Then they could have taken their own advice and house-ruled it for their insulated group, not forced it on everyone else.
As you're clearly well informed about the RC's playgroup, could you shed some light on it? What can you tell us about it? Where are the RC all located?
While you're here, care to explain this change (for 45 days no less)?
Not going to answer my question? You speak with such authority on these things.
We did it because we think it'll be fun and an appropriate celebration of the new set. Try it!
It's 45 days because it's a celebration and we felt that was long enough for people to get a chance to play and short enough not to wear out the welcome. It's also a fairly obvious date.
As we expected, there's been a lot of strong reactions, both positive and negative, to the Un-Celebration. Thanks to all of you who have kept the discourse civilized. We think it'll be a fun six weeks.
However, we've decided that we need to ban an additional card. Nerf War isn't problematic mechanically, and we figured that we didn't need to tell people that they were responsible for making sure not to damage other people's cards. However, we're seeing a lot of people planning a shock and awe approach to try and force a concession, and that's very much missing the spirit of the format. It's also a bit problematic encouraging people to run around game stores and conventions with gun-like objects, and so we feel that Nerf War needs to be removed.
Let's be clear on this: if you are looking for ways to damage an opponent's cards, either out of spite or a desire to get them to concede, we encourage your playgroup, local game store or other organizer to take appropriate action to prevent this.
While we have your attention, we want to clear up a few other pieces of speculation.
* At no point did Wizards ask us to do this. When we told them the plan, they were supportive, but, as normal, they left us to our own devices.
* This is not a test or trial period. It's a chance to do something a little different for a few weeks, and then we'll go back to the usual Commander rules. The only consequence after then for the foreseeable future is that a few playgroups may have discovered some cards they enjoy playing with.
* We have no interest in jeopardizing our various positions in the Magic community for a small short-term profit and have made no effort to buy and sell silver-bordered cards to do so. Full disclosure: I picked up a Hascon promo set when they became available.
Then they could have taken their own advice and house-ruled it for their insulated group, not forced it on everyone else.
As you're clearly well informed about the RC's playgroup, could you shed some light on it? What can you tell us about it? Where are the RC all located?
While you're here, care to explain this change (for 45 days no less)?
Not going to answer my question? You speak with such authority on these things.
We did it because we think it'll be fun and an appropriate celebration of the new set. Try it!
It's 45 days because it's a celebration and we felt that was long enough for people to get a chance to play and short enough not to wear out the welcome. It's also a fairly obvious date.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
As much as I am against conceding out of spite, I don't think I'd be able to hold back if I got targeted by Gifts Given.
Control Magic effects are the only thing I don't enjoy playing against. I don't imagine that the cringe on my face from when my opponents take control of permanents is a welcoming look.
Flicking the corners of my cards each time you tap and re-tap and untap and tap...and then spend another 2 minutes re-thinking your attack step is annoying. I don't want to think about how I respond to someone flicking through their hand when 2 of my cards are in it.
And then having to explain to someone who wants to add 4 mana without tearing their Blacker Lotus into pieces...
Then they could have taken their own advice and house-ruled it for their insulated group, not forced it on everyone else.
As you're clearly well informed about the RC's playgroup, could you shed some light on it? What can you tell us about it? Where are the RC all located?
While you're here, care to explain this change (for 45 days no less)?
Not going to answer my question? You speak with such authority on these things.
We did it because we think it'll be fun and an appropriate celebration of the new set. Try it!
It's 45 days because it's a celebration and we felt that was long enough for people to get a chance to play and short enough not to wear out the welcome. It's also a fairly obvious date.
I am honestly not sure if you are asking a legitimate question requesting clarity or complaining about the temporary nature of Un-Card inclusions, so I am just going to answer it for both.
Yes, this only goes until January 15th. After that point, the "official" rules will revert to what they were and Un cards are no longer legal in the format.
You couldn't do this a week ago either. Unless, of course, you spoke with your playgroup and allowed it. Nothing stops you from doing that once this is done.
If you don't like that this is temporary, then don't participate. I know I won't be because I don't like Un-Cards in EDH. Once the time for this is up, you will have two options: 1) go back to what your playgroup did before and appreciate the time this gave you to play these cards or 2) work with your playgroup to keep this going as a house rule.
As much as I am against conceding out of spite, I don't think I'd be able to hold back if I got targeted by Gifts Given.
Control Magic effects are the only thing I don't enjoy playing against. I don't imagine that the cringe on my face from when my opponents take control of permanents is a welcoming look.
Flicking the corners of my cards each time you tap and re-tap and untap and tap...and then spend another 2 minutes re-thinking your attack step is annoying. I don't want to think about how I respond to someone flicking through their hand when 2 of my cards are in it.
And then having to explain to someone who wants to add 4 mana without tearing their Blacker Lotus into pieces...
If it's any consolation, X is technically in your hand when your opponent sends it there. They also have the option of giving you cards of their own thanks to Naughty // Nice.
Hell, you can even voluntarily change control with Zedruu. Players voluntarily give their cards (or non-voluntarily) with way more black cards than silver cards. Cards like Rainbow Vale, Humble Defector, Akroan Horse, Chaos Lord, Avarice Amulet, Karona, False God, etc. are controlled by opponents most of the time. Scrambleverse changes control of cards as well in a way wackier way than say Gifts Given. 100% of the cards with said effects that aren't silver-bordered are legal in Commander.
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We did it because we think it'll be fun and an appropriate celebration of the new set. Try it!
It's 45 days because it's a celebration and we felt that was long enough for people to get a chance to play and short enough not to wear out the welcome. It's also a fairly obvious date.
I'd like to apologize for any rumor mongering I may have caused with my comments. I am glad however that you did address them in the post regarding Nerf war.
As you're clearly well informed about the RC's playgroup, could you shed some light on it? What can you tell us about it? Where are the RC all located?
While you're here, care to explain this change (for 45 days no less)?
Not going to answer my question? You speak with such authority on these things.
We did it because we think it'll be fun and an appropriate celebration of the new set. Try it!
It's 45 days because it's a celebration and we felt that was long enough for people to get a chance to play and short enough not to wear out the welcome. It's also a fairly obvious date.
I am honestly not sure if you are asking a legitimate question requesting clarity or complaining about the temporary nature of Un-Card inclusions, so I am just going to answer it for both.
Yes, this only goes until January 15th. After that point, the "official" rules will revert to what they were and Un cards are no longer legal in the format.
You couldn't do this a week ago either. Unless, of course, you spoke with your playgroup and allowed it. Nothing stops you from doing that once this is done.
If you don't like that this is temporary, then don't participate. I know I won't be because I don't like Un-Cards in EDH. Once the time for this is up, you will have two options: 1) go back to what your playgroup did before and appreciate the time this gave you to play these cards or 2) work with your playgroup to keep this going as a house rule.
Thanks for the answers because yes, it was a legit question.
I still don't understand the disdain for silver-bordered cards when there are black-bordered cards that are much worse. They get banned when they're too warping or broken. So an eventual unbanning of certain silver-bordered cards and not most of them is not something that should be blindly discarded due to the card's border. Just as Organ Harvest is practically black-bordered Scrambleverse is practically silver-bordered; one of these is banned and the other isn't simply because of their border. That's the logic I don't like accepting. Cards should be banned based on how they interact with the environment or the gameplay and not whether they're black or silver - especially in this format which chose to base itself off of the eternal format card pool even though it doesn't really follow the eternal format card pool because the bannings aren't the same.
And yes, I agree, house rules are a given, but that's true for any game. Look no further than all the house rules you gotta learn with Monopoly. However, if you want to play Monopoly with other people, you'd have to either establish house rules before playing or follow the already established rules. That's fine for that example because the boardgame already comes with everything needed to play. Not Magic: the Gathering, though. You have to build your own deck beforehand with cards from an allowable list in order to go to any place and everything will have built it with the same rules. Sure, you can have a plan B in case your house rules align and you can whip out your The Big Idea deck, but that's not what's really being discussed here. If I take the time to build around a deck only for house rules, it's not really all that viable if I spend money to not be able to play it outside of my circle. I'm talking about going to friendly environments like LGS's or being invited to play at other pods with new people and still be able to take my deck without fear of having to make swaps or not being able to take it altogether. Building a deck with Grusilder, Monster Masher at the helm becomes completely useless with any other legendary creature in the same colors. So unless it's legal, I can't really use it anywhere I want to. That's very disenheartening.
Again, I'm not begging for cards like Volrath's Motion Sensor, Handcuffs, Magical Hacker, Vile Bile to be legal. There are plenty of legal cards with which very annoying decks are built and grunt as you may, you play against those decks because it follows the deckbuilding rules. You don't bat an eyelash because the cards have a silver-border. So I can drop Stasis, Eon Hub in the same turn and undoubtedly some people are gonna get annoyed but nobody's gonna flip the table. If I played a super chaotic Zedruu the Greathearted deck with Scrambleverse and similar cards people aren't gonna flip the table. But you're going to crucify the RC because now I have the "audacity" to play cards like Fowl Play and The Cheese Stands Alone until Jan. 15? You're going to feel insulted simply because I played a silver-bordered card now that they're legal to play with for a month and a half? (Oh, I'm using the pronoun you as referring to those who feel this way - it's not a personal attack against "you" in particular, it's just the pronoun I'm using in my argument).
That is the logic that I honestly don't understand. And I don't say that condescendingly or insultingly. I honestly don't get the unwarrented hatred to all silver-bordered cards. I can understand certain types of silver-bordered cards. But if I want to run Amateur Auteur which is literally just another Felidar Cub, Kami of Ancient Law, Keening Apparition, and Ronom Unicorn then I simply can't just because it's silver-bordered? People are legit insulted if I play Amateur Auteur instead of Kami of Ancient Law? Or if I want to be able to play all 5 cards in the same deck?
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By default, no. Think of this as a great opportunity to show your friends how much fun that can be and see what happens afterwards.
Ah, I see. Well, thanks for making them legal then until then. People wouldn't be able to deny me using these cards until then - which is awesome. Hopefully no one boycotts this by hiding away for the next 44 days. It would be nice for people to be more open to the inclusion of some of these cards. Maybe in some distant future this will be a thing. I can't force my tastes onto others but for the next 44 days I will responsibly play with silver.
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It would have been considerate if the RC had at the very least made this change optional (as in "Hey, why not try some Un-Commander this month? It's just like Commander, except silver-bordered cards are legal!") rather than unilaterally sticking everyone with their idea of a good time.
As it happens, we were finalizing weekly Commander tournaments at our LGS. That's off the rails for six weeks now as the change was met with... resistance from our regulars.
Perhaps we should try advertising Un-Un-Commander tournaments, but that's almost as silly as the decision to make silver-bordered cards legal.
I feel that an UnCommander format is something that Wizards will probably do. As for putting tournaments and everything else on hold I have mixed feelings. I've seen people literally say: "unless it's legal by what the Rules Committee says then it's not legal and I won't allow it" yet now that it is in fact legal, those same people are trying to ignore it all the same. So when it was for their benefit then RC is to be followed but the moment it isn't then the RC can be ignored; to me that is a double-standard. That being said, the ambiguity of some silver-bordered cards are a rules nightmare. So I can understand judges postponing tournaments or banning them since Oracle hasn't been updated for them. Making judgment calls is very difficult for these otherwise. So that part is understandable. The spirit of resistance I'm not too on board with.
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so,today I played in a game with uncards including Nerf War, when I mentioned it was banned this morning the player who had asked if he could still use it, I said I was fine with it for one game. He used it informing me that he had tested both a small four shot nerf gun and his larger capacity one using his most expensive deck and he said that if he felt okay with someone shooting that deck, we should okay. He also pointed out that he wasn't going to be one of those players who pull out the missile or the other larger Nerf guns.
My concern was mainly the fact that my sleeves being new were still slippery, but as it was he was only able to knock three off. And it also made his tribal dino deck legit since he uses Grim lock for it
It would have been considerate if the RC had at the very least made this change optional (as in "Hey, why not try some Un-Commander this month? It's just like Commander, except silver-bordered cards are legal!") rather than unilaterally sticking everyone with their idea of a good time.
As it happens, we were finalizing weekly Commander tournaments at our LGS. That's off the rails for six weeks now as the change was met with... resistance from our regulars.
Perhaps we should try advertising Un-Un-Commander tournaments, but that's almost as silly as the decision to make silver-bordered cards legal.to have a commander tournament
fixed
EDIT: I'm going to quote a post form I think papa_funk that in response o a person's post on reddit :
The banlist was carefully considered. By design, it's a bit more laissez-faire than it would be for a long-term plan (we chose to lean towards letting people play the cards), and you'll note that the announcement talked about being careful with several cards beyond just those that were banned. The fundamental questions we asked were "does this card work within the structure of Commander?" and "is this card such a mess that the games are going to just be awful?" If it did not meet those criteria, we preferred to give the community a chance at it.
Commander is, fundamentally, a format focused on social play. If someone is so desperate to win that they feel the need to tear up a hard-to-find Magic card they own, then I guess that's a thing they can do.
Honestly, the number of posts worrying about ripping up cards has already vastly exceeded the number of Blacker Lotuses we actually expect to be ripped up over the next few weeks.
As for cards like Necro-Impotence, it may be broken in competitive play, but we do not expect it to be a problem in casual games. This puts it in line with cards like Ad Nauseum, Hermit Druid, Protean Hulk, the original Necro and many other black bordered cards. We have always been very up front that, while people are welcome to enjoy Commander however they please, our focus is on social, rather than cutthroat, play.
The RC has long held the position that out-of-the-box Commander is not a well-designed format for tournament play and prizes, and that a TO who wishes to offer such should spend some effort to alter the format to make it work as they want it to. For example, we completely support SCG's decision to not allow silver-bordered cards this weekend.
If TOs use this as an opportunity to examine how they want their tournaments to be run and learn to tailor appropriately even after the event is over, we consider that a win.
As to judge questions, speaking as a judge, I think you'll find that a) most of the concerns are in corners that won't come up in game play very often and b) making a ruling in the spirit of the format is totally fine.
We just posted an update to the banlist (banning Nerf War) and will certainly revisit the banlist if we feel a need to, but we prefer to use a light hand here. The Chaos Confetti combo is far from an issue. It's incredibly convoluted, and there already exist several thousand easier ways to win the game.
The rules of Commander also don't trump the basic rules of humanity. You are expected to treat other people's property with respect and not attempt to damage it. If you feel that is too great a burden, please find something else to do.
Were this a long-term thing, we certainly would ban the dexterity cards (and a stack of others). As a short-term event, we expect local groups to make appropriate accommodations. As I mentioned above, TOs are encouraged to tailor their events and if I were running one where I knew a player might have difficulty, I'd be happy to volunteer to help them out.
The "likely disadvantage" is, I think, overblown. Most of the cards aren't great enough that you must include them, and if you're looking for the tiniest of edges for your deck, you're already voiding the warranty. As for dealing with the cards in opponent's decks, we looked at each one and asked "would this be a problem if the opponent immediately conceded the minigame or the other part of the card just happened" as part of the evaluation, and the cards end up being generally fine. People worrying about arm wrestling don't notice that the "reward" is spending 3 mana for a 3/3 vanilla creature.
Hopefully this clears up some things. I hope it'll be a fun event for folks; understand that a lot of people are embracing it. Give it a shot!
EDIT: I'm going to quote a post form I think papa_funk that in response o a person's post on reddit :
The banlist was carefully considered. By design, it's a bit more laissez-faire than it would be for a long-term plan (we chose to lean towards letting people play the cards), and you'll note that the announcement talked about being careful with several cards beyond just those that were banned. The fundamental questions we asked were "does this card work within the structure of Commander?" and "is this card such a mess that the games are going to just be awful?" If it did not meet those criteria, we preferred to give the community a chance at it.
Commander is, fundamentally, a format focused on social play. If someone is so desperate to win that they feel the need to tear up a hard-to-find Magic card they own, then I guess that's a thing they can do.
Honestly, the number of posts worrying about ripping up cards has already vastly exceeded the number of Blacker Lotuses we actually expect to be ripped up over the next few weeks.
As for cards like Necro-Impotence, it may be broken in competitive play, but we do not expect it to be a problem in casual games. This puts it in line with cards like Ad Nauseum, Hermit Druid, Protean Hulk, the original Necro and many other black bordered cards. We have always been very up front that, while people are welcome to enjoy Commander however they please, our focus is on social, rather than cutthroat, play.
The RC has long held the position that out-of-the-box Commander is not a well-designed format for tournament play and prizes, and that a TO who wishes to offer such should spend some effort to alter the format to make it work as they want it to. For example, we completely support SCG's decision to not allow silver-bordered cards this weekend.
If TOs use this as an opportunity to examine how they want their tournaments to be run and learn to tailor appropriately even after the event is over, we consider that a win.
As to judge questions, speaking as a judge, I think you'll find that a) most of the concerns are in corners that won't come up in game play very often and b) making a ruling in the spirit of the format is totally fine.
We just posted an update to the banlist (banning Nerf War) and will certainly revisit the banlist if we feel a need to, but we prefer to use a light hand here. The Chaos Confetti combo is far from an issue. It's incredibly convoluted, and there already exist several thousand easier ways to win the game.
The rules of Commander also don't trump the basic rules of humanity. You are expected to treat other people's property with respect and not attempt to damage it. If you feel that is too great a burden, please find something else to do.
Were this a long-term thing, we certainly would ban the dexterity cards (and a stack of others). As a short-term event, we expect local groups to make appropriate accommodations. As I mentioned above, TOs are encouraged to tailor their events and if I were running one where I knew a player might have difficulty, I'd be happy to volunteer to help them out.
The "likely disadvantage" is, I think, overblown. Most of the cards aren't great enough that you must include them, and if you're looking for the tiniest of edges for your deck, you're already voiding the warranty. As for dealing with the cards in opponent's decks, we looked at each one and asked "would this be a problem if the opponent immediately conceded the minigame or the other part of the card just happened" as part of the evaluation, and the cards end up being generally fine. People worrying about arm wrestling don't notice that the "reward" is spending 3 mana for a 3/3 vanilla creature.
Hopefully this clears up some things. I hope it'll be a fun event for folks; understand that a lot of people are embracing it. Give it a shot!
Thanks for linking this. It's very important being as it clears up a lot of doubts based on the decision for the RC. It also shows that they didn't just halfass it and it is in the spirit of fun. They also point out many obvious things such as the fact that there are more broken cards in black-bordered and in order to truly break silver-bordered cards it would have to be overly convoluted.
I like the idea of using 1 of every contraption instead of a custom contraption deck of 15.
Would you allow me to play it in a non-green deck we played a game?
Unfortunately, I wouldn't allow it. It breaks the fundamental rules of commander of color identity. Besides, there are green cards that help you assemble contraptions (Steamflogger Service Rep) as well as abuse the fact that you'd have 9 contraptions from Crossbreed Labs (like Druid of the Sacred Beaker). With so few overall cards that assemble contraptions, more than likely you'd have to build a 5C deck in order to really get your mileage.
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Though hilarious, I find this to be a rather clumsy and impetuous decision by the RC, who I believe underestimate the impact that this decision would have on the format. EDH isn't just a small casual splinter format anymore. CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, but I believe it's the second-most popular way to play magic behind Standard Constructed, and just like regular games of magic it's now enjoyed in places ranging from kitchen tables, to LGS, and to growing numbers of tournaments and side events at official functions where people bring their most competitive decks.
Un-sets throw a massive wrench into all of those settings, and the ephemeral nature of this unbanning means it's a complete waste of investment into Unglued and Unhinged, since at least with Unstable it's a current release and people will have cards to mess around with after they've drafted it that would otherwise be useless.
At most I think they should've made a Whitelist for a few completely fair unstable cards like Grusilda, Monster Masher and Grimlock, Dinobot Leader. Though it has potential to be fun for a few games, this just seems a little on the impulsive side.
And you have people clamouring for WotC to take over. Well done RC this talk is gonna escalate.
Can't wait when Commander goes under WotC's hands.
Because Wizards has never screwed anything up. Clearly, they never had cards that need instant-errata before they were even released (Hostage Taker, Ordinary Pony - in the two most recent sets alone). They've never had to ban mass quantities of cards that unbalance Standard or make a twocard infinite combo in the same block.
And they've certainly never made a decision that some people disagree with. [/sarcasm]
Face it - you can't please all of the people all of the time. If you hate the RC so much, you must really hate the format they created. Or not? I wonder if the RC ever gets tired of so many armchair/keyboard warriors second-guessing their every move.
I don't see Wizards doing any better of a job, and frankly, I think they might do far worse. Do I agree with every decision from the RC? Nope (looking at you, Iona). But I love the format, and I feel the RC has a much better track record than WOTC.
The more I think about it, the more I think most of he complaints about silver border in commander are kind of dumb. I mean if you won't want to do silly things like the hokey pokey, then you shouldn't play cards that involve it. I mean it's not like they're even good cards so if you run the silly cards, its because you want to be. Of course, if your opponent challenges you to a breath holding contest, arm wrestling, or whatever, you could just refuse and let them have their on curve or slightly below curve limited fodder. I mean really, are any silly cards actually good other than enter the dungeon? Does it really matter if you can't make a vanilla 4/4 for 3 filip right or throw a 6/6 for 7 with split second that might fight stuff properly? I mean who plays gruel ragebeast that much anyway? If you don't want to put your head on the table, you could just play the better vampire from commander 2017 or the black gearhulk. Who cares about he vanilla 5/5 gluteus maximus other than the cracks about how you can't stop touching your ass? I bet it's really the stuff like necro impotence and Jack in the mox that have the spikes up in arms about how it might affect power level. I'm personally looking forward to throwing cards, putting my head on the table, continuing to play rod of spanking, the infernal spawns, the monkey, etc.
The more I think about it, the more I think most of he complaints about silver border in commander are kind of dumb. I mean if you won't want to do silly things like the hokey pokey, then you shouldn't play cards that involve it. I mean it's not like they're even good cards so if you run the silly cards, its because you want to be. Of course, if your opponent challenges you to a breath holding contest, arm wrestling, or whatever, you could just refuse and let them have their on curve or slightly below curve limited fodder. I mean really, are any silly cards actually good other than enter the dungeon? Does it really matter if you can't make a vanilla 4/4 for 3 filip right or throw a 6/6 for 7 with split second that might fight stuff properly? I mean who plays gruel ragebeast that much anyway? If you don't want to put your head on the table, you could just play the better vampire from commander 2017 or the black gearhulk. Who cares about he vanilla 5/5 gluteus maximus other than the cracks about how you can't stop touching your ass? I bet it's really the stuff like necro impotence and Jack in the mox that have the spikes up in arms about how it might affect power level. I'm personally looking forward to throwing cards, putting my head on the table, continuing to play rod of spanking, the infernal spawns, the monkey, etc.
I'm not a fan because I play once a week at most, and I don't really want to spend that time watching people do the hokey pokey, or throw cards, or miss what's going on in the game because their head is on the table, etc. I don't want to be put in the position of being told I don't like fun because I'm not interested in spending my time that way. It has nothing to do with power level and everything to do with the game turning into something I'm not interested in once un-cards are involved.
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I won’t play vs decks that have phoebe, x, or baron von count at the helm. If people insist on that nonsense, I will be forced to respond in kind and make something degenerate enough to make them regret it.
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I won’t play vs decks that have phoebe, x, or baron von count at the helm. If people insist on that nonsense, I will be forced to respond in kind and make something degenerate enough to make them regret it.
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I won’t play vs decks that have phoebe, x, or baron von count at the helm. If people insist on that nonsense, I will be forced to respond in kind and make something degenerate enough to make them regret it.
Why do you think they are degenerate?
Mir13's post doesn't say that Phoebe, X, and the Baron are degenerate, only that he/she doesn't like them and would build something degenerate in response to people playing them.
I won’t play vs decks that have phoebe, x, or baron von count at the helm. If people insist on that nonsense, I will be forced to respond in kind and make something degenerate enough to make them regret it.
Why do you think they are degenerate?
Mir13's post doesn't say that Phoebe, X, and the Baron are degenerate, only that he/she doesn't like them and would build something degenerate in response to people playing them.
So that sound like an over exageration over people just wanting to play silver boarded commanders.
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(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
Not going to answer my question? You speak with such authority on these things.
We did it because we think it'll be fun and an appropriate celebration of the new set. Try it!
It's 45 days because it's a celebration and we felt that was long enough for people to get a chance to play and short enough not to wear out the welcome. It's also a fairly obvious date.
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So basically I'm not going to be be able to build a Grusilda, Monster Masher or Grimlock, Dinobot Leader EDH deck after Jan. 15, 2018? Nor will I be able to add Fowl Play, Organ Harvest, Giant Fan, Everythingamajig, Clocknapper, Gifts Given, Evil Presents, Earl of Squirrel, Season's Beatings, or Fruitcake Elemental to any of my decks after Jan. 15, 2018? I won't be able to build a deck devoted to host/augment or a deck that utilizes contraptions after Jan. 15, 2018?
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
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Control Magic effects are the only thing I don't enjoy playing against. I don't imagine that the cringe on my face from when my opponents take control of permanents is a welcoming look.
Flicking the corners of my cards each time you tap and re-tap and untap and tap...and then spend another 2 minutes re-thinking your attack step is annoying. I don't want to think about how I respond to someone flicking through their hand when 2 of my cards are in it.
And then having to explain to someone who wants to add 4 mana without tearing their Blacker Lotus into pieces...
Yes, this only goes until January 15th. After that point, the "official" rules will revert to what they were and Un cards are no longer legal in the format.
You couldn't do this a week ago either. Unless, of course, you spoke with your playgroup and allowed it. Nothing stops you from doing that once this is done.
If you don't like that this is temporary, then don't participate. I know I won't be because I don't like Un-Cards in EDH. Once the time for this is up, you will have two options: 1) go back to what your playgroup did before and appreciate the time this gave you to play these cards or 2) work with your playgroup to keep this going as a house rule.
If it's any consolation, X is technically in your hand when your opponent sends it there. They also have the option of giving you cards of their own thanks to Naughty // Nice.
Hell, you can even voluntarily change control with Zedruu. Players voluntarily give their cards (or non-voluntarily) with way more black cards than silver cards. Cards like Rainbow Vale, Humble Defector, Akroan Horse, Chaos Lord, Avarice Amulet, Karona, False God, etc. are controlled by opponents most of the time. Scrambleverse changes control of cards as well in a way wackier way than say Gifts Given. 100% of the cards with said effects that aren't silver-bordered are legal in Commander.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
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I'd like to apologize for any rumor mongering I may have caused with my comments. I am glad however that you did address them in the post regarding Nerf war.
Thanks for the answers because yes, it was a legit question.
I still don't understand the disdain for silver-bordered cards when there are black-bordered cards that are much worse. They get banned when they're too warping or broken. So an eventual unbanning of certain silver-bordered cards and not most of them is not something that should be blindly discarded due to the card's border. Just as Organ Harvest is practically black-bordered Scrambleverse is practically silver-bordered; one of these is banned and the other isn't simply because of their border. That's the logic I don't like accepting. Cards should be banned based on how they interact with the environment or the gameplay and not whether they're black or silver - especially in this format which chose to base itself off of the eternal format card pool even though it doesn't really follow the eternal format card pool because the bannings aren't the same.
And yes, I agree, house rules are a given, but that's true for any game. Look no further than all the house rules you gotta learn with Monopoly. However, if you want to play Monopoly with other people, you'd have to either establish house rules before playing or follow the already established rules. That's fine for that example because the boardgame already comes with everything needed to play. Not Magic: the Gathering, though. You have to build your own deck beforehand with cards from an allowable list in order to go to any place and everything will have built it with the same rules. Sure, you can have a plan B in case your house rules align and you can whip out your The Big Idea deck, but that's not what's really being discussed here. If I take the time to build around a deck only for house rules, it's not really all that viable if I spend money to not be able to play it outside of my circle. I'm talking about going to friendly environments like LGS's or being invited to play at other pods with new people and still be able to take my deck without fear of having to make swaps or not being able to take it altogether. Building a deck with Grusilder, Monster Masher at the helm becomes completely useless with any other legendary creature in the same colors. So unless it's legal, I can't really use it anywhere I want to. That's very disenheartening.
Again, I'm not begging for cards like Volrath's Motion Sensor, Handcuffs, Magical Hacker, Vile Bile to be legal. There are plenty of legal cards with which very annoying decks are built and grunt as you may, you play against those decks because it follows the deckbuilding rules. You don't bat an eyelash because the cards have a silver-border. So I can drop Stasis, Eon Hub in the same turn and undoubtedly some people are gonna get annoyed but nobody's gonna flip the table. If I played a super chaotic Zedruu the Greathearted deck with Scrambleverse and similar cards people aren't gonna flip the table. But you're going to crucify the RC because now I have the "audacity" to play cards like Fowl Play and The Cheese Stands Alone until Jan. 15? You're going to feel insulted simply because I played a silver-bordered card now that they're legal to play with for a month and a half? (Oh, I'm using the pronoun you as referring to those who feel this way - it's not a personal attack against "you" in particular, it's just the pronoun I'm using in my argument).
That is the logic that I honestly don't understand. And I don't say that condescendingly or insultingly. I honestly don't get the unwarrented hatred to all silver-bordered cards. I can understand certain types of silver-bordered cards. But if I want to run Amateur Auteur which is literally just another Felidar Cub, Kami of Ancient Law, Keening Apparition, and Ronom Unicorn then I simply can't just because it's silver-bordered? People are legit insulted if I play Amateur Auteur instead of Kami of Ancient Law? Or if I want to be able to play all 5 cards in the same deck?
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
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By default, no. Think of this as a great opportunity to show your friends how much fun that can be and see what happens afterwards.
Ah, I see. Well, thanks for making them legal then until then. People wouldn't be able to deny me using these cards until then - which is awesome. Hopefully no one boycotts this by hiding away for the next 44 days. It would be nice for people to be more open to the inclusion of some of these cards. Maybe in some distant future this will be a thing. I can't force my tastes onto others but for the next 44 days I will responsibly play with silver.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I feel that an UnCommander format is something that Wizards will probably do. As for putting tournaments and everything else on hold I have mixed feelings. I've seen people literally say: "unless it's legal by what the Rules Committee says then it's not legal and I won't allow it" yet now that it is in fact legal, those same people are trying to ignore it all the same. So when it was for their benefit then RC is to be followed but the moment it isn't then the RC can be ignored; to me that is a double-standard. That being said, the ambiguity of some silver-bordered cards are a rules nightmare. So I can understand judges postponing tournaments or banning them since Oracle hasn't been updated for them. Making judgment calls is very difficult for these otherwise. So that part is understandable. The spirit of resistance I'm not too on board with.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
My concern was mainly the fact that my sleeves being new were still slippery, but as it was he was only able to knock three off. And it also made his tribal dino deck legit since he uses Grim lock for it
fixed
EDIT: I'm going to quote a post form I think papa_funk that in response o a person's post on reddit :
Link to the post
I like the idea of using 1 of every contraption instead of a custom contraption deck of 15.
Would you allow me to play it in a non-green deck we played a game?
Thread | Draft
Thanks for linking this. It's very important being as it clears up a lot of doubts based on the decision for the RC. It also shows that they didn't just halfass it and it is in the spirit of fun. They also point out many obvious things such as the fact that there are more broken cards in black-bordered and in order to truly break silver-bordered cards it would have to be overly convoluted.
Unfortunately, I wouldn't allow it. It breaks the fundamental rules of commander of color identity. Besides, there are green cards that help you assemble contraptions (Steamflogger Service Rep) as well as abuse the fact that you'd have 9 contraptions from Crossbreed Labs (like Druid of the Sacred Beaker). With so few overall cards that assemble contraptions, more than likely you'd have to build a 5C deck in order to really get your mileage.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Un-sets throw a massive wrench into all of those settings, and the ephemeral nature of this unbanning means it's a complete waste of investment into Unglued and Unhinged, since at least with Unstable it's a current release and people will have cards to mess around with after they've drafted it that would otherwise be useless.
At most I think they should've made a Whitelist for a few completely fair unstable cards like Grusilda, Monster Masher and Grimlock, Dinobot Leader. Though it has potential to be fun for a few games, this just seems a little on the impulsive side.
And they've certainly never made a decision that some people disagree with. [/sarcasm]
Face it - you can't please all of the people all of the time. If you hate the RC so much, you must really hate the format they created. Or not? I wonder if the RC ever gets tired of so many armchair/keyboard warriors second-guessing their every move.
I don't see Wizards doing any better of a job, and frankly, I think they might do far worse. Do I agree with every decision from the RC? Nope (looking at you, Iona). But I love the format, and I feel the RC has a much better track record than WOTC.
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So that sound like an over exageration over people just wanting to play silver boarded commanders.