Play a reasonable curve of good cards, take an occasional extra draw as a bonus for playing a solid deck already? She's excellent grease for a number of strategies without promoting any particular one.
She's got a powerful effect, but she's like Ephara, God of the Polis in that she doesn't really need to be abused to be strong. You can find a way to draw 4 cards per turn cycle, but that's going to be needlessly complicated, require several cards on board or an enormous mana advantage, and most playgroups are going to take notice of that and remove her before you can get an overwhelming advantage. Drawing an extra card a turn is a solid effect, occasionally getting two is great. The only real change I would make to a deck with her is maybe going a little heavier on cantrips. Some of the ones that I wouldn't normally run, like Opt and Peek, have more value here.
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+1 to what Weebo said. You could overcomplicate her to trying to get a card each turn, but the amount of effort you'd put into that means you'd just be getting more cards that exist solely to trigger her.
I'd go Tempo, with a few classy cantrips like Brainstorm and a few cheap counters like Arcance Denial to make sure you can hit her when needed, but not put too much effort into it.
Cascade gives you a free second spell to trigger her, and Sensei's Divining Top can be bounced each round for a second cheap spell to trigger her. I've never been a huge fan of Etherium-Horn Sorcerer, but this is one place where he could be solid.
Rebound and Flashback standard stuff can be good as well.
Jori En, Ruin Diver + Reality Strobe and/or Arc Blade. Think of it as free recurring spells after the initial suspension/cast. Timed right you will only need to hardcast one spell instead of two. Also you will only have one turn where both are suspended and you will need to hardcast two spells get Jori's trigger.
Jori En, Ruin Diver + Dash creatures like Zurgo Bellstriker or Mardu Scout or Lightning Berserker. What you utilize here is the alternative dash cost to fulfill Jori's trigger. Such as by just dashing Zurgo Bellstriker + Lightning Berserker you have statisfied Jori's trigger requirement which nets you a card draw for 1RR. Even by themselves a single Lightning Berserker is really valuable as she will only cost you R which makes your second spell you cast that turn much more flexible.
Jori En, Ruin Diver + Glitterfang and/or Mark of Fury. This makes it easier to find even more spells to cast that turn. You could dashcast Lightning Berserker and enchant her with Mark of Fury for instance to fulfill the 2-spell count for that turn. Because the two are both triggering at the beginning of the end step you can choose the order which allows you to always recover both to your hand.
Jori En, Ruin Diver + Spells that self-return to your hand when sent to the graveyard from play. These spells are Fool's Demise, Launch, Slow Motion, Fiery Mantle, Sluggishness, and Undying Rage. You can run all of these or just a couple like Fool's Demise and Sluggishness. What matters about these is that they return to your hand for future use which means you can use these spells more often to fill Jori's quota. As you may notice the best of the bunch is Fool's Demise as you can use this on Jori En, Ruin Diver herself to keep her somewhat safer while on the board.
Let me also just give you a quick and easy reference sheet for what I was suggesting.
EDIT: I forgot but you may want to consider Mystic Retrieval + Runic Repetition for a way to reliably recover your spells. Squee, Goblin Nabob is nice because he recurs himself so that means more reliable means of reaching Jori's 2-spell count trigger. Hell's Thunder and Hellspark Elemental and other Unearth cards are nice as they are the flashback equivalent for creatures. Charmbreaker Devils is nice as it will always retrieve a RANDOM instant or sorcery spell. Chandra's Phoenix is cheap and the requirement to retrieve it is quiet cheap and easy.
I feel like a good way to build a deck around Jori En would be to run a bunch of mana rocks and Unwinding Clock and draw as many Instants as you can in the process. Win condition? I dunno.
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Reality Strobe and Arc Bladeare really good suggestions, thanks! I don't think that Unearth will work with Jori's ability, because Unearth doesn't cast the creature from your graveyard, it just puts it onto the battlefield.
0-drop artifacts, spells with Flashback or Rebound, and creatures with Dash are all good choices. Obviously you want spells with Surge as well.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
We got tons of cards that can help fulfill Jori's quota. Though I wonder where this is all leading up to for a win condition. As are we talking something like a combo deck? Aggro? Control?
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Peasant: Storm (UR) Commander:Hazezon Tamar (GRW), Arjun, the Shifting Flame (UR), [Waiting on Amonkhet] Tiny Leader: [Waiting on Amonkhet] Peasant Dragon: [Waiting on Amonkhet] Modern: Orzhova Spirits (WB) Legacy: Burn (R) Vintage: Bazaar Dredge (B)
We got tons of cards that can help fulfill Jori's quota. Though I wonder where this is all leading up to for a win condition. As are we talking something like a combo deck? Aggro? Control?
That's the problem with running things just to get a draw trigger. You can load your deck with Lightning Berserker and Memnite, but then those are the cards you're drawing into. If you're playing a dozen cantrips, you can reliably trigger the draw without sacrificing card quality. I would start a Jori En deck with Brainstorm, Ponder, Preordain, Gitaxian Probe, Serum Visions, Opt, and Peek. You can play an artifact based deck, a spellslinger deck, merfolk aggro, or whatever else you want. Adding cantrips just lets you staple card draw onto things you already want to be playing, and you're going to draw into much more relevant cards than the deck that's loaded up on dash creatures and mediocre buyback spells.
I'm not trying to argue that you should ignore her ability altogether, just be selective with what you're including to trigger it. Focus on good flashback/buyback/rebound spells and cantrips, rather than things like Glitterfang that are going to have little to no impact in an EDH game.
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This card is something that really piqued my attention. At first i was thinking just every Opt possible and drawing millions of cards. But i really don't know how that deck would win. Is there some kind of retrace nonsense you can get yourself into? Viashino Sandstalker and the like help keep the spells flowing. So i really think you should approach this deck with how it wins then figure out how the draw engine fuels those wins.
Rotten. I was hoping you could lotus petal or chrome mox into her. Loading up on Urza's Bauble and friends might be an interesting way to go. Just cast it turn 3 and play a bauble for value. You could also Trinket Mage into baubles for mega value. Still haven't tackled what you actually do to win the game but it looks like there are loads of way to get the engine going.
It's goodstuff. Don't pretend otherwise. Once you try getting that extra card every turn, you have a problem. I...guess you can use Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir or Vedalken Orrery with her, or just play a lot of instants to make sure you can cast two spells every turn.
*sigh* If you must have a plan, she's a good addition as one of the 99 to Animar, Soul of Elements.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
have a really low and aggressive curve. Get alot of incidental card draw to fuel your agression seems good. at 3 cmc, she could be a beefier sygg or a more balanced edric.
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EDH decks:
RWUNarset, jeskai burn RUB Marchesa the black rose R Daretti, reanimator goodstuff BU Vela, ninja assasin UG Ezuri, woodland critters.
We got tons of cards that can help fulfill Jori's quota. Though I wonder where this is all leading up to for a win condition. As are we talking something like a combo deck? Aggro? Control?
The obvious path for a deck like this is cantrip a bunch of times until you have a full grip of saucy stuff then storm off. But there are other izzit generals that do a better job at it.
Other paths
Creature rush deck: Play lots of cheap creatures and use cheap counters/tricks to keep your team attacking. Utilize Jori to keep the cards flowing so you don't run out of gas when your opponents start dropping big 7 drops. Cheap bounce takes place of pure removal in this case.
The everything has flash deck: Try to max out Joris card draw trigger by playing lots of stuff on opponents turns to get extra draws. This would play out like a classic control deck. Rewind would be an MVP in this deck.
Rebound/Buyback nonsense: Abuse Rebound and cheap buyback to get triggers off Jori. Build incremental card advantage over the game and win with an insurrection or something.
Blue Red Artifact Value: Stop trying to really abuse Jori and just get some extra cards over the course of a game by having a deck with cheaper artifacts and lots of mana rocks. Big Bosh type guys can clean up the game with this deck.
I feel like Thunderblade Charge might be worth testing if you want to go in a more aggressive direction. Has anyone mentioned Galvanoth yet? Because Galvanoth gives you a chance for a free spell.
I've just went with hardcore control myself. Very few creatures, a lot of cheap spells and a few ways to win the game. So far, the deck has a decent record (3 wins, 1 2nd place, 2 4th place) on tables of 4 and it's getting better. None of the wins hilariously enough were due to me actually pulling the win, just with my opponents realizing that I'd win somewhere in the next 6 turns and they'd have no way left out.
Jori En is great at being a decent value general without drawing too much heat. This is something Izzet lacked.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras. Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power. Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza. Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall. Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana. Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die. Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
I've just went with hardcore control myself. Very few creatures, a lot of cheap spells and a few ways to win the game. So far, the deck has a decent record (3 wins, 1 2nd place, 2 4th place) on tables of 4 and it's getting better. None of the wins hilariously enough were due to me actually pulling the win, just with my opponents realizing that I'd win somewhere in the next 6 turns and they'd have no way left out.
Jori En is great at being a decent value general without drawing too much heat. This is something Izzet lacked.
You got a list for that?
Drawing heat is my biggest issue when building Izzet decks. People smell a combo coming and you become public enemy number 1. I suppose drawing just 1 card a turn hits that sweet spot of potent but not scary.
Possibility Storm can allow you to draw extra. I think I got a grasp of a new chaos deck base!
Is this the ticket? Possibility Storm and loads of random instants so you keep drawing cards (and playing more random instants). There is the added bonus of disrupting whatever plans your opponents are up to.
I've just went with hardcore control myself. Very few creatures, a lot of cheap spells and a few ways to win the game. So far, the deck has a decent record (3 wins, 1 2nd place, 2 4th place) on tables of 4 and it's getting better. None of the wins hilariously enough were due to me actually pulling the win, just with my opponents realizing that I'd win somewhere in the next 6 turns and they'd have no way left out.
Jori En is great at being a decent value general without drawing too much heat. This is something Izzet lacked.
You got a list for that?
Drawing heat is my biggest issue when building Izzet decks. People smell a combo coming and you become public enemy number 1. I suppose drawing just 1 card a turn hits that sweet spot of potent but not scary.
I don't run possibility storm. I tried, but the thing is, it doesn't work well when you're trying to control the field. It gets even worse when Mayael's random mana dork turns into an Iona, and her Solemn becomes an Archetype of Endurance. I prefer to be in control of what happens, no matter how fun P.Storm is.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras. Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power. Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza. Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall. Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana. Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die. Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
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Anyone have ideas?
She's got a powerful effect, but she's like Ephara, God of the Polis in that she doesn't really need to be abused to be strong. You can find a way to draw 4 cards per turn cycle, but that's going to be needlessly complicated, require several cards on board or an enormous mana advantage, and most playgroups are going to take notice of that and remove her before you can get an overwhelming advantage. Drawing an extra card a turn is a solid effect, occasionally getting two is great. The only real change I would make to a deck with her is maybe going a little heavier on cantrips. Some of the ones that I wouldn't normally run, like Opt and Peek, have more value here.
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StaffI'd go Tempo, with a few classy cantrips like Brainstorm and a few cheap counters like Arcance Denial to make sure you can hit her when needed, but not put too much effort into it.
Cascade gives you a free second spell to trigger her, and Sensei's Divining Top can be bounced each round for a second cheap spell to trigger her. I've never been a huge fan of Etherium-Horn Sorcerer, but this is one place where he could be solid.
Rebound and Flashback standard stuff can be good as well.
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Jori En, Ruin Diver + Reality Strobe and/or Arc Blade. Think of it as free recurring spells after the initial suspension/cast. Timed right you will only need to hardcast one spell instead of two. Also you will only have one turn where both are suspended and you will need to hardcast two spells get Jori's trigger.
Jori En, Ruin Diver + Dash creatures like Zurgo Bellstriker or Mardu Scout or Lightning Berserker. What you utilize here is the alternative dash cost to fulfill Jori's trigger. Such as by just dashing Zurgo Bellstriker + Lightning Berserker you have statisfied Jori's trigger requirement which nets you a card draw for 1RR. Even by themselves a single Lightning Berserker is really valuable as she will only cost you R which makes your second spell you cast that turn much more flexible.
Jori En, Ruin Diver + Glitterfang and/or Mark of Fury. This makes it easier to find even more spells to cast that turn. You could dashcast Lightning Berserker and enchant her with Mark of Fury for instance to fulfill the 2-spell count for that turn. Because the two are both triggering at the beginning of the end step you can choose the order which allows you to always recover both to your hand.
Jori En, Ruin Diver + Spells that self-return to your hand when sent to the graveyard from play. These spells are Fool's Demise, Launch, Slow Motion, Fiery Mantle, Sluggishness, and Undying Rage. You can run all of these or just a couple like Fool's Demise and Sluggishness. What matters about these is that they return to your hand for future use which means you can use these spells more often to fill Jori's quota. As you may notice the best of the bunch is Fool's Demise as you can use this on Jori En, Ruin Diver herself to keep her somewhat safer while on the board.
Let me also just give you a quick and easy reference sheet for what I was suggesting.
1x Memory Crystal
1x Mystic Speculation
1x Reality Strobe
1x Arc Blade
1x Zurgo Bellstriker
1x Lightning Berserker
1x Mardu Scout
1x Glitterfang
1x Mark of Fury
1x Fool's Demise
1x Launch
1x Slow Motion
1x Fiery Mantle
1x Sluggishness
1x Undying Rage
1x Charmbreaker Devils
1x Squee, Goblin Nabob
1x Chandra's Phoenix
1x Hellspark Elemental
1x Hell's Thunder
1x Mystic Retrieval
1x Runic Repetition
Hopefully this was helpful to you.
EDIT: I forgot but you may want to consider Mystic Retrieval + Runic Repetition for a way to reliably recover your spells.
Squee, Goblin Nabob is nice because he recurs himself so that means more reliable means of reaching Jori's 2-spell count trigger.
Hell's Thunder and Hellspark Elemental and other Unearth cards are nice as they are the flashback equivalent for creatures.
Charmbreaker Devils is nice as it will always retrieve a RANDOM instant or sorcery spell.
Chandra's Phoenix is cheap and the requirement to retrieve it is quiet cheap and easy.
All added to the quick reference list.
Commander: Hazezon Tamar (GRW), Arjun, the Shifting Flame (UR), [Waiting on Amonkhet]
Tiny Leader: [Waiting on Amonkhet]
Peasant Dragon: [Waiting on Amonkhet]
Modern: Orzhova Spirits (WB)
Legacy: Burn (R)
Vintage: Bazaar Dredge (B)
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2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
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Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Commander: Hazezon Tamar (GRW), Arjun, the Shifting Flame (UR), [Waiting on Amonkhet]
Tiny Leader: [Waiting on Amonkhet]
Peasant Dragon: [Waiting on Amonkhet]
Modern: Orzhova Spirits (WB)
Legacy: Burn (R)
Vintage: Bazaar Dredge (B)
I'm not trying to argue that you should ignore her ability altogether, just be selective with what you're including to trigger it. Focus on good flashback/buyback/rebound spells and cantrips, rather than things like Glitterfang that are going to have little to no impact in an EDH game.
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
*sigh* If you must have a plan, she's a good addition as one of the 99 to Animar, Soul of Elements.
On phasing:
have a really low and aggressive curve. Get alot of incidental card draw to fuel your agression seems good. at 3 cmc, she could be a beefier sygg or a more balanced edric.
RWU Narset, jeskai burn
RUB Marchesa the black rose
R Daretti, reanimator goodstuff
BU Vela, ninja assasin
UG Ezuri, woodland critters.
The obvious answer is storm.
Your cantrips are your win condition.
The obvious path for a deck like this is cantrip a bunch of times until you have a full grip of saucy stuff then storm off. But there are other izzit generals that do a better job at it.
Other paths
Creature rush deck: Play lots of cheap creatures and use cheap counters/tricks to keep your team attacking. Utilize Jori to keep the cards flowing so you don't run out of gas when your opponents start dropping big 7 drops. Cheap bounce takes place of pure removal in this case.
The everything has flash deck: Try to max out Joris card draw trigger by playing lots of stuff on opponents turns to get extra draws. This would play out like a classic control deck. Rewind would be an MVP in this deck.
Rebound/Buyback nonsense: Abuse Rebound and cheap buyback to get triggers off Jori. Build incremental card advantage over the game and win with an insurrection or something.
Blue Red Artifact Value: Stop trying to really abuse Jori and just get some extra cards over the course of a game by having a deck with cheaper artifacts and lots of mana rocks. Big Bosh type guys can clean up the game with this deck.
Just some ideas.
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
Jori En is great at being a decent value general without drawing too much heat. This is something Izzet lacked.
You got a list for that?
Drawing heat is my biggest issue when building Izzet decks. People smell a combo coming and you become public enemy number 1. I suppose drawing just 1 card a turn hits that sweet spot of potent but not scary.
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
Is this the ticket? Possibility Storm and loads of random instants so you keep drawing cards (and playing more random instants). There is the added bonus of disrupting whatever plans your opponents are up to.
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/675526-jori-en-izzet-control
Just put it up.
I don't run possibility storm. I tried, but the thing is, it doesn't work well when you're trying to control the field. It gets even worse when Mayael's random mana dork turns into an Iona, and her Solemn becomes an Archetype of Endurance. I prefer to be in control of what happens, no matter how fun P.Storm is.