Can you Exsanguinate for 37 off of the top assuming it is the top card when the Citadel hits?
I'm assuming X spells won't really work, as they can only be cast as their converted mana cost, which would be BB and X would be zero for Exsanguinate. I assume that's how it works, otherwise reminds me of.. Channel + Fireball hehe
Mana Severance removes Lands from the equation so you never have to worry about them coming up top. While it doesn't outright win you the game, in an Esper or Dimir deck you can most likely find ways to offset the life loss and just keep casting to win without Aetherflux Reservoir or Sense's Divining Top.
So, life gain is territory I still haven't really fleshed out.
Generally, when it comes to gaining life, you want to gain it in large chunks and all at once. This is because life isn't that valuable when you're sitting on a pile of it, but once you begin to lose it, the less you have of it the more you need it (and fast!). Unfortunately, most life gain cards don't fit this bill. Cards that grant a numerically large amount of a resource tend not to scale well in Commander (think Heroes Remembered) unless the amount they're granting is variable (think True Conviction), so being good at gaining life most likely correlates with being good at some other quality.
Two life gain cards I've had middling success with have been Kambal, Consul of Allocation and Grim Feast. Both cards can come down reasonably early and provide plenty of extra life to you over the course of the game provided they aren't destroyed. Of course, they suffer from the fact that they're both 1.) not immediate, and 2.) mostly rely upon your opponents to activate, but damn if they aren't actually good at raising that point total. Other cards that seem effective at gaining life are the ones that scale with the number of opponents, so things like Exsanguinate, Debt to the Deathless, Gray Merchant of Asphodel, and Kokusho, the Evening Star. Some of those are pretty demanding, but, again, since life is more valuable the later a game goes on, having to meet those demands probably isn't as concerning as it otherwise might be.
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WUBRGMr. Bones' Wild RideGRBUW Trap your friends in an endless game with this 23-card combo!
I don't think I'll end up building it, but some sort of artifact storm deck using this card with Mishra, Artificer Prodigy so that you can reliably shuffle and reset the top of your deck if you hit a brink seems like it has potential.
I really like the card, but trying to use it "fairly" (not as a combo piece or anything like that) it's harder than i thought
The casting ability screams licia, sanguine tribune, but the tap ability would then be useless
The tap ability could work in my ghave, guru of spores, but the first ability not so much
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
I mean... you WILL deck yourself... theoretically, everyone else should be dead long before that happens - but it's something to be aware of if your deck is low.
I really like the card, but trying to use it "fairly" (not as a combo piece or anything like that) it's harder than i thought
The casting ability screams licia, sanguine tribune, but the tap ability would then be useless
The tap ability could work in my ghave, guru of spores, but the first ability not so much
I'm in the same boat. I planned on using this in my Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder deck where sacrificing 10 non-land permanents should be relatively simple once we get some Thrulls going. That deck runs a lot of Blood Artist effects, so it might be possible for me to "go off" with a sac outlet, Blood Artist, Endrek Sahr, and playing creatures of the top with Bolas's Citadel, but the effect still isn't infinite unless you clear away extra lands somehow. If I was trying to go infinite I would just add SDT back in, but I'm not interested in that . The issue is that I have Bontu the Glorified, Necropotence, Razaketh, etc. to change the top card of my deck (about 9 permanent ways and several other one-shot effects) that would allow me to still go off.
Licia, Sanguine Tribune sounds like it would be fine with Bolas's Citadel. I think it would be a much bigger problem in Edgar Markov where the token production would feed the second ability. Either way though, it's an artifact that costs 6 mana so its not going to make a huge impact till the mid-game either way. I think you might find that it ends up being "just" a really good way to recover after multiple Wraths.
As for Ghave, Guru of Spores, I wouldn't do it. Ghave combos with everything. If you are doing any sort of Saproling shenanigans, it will be a combo piece. You'll end up with all the same issues I'm going to have with Endrek Sahr multiplied by 100.
As for Ghave, Guru of Spores, I wouldn't do it. Ghave combos with everything. If you are doing any sort of Saproling shenanigans, it will be a combo piece. You'll end up with all the same issues I'm going to have with Endrek Sahr multiplied by 100.
Well, it would be really gross with seedborn muse, but i don't have anything that would actually really start an infinite combo with it.
I could try but the thought that i would never utilize the casting ability makes me go a little "ehhh..."
i basically don't have way to manipulate the top of my library or to gain life and my average mana cost is quite high.
so i would "waste" that ability in my deck
still this is a good card and i'd probably grab it as soon as i can
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
I mean... you WILL deck yourself... theoretically, everyone else should be dead long before that happens - but it's something to be aware of if your deck is low.
Long, long before then. With three opponents at no more than 50 life each you only need to cast a spell 17 times at most — and that's only if you're not dipping below your life total from the start of this loop to take an opponent out. 15 if you cast Bolas's Citadel and Sensei's Divining Top after Aetherflux Reservoir is already down. So decking is probably not of much concern.
If you were making a mono-black deck, what would some good cards be
There’s not really much that’ll let you do your thing without some finagling or give you automatic life gain triggers. Aetherflux Reservoir is your best bet to combo out, and it’ll do so grossly. Other than that you do could do things with Gray Merchant of Asphodel and Koko, maybe Disciple of Griselbrand? It likely would be hard to make that work with ease but it’d give you enough to go off with the citadel.
Blood Vassal, Basal Sliver means you lose 3 life, so you'd still need a sacrifice outlet and a one drop to sustain the life loss?
You'd be losing just as much life as opponents, so you'd need a higher life total.
Can you Exsanguinate for 37 off of the top assuming it is the top card when the Citadel hits?
I'm assuming X spells won't really work, as they can only be cast as their converted mana cost, which would be BB and X would be zero for Exsanguinate. I assume that's how it works, otherwise reminds me of.. Channel + Fireball hehe
EDIT: Igore me, I'm simply dead wrong here.
You are assuming wrong. Bolas's citadel simply lets you cast spells form the top of your library, it does not give the spells an alternative cost to its mana cost like omniscience etc. does. It simply change what you pay for the spell when the spell is "locked in".
I'm not sure what you mean by the spells only being able to be cast as their converted mana cost. The mana cost of exsanguinate changes and while on the stack the mana cost is the "base cost" plus the value for x.
So basically yes, yuo can cast exsanguinate for a lot.
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You can go infinite with Sensei's Divining Top and Aetherflux Reservoir.
What other cards are going to help with your life?
Some off the top of my head are white creatures in Resolute Archangel and Exquisite Archangel.
If you were making a mono-black deck, what would some good cards be?
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
But I would throw in a Necropotence to churn away lands after I had made land drops
Can you Exsanguinate for 37 off of the top assuming it is the top card when the Citadel hits?
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
(Also known as Xenphire)
Generally, when it comes to gaining life, you want to gain it in large chunks and all at once. This is because life isn't that valuable when you're sitting on a pile of it, but once you begin to lose it, the less you have of it the more you need it (and fast!). Unfortunately, most life gain cards don't fit this bill. Cards that grant a numerically large amount of a resource tend not to scale well in Commander (think Heroes Remembered) unless the amount they're granting is variable (think True Conviction), so being good at gaining life most likely correlates with being good at some other quality.
Two life gain cards I've had middling success with have been Kambal, Consul of Allocation and Grim Feast. Both cards can come down reasonably early and provide plenty of extra life to you over the course of the game provided they aren't destroyed. Of course, they suffer from the fact that they're both 1.) not immediate, and 2.) mostly rely upon your opponents to activate, but damn if they aren't actually good at raising that point total. Other cards that seem effective at gaining life are the ones that scale with the number of opponents, so things like Exsanguinate, Debt to the Deathless, Gray Merchant of Asphodel, and Kokusho, the Evening Star. Some of those are pretty demanding, but, again, since life is more valuable the later a game goes on, having to meet those demands probably isn't as concerning as it otherwise might be.
Trap your friends in an endless game with this 23-card combo!
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
The casting ability screams licia, sanguine tribune, but the tap ability would then be useless
The tap ability could work in my ghave, guru of spores, but the first ability not so much
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
I'm in the same boat. I planned on using this in my Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder deck where sacrificing 10 non-land permanents should be relatively simple once we get some Thrulls going. That deck runs a lot of Blood Artist effects, so it might be possible for me to "go off" with a sac outlet, Blood Artist, Endrek Sahr, and playing creatures of the top with Bolas's Citadel, but the effect still isn't infinite unless you clear away extra lands somehow. If I was trying to go infinite I would just add SDT back in, but I'm not interested in that . The issue is that I have Bontu the Glorified, Necropotence, Razaketh, etc. to change the top card of my deck (about 9 permanent ways and several other one-shot effects) that would allow me to still go off.
Licia, Sanguine Tribune sounds like it would be fine with Bolas's Citadel. I think it would be a much bigger problem in Edgar Markov where the token production would feed the second ability. Either way though, it's an artifact that costs 6 mana so its not going to make a huge impact till the mid-game either way. I think you might find that it ends up being "just" a really good way to recover after multiple Wraths.
As for Ghave, Guru of Spores, I wouldn't do it. Ghave combos with everything. If you are doing any sort of Saproling shenanigans, it will be a combo piece. You'll end up with all the same issues I'm going to have with Endrek Sahr multiplied by 100.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
Well, it would be really gross with seedborn muse, but i don't have anything that would actually really start an infinite combo with it.
I could try but the thought that i would never utilize the casting ability makes me go a little "ehhh..."
i basically don't have way to manipulate the top of my library or to gain life and my average mana cost is quite high.
so i would "waste" that ability in my deck
still this is a good card and i'd probably grab it as soon as i can
Extra style points if Vampiric Tutor is the top card of your library when the citadel resolves.
Doomsday as well.
Scroll Rack can be combined with tutors. So the ones that can get more than one card are going to be game winning..Demonic Collusion, Diabolic Revelation, Increasing Ambition, Behold the Beyond.
Congregation at Dawn can set up a combo creature win.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
old thread
old thread
old thread
R Zada Arcane Storm
RBU Marchesa
GWU Estrid
GWR Samut?
URB Kess
(R/W)(U/B) Akiri & Silas
BWR Alesha
R Neheb Dragons
G Nylea Wurms
W Darien
U Tetsuko
There’s not really much that’ll let you do your thing without some finagling or give you automatic life gain triggers. Aetherflux Reservoir is your best bet to combo out, and it’ll do so grossly. Other than that you do could do things with Gray Merchant of Asphodel and Koko, maybe Disciple of Griselbrand? It likely would be hard to make that work with ease but it’d give you enough to go off with the citadel.
Golgari Thug could probably be abused somehow, too.
[Primer] Erebos, God of the Dead
HONK HONK
You could combine mana producers like Priest of Gix, Pitiless Plunderer with sacrifice outlets, to keep looping with Haunted Crossroads.
Any aristocrat creature will let you do it indefinitely, Zulaport Cutthroat, Blood Artist, Falkenrath Noble, Bontu's Monument, but I think you'd need a one drop creature as well to sacrifice so the life loss balances out.
Blood Pet would work without needing a sacrifice outlet with an aristocrat and Haunted Crossroads.
Blood Vassal, Basal Sliver means you lose 3 life, so you'd still need a sacrifice outlet and a one drop to sustain the life loss?
You'd be losing just as much life as opponents, so you'd need a higher life total.
Pawn of Ulamog would need a filter outlet like Bog Initiate, Initiates of the Ebon Hand for a mana producer with Haunted Crossroads.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
EDIT: Igore me, I'm simply dead wrong here.
You are assuming wrong. Bolas's citadel simply lets you cast spells form the top of your library, it does not give the spells an alternative cost to its mana cost like omniscience etc. does. It simply change what you pay for the spell when the spell is "locked in".
I'm not sure what you mean by the spells only being able to be cast as their converted mana cost. The mana cost of exsanguinate changes and while on the stack the mana cost is the "base cost" plus the value for x.
So basically yes, yuo can cast exsanguinate for a lot.
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