This is probably an issue most people whom splash black will run into and that is choosing a decent tutor for your deck. I'm currently considering adding a good all-round tutor to my Meren deck, digging for creatures isn't that hard with green but I'm looking for something that can get me any needed card and not just a creature. Though in doing so I'm slightly constrained by two factors. I have a limited budget and thus making an investment in a pricier card needs to be more justified, sometimes just being the best option might not be enough. Furthermore, in my deck black is a splash and it's not a fully dedicated Meren build, so there is a chance the deck might end up going mono green at some point and that is another reason to be perhaps more conservative with my budget. Especially since this is my only EDH deck running black at the moment. So hence why I'm looking to opinions on what people would do in my situation and which cards are being under consideration.
Probably not going to get better than this and its a likely response to a question on which tutor to run when you have access to black. Thing is that they aren't cheap and its not an investment I want to see end up just sitting in my binder. So as good as they might be, cheaper alternatives are probably a better choice for me.
Slightly more friendly on the budget than the previous two cards, with a draw back that is probably less worrying in my deck. So at least something I'm currently preferring over the previous mentioned cards.
The tutor on a stick. Obviously fairly affordable and with the potential of recursion this can do a decent amount of work. Meren does lend itself quite well to the demon but since my deck leans more towards a elfball/druidball kind of list, the recursion is slightly more limited. Additionally, the card does cost 7 CMC and definitely hits the top of my curve, which is something I want to keep in mind since I still have to acquire a copy of Tooth and Nail as well.
Not ideal but would do the trick for cheap, as well as provide some more time to evaluate which tutor I should get as an upgrade for it. So pretty much a placeholder.
I know that there are other cards as well but I think that it pretty much comes down to these options, with Diabolic Tutor being mostly there as a means to fill the slot until I can make a better decision or until my budget is decent enough to make Vampiric/Demonic Tutor something I can afford a bit more. Either way, I'm hoping to get some advice and suggestions on this, as I do want to make a calculated decision on what card I should get without wasting my budget.
Just spend $12 on a beat up Demonic Tutor from Revised. Diabolic isn't even close. Look around on eBay and various Facebook groups where cards and bought and sold.
Go dig through your bulk and buylist stuff if the $12 Is a problem. I went through last night and found $275 worth of mostly dollar rates. Now I've got credit for cube and EDH upgrades for months.
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I've stopped running tutors when they're just good stuff adds, but I run Sidisi and Diabolic Intent in Karador because they fit flavorfully and I want to sac stuff already.
I recommend finding tutors that have an effect that fit more synergistically with your overall strategy and theme. Like Cryogen's example, a Diabolic Intent is probably going to be better than a plain Demonic Tutor when you're sacrificing a creature with a leaves the battlefield or dies trigger. Otherwise tutors are sorta boring and unimaginative good stuff inclusions that ultimately end up wasting everyone's time.
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Rune-Scarred Demon seems like a really solid inclusion in Meren especially as you can recur it quite easily. Past that Diabolic Tutor is probably the one that is most acceptable to all playgroups but is not even nearly as good as Demonic Tutor. They are probably more affordable than you think and really worth it.
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With only 11 instants and sorceries in your decklist and it being mostly green, I doubt Dark Petition will be better than Diabolic Tutor.
If you think you'll build more black someday, I would take the plunge with Demonic Tutor. Diabolic Intent might fit Meren's abilities better, but it technically has higher cost to cast. Demonic will work in pretty much anything that splashes black regardless of whether the deck relies on sacrifices/graveyard or not.
I was going to suggest Sidisi, Undead Vizier when I first skimmed through this thread, but you already run her. I think she's a better choice here than Rune-Scarred Demon.
I know some people find running that running tutors is boring and while its not a full on competitive deck, it is quite combo-centric so it needs ways to get to the cards that I need. To me it depends a bit on the deck on how much tutors I run in it and so far I'm accepting the amount that is in it currently, I just feel that the deck needs one more all-round tutor over a creature only one.
Just spend $12 on a beat up Demonic Tutor from Revised. Diabolic isn't even close. Look around on eBay and various Facebook groups where cards and bought and sold.
Go dig through your bulk and buylist stuff if the $12 Is a problem. I went through last night and found $275 worth of mostly dollar rates. Now I've got credit for cube and EDH upgrades for months.
Most my bulk tends to be moved on quickly already due to my limited budget, so not that much for me to gain there. Think the only way for me to free up a fair amount would be by disassembling one of my other decks and currently not looking to do so. That said, around here its harder to move around a more played version of a card. So if I'd go for a Demonic then I'd probably see about getting a version I can at least trade easily enough as well.
My deck indeed runs too little black to make Dark Petition a worthwhile inclusion, which is why I pretty much already omitted it from my options. It's a good point in that Demonic Tutor offers more versatility down the road compared to Diabolic Intent, especially with Tutor only being several bucks more. So something I'll be keeping in mind.
The primary question in your post has already been answered, but there are alternative tutors you can consider.
While it is not considered "competitive" in any way, if you are looking for a minor synergy in your tutors for a Meren deck, then check out Demonic Collusion. I run it in my Lyzolda worldgorger dragon edh deck as another sneaky way to discard a reanimation target. I can buy-back once to discard the dragon (or another target) when using the tutor to actually find a reanmation spell. Seems playable for Meren
If you play on mtgo in public games, most of the time a rhystic tutor is as good as a 3cmc demonic tutor. People love tapping out on that game. It is also somewhat playable in real life as a casual-tutor if your meta tends to not play a bunch of counterspells (holding mana up), or for early-game sol ring/sakura-tribe elder tutor when everyone is always tapped out.
Depending on what your Meren deck is doing, entomb may be a more valuable tutor over demonic tutor. Even if you are just plugging a life from the loam in your graveyard to start filling the 'yard.
I recommend finding tutors that have an effect that fit more synergistically with your overall strategy and theme. Like Cryogen's example, a Diabolic Intent is probably going to be better than a plain Demonic Tutor when you're sacrificing a creature with a leaves the battlefield or dies trigger. Otherwise tutors are sorta boring and unimaginative good stuff inclusions that ultimately end up wasting everyone's time.
Why would diabolic intent waste less time than demonic tutor?
Imo tutors are usually synergy picks, not random goodstuff, because they're often going to be searching for your important synergistic cards. I.e. if you're trying to use scion of the ur dragon + conspiracy for shenanigans, demo is just going to be a second conspiracy. I don't see why you'd want to use idyllic tutor instead, just in the name of "synergy". By the same token, if you're desperate for, say, deathtouch for your lyzolda, the blood witch deck, sure you could put in quietus spike (or gorgon's head) as extra redundancy, but wouldn't you rather just put in demo and pretend like it's another basilisk collar?
When you're actually BUILDING the deck, sure, including demo tutor is sort of a no-brainer and not very imaginative, but I think in terms of actually play, especially in decks that want specific synergies (especially synergies that don't have very many redundant parts), they're not at all "good stuff". And while demo is always worth it, including lesser tutors like diabolic, grim, cruel, etc, require knowing how important synergy cards are for your deck, and how much mana/cards/life are worth being able to find something crucial to assemble whatever nonsense you're trying to pull off.
to OP: if you think you'll be reusing the card in future decks, shell out for demonic, it's worth its weight in gold. If it's only ever going to be in this one deck forever and ever, and you're on a tight budget, then diabolic tutor or some similar crappy overpriced tutor is probably ok I guess, although you'd better really want it. Diabolic intent is probably a poor purchase since it's pretty pricey and not even close to as flexible as demonic, but if you're on a medium budget and never plan to move the card, then I guess?
Considering the general, my first recommendation (with budget consideration in mind) would be Jarad's Orders. The vast majority of the cards you want to tutor for in Meren are creatures, a creature in the graveyard is often better than a creature in your hand, and JO gets you two creatures that you want.
If you've already got JO or you want something to tutor noncreatures, I would go for Rune-Scarred Demon. With Meren, it's easily reusable, and its mana cost is irrelevant if you're reanimating it.
Considering the general, my first recommendation (with budget consideration in mind) would be Jarad's Orders. The vast majority of the cards you want to tutor for in Meren are creatures, a creature in the graveyard is often better than a creature in your hand, and JO gets you two creatures that you want.
If you've already got JO or you want something to tutor noncreatures, I would go for Rune-Scarred Demon. With Meren, it's easily reusable, and its mana cost is irrelevant if you're reanimating it.
I'm actually taking out Jarad's Orders for this new tutor, mainly because I want and somewhat need a way to get non-creature cards. Meren more or less provides incidental recursion for the deck, so I'm not sure if I will build up enough experience counters consistently to be able to cheat out Rune-Scarred Demon.
I think that with all the feedback so far, I'm currently leaning towards potentially acquiring a Demonic Tutor. Mostly because it simply lets me both search up the card and gives me more chance of being able to cast it as well the same turn.
I know you're looking for non-creature tutors but I found Survival of the Fittest to be the strongest tutor/engine Meren could ever wish for.
It is about as expensive as Demonic Tutor I think, but if I had to pick only one for this Commander I'd play it over Demonic tbh. But maybe that's just me.
It's banned in the MTGO 1v1 commander though, if that matters to you.
Ehm, Survival can only look for creature cards so that isn't going to help me as much as to grab some non-creature cards. The card is definitely good just not a part I'm looking to invest in right now.
If you don't want to run tutors, that's fine. But there are lots of people here suggesting really subpar cards.
I just looked on eBay and there are like a dozen Revised Demonic Tutors you can snag for under $20. The card trades all day long, if you're worried about that. And it just dodged a reprint in Iconic Masters. It's one of the safer ways to spend $20 in EDH. And it makes your deck better. You can argue that it's off-theme or whatever, but being able to grab anything from a fetchland to an answer to a threat to a combo piece for 1B is just too good to pass up, even in my 75%-type meta.
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I think the only real option is demonic. You can't beat the card, and at twenty-five bucks it's a great value and will probably always hold that value. Also, if it ever ends up in the trade binder, I guarantee you'll be able to move it
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Go dig through your bulk and buylist stuff if the $12 Is a problem. I went through last night and found $275 worth of mostly dollar rates. Now I've got credit for cube and EDH upgrades for months.
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BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern:
RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
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If you think you'll build more black someday, I would take the plunge with Demonic Tutor. Diabolic Intent might fit Meren's abilities better, but it technically has higher cost to cast. Demonic will work in pretty much anything that splashes black regardless of whether the deck relies on sacrifices/graveyard or not.
I was going to suggest Sidisi, Undead Vizier when I first skimmed through this thread, but you already run her. I think she's a better choice here than Rune-Scarred Demon.
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Most my bulk tends to be moved on quickly already due to my limited budget, so not that much for me to gain there. Think the only way for me to free up a fair amount would be by disassembling one of my other decks and currently not looking to do so. That said, around here its harder to move around a more played version of a card. So if I'd go for a Demonic then I'd probably see about getting a version I can at least trade easily enough as well.
My deck indeed runs too little black to make Dark Petition a worthwhile inclusion, which is why I pretty much already omitted it from my options. It's a good point in that Demonic Tutor offers more versatility down the road compared to Diabolic Intent, especially with Tutor only being several bucks more. So something I'll be keeping in mind.
While it is not considered "competitive" in any way, if you are looking for a minor synergy in your tutors for a Meren deck, then check out Demonic Collusion. I run it in my Lyzolda worldgorger dragon edh deck as another sneaky way to discard a reanimation target. I can buy-back once to discard the dragon (or another target) when using the tutor to actually find a reanmation spell. Seems playable for Meren
If you play on mtgo in public games, most of the time a rhystic tutor is as good as a 3cmc demonic tutor. People love tapping out on that game. It is also somewhat playable in real life as a casual-tutor if your meta tends to not play a bunch of counterspells (holding mana up), or for early-game sol ring/sakura-tribe elder tutor when everyone is always tapped out.
Depending on what your Meren deck is doing, entomb may be a more valuable tutor over demonic tutor. Even if you are just plugging a life from the loam in your graveyard to start filling the 'yard.
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Imo tutors are usually synergy picks, not random goodstuff, because they're often going to be searching for your important synergistic cards. I.e. if you're trying to use scion of the ur dragon + conspiracy for shenanigans, demo is just going to be a second conspiracy. I don't see why you'd want to use idyllic tutor instead, just in the name of "synergy". By the same token, if you're desperate for, say, deathtouch for your lyzolda, the blood witch deck, sure you could put in quietus spike (or gorgon's head) as extra redundancy, but wouldn't you rather just put in demo and pretend like it's another basilisk collar?
When you're actually BUILDING the deck, sure, including demo tutor is sort of a no-brainer and not very imaginative, but I think in terms of actually play, especially in decks that want specific synergies (especially synergies that don't have very many redundant parts), they're not at all "good stuff". And while demo is always worth it, including lesser tutors like diabolic, grim, cruel, etc, require knowing how important synergy cards are for your deck, and how much mana/cards/life are worth being able to find something crucial to assemble whatever nonsense you're trying to pull off.
to OP: if you think you'll be reusing the card in future decks, shell out for demonic, it's worth its weight in gold. If it's only ever going to be in this one deck forever and ever, and you're on a tight budget, then diabolic tutor or some similar crappy overpriced tutor is probably ok I guess, although you'd better really want it. Diabolic intent is probably a poor purchase since it's pretty pricey and not even close to as flexible as demonic, but if you're on a medium budget and never plan to move the card, then I guess?
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If you've already got JO or you want something to tutor noncreatures, I would go for Rune-Scarred Demon. With Meren, it's easily reusable, and its mana cost is irrelevant if you're reanimating it.
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I think that with all the feedback so far, I'm currently leaning towards potentially acquiring a Demonic Tutor. Mostly because it simply lets me both search up the card and gives me more chance of being able to cast it as well the same turn.
I just looked on eBay and there are like a dozen Revised Demonic Tutors you can snag for under $20. The card trades all day long, if you're worried about that. And it just dodged a reprint in Iconic Masters. It's one of the safer ways to spend $20 in EDH. And it makes your deck better. You can argue that it's off-theme or whatever, but being able to grab anything from a fetchland to an answer to a threat to a combo piece for 1B is just too good to pass up, even in my 75%-type meta.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered