So, first off, long time lurker, first time poster; please forgive any mistakes in formatting as a result. With that out of the way, this is something I've been rolling around in my head for a while.
I've been playing commander for about two years now, and I have gone through several decks and archetypes. From Sharuum the Hegemon to Kaalia of the Vast to Mayael the Anima to Riku of Two Reflections. At this point I have realized that I absolutely love toolbox decks and the Selesnya color identity. I like that when playing as the Selesnya player you can play control with any number of bears and more powerful game-changers like Linvala, Keeper of Silence and of course Gaddock Teeg; at the same time, you can change gears at the flip of a switch and go straight aggro as soon as you drop Avenger of Zendikar or something equally scary.
That's where the toolbox comes in. Running a toolbox deck gives me the opportunity to do all of those things and more, but the problem then becomes that I have to commit to the board proactively. I don't like doing that because it gives Mr. Blue Mage across the table time to plan and cackle maniacally as he plays his eot Cyclonic Rift.
This is why I want to ask you, the wonderful, well-informed, and incredibly attractive members of this forum, if Hunting Grounds is viable as a focal point for a reactive control deck? Just in case it isn't immediately obvious, once you have threshold any "to hand" creature tutor becomes "when an opponent casts a spell you may put a creature from your deck into play." Survival of the Fittest jumps to mind.
I would love to hear three things: Is it doable? What would the deck need to run correctly? And What would be the best commander for the deck?
I know the legend that immediately jumps to mind is Captain Sisay, but I want to see if any others are suitable to what I want to do or have an advantage over her; however, if she just can't be beat, please share that opinion. I'm just a little scared of her because of her perceived threat level.
Thank you in advance. I look forward to hearing from you.
I really like this Idea. I just have two problems with it: Building around a card in the 99 is really difficult without loading up on tons of tutors; and I can't think of a color I wouldn't want in this deck.
I've always enjoyed building decks to suit specific cards, which is why I find EDH/Commander so fun with the idea of a Legendary that you always have access to, but I avoid building decks with the idea of using a specific card that can't be my general. Building a deck around a specific card in the 99 requires a lot of tutors, which I guess isn't bad if you enjoy that sort of thing, but still a lot of deck space just to guarantee having that one card every game. With enough tutors to guarantee pulling that one card, then you might as well just go for an actual win condition and work on winning the game. It's just nowhere near ideal, at least if the deck can't easily go without it.
The amount of colors, or at least the best colors for this deck, is very hard to decide. White and Green are guaranteed to fit Hunting Grounds, but you've got 3 other colors and all of them have some really good stuff that would fit very well. Black would be an amazing fit so that you can recur creatures and use them over and over. Blue would be amazing for cards like Venser, Shaper Savant and Mystic Snake. Red would also be really good, but ultimately sub-par compared to blue or black, for cards like Dualcaster Mage. Thinking about that, I'd go with either Karador, Ghost Chieftain, Roon of the Hidden Realm, or Derevi, Empyrial Tactician. Karador and Roon add an amount of recursion into the mix while adding much more of a control aspect. Karador adding in extra graveyard recursion, while Roon can add in extra value while your creatures are on the board. Derevi, I would play as a typical Aggro/Control while falling back on white's recursion and blue's bounce to add more usage out of your creatures.
One person will either blow up it or your GY (which, if you're adding black, makes you more vulnerable in all likelihood since black uses the GY so much) before it gets back to you. I think you can get one use off it if you drop it at threshold (assuming you have a developed meta that respects and uses GY hate).
Anyone have experience with Lurking Predators? How much attention does that card draw?
I played Hunting Grounds back when EDH was still EDH. I am here to echo the experience that it is difficult to keep relevant cards in hand. If you don't have Avacyn out, its easy to over extend into that wrath by dropping a few good creatures from Player 1 & 2, then Player 3 wipes your board. It may work out better for you, so its worth a shot. Be sure to stock up on draw power for keeping things flowing.
Long time ago before EDH became a thing, I had a 60-card casual deck that ran Hunting Grounds and a bunch of cycling creatures, and paleoloth to keep my hand full. Hunting Grounds is pretty good as long as you have a way to keep your hand full. Some options:
I second the self bounce. You can also use greens panacea of ways to return creatures each upkeep like roaring primadox or temur sabertooth. Getting a few uses out of something like a fiend hunter (props if you bounce it while stacking triggers properly to permanently exile something) or even a reclamation sage or farhaven elf can pretty easily tip a game in your favor. In this case, hunting grounds just becomes a really good card in the 99, rather than a central piece and you still get to keep your "creature control" aspect you were interested in.
I really like this Idea. I just have two problems with it: Building around a card in the 99 is really difficult without loading up on tons of tutors; and I can't think of a color I wouldn't want in this deck.
You make good points following your headline, stocking the deck with an absurd amount of tutors isn’t really my thing either, but I don’t mind having the prerequisite white tutors for enchantments and artifacts that smooth out some of the bumps you get in a singleton format, so in that way I can grab the things I need, but I still challenge myself by not having the open-ended black tutors that let me get whatever, whenever.
Following that, I do want to stay away from blue, because I have been that guy sitting with a strong position playing Riku of Two Reflections and the EOT Rift. Honestly, it’s just too easy when you’re playing against other fair decks.
I don't think it would be reliable in EDH, though I like the idea of the deck. Perhaps you could add R for Sneak Attack and see what other similar cards are available to give you a creature-based control deck? It would then be along a similar theme but without relying on one specific card.
I really like this idea, I think using the Naya colors would allow me the opportunity to react if I lose Hunting Grounds or threshold through Sneak Attack, or even something a little jankier, like Impromptu Raid. In addition, Naya opens up the chance to run Sunforger which can allow me to respond to the Cyclonic Rift with a Ghostway on occasion.
With all that being said, even with Survival of the Fittest in play I would be afraid of not having a creature in hand, so that whole self-bounce situation could be a great. Thank you for that suggestion.
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I've been playing commander for about two years now, and I have gone through several decks and archetypes. From Sharuum the Hegemon to Kaalia of the Vast to Mayael the Anima to Riku of Two Reflections. At this point I have realized that I absolutely love toolbox decks and the Selesnya color identity. I like that when playing as the Selesnya player you can play control with any number of bears and more powerful game-changers like Linvala, Keeper of Silence and of course Gaddock Teeg; at the same time, you can change gears at the flip of a switch and go straight aggro as soon as you drop Avenger of Zendikar or something equally scary.
That's where the toolbox comes in. Running a toolbox deck gives me the opportunity to do all of those things and more, but the problem then becomes that I have to commit to the board proactively. I don't like doing that because it gives Mr. Blue Mage across the table time to plan and cackle maniacally as he plays his eot Cyclonic Rift.
This is why I want to ask you, the wonderful, well-informed, and incredibly attractive members of this forum, if Hunting Grounds is viable as a focal point for a reactive control deck? Just in case it isn't immediately obvious, once you have threshold any "to hand" creature tutor becomes "when an opponent casts a spell you may put a creature from your deck into play." Survival of the Fittest jumps to mind.
What's that? Wrath of God? Cute, here's an Avacyn, Angel of Hope, and so on.
I would love to hear three things: Is it doable? What would the deck need to run correctly? And What would be the best commander for the deck?
I know the legend that immediately jumps to mind is Captain Sisay, but I want to see if any others are suitable to what I want to do or have an advantage over her; however, if she just can't be beat, please share that opinion. I'm just a little scared of her because of her perceived threat level.
Thank you in advance. I look forward to hearing from you.
I've always enjoyed building decks to suit specific cards, which is why I find EDH/Commander so fun with the idea of a Legendary that you always have access to, but I avoid building decks with the idea of using a specific card that can't be my general. Building a deck around a specific card in the 99 requires a lot of tutors, which I guess isn't bad if you enjoy that sort of thing, but still a lot of deck space just to guarantee having that one card every game. With enough tutors to guarantee pulling that one card, then you might as well just go for an actual win condition and work on winning the game. It's just nowhere near ideal, at least if the deck can't easily go without it.
The amount of colors, or at least the best colors for this deck, is very hard to decide. White and Green are guaranteed to fit Hunting Grounds, but you've got 3 other colors and all of them have some really good stuff that would fit very well. Black would be an amazing fit so that you can recur creatures and use them over and over. Blue would be amazing for cards like Venser, Shaper Savant and Mystic Snake. Red would also be really good, but ultimately sub-par compared to blue or black, for cards like Dualcaster Mage. Thinking about that, I'd go with either Karador, Ghost Chieftain, Roon of the Hidden Realm, or Derevi, Empyrial Tactician. Karador and Roon add an amount of recursion into the mix while adding much more of a control aspect. Karador adding in extra graveyard recursion, while Roon can add in extra value while your creatures are on the board. Derevi, I would play as a typical Aggro/Control while falling back on white's recursion and blue's bounce to add more usage out of your creatures.
WBG Karador, Ghost Chieftain
B Toshiro Umezawa
BG Pharika, God of Affliction - Necromancy and Politics
WWW The Church of Heliod
WBR Zurgo, Helmsmasher
RG Wort, the Raidmother
UBR Jeleva, Nephalia's Scourge
UG Vorel of the Hull Clade
If my post has no tags, then i posted from my phone.
Anyone have experience with Lurking Predators? How much attention does that card draw?
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
I think lurking predators is "better" because it requires less to work (cards in library) and you still get value even if you miss.
- Self-bounce using things like erratic portal and cloudstone curio to get repeatable ETB effects
- Graveyard-to-hand effects like phyrexian reclamation with a sacrifice outlet
- Simply having a bunch of draw and a high density of creatures to barf out onto the table.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
You make good points following your headline, stocking the deck with an absurd amount of tutors isn’t really my thing either, but I don’t mind having the prerequisite white tutors for enchantments and artifacts that smooth out some of the bumps you get in a singleton format, so in that way I can grab the things I need, but I still challenge myself by not having the open-ended black tutors that let me get whatever, whenever.
Following that, I do want to stay away from blue, because I have been that guy sitting with a strong position playing Riku of Two Reflections and the EOT Rift. Honestly, it’s just too easy when you’re playing against other fair decks.
I really like this idea, I think using the Naya colors would allow me the opportunity to react if I lose Hunting Grounds or threshold through Sneak Attack, or even something a little jankier, like Impromptu Raid. In addition, Naya opens up the chance to run Sunforger which can allow me to respond to the Cyclonic Rift with a Ghostway on occasion.
With all that being said, even with Survival of the Fittest in play I would be afraid of not having a creature in hand, so that whole self-bounce situation could be a great. Thank you for that suggestion.