So pretty straight forward. What archetype do you dislike most? Comment below on why.
Personally, I hate Group Hug. Decks that don't bother trying to win and just kingmake another player are beyond pointless to me and honestly, take all the fun out of the game.
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This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
All these "reviled archetype" threads make me feel like I'm not experiencing EDH correctly. I'm just in a closed group of people doing experimental stuff like "Well I have a mirror gallery let's see how many copies of my commander, progenitus, can I get on the battlefield" and "Can I kill all of my friends with each homelands legendary creature as my commander" and you're all telling me terrible stories about spikes making the game suck for "casul scrubs" and group huggers without a secret agenda to win the game...
"Pure" group hug, definitely. I don't mind if you're playing hug effects to break the symmetry of them somehow, but when the only point is to give everyone nigh infinite resources without any attempt to win I find it just so boring to play against
Grouphug is atrocious. Any time you try to kingmake, the game is no longer free-for-all, it's 1v1vTeam. Might as well go in as one guy on combo and the other on counter-backup in a pre-match, covert agreement to split any winnings.
Ramp is the only archetype with an undeserved sense of entitlement behind it, where the fun of a commander group is measured by how unopposed the ramp players are. That aside, I'm happy to take on all archetypes. I just don't buy into any out-of-rules expectations going into a match. I met one player who thought everyone was entitled to five unopposed turns before really playing. It's never the stax guy.
We had ourselves a pretty fun time yesterday. A pillow fort/light stax got shredded, Mayael trampled the entire table but only brought out one card and the rest were just hard-casted, aggro outraced moderate combo a couple times, nobody cried foul at anything, lots of smiles. The group hug player sure got pounded, though, lol. Lots of disruption abounded.
As long as you have a reasonable wincon I don't care what you play. I voted Stax since it's usually more annoying than group hug, but both are bad in this case.
Ramp is the only archetype with an undeserved sense of entitlement behind it, where the fun of a commander group is measured by how unopposed the ramp players are. That aside, I'm happy to take on all archetypes. I just don't buy into any out-of-rules expectations going into a match. I met one player who thought everyone was entitled to five unopposed turns before really playing. It's never the stax guy.
Ramp is the only archetype that has all the right tools against it 'soft-banned' in most casual playgroups.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
God, I hate Group Hug. Sometimes, it can be funny and lead to a crazy game of shenanigans. Sadly, it just usually kingmakes. Because not all decks are created equal and group hug just seems exaggerate that problem more often than not.
I won't get mad if a person plays but I will kill them first.
You forgot Chaos decks, which emphasizes on messing the hell out of board for the sake of it, like playing Eye of the Storm + Hive Mind that kind of combo, or Warp World, Scrambleverse, etc. That's the kind of deck I have issues with, others are more or less fine.
EDIT: I guess unlike Stax that shuts down plays or Hug enables plays, Chaos deck just forces people to change strategy over and over and over again. Pretty much the Chaotic Neutral of the archetypes.
I voted combo, but here mostly meaning decks that aim to do the same combo, every game, as fast as possible, with the rest of the deck devoted to getting that combo out as fast as possible. ("You're not really impressing anyone with that Tooth & Nail, shall we play the next game?") Decks that have multiple combos they can do, or decks doing mostly something else with incidental combos due to card choice, sure, why not.
Granted, I could've also voted group hug but haven't actually come across any in a long while. Lucky, I guess.
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X Hope of Ghirapur Swordpile W Ghosty Blinky Anafenza U Nezahal- Big, Blue and HERE! B Gonti Can Afford It R Etali, Primal 'Whatjusthappened?' G Polukranos Wants More Mana WU The Exalted Vizier Temmet WB Home, Athreos WR Basandra, Recursive Aggression WG Karametra, Momma of Lands UB Wrexial Eats Your Brains UR Arjun, the Mad Flame UG The Fable of Prime Speaker BR Hellbent, Malfegor Style BG Jarad, Death is Served RG Running Thromok WUB Varina and ALL the Zombies WUBYennett, the Odd Pain-Train WUR Zedruu the Furyhearted WUG Arcades' Strategy, Shmategy, Sausage and Spam WBR A Case of Mathas' Persistent F*ckery WBRLicia's League of Legendary Lifegain Layabouts WBG The Karador Advantage PackageWRG Gahiji Rattlesnake Collection UBR Jeleva... does... things UBG Damia's Just Deserts URG Yasova's Has More Power Than Sense BRG Wasitora, Bad Kitty WUBRBreya, Eggs, Breya'd Eggs WUBG Tymna and Kydele, Extended Borrowing WURG Kynaios and Tiro, Landfall Impersonations WBRG Saskia Pet Card EnchantressUBRG Yidris of the Chi-Ting Corporation WUBRG Tazri's Amazing Allies
I don't like stax as in solitaire, or group hug as in no win conditions hug. Either of those where there is room for interacting ("stax" like pillow fort and taxing) or if hug has an actual plan in mind, then I'll play.
I also have a thing against combo, but that's a deck by deck thing for me. Your turn should not take forty minutes.
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60 Card Casual Multiplayer: B Dark Ides Life DrainR Rekindle Skies Phoenix TribalWB Veil Oath Tokens BR Brutal Scourge Eldrazi TribalRW Edge Worthy Mid-Range AggroGU Wisp Away Combo GWU Vigorous Flow Energy
Commander / EDH: RFeldon of the Third Path GURashmi, Eternities Crafter RWBMathas, Fiend Hunter GWUBAtraxa, Praetor's Voice
My most hated archetype Chaos isn't in the list. A knowledge pool on a table of 6 players makes the game slow down to a crawl, can't imagine stuff like Scrambleverse and its ilk are added into it.
Hug, but only when it has no intention to win. It's still annoying when people play cards like font of mythos just for lulz (and they better not think they're immune from hate), but as long as you're still going to do SOMETHING I'll allow it.
I think combo is boring and uncreative, I think ramp is usually boring and uncreative, I think reanimator is an effing weird category to add alongside things like "control" and "combo". Reanimator isn't really a broad archetype, nor is it common in commander in my experience.
Combo - I dislike the check for counterspells / spot removal or lose check of combo. It feels too much like it ignores everything else that happened that game up until now.
Mass Land Destruction (MLD) - Generally speaking it feels like Combo in that the person who does it is ahead and is sealing the game off now assuming no answers.
Group Hug - I don't like it because I cant really say how much of how the game went was based on skill or my own deck. It just throws all established metrics off.
Ramp - I don't like it when people abuse this strategy because it brings MLD back in as what people need to do to counter it. I dont mind when a little is thrown in but when people play with plans to hit 15-20 lands on turn 6-10 I get a little salty.
As far as the others mentioned in the poll, I would actually say that I like them for the following reasons:
Aggro - to be honest, this strategy is at such a disadvantage that most people play for control and combo strategies. Bringing an aggro deck in can punish those being too greedy potentially.
Stax - I feel that this strategy is often a fair strategy (when not doing MLD). Because of how greedy this format can be I feel it keeps some people honest in that it makes you try to play to the board and or have cheap removal to combat.
Reanimator - for the most part I think this format is fine. There is so much grave hate available now that if this is a problem for you, you should just add more to your decks. I will give people the benefit of like turn 2 eldrazi or some BS is something worth complaining about but in a lot of cases if you are just talking like slow control reanimator I am cool with it. I remember once way back someone doing a T2 Sylvan Primordial rez and then like 2 clones the following turns on it and that was not cool. For the most part though this is not something I look at the format as a problem with though.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
I dislike combo wins. It's either got removal/counter or welcome to the last 10-15mins being wasted for everyone.
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G Azusa, Lost but Seeking G UG Tishana, Voice of Thunder GU UBW Sen Triplets WBU WUBGAtraxa, Praetors' Voice GBUW WUBRGJodah, Archmage Eternal GRBUW GWR Mayael the Anima RWG RWB Edgar Markov BWR WG Gaddok Teeg GW W Oketra the True W
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Combo. I don't mind combo in EDH but I hate it when heavy duty combo gets mixed into "normal" games, would rather have games where we all play like that and then games where nobody is playing like that.
Ramp is the only archetype with an undeserved sense of entitlement behind it, where the fun of a commander group is measured by how unopposed the ramp players are. That aside, I'm happy to take on all archetypes. I just don't buy into any out-of-rules expectations going into a match. I met one player who thought everyone was entitled to five unopposed turns before really playing. It's never the stax guy.
Good god, this. And woe behold you try to hate on manabases - then they can't cast their extra turns or other huge game winning spells.
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EDH RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
#1.) Chaos: It's like, why sit down to this game? We had a Maelstrom Wanderer chaos deck in our group for a long time whose sole purpose was to ruin the game as much as possible. Vernal Equinox, Possibility Storm, Knowledge Pool, Scrambleverse, Grip of Chaos, Hive Mind, Eye of the Storm.... just.. no. He couldn't figure out why everyone went for him immediately, even when everyone explained they hated chaos. A random card every now and again is fine, but an entire deck is just too much.
#2.) Combo: It's not that I think combo decks are unfair, it's that it forces the group to build appropriately. As ISBPathfinder mentioned, its an answer-check. Don't have an answer? GG. On the flip side, when you deny these players their combo with a well-placed counter or spot removal, they tend to get salty (and in groups outside my main playgroups, they often scoop). This leads to a particularly un-fun environment where everyone needs counters and spot removal in their hand at all times and need to likely be playing combo themselves. It's terrible.
#3.) Stax: Now, I respect the archetype, I even feel it can be a positive checks and balances thing in most groups where people are greedily ramping or tossing things onto the board left and right. However, no one enjoys being completely choked out of a game and watching someone basically goldfish their sweet stax deck for several minutes a turn, only to draw-go their own. I feel like there are degrees of stax, too much just makes the game un-fun for everyone involved and sort of becomes like the combo scenario where everyone just needs to always have a fistful of answers and no one really wants to play out.
Stax because big games can be slow enough without someone deliberately slowing things down for the whole table. I typically play in 6-8 player games, though.
Cheers!
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If in the area, check out Gamers N Geeks and Mini War Games in Mobile, Alabama and Underhill's Games in Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio.
I work hard for my extra cards and I actually play enough lands -- then Group Hug triples everyone's mana and casts Prosperity for 10. When you can't actually make a plan or generate an advantage, it is more like a movie than a game at that point.
Hard to choose between stax and combo, but I voted on Stax because at least after a combo resolves the game is over. With stax you also have to agonizingly sit their for god who knows how many turns before the stax player won.
Really not understanding how group hug gets so much hate. I love it when someone plays group hug, speeds the game along nicely.
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The secret to enjoyable Commander games is not winning first, but losing last.
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Personally, I hate Group Hug. Decks that don't bother trying to win and just kingmake another player are beyond pointless to me and honestly, take all the fun out of the game.
This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
The main goal of course is to attempt to DDOS the game whenever that player plays Hive Mind.
The Unidentified Fantastic Flying Girl.
EDH
Xenagos, the God of Stompy
The Gitrog Monster: Oppressive Value.
Marchesa, Marionette Master - Undying Robots
Yuriko, the Hydra Omnivore
I make dolls as a hobby.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Ying to the yang I suppose.
Limiting the paths to victory for your opponents is very different from opening those paths up super wide, who would have guessed.
Ramp is the only archetype that has all the right tools against it 'soft-banned' in most casual playgroups.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
I won't get mad if a person plays but I will kill them first.
BK'rrik Goodstuff
GWSythis Enchantress
URYusri Coin Flip
BRGKorvold Tokens
BGUYarok Lands Matter
WUBRaffine Looter
EDIT: I guess unlike Stax that shuts down plays or Hug enables plays, Chaos deck just forces people to change strategy over and over and over again. Pretty much the Chaotic Neutral of the archetypes.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
Granted, I could've also voted group hug but haven't actually come across any in a long while. Lucky, I guess.
I also have a thing against combo, but that's a deck by deck thing for me. Your turn should not take forty minutes.
B Dark Ides Life DrainR Rekindle Skies Phoenix TribalWB Veil Oath Tokens
BR Brutal Scourge Eldrazi TribalRW Edge Worthy Mid-Range AggroGU Wisp Away Combo
GWU Vigorous Flow Energy
Commander / EDH:
RFeldon of the Third Path
GURashmi, Eternities Crafter
RWBMathas, Fiend Hunter
GWUBAtraxa, Praetor's Voice
WUBRG Reaper King - Elf Tribal WUBRG | Tribal Fun
WRG Gishath, Sun's Avatar - Dinosaur Tribal WRG | Rawr!!!
WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician - Enchantress Tactics WUG | Enchantments Focused
GBG The Gitrog Monster - Land Shenanigans GBG | Lands/Mill Focused
WBW Kambal, Consul of Life Allocation Matters WBW | Life Gain/Loss focused
UBR Kess, Dissident Mage of the Lotus UBR | Spellslinger
BGB Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons - Counters & Tokens BGB | -1/-1 counters focused
I think combo is boring and uncreative, I think ramp is usually boring and uncreative, I think reanimator is an effing weird category to add alongside things like "control" and "combo". Reanimator isn't really a broad archetype, nor is it common in commander in my experience.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
As far as the others mentioned in the poll, I would actually say that I like them for the following reasons:
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
UG Tishana, Voice of Thunder GU
UBW Sen Triplets WBU
WUBGAtraxa, Praetors' Voice GBUW
WUBRGJodah, Archmage Eternal GRBUW
GWR Mayael the Anima RWG
RWB Edgar Markov BWR
WG Gaddok Teeg GW
W Oketra the True W
---
My Decklist Folder
Good god, this. And woe behold you try to hate on manabases - then they can't cast their extra turns or other huge game winning spells.
RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck
RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
Arena Standard
UUUU Tempo, since before it was cool
Various Wx decks running Fountain of Renewal and Day of Glory
Anything I can cram Chaos Wand in to
#1.) Chaos: It's like, why sit down to this game? We had a Maelstrom Wanderer chaos deck in our group for a long time whose sole purpose was to ruin the game as much as possible. Vernal Equinox, Possibility Storm, Knowledge Pool, Scrambleverse, Grip of Chaos, Hive Mind, Eye of the Storm.... just.. no. He couldn't figure out why everyone went for him immediately, even when everyone explained they hated chaos. A random card every now and again is fine, but an entire deck is just too much.
#2.) Combo: It's not that I think combo decks are unfair, it's that it forces the group to build appropriately. As ISBPathfinder mentioned, its an answer-check. Don't have an answer? GG. On the flip side, when you deny these players their combo with a well-placed counter or spot removal, they tend to get salty (and in groups outside my main playgroups, they often scoop). This leads to a particularly un-fun environment where everyone needs counters and spot removal in their hand at all times and need to likely be playing combo themselves. It's terrible.
#3.) Stax: Now, I respect the archetype, I even feel it can be a positive checks and balances thing in most groups where people are greedily ramping or tossing things onto the board left and right. However, no one enjoys being completely choked out of a game and watching someone basically goldfish their sweet stax deck for several minutes a turn, only to draw-go their own. I feel like there are degrees of stax, too much just makes the game un-fun for everyone involved and sort of becomes like the combo scenario where everyone just needs to always have a fistful of answers and no one really wants to play out.
Cheers!
Krichaiushii on PucaTrade.
I work hard for my extra cards and I actually play enough lands -- then Group Hug triples everyone's mana and casts Prosperity for 10. When you can't actually make a plan or generate an advantage, it is more like a movie than a game at that point.
Draft my Mono-Blue Cube!
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Really not understanding how group hug gets so much hate. I love it when someone plays group hug, speeds the game along nicely.
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