I don't want to use Atraxa as the general. So I'm currently tossing up between two sets of partners.
First, Thrasios, Triton Hero//Ravos the Soulmender which is arguably the stronger of the two pairs, but it's more goodstuff than synergistic. Thrasios does provide draw which gets me to my Seige effects quicker.
Second, Ikra Shidiqi, the Usurper//Ishai, Dragonspeaker. Ikra gives toughness synergy. And a lifegaim subtheme that I would enjoy. Ishai doesn't really add much, but can act as a wincon.
Honestly i would run 5 color, as that gives access to both wall of stone and Aether Membrane
Sure neither are the best walls out there, but they are still decent to add a bit of red to the deck. (Esecialy with Membrane. Just keep bouncing creatures back)
The best commander, by far, would be to just use arcades. If you think anything else is close you're kidding yourself. He already has doran's ability plus the draw ability plus the critical "walls can attack" ability. If you use either of those partner pairs you're going to be sitting on a pile of garbage that instantly folds as soon as assault formation and arcades are removed, and can't do anything until you tutor one of those cards in the first place either.
I mean, if you want to build a bad deck for fun, build a bad deck for fun. But if you want to make a wall deck work, just build arcades. Doran doesn't even add anything to the deck, he's just redundant.
I mean, if you want to build a bad deck for fun, build a bad deck for fun. But if you want to make a wall deck work, just build arcades. Doran doesn't even add anything to the deck, he's just redundant.
I recently came to the realisation that my decks are too strong for most of my playgroup, so I started building some weaker decks so the newer players aren't always getting blown out.
And I brainstormed building one deck for each colour combo, and Estrid, the Masked takes the Bant slot.
I think that I would run Thrasios/Ravos as both would give you access to mid-late game card advantage from the Command zone. They are also overall cheaper than running Ishai/Ikra. Ikra would be a sweet card to include in the 99 though.
I mean, if you want to build a bad deck for fun, build a bad deck for fun. But if you want to make a wall deck work, just build arcades. Doran doesn't even add anything to the deck, he's just redundant.
I recently came to the realisation that my decks are too strong for most of my playgroup, so I started building some weaker decks so the newer players aren't always getting blown out.
And I brainstormed building one deck for each colour combo, and Estrid, the Masked takes the Bant slot.
Hmm, I do understand that goal, but I'd think that having a deck that's extremely fragile to removal would be a pretty un-fun way to avoid blowing out your opposition.
Personally I think the best options are either to build around a particular mechanical restriction with little synergy (i.e. I had a deck where every card gave my opponents choices, such as tempt with vengeance, weird harvest, shared fate, capital punishment), or to just play a precon. Precons are nice since you don't have to build a crappy deck on purpose. Although building around a funny theme can be amusing.
I've also tried some experiments with restricting my own play in certain weird ways. For example, an aggro deck where I chose a random condition to care about (i.e. who has the most land, or who has the most cards, or who has the highest life...the condition being either selected from a deck of conditions written on cards, or each condition assigned a number and rolling a dice to decide) and then whoever satisfied that condition was the person I targeted. The idea being that people could intentionally avoid satisfying those conditions so they'd be less likely to be targeted. This was pretty hilarious but it ended up not slowing me down enough, I still won a pretty high percentage of games. So more fine-tuning is probably necessary to find a good balance.
I agree with Dirk. Even if you are pulling punches while deck building, stick with Arcades. Just build him as goofy wall aggro and leave out the combos. You aren't going to run the table trying to beat face with walls, even with all that draw, but you'll at least have a consistent deck that actually does something even when you don't win, rather than just getting rolled because your key card got killed or building in so much contingency that your deck has no identity and you're just running Bant control, but with walls.
If you're going to build a deck that does dumb *****, build it so that it does that dumb ***** reliably, every game. That's how you make it fun. You want to be able to throw walls at people, then make sure you can throw walls at people starting turn 4, every game.
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The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
And I brainstormed building one deck for each colour combo, and Estrid, the Masked takes the Bant slot.
I have done that as well, However I have 3 Izzet decks with two more in production.
So while i goal was 32 decks, i will probably have closer to 40 by the end.
Arcades was my bant deck but after a few plays i realized i hated it. Too commander dependent so i took it apart pretty much the day i built it. I think I may go with Estrid as well. Not sure.
Hmm, I do understand that goal, but I'd think that having a deck that's extremely fragile to removal would be a pretty un-fun way to avoid blowing out your opposition.
The skill level between myself and the rest of the playgroup is quite large, so I feel building a crappy deck is a better option at this stage. I'll reevaluate if it doesn't go as planned, however.
[quote from="Onering »" url="/forums/the-game/commander-edh/801237-who-should-lead-a-sans-r-walls-deck?comment=9"]I agree with Dirk. Even if you are pulling punches while deck building, stick with Arcades. Just build him as goofy wall aggro and leave out the combos. You aren't going to run the table trying to beat face with walls, even with all that draw, but you'll at least have a consistent deck that actually does something even when you don't win, rather than just getting rolled because your key card got killed or building in so much contingency that your deck has no identity and you're just running Bant control, but with walls.
If you're going to build a deck that does dumb *****, build it so that it does that dumb ***** reliably, every game. That's how you make it fun. You want to be able to throw walls at people, then make sure you can throw walls at people starting turn 4, every game.
The problem is my decks are too reliable. I played my Ghoulcaller Gisa deck, and after every wrath, I was able to bounce back the next turn. I want to have a deck that is just janky, but not necessarily reliable.
And as for the deck, I want to have Arcades/Doran/Phenax as hidden wincons.
[quote from="Monkey222 »" url="/forums/the-game/commander-edh/801237-who-should-lead-a-sans-r-walls-deck?comment=6"]
I have done that as well, However I have 3 Izzet decks with two more in production.
So while i goal was 32 decks, i will probably have closer to 40 by the end.
Arcades was my bant deck but after a few plays i realized i hated it. Too commander dependent so i took it apart pretty much the day i built it. I think I may go with Estrid as well. Not sure.
How did you end up with 5 Izzet decks? Who did you build?
I have done that as well, However I have 3 Izzet decks with two more in production.
So while i goal was 32 decks, i will probably have closer to 40 by the end.
Arcades was my bant deck but after a few plays i realized i hated it. Too commander dependent so i took it apart pretty much the day i built it. I think I may go with Estrid as well. Not sure.
How did you end up with 5 Izzet decks? Who did you build?
Honestly i would run 5 color, as that gives access to both wall of stone and Aether Membrane
Sure neither are the best walls out there, but they are still decent to add a bit of red to the deck. (Esecialy with Membrane. Just keep bouncing creatures back)
Vent Sentinel would've been my choice. TBH, the only thing I see black adding to a walls deck is Wall of Blood.
Though Arcades, the Strategist is the only one I can recommend. Never make a deck dependent on one card in the 99 unless you can reliably fetch that card.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
I don't want to use Atraxa as the general. So I'm currently tossing up between two sets of partners.
First, Thrasios, Triton Hero//Ravos the Soulmender which is arguably the stronger of the two pairs, but it's more goodstuff than synergistic. Thrasios does provide draw which gets me to my Seige effects quicker.
Second, Ikra Shidiqi, the Usurper//Ishai, Dragonspeaker. Ikra gives toughness synergy. And a lifegaim subtheme that I would enjoy. Ishai doesn't really add much, but can act as a wincon.
Which pair of partners would be better?
Sure neither are the best walls out there, but they are still decent to add a bit of red to the deck. (Esecialy with Membrane. Just keep bouncing creatures back)
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
I mean, if you want to build a bad deck for fun, build a bad deck for fun. But if you want to make a wall deck work, just build arcades. Doran doesn't even add anything to the deck, he's just redundant.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Edit: Sorry for the double post. I thought I was editing the previous one.
I recently came to the realisation that my decks are too strong for most of my playgroup, so I started building some weaker decks so the newer players aren't always getting blown out.
And I brainstormed building one deck for each colour combo, and Estrid, the Masked takes the Bant slot.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
Personally I think the best options are either to build around a particular mechanical restriction with little synergy (i.e. I had a deck where every card gave my opponents choices, such as tempt with vengeance, weird harvest, shared fate, capital punishment), or to just play a precon. Precons are nice since you don't have to build a crappy deck on purpose. Although building around a funny theme can be amusing.
I've also tried some experiments with restricting my own play in certain weird ways. For example, an aggro deck where I chose a random condition to care about (i.e. who has the most land, or who has the most cards, or who has the highest life...the condition being either selected from a deck of conditions written on cards, or each condition assigned a number and rolling a dice to decide) and then whoever satisfied that condition was the person I targeted. The idea being that people could intentionally avoid satisfying those conditions so they'd be less likely to be targeted. This was pretty hilarious but it ended up not slowing me down enough, I still won a pretty high percentage of games. So more fine-tuning is probably necessary to find a good balance.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
If you're going to build a deck that does dumb *****, build it so that it does that dumb ***** reliably, every game. That's how you make it fun. You want to be able to throw walls at people, then make sure you can throw walls at people starting turn 4, every game.
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
I have done that as well, However I have 3 Izzet decks with two more in production.
So while i goal was 32 decks, i will probably have closer to 40 by the end.
Arcades was my bant deck but after a few plays i realized i hated it. Too commander dependent so i took it apart pretty much the day i built it. I think I may go with Estrid as well. Not sure.
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
The problem is my decks are too reliable. I played my Ghoulcaller Gisa deck, and after every wrath, I was able to bounce back the next turn. I want to have a deck that is just janky, but not necessarily reliable.
And as for the deck, I want to have Arcades/Doran/Phenax as hidden wincons.
How did you end up with 5 Izzet decks? Who did you build?
-Nin, The Pain Artist
-Jhoira, Weatherlight Captain
-Brudiclad, Telchor Engineer
-Will Kenrith & Rowan Kenrith
-Okaun, Eye of Chaos & Zndrsplt, Eye of Wisdom
Each one plays differently.
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
Vent Sentinel would've been my choice. TBH, the only thing I see black adding to a walls deck is Wall of Blood.
Though Arcades, the Strategist is the only one I can recommend. Never make a deck dependent on one card in the 99 unless you can reliably fetch that card.
On phasing: