I've decided to build a Boros RW angel tribal deck and I need advice on which angel to use as a commander. I want to use an angel so that I can use Path of Ancestry and take best advantage of casting cost lowering from Herald's Horn, Herald of War, and Urza's Incubator. Keep in mind that I'm fairly new to EDH, as I have around 30 games under my belt. Winning is not a primary concern to me, though I do like winning occasionally and thus far haven't won a single game yet. Razia, Boros Archangel, Aurelia, the Warleader, and Gisela, Blade of Goldnight are names I've seen and angels that have been suggested to me. I also see Anya, Merciless Angel and Basandra, Battle Seraph as options.
Gisela and Aurelia are obviously powerful, but Basandra, Razia, or Anya could stip under the radar until I'm ready to strike. I want to get away from commanders that are as much of a lightning rod, possibly, as Kaalia of the Vast is. I get beaten down hard, even before she gets cast the first time. Even sometimes when I'm manascrewed people will come after me just because they see Kaalia in the command zone. Are there other options that I've missed?
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"Cut it down, bury it in the snow, put it to the torch. The rose will still bloom again."
That being said, your curve and ramp will be crucial. The colours aren't super conducive to good ramp, so you'll have to take what you can get and make it count as much as you can.
I went w/ Archangel Avacyn, while not the most powerful of the bunch she's the most versatile and works really well w/ Oketra's Monument.
People just forget she has flash constantly.
Good point, and she's reasonably costed too - I assume you could get a lot from her with a blink package such as Eldrazi Displacer, Cloudshift and so forth.
I like the idea of Cloudshift too, for that reason, as well as because it has Avacyn on it. That's the same reason I put Anguished Unmaking in my Kaalia deck, because it tells the end of Avacyn's story. That, and I happened to have the Game Day promo version of it.
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"Cut it down, bury it in the snow, put it to the torch. The rose will still bloom again."
It's a decent card with a decent trick on it. Plus it can be found with Sunforger (sorry to keep mentioning this, but it's worth running), or you can stick it under an Isochron Scepter.
Yup. Both sides have their value too. The front can help protect your boardstate, the back will scorch token swarms and clear the board for you. She's definitely usable. And reasonably priced to cast. (Also, reasonably priced to buy now following the FtV reprint)
I'll put forth a vote for Gisela, Blade of Goldnight or Archangel Avacyn, as they are the most effective options without presenting too much of a threat (the other options are still potential targets or depressingly weak). As discussed before you'll want to focus pretty hard on artifact ramp and card draw so you can reliably get your hands on, and cast, your powerhouse angels.
You'll probably find Land Tax and Scroll Rack will blow your budget. If I were to spend on them I'd be down $80NZD. Same with the sword and Gilded Lotus, they're both up there. Unfortunately, there's not a lot than can replicate the awesomeness of land tax. Oath of Lieges is ok, but sharing isn't fantastic. If you're turning creatures sideways a lot there's Explorer's Scope - the good side is the trigger isn't forcing you to reveal the card. The bad side is if you don't see a land you're stuck with the card either way. There's also Dowsing Dagger, which I'd recommend here, it could be very strong. Based on Lotus Vale, but actually probably better outside of a deck with land recursion. And with a flying general, it'll flip very quick.
I'm dumb. I put Land Tax and Scroll Rack as ramp... that's actually a card draw combo, better if you have shuffle effects. As for getting more ETB triggers off of things, I can also use Emancipation Angel, but that's a worse option than blinking because I have to recast them.
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"Cut it down, bury it in the snow, put it to the torch. The rose will still bloom again."
Here's where I stand currently. I really like Boros Gisela and Aurelia. Anya could make for an interesting dark horse choice, because she becomes stronger late game. Still, she seems underwhelming to me.
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"Cut it down, bury it in the snow, put it to the torch. The rose will still bloom again."
While I love me some Razia, there's no reason other than wanting to make your game harder to run her as a Commander. And I say this as someone who bought a foil Ravnica Razoa last year just for that. She is so over costed and underpowered compared to nearly every other option.
I agree with this. She's enormously expensive at 8 mana, 4 of which needs specific colours, and her ability is weak for all of that.
I'm dumb. I put Land Tax and Scroll Rack as ramp... that's actually a card draw combo, better if you have shuffle effects. As for getting more ETB triggers off of things, I can also use Emancipation Angel, but that's a worse option than blinking because I have to recast them.
I mean it's two sides of the same coin really, the more cards you draw the higher the likelihood you hit your land drops. This is why I suggest Mindmoil to all and sundry - there's few better ways to see every card in your deck. Emancipation Angel isn't all that strong, I'd probably pass on it personally. If you can't afford Eldrazi Displacer there's always Conjurer's Closet. Restoration Angel would work for these guys too, just not for any angels.
Here's where I stand currently. I really like Boros Gisela and Aurelia. Anya could make for an interesting dark horse choice, because she becomes stronger late game. Still, she seems underwhelming to me.
I think you'd be setting the bar high using Anya - or you'd be playing a seriously ruthless deck aiming to bleed your opponents very quickly. From the choices you've suggested, I'd go with Gisela. If it were me building, I'd spend a couple bucks and grab an Archangel Avacyn.
How about Teferi's Puzzle Box? Maybe make everyone's game chaotic. I don't want to go ruthless, or I'll have the same problems that I have with Kaalia. Everyone targeting me, a lot of the time before I'm even a threat.
Here's where I stand currently. I really like Boros Gisela and Aurelia. Anya could make for an interesting dark horse choice, because she becomes stronger late game. Still, she seems underwhelming to me.
Anya's pretty crap. She sort of becomes stronger, but then once people start dying she sucks, so you want to keep people sort-of-alive without killing them. That's a real hard thing to do. And even if you do it, she still sorta sucks.
gisela I think is highly overrated. She's a big threat and will usually die quickly. Aurelia is certainly strong but she's more likely to be ignored, plus her haste means she'll almost always get some good hits in even if she's killed, and you also can't get blown out by having her killed at an inopportune time like gisela. Plus getting double sword triggers and such is way cooler than just killing people faster imo.
How about Teferi's Puzzle Box? Maybe make everyone's game chaotic. I don't want to go ruthless, or I'll have the same problems that I have with Kaalia. Everyone targeting me, a lot of the time before I'm even a threat.
This depends on your meta to me. The more people cycle the more likely they draw into a win con. But then some decks it will put off.
The other crazy option (and I only mention it because we're talking crazy) is Possibility Storm. It's a good way of getting some bombs into play. You play a cheap ass mana rock and possibly upgrade it to Sword of Feast and Famine or whatever cool stuff you have in the deck. Cast a chump blocker and storm into a big fat angel. It also makes controlling the boardstate hard to manage for your opponents - sure they might storm into a bomb creature, but chances are the timing isn't great on it, and there's a really good chance you're putting off their plays. Being that its a chaos card it's hard to plan perfectly, but I know for a fact that it's a ton of fun.
Anya's pretty crap. She sort of becomes stronger, but then once people start dying she sucks, so you want to keep people sort-of-alive without killing them. That's a real hard thing to do.
Possibility Storm is something that I hadn't thought of playing, and guessing I won't. I even find Teferi's Puzzle Box a bit annoying, and if it's on the table I'll deal with it if possible before my artifact destruction card goes bye-bye. I do really want to play Boros angels. I'd thought briefly of going with Selesnya so I could play Gabriel Angelfire, the card I named myself after.. but he kinda sucks, and it's very weird to have an angel that doesn't always have flying. I just happened to pull him in the first pack of Magic cards I ever opened.
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"Cut it down, bury it in the snow, put it to the torch. The rose will still bloom again."
Possibility Storm is something that I hadn't thought of playing, and guessing I won't. I even find Teferi's Puzzle Box a bit annoying, and if it's on the table I'll deal with it if possible before my artifact destruction card goes bye-bye.
Fair enough, it's not for everyone. It's a pet card of mine, and it is an option to help with board presence mid-game, but if you don't want chaos, you don't want chaos.
Basandra, Battle Seraph would be my first choice just because it has nice art. Remember, players can't cast spells during combat, but, you can activate abilities, including cycling. Why mention that specifically? Astral Slide. You can blink out Basandra when you do want to cast spells and keep her on the board when you want others not to. You can't get it as consistently as Zur, but white does have Enlightened Tutor and Idyllic Tutor. You can add in a package that punishes creatures that attack like Lightmine Field as well as the more common punisher cards if they decide to come at you.
She's not the strongest choice, but she looks nice.
Based on OPs needs, I'd go Avacyn. She's less of a lightning rod than Aurelia or Gisela, who draw hate in casual metas because they have threatening effects, and lets him protect his angels from board wipes.
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I'm a girl, btw. Gabrielle Angelfire... well... meh. You gave solid advice though. I'll strongly consider a deck with Archangel Avacyn at the helm. I'll likely brew one today and have it up in the multiplayer decklists sometime in the next couple days.
I'm a girl, btw. Gabrielle Angelfire... well... meh. You gave solid advice though. I'll strongly consider a deck with Archangel Avacyn at the helm. I'll likely brew one today and have it up in the multiplayer decklists sometime in the next couple days.
Don't know about anyone else, but I'd figured it out, for what that matters. Considering the original card is Gabriel Angelfire it seemed obvious.
Anyway, I'm pleased to see Archangel Avacyn took the forefront. I think it would be an interesting deck, with lots of avenues to explore.
Yes, and I can even abandon the angel theme if I REALLY want to and go with Boros control. I don't think I will, though.. I can still do like midrange with this setup with angel tribal.
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"Cut it down, bury it in the snow, put it to the torch. The rose will still bloom again."
Yeah, it's totally doable! AA is good board control with options, so you've got a good start. Angel tribal will be easy enough, it's just going to be a case of choosing well. To my mind, the best angels are the ones that help stabilize the board or give you some element of control and having protection for them available in your command zone is perfect.
Unfortunately, Basandra says "Players" rather than "Opponents" which would make her great, but I did my best to try and convince OP even though Avacyn is better. As for angels in the colors, they have a high cmc overall so it's often better to be picky and just get some rather than the full tribal, maybe mix it up with humans as well with support like Bruna, the Fading Light and Angel of Glory's Rise. There's a lot of good Humans in the colors like Grand Abolisher, Mentor of the Meek for CA, Recruiter of the Guard for tutoring, and more.
Gisela and Aurelia are obviously powerful, but Basandra, Razia, or Anya could stip under the radar until I'm ready to strike. I want to get away from commanders that are as much of a lightning rod, possibly, as Kaalia of the Vast is. I get beaten down hard, even before she gets cast the first time. Even sometimes when I'm manascrewed people will come after me just because they see Kaalia in the command zone. Are there other options that I've missed?
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
With Gisela, you can add things like Gratuitous Violence and Furnace of Rath, Inquisitor's Flail to curve into her and really bring the pain when she drops. So I guess, I'd probably go for her.
That being said, your curve and ramp will be crucial. The colours aren't super conducive to good ramp, so you'll have to take what you can get and make it count as much as you can.
Good point, and she's reasonably costed too - I assume you could get a lot from her with a blink package such as Eldrazi Displacer, Cloudshift and so forth.
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
These mostly look good. I don't recommend Sphere of the Suns though, it's not amazing by any stretch. There's also Gift of Estates, and if you're running things like Kor Cartographer and Knight of the White Orchid, there's also Oreskos Explorer and blinking them with Eldrazi Displacer and similar.
You'll probably find Land Tax and Scroll Rack will blow your budget. If I were to spend on them I'd be down $80NZD. Same with the sword and Gilded Lotus, they're both up there. Unfortunately, there's not a lot than can replicate the awesomeness of land tax. Oath of Lieges is ok, but sharing isn't fantastic. If you're turning creatures sideways a lot there's Explorer's Scope - the good side is the trigger isn't forcing you to reveal the card. The bad side is if you don't see a land you're stuck with the card either way. There's also Dowsing Dagger, which I'd recommend here, it could be very strong. Based on Lotus Vale, but actually probably better outside of a deck with land recursion. And with a flying general, it'll flip very quick.
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
I agree with this. She's enormously expensive at 8 mana, 4 of which needs specific colours, and her ability is weak for all of that.
I mean it's two sides of the same coin really, the more cards you draw the higher the likelihood you hit your land drops. This is why I suggest Mindmoil to all and sundry - there's few better ways to see every card in your deck. Emancipation Angel isn't all that strong, I'd probably pass on it personally. If you can't afford Eldrazi Displacer there's always Conjurer's Closet. Restoration Angel would work for these guys too, just not for any angels.
I think you'd be setting the bar high using Anya - or you'd be playing a seriously ruthless deck aiming to bleed your opponents very quickly. From the choices you've suggested, I'd go with Gisela. If it were me building, I'd spend a couple bucks and grab an Archangel Avacyn.
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
gisela I think is highly overrated. She's a big threat and will usually die quickly. Aurelia is certainly strong but she's more likely to be ignored, plus her haste means she'll almost always get some good hits in even if she's killed, and you also can't get blown out by having her killed at an inopportune time like gisela. Plus getting double sword triggers and such is way cooler than just killing people faster imo.
Personally I'd go aurelia or avacyn.
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Phelddagrif - Zirilan
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Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
This depends on your meta to me. The more people cycle the more likely they draw into a win con. But then some decks it will put off.
The other crazy option (and I only mention it because we're talking crazy) is Possibility Storm. It's a good way of getting some bombs into play. You play a cheap ass mana rock and possibly upgrade it to Sword of Feast and Famine or whatever cool stuff you have in the deck. Cast a chump blocker and storm into a big fat angel. It also makes controlling the boardstate hard to manage for your opponents - sure they might storm into a bomb creature, but chances are the timing isn't great on it, and there's a really good chance you're putting off their plays. Being that its a chaos card it's hard to plan perfectly, but I know for a fact that it's a ton of fun.
I totally agree with this.
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
Fair enough, it's not for everyone. It's a pet card of mine, and it is an option to help with board presence mid-game, but if you don't want chaos, you don't want chaos.
She's not the strongest choice, but she looks nice.
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Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
Don't know about anyone else, but I'd figured it out, for what that matters. Considering the original card is Gabriel Angelfire it seemed obvious.
Anyway, I'm pleased to see Archangel Avacyn took the forefront. I think it would be an interesting deck, with lots of avenues to explore.
RWArchangel Avacyn, GWNazahn, Revered Bladesmith, RKari Zev, Skyship Raider (French Duel)
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