It got me thinking of a new way to play the singleton format. You know, spice it up. I don't have anything set in stone but the idea is like the roles on a boat the Master is the "high-grade" sea captain. So he she (insert any Legendary Creature here) will retain all rules that apply to a typical commander. Additional rules apply... you cannot cast your "Master" unless your "Commander" is on Deck/"battlefield" or has been cast more than two times.
Now with the "Commander" the lesser ranked position (insert any Legendary Creature here with cmc less than 4) he/she reduces your master's cost by (1) generic mana when on the battlefield. your "Commander" will have commander tax of (1) just as your "Master" has (2) for each time it goes to the command zone. And maybe your "Commander" has no tax if your "Master" is out. So the the lower the cmc of your "Commander" the more appealing of a discount to your "Master". Maybe?
Are you still with me?
They both start out in the command zone.
Colors of your deck can be 1-5. yes, 4 color decks can happen.
Now with the deck itself, it’s now 98
Life? Stays the same.
Of course there will be broken synergies. But let's not get worried about that right now. Just like every format there is a banded card list. Just not right now for this one.
Does this sound interesting at all?
Is it too complicated? If so, what can we simplify?
Do you have any questions?
I'm thinking with all these new 3 cmc or less commander coming out, there would be a lot that people can choose from. And with 148 cards, there would be enough variance that could make or break this. I have not tested anything but I would like to present this idea to some guys at my lsg. But before that, I want to bounce it off you guys. There definitely can be some things I haven't thought of regarding this
The main point of this format seems to be to have access to two different commanders. Everything else is detracting or distracting from that.
Like, why 150 cards? EDH decks are already huge and ponderous. A double sleeved 150 carder would be like 6" tall.
And the life. EDH already has too much life, to the point where no aggressive strategy can be a real thing. Why increase it?
And the colour identity. Colour identity is a core element of EDH - why remove it?
The biggest issue this format would face would be two card combo pairing as the Master and the Commander. I've seen a similar idea suggested wherein you can only cast one if the other is in the Command Zone. If it were me, I would build this format with that restriction, and with the smaller of the creatures fitting within the colour identity of the larger.
Extending from there, perhaps even make the Master an Uncommon or some such. Another possibility would be to enforce certain CMC for Masters and Commanders. Its not the low CMC commanders that need more representation, but the higher, so if the format were a vehicle for getting more beater legendaries into play I'd be more for it.
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EDH RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
You are on to something here. The reason why the it worked in the video was because the chosen commanders were random.
In this case, you do choose essentially 2 commanders and you do have to stay with in the colors of those commanders. But in doing this we get to play with different combos we weren't able to play with before.
It's definitely a kitchen table game. But if it were to be up there with two headed giant, which like you said people go with combos. It still wouldn't be a format you would see on mtgo. Like 2HG was taken off mtgo.
More over, this has never been tested. So I don't actually know what would even work.
I also can imagine a 6 inch double sleeved deck spilling everywhere. Lol.
The end result for what I'm looking for is a double commander singleton format that relies on both commanders and that is interesting enough for others to try, yet simple enough to pick up on. What the heck would that look like?
Make it compatible with regular commander. Take your EDH deck, put in a second minor general, and viola your playing Master & Commander.
So the rules to focus on are those which would control how the Master is incorporated into the game. IE, Legendary or any creature? Allowed on the field with the Commander or not? Mandatory lower CMC? etc etc.
Pretty interested to work something for this because a friend of mine has brought something like this up as a format in the past.
Re; kitchen table, I am of the mindset that EDH as a format is decidedly kitchen table. Don't be too worried about people abusing the system with combos - those people won't be playing some wacky homebrew format, and if they did, it would only be when it was established and had a banlist etc.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
EDH RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
If we were to stay with a color identity within the two commanders. I think that, that should help simplify the variant more. Even tho saying goodbye to 4 color for a bit will be hard. Odric's War Angel could be a good build. Odric, Lunarch Marshal + Jenara, Asura of War. These games could get out of hand with 2 perfect commanders. Since basically having them both right there is almost like a tutor/animation affect at the sametime at a taxed price. Idk. Maybe an uncommon might have to be the "commander". There is too much power that has not been explored.
Even with this, it might become a removal build variant.
On the upside, if it was kept at shared color group then that's just one card the builder has to change if players do want to play M&C. And thus easier to test out and play.
Every time I see one of these "Let's make a new EDH variant!" pop up I can't help but smirk. Every other month someone is trying to reinvent the wheel, so to speak, and we end up with formats like Tiny Leaders and Canadian Highlander that get a bit of attention for being new; and then everyone forgets about them for being pretty forgettable. Sigh.
Hence the focus on making it compatible with regular EDH. Take an EDH deck, slot in a Master and your good to go.
Personally, I'm more inclined to snort every time someone feels the need to point out this cycle.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
EDH RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
We all want a lil salt and pepper. But yeah I think that taking out a slot for the Master in an edh deck would do it. It would make for some scarry fast games possibly. I think I am going to have to make Odric's War Angel. And you know Xenphire, this is just for funzies. But I would like to work out some of the kinks in this hair brain idea. More over, tiny leaders tried to go big. I just want to try this out with my pals and give it a name. Yeah. I'm sure it won't go anywhere. But that doesn't mean I can't try something new in my group. And if they like it they can take it where they want. Now that jsNZ helped me smooth out this idea I had
It's really not "your idea". They literally just found a way to utilize two separate commanders, and pretty much everyone has had the idea, "what if we had more than one commander?" I made a thread about, and I've seen tons of other people make threads about it. So maybe it's too soon to be eating that cake.
honestly, if anyone built a deck with some weird alternate ruleset and could explain it to me before the game, i'd def be up for seeing what it'd look like. in the end, edh is still a social game, and those sitting in the rules committee won't be lambasting me for playing with alternate rules as long as we're still enjoying the game.
I think if people are interested in giving it a go, go for it, and let the rest of us know how it went!
For those who are uninterested, don't just bog these guys down just 'cuz you don't agree. Give advice, sure, but just smirking about how other similar sub-formats have come and gone are far from useful for anyone.
https://youtu.be/O7W8VrfLlY4
It got me thinking of a new way to play the singleton format. You know, spice it up. I don't have anything set in stone but the idea is like the roles on a boat the Master is the "high-grade" sea captain. So he she (insert any Legendary Creature here) will retain all rules that apply to a typical commander. Additional rules apply... you cannot cast your "Master" unless your "Commander" is on Deck/"battlefield" or has been cast more than two times.
Now with the "Commander" the lesser ranked position (insert any Legendary Creature here with cmc less than 4) he/she reduces your master's cost by (1) generic mana when on the battlefield. your "Commander" will have commander tax of (1) just as your "Master" has (2) for each time it goes to the command zone. And maybe your "Commander" has no tax if your "Master" is out. So the the lower the cmc of your "Commander" the more appealing of a discount to your "Master". Maybe?
Are you still with me?
They both start out in the command zone.
Colors of your deck can be 1-5. yes, 4 color decks can happen.
Now with the deck itself, it’s now 98
Life? Stays the same.
Of course there will be broken synergies. But let's not get worried about that right now. Just like every format there is a banded card list. Just not right now for this one.
Does this sound interesting at all?
Is it too complicated? If so, what can we simplify?
Do you have any questions?
I'm thinking with all these new 3 cmc or less commander coming out, there would be a lot that people can choose from. And with 148 cards, there would be enough variance that could make or break this. I have not tested anything but I would like to present this idea to some guys at my lsg. But before that, I want to bounce it off you guys. There definitely can be some things I haven't thought of regarding this
Like, why 150 cards? EDH decks are already huge and ponderous. A double sleeved 150 carder would be like 6" tall.
And the life. EDH already has too much life, to the point where no aggressive strategy can be a real thing. Why increase it?
And the colour identity. Colour identity is a core element of EDH - why remove it?
The biggest issue this format would face would be two card combo pairing as the Master and the Commander. I've seen a similar idea suggested wherein you can only cast one if the other is in the Command Zone. If it were me, I would build this format with that restriction, and with the smaller of the creatures fitting within the colour identity of the larger.
Extending from there, perhaps even make the Master an Uncommon or some such. Another possibility would be to enforce certain CMC for Masters and Commanders. Its not the low CMC commanders that need more representation, but the higher, so if the format were a vehicle for getting more beater legendaries into play I'd be more for it.
RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck
RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
Arena Standard
UUUU Tempo, since before it was cool
Various Wx decks running Fountain of Renewal and Day of Glory
Anything I can cram Chaos Wand in to
In this case, you do choose essentially 2 commanders and you do have to stay with in the colors of those commanders. But in doing this we get to play with different combos we weren't able to play with before.
It's definitely a kitchen table game. But if it were to be up there with two headed giant, which like you said people go with combos. It still wouldn't be a format you would see on mtgo. Like 2HG was taken off mtgo.
More over, this has never been tested. So I don't actually know what would even work.
I also can imagine a 6 inch double sleeved deck spilling everywhere. Lol.
The end result for what I'm looking for is a double commander singleton format that relies on both commanders and that is interesting enough for others to try, yet simple enough to pick up on. What the heck would that look like?
So the rules to focus on are those which would control how the Master is incorporated into the game. IE, Legendary or any creature? Allowed on the field with the Commander or not? Mandatory lower CMC? etc etc.
Pretty interested to work something for this because a friend of mine has brought something like this up as a format in the past.
Re; kitchen table, I am of the mindset that EDH as a format is decidedly kitchen table. Don't be too worried about people abusing the system with combos - those people won't be playing some wacky homebrew format, and if they did, it would only be when it was established and had a banlist etc.
RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck
RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
Arena Standard
UUUU Tempo, since before it was cool
Various Wx decks running Fountain of Renewal and Day of Glory
Anything I can cram Chaos Wand in to
Even with this, it might become a removal build variant.
On the upside, if it was kept at shared color group then that's just one card the builder has to change if players do want to play M&C. And thus easier to test out and play.
(Also known as Xenphire)
Personally, I'm more inclined to snort every time someone feels the need to point out this cycle.
RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck
RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
Arena Standard
UUUU Tempo, since before it was cool
Various Wx decks running Fountain of Renewal and Day of Glory
Anything I can cram Chaos Wand in to
I think if people are interested in giving it a go, go for it, and let the rest of us know how it went!
For those who are uninterested, don't just bog these guys down just 'cuz you don't agree. Give advice, sure, but just smirking about how other similar sub-formats have come and gone are far from useful for anyone.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom