I have a mental process I tend to automatically follow when building up the mana base for any of my decks, but even looking through decklists you can see that people approach that task from many different mentalities. Some people run almost to no basics, others run very high counts. Some people use more artifact rocks, others use a lot more land ramp. Some people use more spell based approaches, while others use more creature based approaches. Some people build with a 40 count land slot to start (I'm in this camp), others start significantly lower.
So, I'm curious... What are your preferred forms of ramp, numbers of land, and ramp methods? Any hidden gems? Do you start deckbuilding with a certain idea of lands and then adjust, or do you figure out your lands last, based on the composition of the deck?
My lands/ramp are generally the last cards I select for a deck. At that point, I know what spells my deck is trying to cast, and when. For example, my Xenagos, God of Revels deck wants to cast an equipment, followed by Xenagos, followed by a 6-mana creature to buff. So, my goal is to ramp up to 5 mana, which means that Farseek and Nature's Lore make sense, but Kodama's Reach might interfere with playing the equipment, and Skyshroud Claim doesn't help at all.
I also think about which permanent types I want to play, and which types I want to hose. I also So, if I'm playing green, I can rely on land/enchantment ramp, abstain from artifacts entirely (except Sol Ring) and run hosers like Creeping Corrosion. If I'm playing a low-curve Esper deck, I can skip ramp and run artifact wipes, but if I'm running a midrange or control deck that needs more mana, I have to run those rocks and abstain from the wipes.
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I may not be the best to comment on this because I am no longer a budget player... I have gotten to the point with my collection that I have all the "best" (term used loosely) non-basic lands that share basic land types, so they typically make my lists. Because of this, I look for ramp or tutor spells that will fetch those specifically.
I have never found the discard effects of the two moxes to be a huge loss, because the ramp and acceleration they give during the early game can be instrumental in allowing me to get to my wincons quickly.
As a vaguely connected aside/intro, I like having the option of casting my Commander as soon as possible if necessary. Which is a large part of why I don't go higher then CMC 6 for Commanders.
To that end, I usually include Sol Ring and the appropriate Diamond(s)/Signets. Depending on the Commander, I may include Darksteel Ingot and/or the appropriate Obelisk or Banner, or similar 3 costing rocks. I recently got a few Jeweled Amulets, need to put those in a few decks.
If the deck is in green, I almost always add Nature's Lore, and Cultivate/Kodama's Reach find their way into a number of decks as well. The CMC 4 ramp spells are usually reserved for Mono-Green or for decks like Zegana who are mostly not-Green but still want to get up to double digits land counts. I don't really see the point of ramp spells that cost more than that. Why not just run something slightly cheaper so that you can still do something else on your turn?
Mana creatures generally either fetch the land to the field, or to my hand, or on death, or are otherwise that ridiculous. The exceptions are Anafenza, where I'm running several Llanowar Elf dudes to try and land her T2, and Titania, where landfall + Lotus Cobra is apparently ludicrous. As you all can see, I tend towards getting more lands out of the deck, simply because not as many cards can interact with lands as opposed to creatures. And not to mention that when you've thinned your deck of most of your lands, you'll basically just be drawing ammo instead of fuel.
I'm in the 40 Lands camp as well. I think it's harder to start with a lower land count only to find yourself needing to add more lands, rather than the reverse of having too many lands and subsequently dropping one for another creature/spell/etc. Duals, shocks, and fetches are the 3 land types that make it into every deck if I have them, with Painlands, Filterlands (Twilight Mire), and the Temples being good options for decks if I can work with their drawbacks. I don't have many super-powered utility lands, so most utility slots are Bojuka Bog and things like that. That is also why I tend towards a decent number of basics, I just don't have any other lands for those slots lol. If I'm running Caged Sun, etc, or if there just aren't really any good utility lands for the deck then I will also run a higher number of basics for those reasons. I'm not really a fan of just cramming a bunch of utility lands into a deck just because you can, either.
I mean, generally:
- if you want to cast your general quickly, then the appropriate rocks, spells, and creatures that allow that are tantamount. The Temples aren't going to work well here, while the Painlands and Shocks and such are going to shine.
- if it's more of a controlling deck, you can appreciate the Temple Scrying and can accept lands potentially ETB tapped if they have a good effect stapled on.
- if land destruction is part of your game plan or meta, then you'll want to mix Dash 1 and Dash 2 above. (for eg, Jhoira needs to be able to cast things from just a couple of permanents, while Narset seeks to control the game and build up CA to properly set up the LD)
I typically start with 35 land sources. Some might argue it's low but I think it's correct. You can adjust later.
As some may already know I hate Sol Ring. I'm not a fan of rocks that don't contribute anything later in the game, so yea. Only Mind Stone, Hedron Archive and Dreamstone Hedron are my only choices. Very rarely do I consider Cluestones.
If I'm playing green, the decision is even easier. No rocks at all. I try not to ramp too much; staples like Cultivate, Kodama's Reach (or Nissa's Pilgrimage) and the underrated Recross the Paths are sufficient. I'm no Farmer Joe, that's a certainty.
But my preferred (possibly only) method is always starting the nonland cards first. Figure out the plan/theme before the sources required seems right to me.
Depends on what I'm trying to do. My yeva deck needs 5 mana pretty quickly and then a lot more after that. So I run a mix of early stuff and later stuff, but mostly go for land enchants since it's basically an enchantress deck that plays at instant speed. That said, I removed strictly card advantage staples like cultivate and company for decidedly quicker nature's lore, sakura triber elder, the suspend one. She only runs 36 lands, though.
My other decks? Depends. they usually go for 38 lands, though one of my mono red has 37 snow covered mountains, 6 to 8 non basics, + doublers/mana rocks. I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 58/60 mana, but has a lot of high end bombs to drop down. then there is my deck I called mana squared (sasaya), where its focus is to hit 6 lands on battlefield + 7 in hand+ other stuff in order to actually win. It is rather full of lands, almost 50 forests, but no mana rocks. It runs all of the card advantage land fetchers, and I do mean all of them.
My basic plan? Figure out what my end game is, whether it's a stupid silly combo, large assortment of beatsticks, or up yours control/rattlesnake. Figure out what it takes to hit that end game, and then go from there. Usually I figure 37 lands + some number of rocks, though it will vary. In my grixis deck, for instance, I actually prefer cost reduction over mana rocks (save the ubiquitous sol ring), so the land count is a bit higher.
Dragonlord NOjutai: stony silence deck, no mana rocks but UW doesn't have much other ramp options I mostly stick to trying to keep up and drawing enough cards to consistently hit land drops, I am playing 1 cmc cantrips to find them. solemn, knight of the white orchid, wethered wayfinder, land tax. 38 lands 37 lands + maze of Ith
Deveri, bird tribal: There is nothing over 6 mana in the deck and Deveri does the mana ramping by untapping lands. With deveri any bird hitting my opponent is ramp. This is the most complicated land base with fetches, shocks, tango lands, Bounce lands, other etb tapped lands, man lands and tons of other utility lands. I am trying to get both bant turn three and trying to have all the lands with synergy with deveri is hard. 36 lands only a few basics.
zirilan: ramp ramp ramp soo much ramp, 5 cmc general that wants 7 mana the turn he comes out, I with the restrictions of red it is mostly artifact based but I am using a mixture of artifact mana rocks and land search. Also Braid of fire. Mana doublers even those that effect other mountains are also used. 40 lands 30 basic mountains (for valakuat).
I don't like spell mana ramp, I typically use a mixture of mana rocks and land search. I don't like hyper ramp play style, it bores me, I like high synergy so I want the most synergistic thing I can be doing. I just draw more cards and hit a land drop every turn to play the game. also I hate drawing ramp when all I need is a threat.
When building a deck the first thing apart from the commander I put in is 38 place holder basics which I have found to work. Once ive built the rest of the deck these get changed out for all the usual offenders like shocks, maybe some fetches, pain lands, tri lands, ravnica karoos and utility lands which fit. At the end though im still left with around 12-15 basics so the battle lands are still useful in my decks.
At the moment in terms of ramp I'm going through a bit of a change. Previously I would swear by a standard package of: Signets, Sol Ring, Darksteel Ingot and probably a Rampant Growth and Harrow for green decks but as I've developed a flashier land base putting in Skyshroud Claim and Farseek in particular, instead of signets, has been awesome. Kodama's Reach was swapped in for ramp growth and is doing pretty well. Other obvious includes are Solemn Simulacrum but beyond that I dont think I ramp all that much.
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EDH BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern: RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
My land counts vary wildly between my EDH decks - As does the split between lands/artifacts/creature-based ramp
But I'll reevaluate the split several times during the deck building process.
I play with a casually-competitive playgroup - we usually have 3-5 different EDH decks ready to go and pick before the game (competitive/tribal/casual/'standard'/whatever home brew theme was suggested the last time we caught up/etc)
Ezuri, Claw of progress (prior to mulligan rule change) - 28 lands, 2 rocks (sol & signet) and 5-6 dorks/fetchers. But this deck has ~95 cards at cmc 3 or less and was designed with partial Paris in mind. Had a good run. I'll be adding 2 lands before testing again to see how few I can get away with.
Omnath, Locus of Rage - 48 lands, sol ring, smokebraider and a handful of land-rampy spells (mostly for use once Omnath was online). Decided not to go with creature/artifact ramp due to land count - it's a bit floody (really?) but it's a deck for casual shenanigans
Oloro, ageless Ascetic - 35ish lands and about 10 rocks. It was a draw-go control shell running every boardwipe effect I owned at the time- maybe 12
My start point, before I get a feel for a deck, would be about 35 lands and 3-5 Rock/creatures per colour you're running
for me it really depends on what kind of deck I'm building. ex. for Edric I have only 34 lands and from those lands, I run ALL the multi UG and 5c lands possible. Because that deck draws stupid amounts of cards, and it also needs colored mana, it was the way to go. For Animar Warp World I run 38 lands and mostly basic ( I run stuff like Blood Moon), ramp is in the form of creatures that bring land with them like Farhaven Elf and Co.. Because I need the ramp and the permanents, 2 for 1 is really good.
I start with 40 slots for mana producing lands (things like Maze of Ith I count as a 0 CMC spell that stops me from playing a land that turn). I then adjust up or down depending on the game plan and average CMC of my deck. For example my Jor Kadeen Stax deck plays 36 lands, 1 of which is the previously mentioned Maze and Mishra's Workshop (which I count as a ritual because it never lives for more than a single spell). The way I count I have 34 lands in the deck. I am also running 20 mana rocks, I run such a high amount of mana production to offset my strategy of "kill all the lands".
My Bladewing the Risen deck runs 36 land and 6 rocks to accelerate. The numbers in that deck are in flux though as I recently rebuilt it and have not yet found the "sweet spot" for my mana production.
Before I took it apart my Geth deck was 36 land and maybe 6 rocks, it was a control deck with tons of card draw so less more mana production was possible. (His ability was mostly there for gravy)
A little more than half my Ghoulcaller Gisa deck is dedicated to mana production in some form or fashion. Right now, I have 25 basic swamps and 7 nonbasic lands for a total of 32 lands, then 14 mana rocks, and finally a package of mana doublers and land finders.
My mana rocks include the obvious Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, and Grim Monolith in addition to Basalt Monolith (infinite mana with Rings of Brighthearth), wayfaerer's bauble, and the rest are 2cc rocks. I am looking for a coldsteel heart, and the new Reliquary Tower mana rock from Commander 2015 (I forget the name right now). Because I amin mono black, I have Crypt Ghast, Nirkana Revenant and Gauntlet of Power. I want to get a Caged Sun eventually.
I also play land finders like Liliana's Shade and Pilgrim's Eye. I was never impressed with Burnished Hart. I didnt like burning up two turns to fetch lands. I would rather see Pilgrim's Eye in my deck. The 1/1 body can be clamped for two cards, or the evasion from flying can be taken advatage of with other equipment such as Lashwrithe/Nightmare Lash. Also, I like to take advatage of EtB triggers with Nim Dearhmantle and sacrifice outlets... like my Commander.
The game plan for my deck is to ramp out, draw cards, play some answers to whatever is threatening me, and create a zombie token swarm as a win condition. The more mana I have, the more zombies I can make.
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"Whatever style you wish to play, be it fast and frenzied or slow and tactical, the surest way to defeat your opponent consistently is by dominating him or her in the war of card advantage." - Brian Wiseman, April 1996
That's interesting, I feel the exact opposite. Pilgrim's Eye has never impressed me much since it's a one shot effect, and doesn't ramp/advance me any, while I love the Hart since it can explode my position forwards. You can also still clamp a Hart. People have only recently begun killing my hart in the early game though, so maybe that's part of it.
1) The amount of land and ramp you want depends on your curve.
A deck that uses Progenitus as the commander will have significnatly more land and ramp than Derevi, Empyrial tactician for obvious reasons. If you have a "normal" curve, I believe the rule of thumb is that you start with X lands and then for every two pieces of ramp you play, you can cut a land. I'm not actually sure what X was, but it's probably somewhere between 40-45, but you can adjust the "starting point" based on your curve.
also with respect to curve, you want to spread out the CMC of your ramp options. You don't want 15 2-CMC ramp options as that's generally overkill. Rather, you want a bunch at the low CMC to help you cast your higher CMC ramp spells, and those are the ones that will keep you set for the game.
Since my decks tend to be slow and durdly, I generally run around 36-38 lands and 15-20 ramp spells. and I usually have around 10-15 ramp spells between 0-3 CMC and around 3-5 ramp spells at 4+ CMC.
2) The type of ramp you want depends on your gameplan as well as what's in your playgroup.
First, you should understand what types of ramp exists. The best example here is to see the difference between Llanowar Elves (mana dorks), Nature's Lore (spell ramp), Wood Elves (creature-land ramp), and Moss Diamond (mana rocks). They each net you G (technically the middle two are fetching forests so they're normally getting ABU duals or shocks, but it's close enough), but they have varying mana costs so they will get you that mana on different turns, and the mana they provide are nullified by different cards. There are other cards that provide mana in different ways (such as Awakening Zone and Seething Song) but these four are the most common.
In terms of explosiveness (the mana they get you for the mana they cost), generally colorless mana rocks are the most explosive, then mana dorks, then spell ramp are about equal to colored mana rocks, and then creature-land ramp. Each type has different strengths and weaknesses when it comes to resiliency; for example, mana dorks are easy to kill, while creature ramp give you the most "value" (lands are usually the permanent type that is least fooled around with, and the creature ramp provide bodies for combat, Birthing Pod, etc), and you just need to tailor your build to what your friends play. For example, if everyone in your group loves Stranglehold, Aven Mindcensor and other similar cards, you may want to limit the land searching spells simply because you won't be searching your library for them. If your group loves their Aura shards, Creeping Corrosion, and other cards, you may want to limit your artifact rampers. And so on.
Of course, it then depends on your gameplan as well as how cutthroat you want to be. For example, Narset, Enlightened Master wants all the most efficient mana rocks because your gameplan is to just slam narset ASAP with some protection, attack once, and go infinite from there. The cutthroat Narset decks will likely not use Burnished Hart unless they're desperate, as cards like Worn Powerstone and Thran Dynamo are simply more efficient. However if you are not a cutthroat deck it would be safer to not make all of your ramp a single type, because as the game goes longer, the more things that are unexpected can happen. For example, if you only play mana rocks you don't want to get shut down by a Creeping Corrosion. Cutthroat Narset builds will just take their chances and run mana rocks because a Creeping Corrosion-type spell likely won't get cast by the time you win, but if you are aiming for a slower and durdly Narset build, a creeping corrosion type spell will likely get cast sometime and you don't want your mana sources to disappear.
And with regards to your gameplan, if your plan is to do stuff and then armageddon, you probably don't need a lot of cards that fetch out lands. But if you instead are planning to wipe creatures/artifacts/enchantments/planeswalkers often, instead you may want to rely on the cards that fetch lands. etc.
My decks are slow and durdly, so I always spread out my ramp types. I have some mana dorks, some mana rocks, some that fetch out lands (be they nonpermanent spells like Cultivate or grabbed by a creature like Wood elves, or even in nongreen decks things like Burnished Hart), and sometimes an enchantment or two that helps with mana ramp, maybe even a planeswalker or two as well. That way, it's harder for the rug to get pulled out from beneath me.
3) The actual lands you want to play depends on your budget.
As a rule of thumb, the stronger lands cost more $$$. The stronger lands also allow you to play more nonbasics that don't tap for color(s), as they are good enough to pick up the slack. For example, if you have a 3 or 5-color deck that has fetchlands/ABU duals/shocklands, it's actually not that hard to get necropotence out, whereas GLHF doing that if your mana base is a bunch of azorius guildgates. Also the land types get better or worse depending on the deck's colors and curve. the fastlands (Seachrome Coast) are way better in low curve decks than in other decks, while the bouncelands/karoos (Azorius Chancery) are better in slow, durdly decks that don't need to curve out in the early turns. Tango lands Prairie Stream) will be great in 2-color decks, especially if those decks pack fetchlands, as those decks have a high number of basics, while they're a bit worse in 3-color decks, and are kind of bad in 5-color. My personal ranking of the dual lands, from best to worst (disregarding monetary costs), are as follows...
TOP TIER (aka lolfetchlands)
Fetchlands (Flooded Strand)
HIGH TIER (aka goes well with fetchlands)
Original Duals/ABU Duals (Tundra)
Shocklands (Hallowed Fountain)
MID TIER (aka usefulness depends on the deck, not in any order)
Pain lands (Adarkar Wastes) - 2 or 3-color decks
Trilands (Seaside Citadel, Sandsteppe Citadel) - 3-color decks
Tango lands (Prairie Stream) - 2 or 3-color decks
Fast lands (Seachrome Coast) - low curve decks
Filter Lands (Mystic Gate) - medium or high curve decks
Bounce lands/Karoos (Azorius Chancery) - high curve decks with lands that have ETB effects
Check lands (Glacial Fortress) - pretty good with ABU duals/shocklands though still not high tier
BOTTOM TIER (aka super budget builds)
Taplands (Azorius Guildgate, Sejiri Refuge, Tranquil Cove, etc. Lands that always enter tapped and don't have an appreciable effect to make up for it)
Then you have the rainbow lands like City of Brass, Forbidden Orchard, and so on, which gain value as the number of colors in your deck increases, and range from utterly amazing (Command Tower) to hyperbudget (Rupture Spire).
I generally do lands last, almost always with 32. Depending on the # of colors, I'll usually add in all the available fetches unless there isn't need for a specific color (i.e. 5 color deck with virtually no red/green, leave out wooded foothills) and then duals/shocks depending on how the color usage breaks down, then filter lands, then utility lands. My mono colored edh decks have around 20-25 basic lands and then utility lands (Buried Ruin, Wasteland, etc) whereas my 5 color decks have none. Once a deck is no longer mono colored, I usually feel like rainbow lands are a must have (command tower, reflecting pool, etc) so that's usually 2 or 3 spots.
5 color superfriends control breaks down like this: 7 duals 7 shocks 9 fetches 3 rainbow 6 utility (including cabal coffers/urborg)
oh yea. if you run black, run urborg/coffers.
Of course a lot of this hinges on whether or not your playgroup allows proxies.
My default starting point with lands is 36, not counting any lands that don't generate mana (such as Maze of Ith). Occasionally I go a bit lower, either because the deck has a lot of low-cmc stuff or other mana producers (Rhys the Redeemed has 34 lands but a bunch of mana dorks), or because I have enough other sources of ramp. Decks without green tend to run a few more lands than decks without green.
Beyond that, it comes down to my curve and things like that. I very rarely get mana-screwed, so I must be doing something reasonably well.
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I have a mental process I tend to automatically follow when building up the mana base for any of my decks, but even looking through decklists you can see that people approach that task from many different mentalities. Some people run almost to no basics, others run very high counts. Some people use more artifact rocks, others use a lot more land ramp. Some people use more spell based approaches, while others use more creature based approaches. Some people build with a 40 count land slot to start (I'm in this camp), others start significantly lower.
So, I'm curious... What are your preferred forms of ramp, numbers of land, and ramp methods? Any hidden gems? Do you start deckbuilding with a certain idea of lands and then adjust, or do you figure out your lands last, based on the composition of the deck?
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
I also think about which permanent types I want to play, and which types I want to hose. I also So, if I'm playing green, I can rely on land/enchantment ramp, abstain from artifacts entirely (except Sol Ring) and run hosers like Creeping Corrosion. If I'm playing a low-curve Esper deck, I can skip ramp and run artifact wipes, but if I'm running a midrange or control deck that needs more mana, I have to run those rocks and abstain from the wipes.
For decks that have G, My short list is:
Nature's Lore
Farseek
Wood Elves
Skyshroud Claim
For mana rocks, I typically run as many 0 and 1 cost rocks, which are:
Mox Diamond
Chrome Mox
Mana Crypt
Sol Ring
Mana Vault
I have never found the discard effects of the two moxes to be a huge loss, because the ramp and acceleration they give during the early game can be instrumental in allowing me to get to my wincons quickly.
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To that end, I usually include Sol Ring and the appropriate Diamond(s)/Signets. Depending on the Commander, I may include Darksteel Ingot and/or the appropriate Obelisk or Banner, or similar 3 costing rocks. I recently got a few Jeweled Amulets, need to put those in a few decks.
If the deck is in green, I almost always add Nature's Lore, and Cultivate/Kodama's Reach find their way into a number of decks as well. The CMC 4 ramp spells are usually reserved for Mono-Green or for decks like Zegana who are mostly not-Green but still want to get up to double digits land counts. I don't really see the point of ramp spells that cost more than that. Why not just run something slightly cheaper so that you can still do something else on your turn?
Mana creatures generally either fetch the land to the field, or to my hand, or on death, or are otherwise that ridiculous. The exceptions are Anafenza, where I'm running several Llanowar Elf dudes to try and land her T2, and Titania, where landfall + Lotus Cobra is apparently ludicrous. As you all can see, I tend towards getting more lands out of the deck, simply because not as many cards can interact with lands as opposed to creatures. And not to mention that when you've thinned your deck of most of your lands, you'll basically just be drawing ammo instead of fuel.
I'm in the 40 Lands camp as well. I think it's harder to start with a lower land count only to find yourself needing to add more lands, rather than the reverse of having too many lands and subsequently dropping one for another creature/spell/etc. Duals, shocks, and fetches are the 3 land types that make it into every deck if I have them, with Painlands, Filterlands (Twilight Mire), and the Temples being good options for decks if I can work with their drawbacks. I don't have many super-powered utility lands, so most utility slots are Bojuka Bog and things like that. That is also why I tend towards a decent number of basics, I just don't have any other lands for those slots lol. If I'm running Caged Sun, etc, or if there just aren't really any good utility lands for the deck then I will also run a higher number of basics for those reasons. I'm not really a fan of just cramming a bunch of utility lands into a deck just because you can, either.
I mean, generally:
- if you want to cast your general quickly, then the appropriate rocks, spells, and creatures that allow that are tantamount. The Temples aren't going to work well here, while the Painlands and Shocks and such are going to shine.
- if it's more of a controlling deck, you can appreciate the Temple Scrying and can accept lands potentially ETB tapped if they have a good effect stapled on.
- if land destruction is part of your game plan or meta, then you'll want to mix Dash 1 and Dash 2 above. (for eg, Jhoira needs to be able to cast things from just a couple of permanents, while Narset seeks to control the game and build up CA to properly set up the LD)
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
As some may already know I hate Sol Ring. I'm not a fan of rocks that don't contribute anything later in the game, so yea. Only Mind Stone, Hedron Archive and Dreamstone Hedron are my only choices. Very rarely do I consider Cluestones.
If I'm playing green, the decision is even easier. No rocks at all. I try not to ramp too much; staples like Cultivate, Kodama's Reach (or Nissa's Pilgrimage) and the underrated Recross the Paths are sufficient. I'm no Farmer Joe, that's a certainty.
But my preferred (possibly only) method is always starting the nonland cards first. Figure out the plan/theme before the sources required seems right to me.
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My other decks? Depends. they usually go for 38 lands, though one of my mono red has 37 snow covered mountains, 6 to 8 non basics, + doublers/mana rocks. I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 58/60 mana, but has a lot of high end bombs to drop down. then there is my deck I called mana squared (sasaya), where its focus is to hit 6 lands on battlefield + 7 in hand+ other stuff in order to actually win. It is rather full of lands, almost 50 forests, but no mana rocks. It runs all of the card advantage land fetchers, and I do mean all of them.
My basic plan? Figure out what my end game is, whether it's a stupid silly combo, large assortment of beatsticks, or up yours control/rattlesnake. Figure out what it takes to hit that end game, and then go from there. Usually I figure 37 lands + some number of rocks, though it will vary. In my grixis deck, for instance, I actually prefer cost reduction over mana rocks (save the ubiquitous sol ring), so the land count is a bit higher.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
My UW plays no mana rocks
Only my red deck is trying to turbo ramp.
Glissa: The ramp is almost all artifact/artifact creature based. sol ring, wayfarer's bauble, Mind stone, golgari keyrune headron archive, solemn, burnished hart, blighted woodland. The mana base has a lot of utility lands but since most of the deck is colourless. 35 lands. The lowest of all my decks.
Dragonlord NOjutai: stony silence deck, no mana rocks but UW doesn't have much other ramp options I mostly stick to trying to keep up and drawing enough cards to consistently hit land drops, I am playing 1 cmc cantrips to find them. solemn, knight of the white orchid, wethered wayfinder, land tax.
38 lands37 lands + maze of IthDeveri, bird tribal: There is nothing over 6 mana in the deck and Deveri does the mana ramping by untapping lands. With deveri any bird hitting my opponent is ramp. This is the most complicated land base with fetches, shocks, tango lands, Bounce lands, other etb tapped lands, man lands and tons of other utility lands. I am trying to get both bant turn three and trying to have all the lands with synergy with deveri is hard. 36 lands only a few basics.
zirilan: ramp ramp ramp soo much ramp, 5 cmc general that wants 7 mana the turn he comes out, I with the restrictions of red it is mostly artifact based but I am using a mixture of artifact mana rocks and land search. Also Braid of fire. Mana doublers even those that effect other mountains are also used. 40 lands 30 basic mountains (for valakuat).
I don't like spell mana ramp, I typically use a mixture of mana rocks and land search. I don't like hyper ramp play style, it bores me, I like high synergy so I want the most synergistic thing I can be doing. I just draw more cards and hit a land drop every turn to play the game. also I hate drawing ramp when all I need is a threat.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
At the moment in terms of ramp I'm going through a bit of a change. Previously I would swear by a standard package of: Signets, Sol Ring, Darksteel Ingot and probably a Rampant Growth and Harrow for green decks but as I've developed a flashier land base putting in Skyshroud Claim and Farseek in particular, instead of signets, has been awesome. Kodama's Reach was swapped in for ramp growth and is doing pretty well. Other obvious includes are Solemn Simulacrum but beyond that I dont think I ramp all that much.
BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern:
RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
But I'll reevaluate the split several times during the deck building process.
I play with a casually-competitive playgroup - we usually have 3-5 different EDH decks ready to go and pick before the game (competitive/tribal/casual/'standard'/whatever home brew theme was suggested the last time we caught up/etc)
Ezuri, Claw of progress (prior to mulligan rule change) - 28 lands, 2 rocks (sol & signet) and 5-6 dorks/fetchers. But this deck has ~95 cards at cmc 3 or less and was designed with partial Paris in mind. Had a good run. I'll be adding 2 lands before testing again to see how few I can get away with.
Omnath, Locus of Rage - 48 lands, sol ring, smokebraider and a handful of land-rampy spells (mostly for use once Omnath was online). Decided not to go with creature/artifact ramp due to land count - it's a bit floody (really?) but it's a deck for casual shenanigans
Oloro, ageless Ascetic - 35ish lands and about 10 rocks. It was a draw-go control shell running every boardwipe effect I owned at the time- maybe 12
My start point, before I get a feel for a deck, would be about 35 lands and 3-5 Rock/creatures per colour you're running
My Bladewing the Risen deck runs 36 land and 6 rocks to accelerate. The numbers in that deck are in flux though as I recently rebuilt it and have not yet found the "sweet spot" for my mana production.
Before I took it apart my Geth deck was 36 land and maybe 6 rocks, it was a control deck with tons of card draw so less more mana production was possible. (His ability was mostly there for gravy)
amazingly epic sig courtesy of DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Planes.
My mana rocks include the obvious Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, and Grim Monolith in addition to Basalt Monolith (infinite mana with Rings of Brighthearth), wayfaerer's bauble, and the rest are 2cc rocks. I am looking for a coldsteel heart, and the new Reliquary Tower mana rock from Commander 2015 (I forget the name right now). Because I amin mono black, I have Crypt Ghast, Nirkana Revenant and Gauntlet of Power. I want to get a Caged Sun eventually.
I also play land finders like Liliana's Shade and Pilgrim's Eye. I was never impressed with Burnished Hart. I didnt like burning up two turns to fetch lands. I would rather see Pilgrim's Eye in my deck. The 1/1 body can be clamped for two cards, or the evasion from flying can be taken advatage of with other equipment such as Lashwrithe/Nightmare Lash. Also, I like to take advatage of EtB triggers with Nim Dearhmantle and sacrifice outlets... like my Commander.
The game plan for my deck is to ramp out, draw cards, play some answers to whatever is threatening me, and create a zombie token swarm as a win condition. The more mana I have, the more zombies I can make.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
A deck that uses Progenitus as the commander will have significnatly more land and ramp than Derevi, Empyrial tactician for obvious reasons. If you have a "normal" curve, I believe the rule of thumb is that you start with X lands and then for every two pieces of ramp you play, you can cut a land. I'm not actually sure what X was, but it's probably somewhere between 40-45, but you can adjust the "starting point" based on your curve.
also with respect to curve, you want to spread out the CMC of your ramp options. You don't want 15 2-CMC ramp options as that's generally overkill. Rather, you want a bunch at the low CMC to help you cast your higher CMC ramp spells, and those are the ones that will keep you set for the game.
Since my decks tend to be slow and durdly, I generally run around 36-38 lands and 15-20 ramp spells. and I usually have around 10-15 ramp spells between 0-3 CMC and around 3-5 ramp spells at 4+ CMC.
2) The type of ramp you want depends on your gameplan as well as what's in your playgroup.
First, you should understand what types of ramp exists. The best example here is to see the difference between Llanowar Elves (mana dorks), Nature's Lore (spell ramp), Wood Elves (creature-land ramp), and Moss Diamond (mana rocks). They each net you G (technically the middle two are fetching forests so they're normally getting ABU duals or shocks, but it's close enough), but they have varying mana costs so they will get you that mana on different turns, and the mana they provide are nullified by different cards. There are other cards that provide mana in different ways (such as Awakening Zone and Seething Song) but these four are the most common.
In terms of explosiveness (the mana they get you for the mana they cost), generally colorless mana rocks are the most explosive, then mana dorks, then spell ramp are about equal to colored mana rocks, and then creature-land ramp. Each type has different strengths and weaknesses when it comes to resiliency; for example, mana dorks are easy to kill, while creature ramp give you the most "value" (lands are usually the permanent type that is least fooled around with, and the creature ramp provide bodies for combat, Birthing Pod, etc), and you just need to tailor your build to what your friends play. For example, if everyone in your group loves Stranglehold, Aven Mindcensor and other similar cards, you may want to limit the land searching spells simply because you won't be searching your library for them. If your group loves their Aura shards, Creeping Corrosion, and other cards, you may want to limit your artifact rampers. And so on.
Of course, it then depends on your gameplan as well as how cutthroat you want to be. For example, Narset, Enlightened Master wants all the most efficient mana rocks because your gameplan is to just slam narset ASAP with some protection, attack once, and go infinite from there. The cutthroat Narset decks will likely not use Burnished Hart unless they're desperate, as cards like Worn Powerstone and Thran Dynamo are simply more efficient. However if you are not a cutthroat deck it would be safer to not make all of your ramp a single type, because as the game goes longer, the more things that are unexpected can happen. For example, if you only play mana rocks you don't want to get shut down by a Creeping Corrosion. Cutthroat Narset builds will just take their chances and run mana rocks because a Creeping Corrosion-type spell likely won't get cast by the time you win, but if you are aiming for a slower and durdly Narset build, a creeping corrosion type spell will likely get cast sometime and you don't want your mana sources to disappear.
And with regards to your gameplan, if your plan is to do stuff and then armageddon, you probably don't need a lot of cards that fetch out lands. But if you instead are planning to wipe creatures/artifacts/enchantments/planeswalkers often, instead you may want to rely on the cards that fetch lands. etc.
My decks are slow and durdly, so I always spread out my ramp types. I have some mana dorks, some mana rocks, some that fetch out lands (be they nonpermanent spells like Cultivate or grabbed by a creature like Wood elves, or even in nongreen decks things like Burnished Hart), and sometimes an enchantment or two that helps with mana ramp, maybe even a planeswalker or two as well. That way, it's harder for the rug to get pulled out from beneath me.
3) The actual lands you want to play depends on your budget.
As a rule of thumb, the stronger lands cost more $$$. The stronger lands also allow you to play more nonbasics that don't tap for color(s), as they are good enough to pick up the slack. For example, if you have a 3 or 5-color deck that has fetchlands/ABU duals/shocklands, it's actually not that hard to get necropotence out, whereas GLHF doing that if your mana base is a bunch of azorius guildgates. Also the land types get better or worse depending on the deck's colors and curve. the fastlands (Seachrome Coast) are way better in low curve decks than in other decks, while the bouncelands/karoos (Azorius Chancery) are better in slow, durdly decks that don't need to curve out in the early turns. Tango lands Prairie Stream) will be great in 2-color decks, especially if those decks pack fetchlands, as those decks have a high number of basics, while they're a bit worse in 3-color decks, and are kind of bad in 5-color. My personal ranking of the dual lands, from best to worst (disregarding monetary costs), are as follows...
TOP TIER (aka lolfetchlands)
Fetchlands (Flooded Strand)
HIGH TIER (aka goes well with fetchlands)
Original Duals/ABU Duals (Tundra)
Shocklands (Hallowed Fountain)
MID TIER (aka usefulness depends on the deck, not in any order)
Pain lands (Adarkar Wastes) - 2 or 3-color decks
Trilands (Seaside Citadel, Sandsteppe Citadel) - 3-color decks
Tango lands (Prairie Stream) - 2 or 3-color decks
Fast lands (Seachrome Coast) - low curve decks
Filter Lands (Mystic Gate) - medium or high curve decks
Bounce lands/Karoos (Azorius Chancery) - high curve decks with lands that have ETB effects
Check lands (Glacial Fortress) - pretty good with ABU duals/shocklands though still not high tier
LOW TIER (aka playable)
Scry lands (Temple of Enlightenment)
Manlands (Celestial Colonnade)
Vivid lands (Vivid Meadow)
BOTTOM TIER (aka super budget builds)
Taplands (Azorius Guildgate, Sejiri Refuge, Tranquil Cove, etc. Lands that always enter tapped and don't have an appreciable effect to make up for it)
Then you have the rainbow lands like City of Brass, Forbidden Orchard, and so on, which gain value as the number of colors in your deck increases, and range from utterly amazing (Command Tower) to hyperbudget (Rupture Spire).
WUBRGProgenitus
URGMaelstrom Wanderer
WUBOloro, Ageless Ascetic
WURZedruu, the Greathearted
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher ($100)
GWUDerevi, Empyrial Tactician ($100)
UGKruphix, God of Horizons ($100)(retired)UTalrand, Sky Summoner (French 1v1, $100)
5 color superfriends control breaks down like this: 7 duals 7 shocks 9 fetches 3 rainbow 6 utility (including cabal coffers/urborg)
oh yea. if you run black, run urborg/coffers.
Of course a lot of this hinges on whether or not your playgroup allows proxies.
WUBRGReaper King - Superfriends
WUBRGChild of Alara - The Nauseating Aurora
WUBSharuum the Hegemon - Christmas In Prison
WUBZur the Enchanter - Ow My Face
WRJor Kadeen, the Prevailer - Snow Goats
BRGrenzo, Dungeon Warden - International Goblin All Purpose Recycling Facility Number 12
WGSaffi Eriksdotter - Saffi Combosdotter
UPatron of the Moon - The Age of Aquarius
BHorobi, Death's Wail - Bring Out Your Dead
GSachi, Daughter of Seshiro - Sneks
Beyond that, it comes down to my curve and things like that. I very rarely get mana-screwed, so I must be doing something reasonably well.