is an example of this, even though she's powerful she costs 9 mana to cast. By that logic we should ban Laboratory Maniac because we never know when another Leveler will be printed.
Believe me plenty of people have voiced opinions about inconsistancies in the ban list. This is probably the first time I have ever heard of anyone complaining that the servant is banned but if it bothers you you could bring it to your meta and see if they will let you play it. Sadly I dont think there is a big outcry for the servant to come off the list from commander players as a whole though so I wouldnt hold my breath for it to come off due to popular demand.
If it comes off the list it will be the way that worldgorger came off the list. Until then though sry bud its on the list.
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But if this is the reasoning, why was Worldgorger Dragon unbanned? I think Painter's Servant has far more "fun" applications than Worldgorger.
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I don't actually agree with the unbanning of Worldgorger, however easy it can be to disrupt. Use more removal and the problem of Worldgorger pretty much goes away.
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RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
And I think the big problem was you can cast spell isn't in your color. So it's can be problematic in a format where you have colors identities...
For Worldgorger Dragon... You have so many cards to destroy the board of someone who try to play Worldgorger Dragon combo.
If you counter the triggering ability of leaving the battlefield he lose everything and if you cast removal when the enter the battlefield ability was on the stack, the last triggering ability is resolve before the first and in result you lose all your permanents...
It's a risky combo!!!
WBGhost Council of OrzhovaBW
GUBThe MimeoplasmBUG
RGWort, the RaidmotherGR
UGRRiku of Two ReflectionsRGU
Casual
WGBJunkStone DeckBGW
BMonoBlack VampireB