So i was at the pre-release yesterday and played simic (And went 2-3, which i am proud about given that most people were playing Grull... Riot is too strong)
But given the amount of Adapt I have i was curious if Adapt is a strategy that can be applied. Ia m not looking for a competitive deck, but a bit higher than casual. Biomancer's Familiar, Training Grounds and Heartstone reduce the cost able to make adapt, making it 5 less. Doubling season, Primal Vigor and hardened scales are a must. And While i want to play Master Biomancer, he prevents my creatures form ebbing able to to adapt. (though he does pump those who can't)
of course with the other Simic abilities, maybe we are looking more at a +1/+1 counters matter, With Evolve and Graft being a thing, but i was really wanting to focus on the Adapt ability right now, and see if I can make that viable before rushing to just +1/+1 counters matter. (And while I also do want to make Vannifar, this would be led by Zegana, Utopian Speaker
Or maybe old Zegana and then make Brawn and Wonder a thing.
(I have a battlcruiser deck (Dragons) Swarm (Ghave) Niche (Yuriko) Weird (okaun and Zndrslpt) and Competatve (Storm Jhoira) so now i want something different)
(And while i want to also build vannifar, every deck is competitive or combo heavy, which I do not want.)
While probably not enough to build a deck around. The good creatures with adept are great! And have good payof for putting counters on them anyway.
The self-enabling ability is just gravy.
I'll be trying some in my Atraxa deck after playing with them on prerelease.
While probably not enough to build a deck around. The good creatures with adept are great! And have good payof for putting counters on them anyway.
The self-enabling ability is just gravy.
I'll be trying some in my Atraxa deck after playing with them on prerelease.
Hmm, an Atraxa that does not focus on PW or infect (Though, I will still keep infect as a win con) Might go with that as a +1/+1 counters matter. Though not sure if Black and white has enough support on that spectrum. Black does however offer infect sources.
How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
A couple of the adapt cards are pretty good in their own right and potentially good enough for Commander. The vast majority of them are not playable outside limited. That is pretty much the case with most game mechanics. Most cards with raid and afterlife are also not good enough for this format. The fact that some of them are actually playable in Commander puts adapt ahead of some other mechanics in recent sets.
I agree with the others. Individual cards are playable for their non-adapt effects. Biomancer's Familiar is a cost reducer. Incubation Druid goes into a deck with other +1/+1 counter synergies. That flyer that can reduce the adapt cost with instants/sorceries in the GY to be a 2 mana 5/5. But as an ability it is just super weak in commander. Then there is the general issue of abilities like this where it only appears in one set and just doesn't have enough payoffs to be worthwhile. There are 12 cards with adapt in print right now and of those only 5 are 'playable' cards.
I agree with the others. Individual cards are playable for their non-adapt effects. Biomancer's Familiar is a cost reducer. Incubation Druid goes into a deck with other +1/+1 counter synergies. That flyer that can reduce the adapt cost with instants/sorceries in the GY to be a 2 mana 5/5. But as an ability it is just super weak in commander. Then there is the general issue of abilities like this where it only appears in one set and just doesn't have enough payoffs to be worthwhile. There are 12 cards with adapt in print right now and of those only 5 are 'playable' cards.
My next question is now, can any guild run their (three) abilitie sin EDh as a "tribal" deck (i gues sin this case it would be a guild deck
Incubation Druid is the only Adapt card that I consider remotely viable enough for Commander, and even that is niche. Bloom Tender is better most of the time.
If I ever have to pay the Adapt cost on Incubation Druid instead of using virtually any other more efficient means of gaining a +1/+1 counter, then things are not going well.
The Adapt ability is over-costed for a format swimming in +1/+1 counters and synergies. Some Adapt creatures may be played in niche decks for the synergy of their other abilities or effects with +1/+1 counters, but Adapt itself is just awful.
Pteramander is totally playable, and seems like an excellent slot into Edric. 1/1 flying for 1, and potentially as low as a 5/5 flier for 2 if you have enough instant/s and sorceries in your graveyard.
Pteramander is totally playable, and seems like an excellent slot into Edric. 1/1 flying for 1, and potentially as low as a 5/5 flier for 2 if you have enough instant/s and sorceries in your graveyard.
and if you can get a turn around with him, you may be able to pay the cost anyway, as he does not have haste so making him a 5/5 turn he comes out is not always important... or pump him turn he comes out to have a 5/5 blocker if you have the mana.
Benthic Biomancer will be slotted into my Marchesa, the Black Rose deck for sure. I think a free loot every turn will be very beneficial to my deck, and if I am on the throne the adapt ability will let me continue to recur the creature.
Skatewing Spy is worth it. The similar outlast dudes from Khans of Tarkir that acted as +1/+1 counter lords were typically pretty good in +1/+1 decks. Flying is always a really strong ability to give out. I'm slamming him into my Ezuri deck and not looking back for one, but any U/G/x counters deck should want a 4 drop that gives their whole team flying. Maybe it won't make the most tuned decks, there is a lot of competition for effects, but it should at least be considered.
Pteramander seems interesting as well, but probably won't be enough. All I know is that it is itself cheap, its got a rather large adapt number at 4, and its adapt cost can often be rather cheap depending on how your deck is built.
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The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
I think that the bigger issue here is just the sheer lack of creatures with Adapt; if you only have 12 Adapt creatures in existence, it's hard to build a deck around trying to build around Adapt synergistically when you can go an entire game without ever drawing an Adapt card. And that is assuming that all 12 Adapt cards are playable in Commander, which I don't think they are. So unless you are running Biomancer's Familiar, Training Grounds, and Heartstone for other things, then just running them to make Adapt better isn't really a winning proposition.
And looking at the Adapt cards, which ones would you really want to play?
Aeromonculus - A limited card that is only playable if you are forcing Adapt. Benthic Biomancer - At least you aren't overpaying for the Adapt ability. Growth-Chamber Guardian - 3 mana to Adapt:2 is probably fine, but the second ability is blanked in a highlander format (although theoretically, you do get to shuffle your deck if you need it, which makes SDT and Sylvan Library a little better). Incubation Druid - 5 mana to Adapt:3 seems okay and getting a mana boost out of it is solid, but Graft, Metallic Mimic, Rishkar, Peema Renegade, etc. are probably a better ways to go than paying full price to Adapt this. Pteramander - Adapt:4 for anything less than 4 mana is going to be really good. I think there is some good potential here. Sauroform Hybrid - Adapt:4 for 6 mana is starting to get a little on the expensive side, but this is a Limited Common and low-powered for a reason. Scuttlegator - Adapt:3 for 8 mana basically means that you are rarely (if ever) using the Adapt ability. This card is underwhelming at best. Sharktocrab - You are overpaying for the Adapt here, but you at least get an extra ability for your troubles and a 4/4 for 4 mana out of the deal. Skatewing Spy - You are again overpaying for the Adapt, but the second ability makes it playable (although it pales in comparison to Herald of Secret Streams) Skitter Eel - Decently costed Adapt ability on an otherwise boring body Trollbred Guardian - This one is pretty good and will see play in lots of UG +1/+1 counter decks (probably replacing Crowned Ceratok) Zegana, Utopian Sepaker - This one is probably the best Adapt card.
So me, Adapt is more of something that can just be part of a larger +1/+1 counter strategy that serves as a backup plan if any your other avenues to place counters on creatures isn't online. For me, I intend to put Zegana, Utopian Speaker, Trollbred Guardian, and Incubation Druid in my Vorel deck.
Personally, the only Adapt card I'm likely to play in any of my decks is new Zegana, and even she's iffy. As noted above, Herald of Secret Streams is all sorts of better than Skatewing Spy (or Trollbred Guardian, for that matter, though the Guardian may have a place in counter decks lacking U). Not to say none of the others are playable - a few of them are, and can be very good in the right decks. I just don't see any of them (except maybe Zegana 2) potentially making the cut for the three "counters matter" decks I'm currently playing (Anafenza, Atraxa and Animar hydra tribal).
Most mechanics are like this. Actually, adapt has more good cards than most mechanics, which might have one or two good cards.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Skatewing Spy is worth it. The similar outlast dudes from Khans of Tarkir that acted as +1/+1 counter lords were typically pretty good in +1/+1 decks. Flying is always a really strong ability to give out. I'm slamming him into my Ezuri deck and not looking back for one, but any U/G/x counters deck should want a 4 drop that gives their whole team flying. Maybe it won't make the most tuned decks, there is a lot of competition for effects, but it should at least be considered.
Skatewing Spy is worth it. The similar outlast dudes from Khans of Tarkir that acted as +1/+1 counter lords were typically pretty good in +1/+1 decks. Flying is always a really strong ability to give out. I'm slamming him into my Ezuri deck and not looking back for one, but any U/G/x counters deck should want a 4 drop that gives their whole team flying. Maybe it won't make the most tuned decks, there is a lot of competition for effects, but it should at least be considered.
Levitation also grants all d00dz flying. Also costs 4 mana, albeit more color-intensive, but not a problem for a two-color deck, or even a three-color deck TBH. It can survive most wraths, while Skatewing Spy won't.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Skatewing Spy is worth it. The similar outlast dudes from Khans of Tarkir that acted as +1/+1 counter lords were typically pretty good in +1/+1 decks. Flying is always a really strong ability to give out. I'm slamming him into my Ezuri deck and not looking back for one, but any U/G/x counters deck should want a 4 drop that gives their whole team flying. Maybe it won't make the most tuned decks, there is a lot of competition for effects, but it should at least be considered.
Levitation also grants all d00dz flying. Also costs 4 mana, albeit more color-intensive, but not a problem for a two-color deck, or even a three-color deck TBH. It can survive most wraths, while Skatewing Spy won't.
Yeah, but Wonder is functionally free and is immune to wraths
Yeah, but Wonder is functionally free and is immune to wraths
I like to list two, either in case one gets exiled or because this usually isn't something I'd waste a tutor on.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
But given the amount of Adapt I have i was curious if Adapt is a strategy that can be applied. Ia m not looking for a competitive deck, but a bit higher than casual. Biomancer's Familiar, Training Grounds and Heartstone reduce the cost able to make adapt, making it 5 less. Doubling season, Primal Vigor and hardened scales are a must. And While i want to play Master Biomancer, he prevents my creatures form ebbing able to to adapt. (though he does pump those who can't)
of course with the other Simic abilities, maybe we are looking more at a +1/+1 counters matter, With Evolve and Graft being a thing, but i was really wanting to focus on the Adapt ability right now, and see if I can make that viable before rushing to just +1/+1 counters matter. (And while I also do want to make Vannifar, this would be led by Zegana, Utopian Speaker
Or maybe old Zegana and then make Brawn and Wonder a thing.
(I have a battlcruiser deck (Dragons) Swarm (Ghave) Niche (Yuriko) Weird (okaun and Zndrslpt) and Competatve (Storm Jhoira) so now i want something different)
(And while i want to also build vannifar, every deck is competitive or combo heavy, which I do not want.)
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
I just don't see much point in trying to abuse adapt when you could just put counters normally.
The self-enabling ability is just gravy.
I'll be trying some in my Atraxa deck after playing with them on prerelease.
Modern: WUBRG Humans - GBW Traverse - GWU Knightfall - GRW Bushwhacker Zoo -
Hmm, an Atraxa that does not focus on PW or infect (Though, I will still keep infect as a win con) Might go with that as a +1/+1 counters matter. Though not sure if Black and white has enough support on that spectrum. Black does however offer infect sources.
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
My next question is now, can any guild run their (three) abilitie sin EDh as a "tribal" deck (i gues sin this case it would be a guild deck
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
If I ever have to pay the Adapt cost on Incubation Druid instead of using virtually any other more efficient means of gaining a +1/+1 counter, then things are not going well.
The Adapt ability is over-costed for a format swimming in +1/+1 counters and synergies. Some Adapt creatures may be played in niche decks for the synergy of their other abilities or effects with +1/+1 counters, but Adapt itself is just awful.
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
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and if you can get a turn around with him, you may be able to pay the cost anyway, as he does not have haste so making him a 5/5 turn he comes out is not always important... or pump him turn he comes out to have a 5/5 blocker if you have the mana.
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
Modern: WUBRG Humans - GBW Traverse - GWU Knightfall - GRW Bushwhacker Zoo -
8.RG Green Devotion Ramp/Combo 9.UR Draw Triggers 10.WUR Group stalling 11.WUR Voltron Spellslinger 12.WB Sacrificial Shenanigans
13.BR Creatureless Panharmonicon 14.BR Pingers and Eldrazi 15.URG Untapped Cascading
16.Reyhan, last of the Abzan's WUBG +1/+1 Counter Craziness 17.WUBRG Dragons aka Why did I make this?
Building: The Gitrog Monster lands, Glissa the Traitor stax, Muldrotha, the Gravetide Planeswalker Combo, Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix + Sidar Kondo of Jamuraa Clues, and Tribal Scarecrow Planeswalkers
Skatewing Spy is worth it. The similar outlast dudes from Khans of Tarkir that acted as +1/+1 counter lords were typically pretty good in +1/+1 decks. Flying is always a really strong ability to give out. I'm slamming him into my Ezuri deck and not looking back for one, but any U/G/x counters deck should want a 4 drop that gives their whole team flying. Maybe it won't make the most tuned decks, there is a lot of competition for effects, but it should at least be considered.
Pteramander seems interesting as well, but probably won't be enough. All I know is that it is itself cheap, its got a rather large adapt number at 4, and its adapt cost can often be rather cheap depending on how your deck is built.
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
And looking at the Adapt cards, which ones would you really want to play?
Aeromonculus - A limited card that is only playable if you are forcing Adapt.
Benthic Biomancer - At least you aren't overpaying for the Adapt ability.
Growth-Chamber Guardian - 3 mana to Adapt:2 is probably fine, but the second ability is blanked in a highlander format (although theoretically, you do get to shuffle your deck if you need it, which makes SDT and Sylvan Library a little better).
Incubation Druid - 5 mana to Adapt:3 seems okay and getting a mana boost out of it is solid, but Graft, Metallic Mimic, Rishkar, Peema Renegade, etc. are probably a better ways to go than paying full price to Adapt this.
Pteramander - Adapt:4 for anything less than 4 mana is going to be really good. I think there is some good potential here.
Sauroform Hybrid - Adapt:4 for 6 mana is starting to get a little on the expensive side, but this is a Limited Common and low-powered for a reason.
Scuttlegator - Adapt:3 for 8 mana basically means that you are rarely (if ever) using the Adapt ability. This card is underwhelming at best.
Sharktocrab - You are overpaying for the Adapt here, but you at least get an extra ability for your troubles and a 4/4 for 4 mana out of the deal.
Skatewing Spy - You are again overpaying for the Adapt, but the second ability makes it playable (although it pales in comparison to Herald of Secret Streams)
Skitter Eel - Decently costed Adapt ability on an otherwise boring body
Trollbred Guardian - This one is pretty good and will see play in lots of UG +1/+1 counter decks (probably replacing Crowned Ceratok)
Zegana, Utopian Sepaker - This one is probably the best Adapt card.
So me, Adapt is more of something that can just be part of a larger +1/+1 counter strategy that serves as a backup plan if any your other avenues to place counters on creatures isn't online. For me, I intend to put Zegana, Utopian Speaker, Trollbred Guardian, and Incubation Druid in my Vorel deck.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
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Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
On phasing:
I Wonder what else you could use for that
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Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsLevitation also grants all d00dz flying. Also costs 4 mana, albeit more color-intensive, but not a problem for a two-color deck, or even a three-color deck TBH. It can survive most wraths, while Skatewing Spy won't.
On phasing:
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
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I like to list two, either in case one gets exiled or because this usually isn't something I'd waste a tutor on.
On phasing:
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG