The thing with "Stax" when it comes to spells costing more, is that it's not actually all that good with Lavinia, Azorius Renegade. She specifically makes it so opponents can't cast cards, where as Grand Arbiter Augustin IV makes spells cost more.
Winter Orb and other mana lockdown cards are still good, but not as good as they would be.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
No, when you cast Angel’s Grace the Knowledge Pool trigger and it’s split second trigger go on the stack, so you can stack them by letting the Knowledge Pool trigger resolve first. They can’t do anything until the Knowledge Pool trigger resolves. This thread explains it better than me.
So they can respond once Angel’s grace is off the stack, but whatever was cast out of the Pool is already on the stack, so they have to cast a counterspell and then another instant to stop it, but you can respond to the instant with another instant and so on. If there’s another better solution for guaranteeing they don’t send your wincon to the grave I’m all ears, as this only guarantees you have control of the spell, not if it resolves.
As a side note, I might try to find a space for grand Abolisher as he guarentees they can’t do anything if he comes down before Pool resolves.
Edit: Just had an idea, what about a wincon that explicitly says can't be countered? Like Nezahal or Sphinx of the Final word? Either one is guaranteed to be put on the stack on your side with Angel's Grace and once they're out in a CEDH meta where everyone's commanders are like 2/3s pretty sure everyone will just get beaten to death in like 15 turns. Of course this fares slightly worse in a battlecruiser meta but at that point if Knowledge Pool resolves winning is just a formality anyway.
Arbiter will make it so they can cast free spells as long as they pay one thus negating the purpose of Pool in the first place, that ruling thread is cool.
I just realised an uncounterable wincon is unnecessary with Angel’s Grace as once it’s on the stack opponents have no way of actually resolving a counterspell. I’m dumb. In that case, one-card wincon suggestions that could be protected with Angel’s Grace are great.
To be absolutely clear regarding Knowledge Pool and Split Second since Jinandtonic123's last comment suggests something not true (if I understand their comment correctly):
This causes the Pool to trigger. Since Angel's Grace has Split Second, no one can cast any spells or activate any non-mana abilities.
The Pool's trigger resolves and exiles Angel's Grace. Shortly after, they choose any other card exiled with Pool and cast that.
They are able to do so since Angel's Grace is exiled first (so Split Second will not stop them from casting the spell off the Pool. They choose to cast the Boomerang.
Now, Angel's Grace is off the Stack so Split Second no longer does anything (a quick mention that Split Second is *not* a trigger)
Bolt is exiled and the player casts the exiled Counterspell targeting the Boomerang
Obviously this requires a counterspell to be exiled under the Pool so either it needs to already be there or someone needs to cast one, let it get exiled, and then cast a different spell to get to the counterspell again. Not impossible but not exactly easy. And, as Jinandtonic123 pointed out above, the other player can respond to the Pool trigger with the Bolt on the stack to then get the Counterspell from exile first.
The main point is that Split Second and Knowledge Pool don't really do anything that Knowledge Pool doesn't already do on its own. Nothing in this scenario prevents another player from responding to the win con spell unless the win con spell actually has split second itself (which very few do). Angel's Grace can't be used to "protect" the "real" spell from being countered since it is not on the stack when the win con spell is (it is exiled under Knowledge Pool). And, to make sure all the bases are covered, if the Angel's Grace is exiled to then get the win con and then the player casts something else to get Angel's Grace back from the Pool and cast it, it will still only stop players from doing most things until Angel's Grace resolves. Once it does, the win con spell is fair game to be targeted.
Ok, to clear up any confusion, Angel’s Grace doesn’t stop the spell from being countered because Knowledge Pool and Lavinia already prevents anyone from actually resolving anything. What it does is guarantee that you are the one casting your win con from the Pool (I.e. the spell will enter the stack under your control). Otherwise your opponent could respond with an instant (any instant) to cast your win con from the Pool, at which point Lavinia counters it and it goes into the graveyard, which means nobody wins basically until people deck out unless you do something. There are still ways out of the lock, namely commanders that can kill Lavinia like Breya, or ones that make a boardstate on their own like Omnath, and as such holding up interaction for those is very important.
Unless your commander can handle it on his own, ending the game is the toughest part with Azorius.
If you're going to Knowledge Pool, you might not want to depend on just Rest In Peace and Helm. Man-lands are agonizingly slow, and might not even out race an enemy commander.
You could try Decree of Justice, Monastery Mentor (I use him a lot because Future Sight and Sensei's Divining Top is one of my favorite combos), Luminarch Ascension, Planeswalkers (Teferi HoD and Jace TMS are very good when you have a lock), Dream Halls + Laboratory Maniac.
Yep, because you can only guarantee one card resolving with Angel’s Grace, the win con should not be a combo but one card that can win on its own. It’s important that it’s not a 100% lock as they can still cast their commander and/or race you with what they have on board. Something like Luminarch Ascension is great if the board is reasonably clear or you have a Glacial Chasm/Maze of Ith to protect yourself until you get the quest counters. Planeswalkers are not because they can attack them with their commander. Decree could work but you never have to cast it. Honestly the best one I can think of at this stage is just Lab Man because if you can guarantee he resolves all you have to do is wait until you deck out. It’s probably the “best” wincon but I was hoping for something a bit more thematic. It could also be weak because your opponents could just kill you by the time you deck out, so ideally a wincon that can protect itself and you. I mean generally by the time you have Pool our you’ll have random bears to block until you get your Luminarch Angel’s, but in EDH you sort of have to plan for worst-case scenario. I’m thinking a big creature with hexproof, ideally vigilance or lifelink or something to help race, would get there (hexproof is for stuff like Maze of Ith).
The biggest commanders in a reasonably competitive meta (which is probably where I would play this deck) body-wise would be probably Kess and Tasigur (Gitrog is not really a thing in my meta) so something that can outrace those somehow is ideal (pretty hard because of Commander damage, so big flying vigilance lifelinker? Hexproof/shroud is also ideal, big ask but I’m guessing there’s probably an angel/Sphinx somewhere with those kinds of abilities? Either that or I guess some creature that can generate a board state on it’s own to protect yourself, and/or built in removal. Of course, any other random I-win sorcery or enchantment works as well but I can’t think of any right now. Help?
Edit: Did some browsing. Creature wise I feel like some options are: Memnarch (take their commanders), some Eldrazi with Annihilator or some obnoxious destruction ability, probably one of the Ulamogs), Lorthos (taps their commanders and utility lands). I think Lorthos and Memnarch are better options as they directly deal with problematic commanders and lands as soon as you untap with them. If you’re wanting more thematic I suppose Avacyn also works but it can be Mazed so you still need other creatures to get through.
I think I already said it but did you give some thought to a couple pieces of equipment? A sword on Lavinia should out race most things and Jitte would let you repeatedly kill commanders once you get trucking with it. Plenty of pretty strong options there. And SFM can get greaves.
That'd probably be my inclination since you're gonna have to jam some value critters anyway (archaeomancer type stuff). The game is gonna be super slow anyway.
Edit: Oh, Platinum Angel might be a reasonable wincon given all your artifact tutors. Just pop that bad boy off and no one can really do anything and you can just eat commander damage.
Platinum Angel is a great suggestion! However if someone has flying chump blockers or a bigger flying commander then you can’t really kill them either (unlikely in competitive, but still ). I will definitely put it in the maybeboard. The other better options I’ve come across are Eldrazi conscription on Lavinia (provides the fastest clock), Memnarch and Lorthos the Tidebringer as they deal with your opponents’ permanents. Anyone have any ideas?
Actually Guile is a great creature with the second ability of Lavinia, so Omen Machine will mean you'll get all your opponents spells, and also this is another backup plan with the Knowledge Pool because opponents can't superseed you with casting your win con as you'll just get it (Guile) because it'll get countered if opponents play a spell.
Guile's an awesome suggestion, I overlooked that particular interaction. I'm currently trying out Memnarch as if you can guarantee he resolves he just steals the other commanders in your following turn and then there's literally nothing your opponents can do anymore.
Wouldn't Celestial Colonnade or Faerie Conclave be solid wincons in a lockout scenario? Hell, anything that dodges our locks and as much removal as possible seems decent, even Azorius Keyrune could do work.
Sure, there is a chance of spending $4 on a booster and getting the Mythic Rare $30 super card. There is also a chance of surviving putting your tongue in a light socket.
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It doesn't stop anything already being cast it just stops thing is the exact moment that spell is cast until it resolves.
Winter Orb and other mana lockdown cards are still good, but not as good as they would be.
On phasing:
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-rulings/magic-rulings-archives/291456-knowledge-pool-split-second
So they can respond once Angel’s grace is off the stack, but whatever was cast out of the Pool is already on the stack, so they have to cast a counterspell and then another instant to stop it, but you can respond to the instant with another instant and so on. If there’s another better solution for guaranteeing they don’t send your wincon to the grave I’m all ears, as this only guarantees you have control of the spell, not if it resolves.
As a side note, I might try to find a space for grand Abolisher as he guarentees they can’t do anything if he comes down before Pool resolves.
Edit: Just had an idea, what about a wincon that explicitly says can't be countered? Like Nezahal or Sphinx of the Final word? Either one is guaranteed to be put on the stack on your side with Angel's Grace and once they're out in a CEDH meta where everyone's commanders are like 2/3s pretty sure everyone will just get beaten to death in like 15 turns. Of course this fares slightly worse in a battlecruiser meta but at that point if Knowledge Pool resolves winning is just a formality anyway.
The main point is that Split Second and Knowledge Pool don't really do anything that Knowledge Pool doesn't already do on its own. Nothing in this scenario prevents another player from responding to the win con spell unless the win con spell actually has split second itself (which very few do). Angel's Grace can't be used to "protect" the "real" spell from being countered since it is not on the stack when the win con spell is (it is exiled under Knowledge Pool). And, to make sure all the bases are covered, if the Angel's Grace is exiled to then get the win con and then the player casts something else to get Angel's Grace back from the Pool and cast it, it will still only stop players from doing most things until Angel's Grace resolves. Once it does, the win con spell is fair game to be targeted.
If you're going to Knowledge Pool, you might not want to depend on just Rest In Peace and Helm. Man-lands are agonizingly slow, and might not even out race an enemy commander.
You could try Decree of Justice, Monastery Mentor (I use him a lot because Future Sight and Sensei's Divining Top is one of my favorite combos), Luminarch Ascension, Planeswalkers (Teferi HoD and Jace TMS are very good when you have a lock), Dream Halls + Laboratory Maniac.
The biggest commanders in a reasonably competitive meta (which is probably where I would play this deck) body-wise would be probably Kess and Tasigur (Gitrog is not really a thing in my meta) so something that can outrace those somehow is ideal (pretty hard because of Commander damage, so big flying vigilance lifelinker? Hexproof/shroud is also ideal, big ask but I’m guessing there’s probably an angel/Sphinx somewhere with those kinds of abilities? Either that or I guess some creature that can generate a board state on it’s own to protect yourself, and/or built in removal. Of course, any other random I-win sorcery or enchantment works as well but I can’t think of any right now. Help?
Edit: Did some browsing. Creature wise I feel like some options are: Memnarch (take their commanders), some Eldrazi with Annihilator or some obnoxious destruction ability, probably one of the Ulamogs), Lorthos (taps their commanders and utility lands). I think Lorthos and Memnarch are better options as they directly deal with problematic commanders and lands as soon as you untap with them. If you’re wanting more thematic I suppose Avacyn also works but it can be Mazed so you still need other creatures to get through.
That'd probably be my inclination since you're gonna have to jam some value critters anyway (archaeomancer type stuff). The game is gonna be super slow anyway.
Edit: Oh, Platinum Angel might be a reasonable wincon given all your artifact tutors. Just pop that bad boy off and no one can really do anything and you can just eat commander damage.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
I'm not a giant fan of the very expensive wincons though. I think Luminarch Ascension is my favorite of things you've listed.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
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---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith