Unbender Tine . I'm currently working on a Hanna stax deck with the obligatory Mana Crypt and Sol Ring in addition to a number of creatures with strong abilities such as Master Transmuter, lands with strong abilities (Bazaar of Baghdad, Serra's Sanctum) and other mana rocks such as Grim Monolith. I came across the Tine and was thinking it could be a solid ramp piece but at the same time it is also quite expensive at 4 cmc. Does anyone have any experiences playing with it? Was it worth it?
Clock of Omens is your card, bruh. The tine is about as good as a cockroach crawling inside your rectum and deciding the real estate is perfect for starting a family.
Clock of Omens is your card, bruh. The tine is about as good as a cockroach crawling inside your rectum and deciding the real estate is perfect for starting a family.
please explain why, when OP is looking for a card that untaps multiple permanent types, you recommend a card that only untaps artifacts?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
Clock of Omens is your card, bruh. The tine is about as good as a cockroach crawling inside your rectum and deciding the real estate is perfect for starting a family.
please explain why, when OP is looking for a card that untaps multiple permanent types, you recommend a card that only untaps artifacts?
Because if you want to untap multiple permanent types, you use Turnabout or Derevi or literally anything else. Tine is the equivalent of "4 mana: do nothing unless you were already winning". Clock combos with many primary stax lock pieces and is generally more abusable than Tine. If OP's ultimate goal is to play Archon of The Triumvirate on turn 6, by all means play Tine. As someone who has attempted to make the card playable in the past, failed, and is now vindictively salty to the degree evident in my post, I'm telling you it isn't and will never be "wurth".
OP, if you're attempting a competitive build, the thing will disappoint you. Find something else.
I'm a fan of Unbender Tine in my Merieke deck. It untaps Merieke, provide mana as needed, and plays a role in various combos.
This, OP. Everyone's experiences will be different, but Tine is not to be discounted. Check mine and Incanur's Merieke decks in our signatures for some ideas in not only untapping creatures as necessary, but also untapping Tine.
Clock of Omens is your card, bruh. The tine is about as good as a cockroach crawling inside your rectum and deciding the real estate is perfect for starting a family.
please explain why, when OP is looking for a card that untaps multiple permanent types, you recommend a card that only untaps artifacts?
Because if you want to untap multiple permanent types, you use Turnabout or Derevi or literally anything else. Tine is the equivalent of "4 mana: do nothing unless you were already winning". Clock combos with many primary stax lock pieces and is generally more abusable than Tine. If OP's ultimate goal is to play Archon of The Triumvirate on turn 6, by all means play Tine. As someone who has attempted to make the card playable in the past, failed, and is now vindictively salty to the degree evident in my post, I'm telling you it isn't and will never be "wurth".
OP, if you're attempting a competitive build, the thing will disappoint you. Find something else.
.
OK, so you suggested a card that only effects artifacts (which he should put in the deck, but which doesn't actually do what he is looking for in terms of untapping lands and creatures), then explained it by instead suggesting a one time effect and a card that literally cannot go in his deck.
You want to suggest OP give up on repeatable untap effects that hit all permanent types in favor of narrower effects that are more efficient, just say so. You at least explained why clock is better for stax in your second post by touching on the combo with orb and other cards.
At worst, tine is an overpriced mana rock. That is pretty bad. The question is how often can OPs deck deck into situations where it's untapping sanctum, bazaar, tomb, etc (I focus specifically on lands because that's what sets it apart, otherwise paradox engine is almost strictly better). Unless he can be sure he's got a boss land to untap whenever tine is out, then it's not worth it. I'd argue that the printing of paradox engine renders the tine obsolete as a redundant piece next to clock, but the question he needs to ask then is if he really needs that much redundancy. Probably not, though untapping his commander helps.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
In this case, you're going to want to run both, and not choose between the 2. You will then realize that Tine also does nothing on its own, and cut it, because while Engine requires help, the pay off for when it works just obliterates Tine.
It's bad. It's slow. It isn't even worth trying. I have tried it, and have cut it from every build where it has been tried.
I can't imagine cutting Tine from my Merieke list. Paradox Engine is awkward with Merieke because sometimes you don't want to untap her. I might try it alongside Tine if I can get my hands on one; turning Merieke into a 1/1 Avatar of Woe ain't the worst thing in the world.
Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
I can't see how Tine isn't worth playing in Grand Arbiter. My wife's GA deck loves it. At worst it's a 2 mana mana-rock. At best, it's a swiss-army knife. Untap nykthos for tons o'mana. Untap a creature to give it "vigilance". Untap Arcanis to get another 3 cards. Best find in a while for that deck.
Tine can perform several useful functions due to its versatility. Worst case scenario, it's a mana rock. Outside of that though? Untapping lands that tap for multiple mana. Untapping things like Grim Monolith or Mana Vault, even Sol Ring. Untapping creatures with potent abilities or just to give them pseudo vigilance. Untapping things that have a stiff untap cost or are slow to power up for a large effect(Magistrate's Scepter). What it lacks in potency (Unwinding Clock), it makes up for in versatility in many decks. If you are playing a lot of cards besides boring 'ol lands that seem really silly to use multiple times per turn, Unbender Tine is a fine inclusion.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Legacy: TES
EDH: Grand Arbiter $tax, Freyalise Stompy, Mimeoplasm Death From the Grave
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
BRWC Mardu Shops - Tymna and Akiri Artifacts BRWC
please explain why, when OP is looking for a card that untaps multiple permanent types, you recommend a card that only untaps artifacts?
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
Because if you want to untap multiple permanent types, you use Turnabout or Derevi or literally anything else. Tine is the equivalent of "4 mana: do nothing unless you were already winning". Clock combos with many primary stax lock pieces and is generally more abusable than Tine. If OP's ultimate goal is to play Archon of The Triumvirate on turn 6, by all means play Tine. As someone who has attempted to make the card playable in the past, failed, and is now vindictively salty to the degree evident in my post, I'm telling you it isn't and will never be "wurth".
OP, if you're attempting a competitive build, the thing will disappoint you. Find something else.
This, OP. Everyone's experiences will be different, but Tine is not to be discounted. Check mine and Incanur's Merieke decks in our signatures for some ideas in not only untapping creatures as necessary, but also untapping Tine.
EDH decks: 1. RGWMayael's Big BeatsRETIRED!
2. BUWMerieke Ri Berit and the 40 Thieves
3. URNiv's Wheeling and Dealing!
4. BURThe Walking Dead
5. GWSisay's Legends of Tomorrow
6. RWBRise of Markov
7. GElvez and stuffz(W)
8. RCrush your enemies(W)
9. BSign right here...(W)
This, OP. Engine is broken (and by extension, "good"). Tine is just not worth 4 mana, and you heard it here, it isn't even worth 2.
OK, so you suggested a card that only effects artifacts (which he should put in the deck, but which doesn't actually do what he is looking for in terms of untapping lands and creatures), then explained it by instead suggesting a one time effect and a card that literally cannot go in his deck.
You want to suggest OP give up on repeatable untap effects that hit all permanent types in favor of narrower effects that are more efficient, just say so. You at least explained why clock is better for stax in your second post by touching on the combo with orb and other cards.
At worst, tine is an overpriced mana rock. That is pretty bad. The question is how often can OPs deck deck into situations where it's untapping sanctum, bazaar, tomb, etc (I focus specifically on lands because that's what sets it apart, otherwise paradox engine is almost strictly better). Unless he can be sure he's got a boss land to untap whenever tine is out, then it's not worth it. I'd argue that the printing of paradox engine renders the tine obsolete as a redundant piece next to clock, but the question he needs to ask then is if he really needs that much redundancy. Probably not, though untapping his commander helps.
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
In this case, you're going to want to run both, and not choose between the 2. You will then realize that Tine also does nothing on its own, and cut it, because while Engine requires help, the pay off for when it works just obliterates Tine.
It's bad. It's slow. It isn't even worth trying. I have tried it, and have cut it from every build where it has been tried.
To each their own, but you will be disappointed.
On phasing:
EDH: Grand Arbiter $tax, Freyalise Stompy, Mimeoplasm Death From the Grave