Not that they're terribly expensive, but I was really surprised at the prices of Cloudstone Curio and Bloom Tender when I looked for both recently. These are the kinds of cards I already own but end up omitting or proxying because getting additional copies doesn't seem reasonable.
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EDH playing competitive Magic cast away
Current Decks GTitania midrange RGThromok tokens/goodstuff | UB Grimgrin zombie tribal GW Sigarda enchantress | R Godo voltron U Braids aggro | WR Kalemne punisher RU Mizzix storm | BUG Mimeoplasm competitive reanimator | UG Ezuri infect
There are a few major categories of cards who have large demand (and thus increased prices) almost solely due to EDH:
-******* FOILS
-All the cards at 4+ cmc that generate massive resources
-All the cards at 8+ cmc that make you win a multiplayer game if they resolve. The kinds of cards that are all-stars in casual or beginning EDH metas.
-Super popular legendary creatures, especially ones that have never come out of booster packs
-Certain combo pieces for infinite combos that (I think) don't see play in other formats
pretty sure most/all of these would be like $1-2 apiece if not for EDH
also chromatic lantern for some reason, even though that card is outclassed to the point of obsolescence
Aluren and Helm of Obedience are more likely legacy driven. There used to be an argument for Loyal Retainers too, but it would be some pretty serious price memory seeing as Survival got banned years ago. I otherwise agree with most of this. Legendary creatures, especially foils, are definitely the biggest offenders.
It's possible a lot of the stuff in this thread would be pricey from casual demand with or without EDH. As an example, Doubling Season was expensive before EDH was as widespread as it is today and there's no reason to think it wouldn't be expensive without EDH now. It's kind of moot because the two have become more or less one and the same for a lot of people.
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[Pr]Jaya | Estrid | A rotating cast of decks built out of my box.
i'd consider sol ring, mana crypt and some of the other artifact ramp that are banned in legacy but are insanely expensive..
mana crypt is probably pricey 'cuz its from a limited print run too though..
maybe even some cards like mana drain? i dont see it played in vintage, i think its banned in legacy (though i dont think its efficient enough), and i dont think any vintage decks play it either?
Mana Drain was played in vintage not too long ago and the price is due to its rarity and usage in that format. The price sustains probably because of the demand created by commander. Also, you dont think Mana Drain is efficient enough for legacy? I think that while two is a lot to pay for a counter in that format, the upside of half price Jaces and Show and Tells would be worth leaving 2 up for a turn.
To be fair regarding doubling season, that card was expensive before EDH was a thing because of 60-card casual, which is functionally the same within the scope of the current discussion (card prices propped up exclusively from non-tournament social formats).
A lot of cards used to be much worse before getting a main set reprint. I seem to recall Akroma's Memorial getting pretty high up there back before it showed up in M13.
You could probably count "Vintage staples with high availability" as well; Pre-Commander Sol Ring being a good example. Sure everybody ran one in their Vintage decks, but even before the precons I would be willing to bet the people who played EDH greatly outnumbered those who played Vintage, Sol Ring had a ~$15 minimum price tag as a result. This was before the Commander boom, so that was quite a lot back then.
I don't think it's expensive because "commander demand" drives up the price, it's expensive because it's p3k. All the non-jank p3k cards, regardless of what format they're played in, are super expensive compared to their equivalent alternatives in other sets pretty much exclusively because p3k saw such limited print (compare: Ravages of War vs Armageddon; Three Visits vs Nature's Lore; Imperial Seal vs Vampiric Tutor; and so on).
When I think "Commander demand" I usually think combo cards like Food Chain, Rings of Brighthearth, Mycosynth Lattice, Gauntlet of Power, Staff of Domination, Palinchron, etc., since infinite combo victories are pretty much unique to EDH. In every other format, having 20 life total and only 1 opponent means it's much faster to just turn creatures sideways and beat face rather than assemble an infinite combo.
True. But it wouldn't have topped 100$ if it wasn't EDH playable. Take a look at the cards topping 100$ in P3K, Imperial Seal - Vintage Card, Capture of Jingzhou, Imperial Recruiter - legacy/vintage, Zodiac Dragon - this is a collector item. and Ravages of War. Commander drove the price of this card to absurd levels. Although Three Visits is the wtf price on this set.
i'd consider sol ring, mana crypt and some of the other artifact ramp that are banned in legacy but are insanely expensive..
mana crypt is probably pricey 'cuz its from a limited print run too though..
maybe even some cards like mana drain? i dont see it played in vintage, i think its banned in legacy (though i dont think its efficient enough), and i dont think any vintage decks play it either?
Mana Drain was played in vintage not too long ago and the price is due to its rarity and usage in that format. The price sustains probably because of the demand created by commander. Also, you dont think Mana Drain is efficient enough for legacy? I think that while two is a lot to pay for a counter in that format, the upside of half price Jaces and Show and Tells would be worth leaving 2 up for a turn.
Doubling Season was high before Commander. Mana Crypt was like $2, though, and Sol Ring was $3. Mana Drain was over $100, though, because of vintage. A lot of the portal cards are because of commander, though.
Most cards printed in the last 15x years are still reasonably obtainable.
Yes there is the normal old-powerhouses like volcanic island/mana drain/timetwister/etc, but there are some specific cards from the early years that are not seeing heavy play in eternal (vintage + legacy), but are extremely relevant for commander.
Due to their age and limited printing, something like a gauntlet of might and Forcefield still hold a high price tag for cards that are mostly seen in just EDH.
i'd consider sol ring, mana crypt and some of the other artifact ramp that are banned in legacy but are insanely expensive..
mana crypt is probably pricey 'cuz its from a limited print run too though..
maybe even some cards like mana drain? i dont see it played in vintage, i think its banned in legacy (though i dont think its efficient enough), and i dont think any vintage decks play it either?
Mana Drain was played in vintage not too long ago and the price is due to its rarity and usage in that format. The price sustains probably because of the demand created by commander. Also, you dont think Mana Drain is efficient enough for legacy? I think that while two is a lot to pay for a counter in that format, the upside of half price Jaces and Show and Tells would be worth leaving 2 up for a turn.
I know! Thats what I'm saying lol. It's like, way too good.
really? this is starting to be a legacy convo, but i'm doubting that if mana drain would be unbanned in legacy, that it would see heavy (3 or more-ofs) play. if you look at all the counterspells used in legacy, most cost just 1 mana. in legacy, convenience of casting (i.e. lower casting cost) almost always beats sheer power of the cards themselves. spell pierce and spell snare are a lot more narrow than counterspell, but counterspell doesn't see any legacy play cuz of its inconvenience, not because of its power (it defo is up there in power). in the current meta, probably miracles would be one of the few decks that might sport it as a one-of.. i dunno.. im not a miracles player..
ANYWAYS, i dont recall anyone mentioning rhystic study.. i dont think that sees any play outside of casual.. cruel tutor? death baron, and coat of arms were the priciest things i had to get for my horde deck, and i dont think they see play anywhere either.
I would say pretty much any of the of the Theros Gods. Also, any big splashy blue spell/enchantment.
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My friend bought two boxes of each set in the Scars of Mirrodin block, and last night, someone drafted a Phyrexian Obliterator.
I'm pretty damn sure it doesn't see play in Modern/Legacy due to it's casting cost (quad black is tough.)
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"When does a man die? When he is hit by a bullet? No! When he suffers a disease? No! When he ate a soup made out of a poisonous mushroom? No! A man dies when he is forgotten!" Currently Piloting: EDH BGGlissa, The Traitor - Recursion (Primer) WBRKaalia of The Vast URGRiku of Two Reflections WUBSydri, Galvanic Genius UBRamirez DePietro GWKrond, The Dawn-Clad GWUDerevi, Empyrial Tactician RGOmnath, Locus of Rage
Doubling Season was high before Commander. Mana Crypt was like $2, though, and Sol Ring was $3. Mana Drain was over $100, though, because of vintage. A lot of the portal cards are because of commander, though.
Mana Crypt was like $2... in 1995... It has long been a Vintage staple.
What about Imperial Seal and Grim Tutor? I don't think they see any Legacy play and am usnure about Vintage...
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The "Crazy One", playing casual magic and occasionally dipping his toes into regular play since 1994.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
What about Imperial Seal and Grim Tutor? I don't think they see any Legacy play and am usnure about Vintage...
Grim Tutor and Imperial Seal have both seen some play in Vintage previously (i.e. in the old "Grim Long" deck, but they're not exactly staples, no. Imperial Seal is banned in Legacy and restricted in Vintage.
Doubling Season was high before Commander. Mana Crypt was like $2, though, and Sol Ring was $3. Mana Drain was over $100, though, because of vintage. A lot of the portal cards are because of commander, though.
Mana Crypt was like $2... in 1995... It has long been a Vintage staple.
I bought it from Troll and Toad around Shards of Alara for like $2. They had multiple in stock, too. Of course, while it's a staple of some vintage decks, it's only a one of in select ones and vintage is almost always an X proxy format. I'd assume there weren't a lot of purchases for a card that you might get to use once in a huge while. It also likely wasn't a casual card until Commander. Of course, until the commander decks and the internet trying to streamline the most busted thing possible, I never even saw anyone play one. Back then, all the decent tutors were under $10 as well. Most of them were either banned in legacy or saw only play in select decks. Then, the commander decks hit and now everyone wants 10 for all their decks. Duals used to be cheap back then, too, but that's a much legacy as commander. I actually got Channel 4 for a dollar too. Just because a card is overpowered doesn't mean anything if no one's buying it. I got my Tolarian Academy for a couple bucks, too. It's no different than Natural Order before Progenitus hit legacy or Bazzar/LED before Odyssey. I mean, really, 4X fast mana and cheap tutors certainly weren't casual and they weren't used in any significant number in tournaments.
Chrome Lantern obsolete? It solves all your colored mana problems...
Current Decks
GTitania midrange
RGThromok tokens/goodstuff | UB Grimgrin zombie tribal
GW Sigarda enchantress | R Godo voltron
U Braids aggro | WR Kalemne punisher
RU Mizzix storm | BUG Mimeoplasm competitive reanimator | UG Ezuri infect
Aluren and Helm of Obedience are more likely legacy driven. There used to be an argument for Loyal Retainers too, but it would be some pretty serious price memory seeing as Survival got banned years ago. I otherwise agree with most of this. Legendary creatures, especially foils, are definitely the biggest offenders.
It's possible a lot of the stuff in this thread would be pricey from casual demand with or without EDH. As an example, Doubling Season was expensive before EDH was as widespread as it is today and there's no reason to think it wouldn't be expensive without EDH now. It's kind of moot because the two have become more or less one and the same for a lot of people.
Mana Drain is banned in legacy...
A lot of cards used to be much worse before getting a main set reprint. I seem to recall Akroma's Memorial getting pretty high up there back before it showed up in M13.
You could probably count "Vintage staples with high availability" as well; Pre-Commander Sol Ring being a good example. Sure everybody ran one in their Vintage decks, but even before the precons I would be willing to bet the people who played EDH greatly outnumbered those who played Vintage, Sol Ring had a ~$15 minimum price tag as a result. This was before the Commander boom, so that was quite a lot back then.
True. But it wouldn't have topped 100$ if it wasn't EDH playable. Take a look at the cards topping 100$ in P3K, Imperial Seal - Vintage Card, Capture of Jingzhou, Imperial Recruiter - legacy/vintage, Zodiac Dragon - this is a collector item. and Ravages of War. Commander drove the price of this card to absurd levels. Although Three Visits is the wtf price on this set.
Survival of the Fittest - solid Commander staple. banned in Legacy, too clunky in Vintage
Bloom Tender - Started to rise during the 3 color commander era
Food Chain - got banned in French, but still relevant in some Commander decks
Minamo, School at Water's Edge, Hall of the Bandit Lord, and other Kamigawa legendary lands - superb utility, again relevant to some commander decks
Seedborn Muse - So powerful in Commander I could cry
Tooth and Nail - play this, then usually win
Academy Rector - cheats Omniscience and other powerful stuff to play
Legacy:
UWR Miracles
BUG Shardless Sultai
EDH:
GWUDerevi, Master of SynergyUWG
RWBAlesha, Legacies and RelicsBWR
0R0Daretti, More than Meets the Eye0R0
WGSelvala, Elf StaxGW
RUGRiku of Infinite InvocationsGUR
I know! Thats what I'm saying lol. It's like, way too good.
GWUBAtraxa, Praetor's Voice PrimerGWUB
GWURoon Bant Blink WhateverGWU
BRGLord Windgrace LandsBRG
Not that I know of.
Salt is part of the game. Deal with it.
Yes there is the normal old-powerhouses like volcanic island/mana drain/timetwister/etc, but there are some specific cards from the early years that are not seeing heavy play in eternal (vintage + legacy), but are extremely relevant for commander.
Due to their age and limited printing, something like a gauntlet of might and Forcefield still hold a high price tag for cards that are mostly seen in just EDH.
Links to my most current deck lists;
Primary EDH; Rakka Mar Token Perfection, Crosis Mnemonic Betrayal, Cromat Villainous, Judith Gravestorm, Rakdos Empty Storm, Exava Artifacts, Bant Trash, & Fumiko Voltron!
EDH kept at home; Ruzzian Isset & Rakdos LoR!
EDH (nostalgic/pimp/retired) in storage;
Latulla Burns, Akroma Smash, Jeska Voltron, Rakdos Storm, Bladewing Darghans, Lyzolda Worldgorger, Xantcha Steals your Heart, Jori Storm, Wydwen Permission, Gwendlyn Paradox, Jeleva Warps, & Sigarda Brick!
Legacy Showanimator and High Tide!
ANYWAYS, i dont recall anyone mentioning rhystic study.. i dont think that sees any play outside of casual.. cruel tutor? death baron, and coat of arms were the priciest things i had to get for my horde deck, and i dont think they see play anywhere either.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
Angus Mackenzie
Thran Dynamo
Coalition Relic
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
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I'm pretty damn sure it doesn't see play in Modern/Legacy due to it's casting cost (quad black is tough.)
Currently Piloting:
EDH
BGGlissa, The Traitor - Recursion (Primer)
WBRKaalia of The Vast
URGRiku of Two Reflections
WUBSydri, Galvanic Genius
UBRamirez DePietro
GWKrond, The Dawn-Clad
GWUDerevi, Empyrial Tactician
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage
Modern
UG Infect
Bribery is a relatively common singleton sideboard card in modern played against decks like RG tron and Nahiri decks, etc.
(Have briberied a few emrakuls in my day ;))
My pick for EDH expensive only is Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger (and all the praetors really except Elesh Norn)
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Mana Crypt was like $2... in 1995... It has long been a Vintage staple.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
Grim Tutor and Imperial Seal have both seen some play in Vintage previously (i.e. in the old "Grim Long" deck, but they're not exactly staples, no. Imperial Seal is banned in Legacy and restricted in Vintage.
Neheb
Marath
Yidris
Sharuum
Yidris
this
Salt is part of the game. Deal with it.
My FTV Nicol Bolas and promo Hanna, Ship's Navigator were big money for a couple of not-broken creatures.
Consecrated Sphinx is up there too. I think Omniscience probably sees more play in EDH than any other format. Blade of Selves. Plenty more I'm sure.
Nicol Bolas Dragon Dick
Hanna, Ship's Navigator Heart-attack Stax
Oona, Queen of the Fae Fairy Dance
Vhati Il-Dal Tree of Woe
Scion of the Ur-Dragon Durgensturm
Jolrael, Empress of Beasts Jamuraa's Army
Liliana, Heretical Healer Rise from your Graves and Proliferate
Tariel, Reckoner of Souls Angelic Judgment
Neheb
Marath
Yidris
Sharuum
Yidris