Last six games i played with The Immortal Sun and this card is a beast. Artifact for 6 mana and you draw additional card at draw step, your creatures have +1+1, every spells cost 1 less, and players can't use loyalty abilities from planeswalker.
Oh yes, most definitely. An AMAZING card that is overlooked due to its mana cost. I feel I am the only one at my LGS who plays it. (thing is, it has also won me games. Getting that extra draw, getting that extra damage to push me over the edge. Or shutting down a troublesome PW. (Like a Karn who is about to go off with a few game-winning exiled permanents)
Glad i'm not only one who plays this card. When i cast Immortal Sun and if opponents didn't succeed to destroy it, i won almost every game. Also art is beautiful.
I put out Herald's horn and put in Immortal Sun, also playing with Urza's incubator ofc. But right know think i will put in again Herald's horn, and put out some enchantment.
I was playing with Kindred Discovery but didn't have luck to draw this card, only one time and didn't help much because of situation on table. But one moth ago i put in again and last few games i was lucky to draw it and works great.
I run Horn, Incubator, Sun. (And with The Ur-dragon in get (in total) -5 on cost) So in teh end, i am ONLY paying for colors.
Btw finally i bought Chromatic Lantern, Belbe's Portal and Somberwald Sage. Right now, think that i have everything i need for this deck. Ofc some creatures or instant-sorcery-artifact-enchantment are about your taste of cards.
Absolutely love this deck, it's so powerful and the most important thing it has Dragons
What do you think about Kaalia of the Vast? I'm thinking to play with her
I used her in my original draft, but she did not perform as well as I wanted her to. If she had haste, different story, but with a 2/2 body, she is not going to stick around easily (Plus she does not synergize with dragons, she can put them out, but gets no benefits from them.
If you want to use her for bait, then you have something to look at. The amount of times people target my Draco is funny, esepcially since i have far worse things they should target
I'm looking forward to jamming Heartless Summoning into the deck to speed it up. I'm fine with the -1/-1 since all my creatures are already 5/5+ and it's much harder to remove than Warden of Evos Isle and Krosan Drover since it's an enchantment.
I'm looking forward to jamming Heartless Summoning into the deck to speed it up. I'm fine with the -1/-1 since all my creatures are already 5/5+ and it's much harder to remove than Warden of Evos Isle and Krosan Drover since it's an enchantment.
The only time Deflecting Palm is going to be any good is against Blasphemous Act or fireballs from decka like Neheb, the Eternal or Wort, the Raidmother. Or maybe if you have a particularly problematic Voltron deck in your meta. Otherwise its not going to get you much value.
I don't see any interaction between palm and blasty act.
Also it seems meh vs wort since you only prevent half the damage.
Anyway but I agree overall, not an amazing card generally speaking, should be replaced in most decks. Funny way to win though.
I'm looking forward to jamming Heartless Summoning into the deck to speed it up. I'm fine with the -1/-1 since all my creatures are already 5/5+ and it's much harder to remove than Warden of Evos Isle and Krosan Drover since it's an enchantment.
And i don;t get a -1/-1, instead I get a +1/+1 bonus from Sun.
I like all your choices though The Immortal Sun is yet another 6 drop in a deck full of 6 drops. Also I think I would (and will) choose Mirari's Wake over it. It costs less and double mana is a lot better than cost reduction when your mana curve is so high.
I'm looking forward to jamming Heartless Summoning into the deck to speed it up. I'm fine with the -1/-1 since all my creatures are already 5/5+ and it's much harder to remove than Warden of Evos Isle and Krosan Drover since it's an enchantment.
And i don;t get a -1/-1, instead I get a +1/+1 bonus from Sun.
I like all your choices though The Immortal Sun is yet another 6 drop in a deck full of 6 drops. Also I think I would (and will) choose Mirari's Wake over it. It costs less and double mana is a lot better than cost reduction when your mana curve is so high.
I run Wake as well
the 6 mana drop is worth while. Getting a +1/+1, a reduction, draw an extra card and forcing opponents to not use PWs is well worth it.
I don't see any interaction between palm and blasty act.
Also it seems meh vs wort since you only prevent half the damage.
Anyway but I agree overall, not an amazing card generally speaking, should be replaced in most decks. Funny way to win though.
I may have missed the "to you" part when I said that. And as for Wort I was just listing decks that like to throw big fireballs. Preventing half is still, generally, going to save you.
What do you think about Kaalia of the Vast? I'm thinking to play with her
I used her in my original draft, but she did not perform as well as I wanted her to. If she had haste, different story, but with a 2/2 body, she is not going to stick around easily (Plus she does not synergize with dragons, she can put them out, but gets no benefits from them.
If you want to use her for bait, then you have something to look at. The amount of times people target my Draco is funny, esepcially since i have far worse things they should target
Ui
Yes she is target for everyone. But in 1 vs 1 are better chances that i will use her ability few times.
Btw i just found this card "Where Ancients Tread". It's crazy in big creatures decks.
ah. I play 3-4 player FFA (the way edh is meant to be played)
In 1v1 you can most likely use her.
Where ancients tread is a good card but i have scourge of valkas and dragon tempest.
If you like Where Ancients Tread do I have an enchantment for you. However I'm just not sure there's enough room in the deck. They're definitely not going into mine.
If you like Where Ancients Tread do I have an enchantment for you. However I'm just not sure there's enough room in the deck. They're definitely not going into mine.
Grand Coliseum - ETB tapped, but add mana of any color and without damage at late game Kindred Summons - Dragons aren't elfs to put 20 in the field, but for 3 or 4 at instant speed, looks tempting maelstrom wanderer - As above, most of the spells cost 7 or less, and haste is extremely important in this deck prime speaker zegana - draw 6+ cards for 6 manas and leave a 6/6+ creature looks nice Windreader Sphinx - basicly a overcosted Kindred Discovery with body Sunbird's Invocation - with cost reduction, you can pay 4 to dig 7 Defense of the Heart - Hellkite Charger + Savage Ventmaw for 4 manas? Maybe a little slow
Grand Coliseum - ETB tapped, but add mana of any color and without damage at late game Kindred Summons - Dragons aren't elfs to put 20 in the field, but for 3 or 4 at instant speed, looks tempting maelstrom wanderer - As above, most of the spells cost 7 or less, and haste is extremely important in this deck prime speaker zegana - draw 6+ cards for 6 manas and leave a 6/6+ creature looks nice Windreader Sphinx - basicly a overcosted Kindred Discovery with body Sunbird's Invocation - with cost reduction, you can pay 4 to dig 7 Defense of the Heart - Hellkite Charger + Savage Ventmaw for 4 manas? Maybe a little slow
wanderer and sunbird are good picks.
I would go for hellkite charger + ventmaw if his ability was only 6. But it is not it is 7 so hellkite is not going back in the deck anytime soon.
Cauldron dance is too g to be removed for berserk but perhaps I will opt for sunbird or wanderer first instead.
Also I need to rethink if I really need some of the dragons that followed with this deck...
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EDH BGU Sidisi, Brood Tyrant - Lurking Zombies. GBG Sapling of Colfenor - Forest Growth and Destruction. RWU Zedruu the Greathearted - Blinking and trading. GWB Teneb the Harvester - Enchantments, you lose life I gain life. RRR Neheb the Eternal - Ping people for mana burn.
Looking at the list on page one you seem to have a lot of powerful cards in the deck but I think you could actually put in more ramp. When I play Ur-Dragon, I aggresively mulligan for ramp and try to reach 5-6 mana as soon as possible. The cards that make the deck snowball out of control are usually ways to put more than one dragon into play each turn: Sunbird's Invocation, Rishkar's Expertise, Frontier Siege, Savage Ventmaw, Burgeoning and Intet, the Dreamer come to mind.
Optimally, the deck wants to go through 3 stages in a game:
1. Ramp. You know the jig. We run green, so ramp is not hard to come by.
2. Unload. Put out 2-4 Dragons, which is usually enough to put on real pressure and force mass removal, so don't over-extend.
3. Reload. Rishkar's Expertise, Soul's Majesty, Hunter's Insight, Rush of Knowledge, Kindred Discovery and of course our top man The Ur-Dragon himself
Then repeat 2. and 3.
Also: meet Bower Passage, the baddest ench on the block. Won me so many games...
I just need some help figuring out what to take out so i can put those in.
Just play the deck a few times and take out cards that feel weak or underperform. You know, the ones you seem to be drawing every game but you never cast... yeah those are the cards that need replacement.
I should evaluate C19 stuff since it makes up for the lack of new content the deck has been getting up until then.
Draconic Disciple: There's much better mana dorks out there to choose from.
Sarkhan, Fireblood: I am on the fence. The dude has more than proven himself to me in draft but in a multiplayer Ur-Dragon build I find him to be a fragile rock that's actually too specific even in this deck. At least Dragonspeaker Shaman's curve correction is a static ability and cannot be attacked directly by creatures making a little less likely to die prematurely.
Dragon's Hoard: Run it. It offers 2 fuctions the deck sorely needs: Extra mana and the ability to replace the dragon cards you use up. 3 mana is a lot for a rock but I see a lot of lists run much unwieldier things like Gilded Lotus and Quicksilver Amulet (Seriously how do you not get nervous when you guys can't do much at all in the early game?)
Spit Flame: There's better spot removal for 1-2 mana in your all colors. Sure it can recur itself but you're practically negating the eminence discount to get it back, not that you would even want to in the later stages of the game.
Sarkhan's Unsealing: It's too slow for me. Unless its insanely good like Kindred Discovery or the annoying to cast Temur Ascendancy I'd rather not have to choose between casting a dragon or a support card I have to hope I can keep by the turn I cast my next dragon.
Chromium, the Mutable: Well it's nice that he can't be countered but...he's just big and nothing really else.
Nicol Bolas, the Ravager: He's been doing well for me. While kinda annoying to cast colors-wise he's still a 4/4 flier with a mildly irritating ETB for only 3 mana. Also, his flip side is the only Nicol Bolas planeswalker card that doesn't make me shake my head when people shoehorn it in a dragon deck. It actually works with your deck instead of the other Nicol Bolas walkers that might as well be the player straight up admitting his/her deck is so bad you want to play with their opponent's decks instead.
Palladia-Mors, the Ruiner: ...She's just big. And she can't even do that all the way right. I hate playing against hexproof as much as the next guy but seriously? It's like the world's slowest haste. What. The. Heck.
Sarkhan, Dragonsoul: Run him with doubling season or don't run him at all. His third ability is the only thing about the card that isn't garbage.
Sarkhan's Whelp: Even if your deck had all the Sarkhan planewalkers for whatever reason this card just doesn't really do anything, not that it was even supposed to.
Early game for me is like turn 5. Sometimes even earlier like turn 4 or even 3. If I get a really good opening hand I can even start play dragons as early as turn 2. (Require exploration and sol ring in opening hand with 3-4 lands (if 3 i draw into number 4) and a 7 or less dragon.)
But that seldom happens so usually turn 4 or 5 I am playing dragons. Or playing kindred discovery or femur ascendancy and then my dragons. (Simtimes I will have both)
I run Horn, Incubator, Sun. (And with The Ur-dragon in get (in total) -5 on cost) So in teh end, i am ONLY paying for colors.
My Kozi deck run the three mentioned along with Stone Calendar, Cloud key, Conduit of Ruin, Helm of Awakening, Planar Gate and Eye of Ugin which lowers the cost of my Eldrazi by -13. (Which makes the most expensive card in my Kozi deck (Emrakul, the Promised End) free.) (And I can even make them cost less by using something like sculpting steel on one of the reducers, but I would rather sculpting steel Blinkmoth Urn)
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Portal is good.
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I used her in my original draft, but she did not perform as well as I wanted her to. If she had haste, different story, but with a 2/2 body, she is not going to stick around easily (Plus she does not synergize with dragons, she can put them out, but gets no benefits from them.
If you want to use her for bait, then you have something to look at. The amount of times people target my Draco is funny, esepcially since i have far worse things they should target
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not bad in terms of cost reduction, but i prefer the reduction pack i have right now. Urza's icubator, Herald's Horn and the Immortal Sun (And my Commander as well.)
Total reduction: -5
And i don;t get a -1/-1, instead I get a +1/+1 bonus from Sun.
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Also it seems meh vs wort since you only prevent half the damage.
Anyway but I agree overall, not an amazing card generally speaking, should be replaced in most decks. Funny way to win though. How is total cost reduction a relevant or useful metric? I'd just consider them as mana rocks.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
I run Wake as well
the 6 mana drop is worth while. Getting a +1/+1, a reduction, draw an extra card and forcing opponents to not use PWs is well worth it.
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I may have missed the "to you" part when I said that. And as for Wort I was just listing decks that like to throw big fireballs. Preventing half is still, generally, going to save you.
In 1v1 you can most likely use her.
Where ancients tread is a good card but i have scourge of valkas and dragon tempest.
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starting to feel like a burn deck.
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I mean....
Dragons?
Dragons don't always burn, have you seen "How to Train Your Dragon"?
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Nope, too cutesy for me. But they are most well known for fire breath.
Grand Coliseum - ETB tapped, but add mana of any color and without damage at late game
Kindred Summons - Dragons aren't elfs to put 20 in the field, but for 3 or 4 at instant speed, looks tempting
maelstrom wanderer - As above, most of the spells cost 7 or less, and haste is extremely important in this deck
prime speaker zegana - draw 6+ cards for 6 manas and leave a 6/6+ creature looks nice
Windreader Sphinx - basicly a overcosted Kindred Discovery with body
Sunbird's Invocation - with cost reduction, you can pay 4 to dig 7
Defense of the Heart - Hellkite Charger + Savage Ventmaw for 4 manas? Maybe a little slow
I would go for hellkite charger + ventmaw if his ability was only 6. But it is not it is 7 so hellkite is not going back in the deck anytime soon.
Cauldron dance is too g to be removed for berserk but perhaps I will opt for sunbird or wanderer first instead.
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With that I wonder how useful Shifting Shadow will be, it will put more targets in grave and trigger on Temur Ascendancy, Elemental Bond and Kindred Discovery if that is a big dragon, which should be in most of the cases.
Also I need to rethink if I really need some of the dragons that followed with this deck...
BGU Sidisi, Brood Tyrant - Lurking Zombies.
GBG Sapling of Colfenor - Forest Growth and Destruction.
RWU Zedruu the Greathearted - Blinking and trading.
GWB Teneb the Harvester - Enchantments, you lose life I gain life.
RRR Neheb the Eternal - Ping people for mana burn.
I just need some help figuring out what to take out so i can put those in.
Sunbird's Invocation, Rishkar's Expertise, Frontier Siege, Savage Ventmaw, Burgeoning and Intet, the Dreamer come to mind.
Optimally, the deck wants to go through 3 stages in a game:
1. Ramp. You know the jig. We run green, so ramp is not hard to come by.
2. Unload. Put out 2-4 Dragons, which is usually enough to put on real pressure and force mass removal, so don't over-extend.
3. Reload. Rishkar's Expertise, Soul's Majesty, Hunter's Insight, Rush of Knowledge, Kindred Discovery and of course our top man The Ur-Dragon himself
Then repeat 2. and 3.
Also: meet Bower Passage, the baddest ench on the block. Won me so many games...
I find that I need removal mostly to deal with problematic Enchantments and Artifacts because cards like Dragon Tempest, Warstorm surge, Scourge of Valkas, Silumgar, the Drifting Death as well as Crux of Fate and Kindred Dominance deal with creatures pretty well. I rund catch alls like Anguished Unmaking, my honorary dragon Trygon Predator and Big daddy Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker.
My Playgroup isn't super-competitive so YMMV with my list depending on yours:
https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/lair-of-the-ur-dragon/
Just play the deck a few times and take out cards that feel weak or underperform. You know, the ones you seem to be drawing every game but you never cast... yeah those are the cards that need replacement.
EDIT: fixed card tags
UR Mizzix of the Izmagnus ~~~ Build your own win-condition: Finite Spellslinging
UR Brudiclad, Telchor Engineer ~~~ We are the Borg. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own.
WUB Oloro, Ageless Ascetic ~~~ A Guide to dying slowly
UBR Marchesa, the Black Rose ~~~ Marchesa's undying Marionettes
RGW Mayael the Anima ~~~ All Hail the Big Chungus
GWU Chulane, Teller of Tales ~~~ Permanents Only ETB Shenanigans
BGU Sidisi, Brood Tyrant ~~~ Sidisi's Restless Servants
WUBRG The Ur-Dragon ~~~ Dragons eat your face
Nicol Bolas, the Ravager, Chromium, the Mutable, Lathliss, Dragon Queen, but also Sarkhan's Unsealing, Sarkhan, Fireblood, Sarkhan, Dragonsoul...
Tiny - Yasova
Lathliss, Dragon Queen
Sarkhan, Fireblood,
Dragon's Hoard
Sarkhan's Unsealing
Spit Flame
Demanding Dragon
Palladia-Mors, the Ruiner
Draconic Disciple
Bone Dragon requires a few too many creatures in graveyard to work right
Draconic Disciple: There's much better mana dorks out there to choose from.
Sarkhan, Fireblood: I am on the fence. The dude has more than proven himself to me in draft but in a multiplayer Ur-Dragon build I find him to be a fragile rock that's actually too specific even in this deck. At least Dragonspeaker Shaman's curve correction is a static ability and cannot be attacked directly by creatures making a little less likely to die prematurely.
Dragon's Hoard: Run it. It offers 2 fuctions the deck sorely needs: Extra mana and the ability to replace the dragon cards you use up. 3 mana is a lot for a rock but I see a lot of lists run much unwieldier things like Gilded Lotus and Quicksilver Amulet (Seriously how do you not get nervous when you guys can't do much at all in the early game?)
Spit Flame: There's better spot removal for 1-2 mana in your all colors. Sure it can recur itself but you're practically negating the eminence discount to get it back, not that you would even want to in the later stages of the game.
Sarkhan's Unsealing: It's too slow for me. Unless its insanely good like Kindred Discovery or the annoying to cast Temur Ascendancy I'd rather not have to choose between casting a dragon or a support card I have to hope I can keep by the turn I cast my next dragon.
Sparktongue Dragon: Pffft hahahahahahaha...
Bone Dragon: ...hahahahahahaha!
Demanding Dragon: Pretty funny but not really all that great.
Lathliss, Dragon Queen: I see little reason to not run her in the ur-dragon. She effectively doubles your dragon summoning.
Arcades, the Strategist: He's a good card but not in this deck.
Chromium, the Mutable: Well it's nice that he can't be countered but...he's just big and nothing really else.
Nicol Bolas, the Ravager: He's been doing well for me. While kinda annoying to cast colors-wise he's still a 4/4 flier with a mildly irritating ETB for only 3 mana. Also, his flip side is the only Nicol Bolas planeswalker card that doesn't make me shake my head when people shoehorn it in a dragon deck. It actually works with your deck instead of the other Nicol Bolas walkers that might as well be the player straight up admitting his/her deck is so bad you want to play with their opponent's decks instead.
Palladia-Mors, the Ruiner: ...She's just big. And she can't even do that all the way right. I hate playing against hexproof as much as the next guy but seriously? It's like the world's slowest haste. What. The. Heck.
Vaevictis Asmadi, the Dire: I guess it's fun if you're the gambling type but I'd rather run Steel Hellkite and just actually destroy things.
Sarkhan, Dragonsoul: Run him with doubling season or don't run him at all. His third ability is the only thing about the card that isn't garbage.
Sarkhan's Whelp: Even if your deck had all the Sarkhan planewalkers for whatever reason this card just doesn't really do anything, not that it was even supposed to.
also the new commander deck's Nesting Dragon is going in my build since I do run fetches, Exploration, Crucible of Worlds, and Oracle of Mul Daya. I'm tempted to run Crucible of Fire just to try and see if I can kill people with hatchling tokens.
But that seldom happens so usually turn 4 or 5 I am playing dragons. Or playing kindred discovery or femur ascendancy and then my dragons. (Simtimes I will have both)
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Is it worth a try?
And maybe just a thought about Tome of the Guildpact...
Tiny - Yasova