MTG Salvation

Thantis the Warweaver

A lot of contention this card has created, but I think it's quite a good general. My concept is to Jund 'em out three ways.
First, make it hurt for your opponents to hit you, and more attractive to hit someone else:

Second, -1/-1 counters. The perfect marriage of Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons and The Scorpion God

And finally, hurt your opponents:


Pack a decent removal, ramp, draw, and land package, and you have something interesting.

Also, a not insignificant amount of token creation to take advantage of The Scorpion God, Skull Clamp, Grave Pact, etc.

Anything that should be added? More focus?

Don't forget Archetype of Finality and Bow of Nylea to help your creatures get through when they have to attack.

Props on the -1/-1 direction. Thantis may not support the theme directly, you could weaken their creatures to nonexistence by encouraging combat.

Cards like Grave Betrayal, Death's Presence, Blade of the Bloodchief, and Reyhan, Last of the Abzan would continue the +1/+1 side of things alive.

Extra block: Echo Circlet, Vanguard's Shield

Adding trample would help Thantis go around blockers.

Use goad to manipulate combat: Besmirch, Disrupt Decorum, and Grenzo, Havoc Raiser (whom works really well with a token subtheme if we get to it).

Quote from TearingEons »

Don't forget Archetype of Finality and Bow of Nylea to help your creatures get through when they have to attack.

Deathtouch is a fantastic idea. I don't know why I didn't think of it.

Quote from cyberium_neo »

Props on the -1/-1 direction. Thantis may not support the theme directly, you could weaken their creatures to nonexistence by encouraging combat.

Cards like Grave Betrayal, Death's Presence, Blade of the Bloodchief, and Reyhan, Last of the Abzan would continue the +1/+1 side of things alive.

Extra block: Echo Circlet, Vanguard's Shield

Adding trample would help Thantis go around blockers.

Use goad to manipulate combat: Besmirch, Disrupt Decorum, and Grenzo, Havoc Raiser (whom works really well with a token subtheme if we get to it).

I can't claim the original idea for the -1/-1 counters, someone mentioned it in the Rumor Mill and I ran with it.

It is a fantastic way to hose Indestructible though, because I imagine you'd be public enemy #1 after dropping Thantis without the shrink threat.

I am sure it was just an oversight since you already mentioned Dread, but No Mercy absolutely has to go in this deck. Same is true with Sandwurm Convergence. If you are feeling risky, you could even include Form of the Dragon. Also, Retribution of the Ancients is a nifty Jdefense against token swarm attacks with Thantis.

(Sorry for not linking the cards, but my crappy phone won't let me do it)

Spike Weaver and a Constant Mists seem good for this deck for when stuff does not go as you want.

More fog tech with Glacial Crevasses or Sunstone and snow lands. I imagine the Jund deck will bring a few decent land recursion cards.

Also on phone so no tags sorry.

Elephant Grass is cool, and Repercussion is kind of like Bedlam.

Quote from Tears of Tomorrow »

I mean ok, creating a situation where opponents are punished for attacking while you are free to prosper is a solid strategy that has great synergy with your spider commander, so as long as your opponents have creatures out you're going to easily take over control of the field, dictating the pace and removing anything problematic like pesky enchantments and artifacts (when it comes to removing problematic permanents, Jund i a great combination of colors)... But my issue is: what about decks that don't rely on creatures? What about those control/combo decks that just sit there, counter/remove only cards that diretly threaten them, and generally don't do much of anything outside of that, until they're ready to go off and win in one big turn? How does a deck like this deal with those?

There are plenty of cards that create tokens for your opponents (and yourself) to your advantage.

This deck wouldn't be a bad spot to put in Varchild, Betrayer of Kjeldor and Varchild's War-Riders.

Other cards that will force combat from your opponents: Forbidden Orchard, Hunted Troll, Hunted Dragon, Seed The Land and Genesis Chamber(though you may want to choose opponents to give tokens to), Terastodon, Waiting in the Weeds, Kamahl, Fist of Krosa (to be cruel and make their lands attack or force them to empty their mana during combat then get them with Scorpion God), Beast Within, Death by Dragons, Rite of the Raging Storm, Akroan Horse, Goblin Spymaster, and the great Sylvan Offering.

Also, Ophiomancer or Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs as other deterrents. And Druid's Call, if you want to make Thantis blocking a big creature a punishment. Bitter Feud can incentivize opponents (or the Curses) to swing at each other.

You might as well run Ishkanah, Grafwidow and Dragonlair Spider just to take advantage of the tokens (and if you have both Dragonlair and Ishkanah out, a potential damage outlet)

You can use Cryptolith Rite and Seedborn Muse to lessen the effects of "attack each turn if able".

Would Hunted Troll, Hunted Dragon, and Hunted Horror have a place in this deck?

In the same vein as Seedborn Muse, there's also Quest for Renewal for creatures and Nature's Will and Bear Umbra for lands. And there's not a lot we can do for vigilance in Jund aside from Sight of the Scalelords and Akroma's Memorial. Also, Gorm the Great looks good here as an alternative lure effect.

Some valid points, Tears. However, if we are forcing all of your opponents to attack, chances are some of them will attack the creatureless control player as well. And just because we are forcing others to attack and defending ourselves with rattlesnakes doesn't mean we can't attack the control player ourselves and/or control their boardstate with permanent removal.

Seems like relatively similar idea to my Gahiji, Honored One (with the obvious change of one color and already having 'each creature attacks' on command zone instead of a buff for attacking someone else). Let's see what I find that could be fun in this context:

Bitter Feud: picking two opponents; either they team up and try to tear down through your defenses, or they blow up each other.
Deadly Recluse is a pretty innocent common that's saved me from many random attacks. Like a little brother to your commander.
Reincarnation is nice to have in hand when someone (inevitably) gets tired of one of your key creatures.
On the higher end, Silverclad Ferocidons can make people think twice about coming at you... or blocking it.
Similarly, Assembled Alphas seems to ride somewhere between 'I don't like it' and 'I don't want to waste a kill spell on it'.
And for one more high-ender, Engulfing Slagwurm tends to survive combat for some reason...
Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs gets you things if they come at you. With which then to hit back.
Hornet Nest. For relatively obvious and fun reasons.
Best one-drop of the deck: Sedge Scorpion. Cute lil' thing with great flavor text.
Depending how far you go defensively, Trove of Temptation, despite overlapping with your commander a bit, could be beneficial.

Hope here's something to use

As for the players without creatures part, Charging Cinderhorn and Crimson Honor Guard can punish them for not playing ball. Rite of the Raging Storm makes them play ball. Shaman of Forgotten Ways is decent ramp and pretty punishing for people who do not run creatures.

Quote from ilovesaprolings »

What about some "backstabby" group hug cards?
Example: predator, flagship
You can give your creatures flying and be evasive
You can give opponents creatures flying. You don't care since you have reach, they will kill each other.
You can give a lot of creatures flying and then wrath.

Cards like that, that can power up your opponent, but you can also be sure they won't kill you with that power. I can't think about other cards like that right now, though...

How about Vow of Malice, Vow of Lightning, and Vow of Wildness? People will be forced to attack, might as well make sure they can't attack you. :3

Rattlesnakes, you say? How dreadful!

Quote from joeyb11223 »

couple of other cards that act as rattlesnakes

Wall of souls any fatties which lack evasion won't want to come your way

Royal Assassin nice ability and won't have to attack on your turn since you've tapped it.

vindictive lich

Adding Kiku, Night's Flower to that list?