I very briefly ran it in my second ever Commander deck, an all-in Sedris reanimator deck. That deck has since been upgraded heavily and the card was removed.
Describing this as a "Gatekeeper" is pretty fair - Rise from the Grave and Fearsome Awakening are bad because they cost more than Zombify. We have enough effectively better effects to keep this out of most normal, sane, non-budget lists though.
I don't think this is a completely fair argument. At least Rise can hit any 'Yard, not being limited to just your own is worth +1 to the cmc, I think. Although I'd hazard a guess that Rise isn't stronger than Ashen Powder.
Honestly it's pretty unplayable. It's not unplayable because it is a bad card (not a great one either) but because black has so many reanimation effects with random upside depending on the deck. Reanimation cards don't even cost that much $$$ wise so there is no need to run Zombify because of budget reasons. As far as I know only Reanimate has any value. The rest are pretty much dollar rares.
Necromancy is also in the $4 - $6 USD range. But yes, you're right, most reanimation spells are fairly inexpensive $$ wise.
I dont think its Bad per se, but certainly not optimal. Realistically Vigor Mortis or Dread Return would be better provided that your deck also uses G for vigor and can easily produce BB.
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EDH BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern: RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
Describing this as a "Gatekeeper" is pretty fair - Rise from the Grave and Fearsome Awakening are bad because they cost more than Zombify. We have enough effectively better effects to keep this out of most normal, sane, non-budget lists though.
I don't think this is a completely fair argument. At least Rise can hit any 'Yard, not being limited to just your own is worth +1 to the cmc, I think. Although I'd hazard a guess that Rise isn't stronger than Ashen Powder.
Fair, although as you pointed out Ashen Powder hits opposing yards if that is what you care about. Animate Dead and Necromancy also hit opposing creatures, which is commonly missed. And for my part I'd probably also favor Beacon of Unrest (also hits artifacts and shuffles in) or Grim Return (less flexible, but instant-speed) or Puppeteer Clique (Temporary but reusable and has great typing and a modest body) and Body Double (if I'm in blue)...there's plenty of better ways to hijack stuff from an opponent's graveyard is the point.
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Sufferer of EDHD
Commander - Currently Playing: RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G) RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B) WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Describing this as a "Gatekeeper" is pretty fair - Rise from the Grave and Fearsome Awakening are bad because they cost more than Zombify. We have enough effectively better effects to keep this out of most normal, sane, non-budget lists though.
I don't think this is a completely fair argument. At least Rise can hit any 'Yard, not being limited to just your own is worth +1 to the cmc, I think. Although I'd hazard a guess that Rise isn't stronger than Ashen Powder.
Fair, although as you pointed out Ashen Powder hits opposing yards if that is what you care about. Animate Dead and Necromancy also hit opposing creatures, which is commonly missed. And for my part I'd probably also favor Beacon of Unrest (also hits artifacts and shuffles in) or Grim Return (less flexible, but instant-speed) or Puppeteer Clique (Temporary but reusable and has great typing and a modest body) and Body Double (if I'm in blue)...there's plenty of better ways to hijack stuff from an opponent's graveyard is the point.
Well right. We're not arguing those three auras are better or not (because very clearly they are, they're far too efficient for the upfront mana cost).
I wouldn't say Grim Return is better than Zombify though. GR is a combat trick. Zombify gives something to do when you rip it off the top. GR requires conditions to be met and allows you to respond to it, if it was something you wanted back. That makes it pretty narrow all things considered.
And now Comic-Con got in the way. Oh well. Prophecy. It's about as bad as it's namesake set though at least it's card draw in white.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
I can't think of any deck that wants this, but it is a 1CMC Cantrip (Slowtrip, whatever) in white, of which there are precious few. It can hose top-of-library tutoring but as a Sorcery that'll be hard to do and white has better ways to make the tutor-lovers miserable. It also sorta-kinda combos with Oust and Unexpectedly Absent and Lapse of Certainty, and I guess some sort of serious mono-white control list might want to at least consider all of those things.
It is probably bad because any deck looking to sling spells in White is probably also part-Blue, and...no, I'm afraid I can't think of any home for this at this time. Maybe someday we'll get a R/W Prowess Spellslinger and this card will be worth a look?
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Sufferer of EDHD
Commander - Currently Playing: RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G) RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B) WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
It's like a slowtrip Bandage that you can just cast on the first turn to be at 21 sometimes. Its sorcery speed restricts it from being used to defeat Vampiric Tutor and other similar topdeck tutors. Basically a useless card in every format, but hey, Ihsan's Shade is a cool guy.
Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
This card deserves a Jar Jar Binks alter. "Mesa Jar Jar Binks. Mesa Enchantress. Mesa very goodsa in Selesnya Enchantress."
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because it sucks, and sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because everyone already knows how good it is at what it does. This is the latter.
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The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
Sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because it sucks, and sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because everyone already knows how good it is at what it does. This is the latter.
I've never seen it do much, really. I've seen Vedalken Archmage run away with games (usually chaining eggs or something). But ME? Never. I think in an enchantress deck you need a bit more upside to be playing this. You already have Argothian Enchantress, Eidolon of Blossoms, enchantress's presence... so maybe it's the 4th of this effect in a WG enchantress? Not even sure it makes the cut.
In a non-green enchantress deck it becomes more valuable, but it still dies to everything. I feel like the main non-green Wx enchantment decks would prefer Sram, Senior Edificer or Kor Spiritdancer, or plays Zur the Enchanter as the commander. ME, to me, only fits in a non-green, non-aura, non-Zur echantress deck. Daxos the Returned is the only obvious deck to me.
Sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because it sucks, and sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because everyone already knows how good it is at what it does. This is the latter.
I've never seen it do much, really. I've seen Vedalken Archmage run away with games (usually chaining eggs or something). But ME? Never. I think in an enchantress deck you need a bit more upside to be playing this. You already have Argothian Enchantress, Eidolon of Blossoms, enchantress's presence... so maybe it's the 4th of this effect in a WG enchantress? Not even sure it makes the cut.
In a non-green enchantress deck it becomes more valuable, but it still dies to everything. I feel like the main non-green Wx enchantment decks would prefer Sram, Senior Edificer or Kor Spiritdancer, or plays Zur the Enchanter as the commander. ME, to me, only fits in a non-green, non-aura, non-Zur echantress deck. Daxos the Returned is the only obvious deck to me.
Sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because it sucks, and sometimes you get a card that there isn't much to say about because everyone already knows how good it is at what it does. This is the latter.
I've never seen it do much, really. I've seen Vedalken Archmage run away with games (usually chaining eggs or something). But ME? Never. I think in an enchantress deck you need a bit more upside to be playing this. You already have Argothian Enchantress, Eidolon of Blossoms, enchantress's presence... so maybe it's the 4th of this effect in a WG enchantress? Not even sure it makes the cut.
In a non-green enchantress deck it becomes more valuable, but it still dies to everything. I feel like the main non-green Wx enchantment decks would prefer Sram, Senior Edificer or Kor Spiritdancer, or plays Zur the Enchanter as the commander. ME, to me, only fits in a non-green, non-aura, non-Zur echantress deck. Daxos the Returned is the only obvious deck to me.
Don't get me wrong, I love paying 5RR for a 6/2 that pings a creature or player for 1 damage...
...
...but I also really don't.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Eh, part of enchantress's power comes from getting a ton of value from each enchantment. Yes, I'd like 4+ effects that draw cards, both because I want to have one at all times and because its great in multiples. I mean, yeah, I'd rather have argothian because shroud, but I'd rather have argothian AND Mesa. The more cards you draw per enchantment, the more likely you'll start chaining enchantments instead of hitting a land and stopping. And of course, literally any non green enchantress has her as at the top unless it's focused solely on auras, and then she's still baller. I don't think I've ever been unhappy to draw her,
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The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
I've sketched out a Te-Morph Frontier deck a few times, and this card has never been in the 99; it's only 5R for a 6/2 that deals 1 damage, spread over two turns even, and even then it simply isn't good enough. The 6/2 stat line is real bad especially given the prevalence of first strike and double strike in my meta, and 1 damage is near-irrelevant.
Relevant for Baron Von Count as it hits everything but 4 and you want to load up on "5"s due to the likelihood the Baron is going to get his clock cleaned.
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Sufferer of EDHD
Commander - Currently Playing: RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G) RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B) WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Yes, it only costs 2R to get that with this card. You're playing Animorphs right?
All morphs are automatically good because Animar, as Animar mostly cares about putting them into play face down. The front side, from cost to flip, to stats, to any effects, is gravy, and its what decides what morphs make the cut. Your only question is how many morph creatures are you running, and how far that gets you down your list. This guy sits in a spot where he isn't an auto include, but makes the cut if you go all in on morphs, and will usually get flipped if he does.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
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I would even prefer cheaper one-shot effects like the aforementioneed Sedris, the Traitor King's unearth or Apprentice Necromancer before running this.
I don't think this is a completely fair argument. At least Rise can hit any 'Yard, not being limited to just your own is worth +1 to the cmc, I think. Although I'd hazard a guess that Rise isn't stronger than Ashen Powder.
Necromancy is also in the $4 - $6 USD range. But yes, you're right, most reanimation spells are fairly inexpensive $$ wise.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern:
RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
Fair, although as you pointed out Ashen Powder hits opposing yards if that is what you care about. Animate Dead and Necromancy also hit opposing creatures, which is commonly missed. And for my part I'd probably also favor Beacon of Unrest (also hits artifacts and shuffles in) or Grim Return (less flexible, but instant-speed) or Puppeteer Clique (Temporary but reusable and has great typing and a modest body) and Body Double (if I'm in blue)...there's plenty of better ways to hijack stuff from an opponent's graveyard is the point.
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Well right. We're not arguing those three auras are better or not (because very clearly they are, they're far too efficient for the upfront mana cost).
I wouldn't say Grim Return is better than Zombify though. GR is a combat trick. Zombify gives something to do when you rip it off the top. GR requires conditions to be met and allows you to respond to it, if it was something you wanted back. That makes it pretty narrow all things considered.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
And now Comic-Con got in the way. Oh well. Prophecy. It's about as bad as it's namesake set though at least it's card draw in white.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
It is probably bad because any deck looking to sling spells in White is probably also part-Blue, and...no, I'm afraid I can't think of any home for this at this time. Maybe someday we'll get a R/W Prowess Spellslinger and this card will be worth a look?
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
His deeds will not be forgiven until he merits.
This, however, will never merit.
On phasing:
This card deserves a Jar Jar Binks alter. "Mesa Jar Jar Binks. Mesa Enchantress. Mesa very goodsa in Selesnya Enchantress."
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
I also use her in Mathas, Fiend Seeker and Queen Marchesa enchantment decks.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
I've never seen it do much, really. I've seen Vedalken Archmage run away with games (usually chaining eggs or something). But ME? Never. I think in an enchantress deck you need a bit more upside to be playing this. You already have Argothian Enchantress, Eidolon of Blossoms, enchantress's presence... so maybe it's the 4th of this effect in a WG enchantress? Not even sure it makes the cut.
In a non-green enchantress deck it becomes more valuable, but it still dies to everything. I feel like the main non-green Wx enchantment decks would prefer Sram, Senior Edificer or Kor Spiritdancer, or plays Zur the Enchanter as the commander. ME, to me, only fits in a non-green, non-aura, non-Zur echantress deck. Daxos the Returned is the only obvious deck to me.
8.RG Green Devotion Ramp/Combo 9.UR Draw Triggers 10.WUR Group stalling 11.WUR Voltron Spellslinger 12.WB Sacrificial Shenanigans
13.BR Creatureless Panharmonicon 14.BR Pingers and Eldrazi 15.URG Untapped Cascading
16.Reyhan, last of the Abzan's WUBG +1/+1 Counter Craziness 17.WUBRG Dragons aka Why did I make this?
Building: The Gitrog Monster lands, Glissa the Traitor stax, Muldrotha, the Gravetide Planeswalker Combo, Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix + Sidar Kondo of Jamuraa Clues, and Tribal Scarecrow Planeswalkers
Some people build Zedruu the Greathearted as an enchantress (can donate controlling enchantments like Nevermore, Dictate of Kruphix, and Cast Out for #value, likes Paradox Haze, gets to use Wild Research, usually draws game out long enough to abuse Enduring Ideal), or build the W/x gods as Enchanter decks (Heliod, God of the Sun and Athreos, God of Passage most specifically I think), so certainly this has homes. Even in G/W enchantress redundancy is good, although I agree the three you listed are much much better than this. I wish white had an Argothian Enchantress equivalent too, but any port in a storm.
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
I thought of Zedruu Enchantress decks, but I think Zedruu would prefer donating cards to draw extra cards vs having an enchantress in play.
8.RG Green Devotion Ramp/Combo 9.UR Draw Triggers 10.WUR Group stalling 11.WUR Voltron Spellslinger 12.WB Sacrificial Shenanigans
13.BR Creatureless Panharmonicon 14.BR Pingers and Eldrazi 15.URG Untapped Cascading
16.Reyhan, last of the Abzan's WUBG +1/+1 Counter Craziness 17.WUBRG Dragons aka Why did I make this?
Building: The Gitrog Monster lands, Glissa the Traitor stax, Muldrotha, the Gravetide Planeswalker Combo, Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix + Sidar Kondo of Jamuraa Clues, and Tribal Scarecrow Planeswalkers
Don't get me wrong, I love paying 5RR for a 6/2 that pings a creature or player for 1 damage...
...
...but I also really don't.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
Dragons of Legend, Lead by Scion of the UR-Dragon
The Gitrog Monster
Gonti, Lord of Luxury
Shogun Saskia
Hive World
Atraxa hates fun
Abzan
Relevant for Baron Von Count as it hits everything but 4 and you want to load up on "5"s due to the likelihood the Baron is going to get his clock cleaned.
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
(Image by totallynotabrony)
Yes, it only costs 2R to get that with this card. You're playing Animorphs right?
All morphs are automatically good because Animar, as Animar mostly cares about putting them into play face down. The front side, from cost to flip, to stats, to any effects, is gravy, and its what decides what morphs make the cut. Your only question is how many morph creatures are you running, and how far that gets you down your list. This guy sits in a spot where he isn't an auto include, but makes the cut if you go all in on morphs, and will usually get flipped if he does.
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!