I really loved playing Recycle in my Azusa, Lost but Seeking deck back in the day. I'm trying to keep myself off of U & G in EDH these days, and I just stumbled back upon Null Profusion, which I had forgotten about for awhile.
I'm sure there's plenty of ways in black (or bi- or tri-color combinations containing black) to draw your deck with Profusion in play. I'm wondering what some of the most efficient / easiest to assemble / ways that don't require otherwise useless cards in your deck are. I mean, if you had Thraximundar, Null Profusion, and Phyrexian Altar in play, I guess you could loop Gravecrawler to draw your deck. But that's pretty janky. Any better ideas?
Black has a lot of solid draw already and 6 mana is a lot for what this card does. What it CAN do is huge, but in the time I ran it I always found that it'd draw me a few cards and then I just didn't have enough cards in hand to make it work. Like, I'd draw into a couple of totally irrelevant cards just to cycle them and wind up with land.
That said, I love these cards because they can explode in the right deck. It's just that those decks tend to be low cost combo decks and there just aren't that many of those out there.
Black has a lot of solid draw already and 6 mana is a lot for what this card does. What it CAN do is huge, but in the time I ran it I always found that it'd draw me a few cards and then I just didn't have enough cards in hand to make it work. Like, I'd draw into a couple of totally irrelevant cards just to cycle them and wind up with land.
That said, I love these cards because they can explode in the right deck. It's just that those decks tend to be low cost combo decks and there just aren't that many of those out there.
Yeah, every time I watch a bunch of Vintage videos, I end up wishing that Yawgmoth's Bargain was playable in EDH (I might not actually wish that when it played out in real life, but...). Same goes with watching Vintage / Legacy / Modern and seeing Griselbrand get Goryo's Vengeance'd into play, smack someone, and draw half the deck. Long story short, I like cards that are super broken / breakable and Null Profusion seems like a card that's breakable. I was thinking of just jamming a bunch of 0cmc mana rocks and rituals and seeing if it could be Ad Nauseum #2 minus the life loss.
Sensei's Divining Top? It's not like, draw your deck infinite, but it basically adds a kicker to each of your spells to draw an additional card. Avoiding U/G, there's not a lot of ways to play off the top of your deck.
Something like Cloud Key would make it go harder, but I'm not sure if that's good enough on its own.
Without top: play a card, draw a card.
With top: Put Top on top, draw a card. Play a card, draw Top. Play Top, draw a card.
I'm sorry, but the downside of 6 mana and having to discard down to 2 each turn is a put-off. Even if you just want to draw your deck in one turn, there's combos out there that are much less painful.
I agree. We should all only play g/x decks because they are the most objectively fun and anyone who disagrees does not know the truth about EDH. Everyone should just play their decks because interaction beyond high fiving about how many land are in play is unfun and equivalent to casting Stasis while kicking puppies. I for one will never play with anyone who casts tutors, removal spells, blue cards, things I arbitrarily decide I don't like but will probably cast myself later.
OK personally, I don't think you have to build around it to make it work. I run it myself in a janky black mass thrulls/demons deck. If someone removes it, it sucks, but I've never found an opponent do that, because even if it has utility, it doesn't scare you the same way that Bruna, Light of Alabaster does, for example. The maximum hand size hasn't mattered a lot. Just run a little recursion and discard your creatures, for example. It's also worth it to run cards like Sign in Blood or other already well-functional card draw, because it does make it that more impactful, as long as the cards are cheap. Also, running cards like Hero's Downfall or other pinpoint removal doesn't feel as bad. In EDH, cards that would otherwise be worse than duel magic can shine, if they somehow replace themselves. Dregs of Sorrow and even Annihilate works different here (that is if your meta isn't all aggro and combo, the point is that cantrips shine during grindy games and Null Profusion can do a lot of that work Slay and Execute can also do wonders depending on your local meta and how large the game in question is).
I run it in my Toshiro Umezawa deck and I tend to like it when I draw it. Its nice to be able to chain a kill spell through two targets thanks to my commander and draw two cards. The odd thing about it is that when you have it you really just want to shread through your deck as fast as you can so situational answers and stuff you should just burn them and keep moving because its not worth sitting on a stagnant hand to execute them at the correct time.
It really turns a control deck on end and makes it important to just move cards as fast as possible. That said, its really good and it usually does a ton of crazy stuff.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
All Null Profusion needs you to is play your deck and it'll provide you with a ton of card advantage anyway.
Ummm, yeah, the poster was asking about infinite draw combos or cards advantageous to run with it, not just Null Profusion good by itself.
All the combos your mentioned there require multiple specific cards to work.
How stupid of me. I should know that the only good combos in Magic are 1-card combos, which is the definition of the word "combo." Pardon me while I go correct that stupid dictionary which misled me.
I really loved playing Recycle in my Azusa, Lost but Seeking deck back in the day. I'm trying to keep myself off of U & G in EDH these days, and I just stumbled back upon Null Profusion, which I had forgotten about for awhile.
I'm sure there's plenty of ways in black (or bi- or tri-color combinations containing black) to draw your deck with Profusion in play. I'm wondering what some of the most efficient / easiest to assemble / ways that don't require otherwise useless cards in your deck are. I mean, if you had Thraximundar, Null Profusion, and Phyrexian Altar in play, I guess you could loop Gravecrawler to draw your deck. But that's pretty janky. Any better ideas?
Thanks!
R.I.P. Sundering Titan (6/20/12) and Braids, Cabal Minion (9/12/14)
Black has a lot of solid draw already and 6 mana is a lot for what this card does. What it CAN do is huge, but in the time I ran it I always found that it'd draw me a few cards and then I just didn't have enough cards in hand to make it work. Like, I'd draw into a couple of totally irrelevant cards just to cycle them and wind up with land.
That said, I love these cards because they can explode in the right deck. It's just that those decks tend to be low cost combo decks and there just aren't that many of those out there.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
Yeah, every time I watch a bunch of Vintage videos, I end up wishing that Yawgmoth's Bargain was playable in EDH (I might not actually wish that when it played out in real life, but...). Same goes with watching Vintage / Legacy / Modern and seeing Griselbrand get Goryo's Vengeance'd into play, smack someone, and draw half the deck. Long story short, I like cards that are super broken / breakable and Null Profusion seems like a card that's breakable. I was thinking of just jamming a bunch of 0cmc mana rocks and rituals and seeing if it could be Ad Nauseum #2 minus the life loss.
R.I.P. Sundering Titan (6/20/12) and Braids, Cabal Minion (9/12/14)
Something like Cloud Key would make it go harder, but I'm not sure if that's good enough on its own.
Without top: play a card, draw a card.
With top: Put Top on top, draw a card. Play a card, draw Top. Play Top, draw a card.
Seems fine.
Draft my Peasant Cube.
For instance, with Phyrexian Altar and Gravecrawler, Grim Haruspex is all you need. Pentavus, Blade of the Bloodchief, Ashnod's Altar, and Skullclamp work too. There's Dross Scorpion, Myr Turbine, and Skullclamp. Or Aphetto Alchemist equipped with Illusionist's Bracers + Arcanis the Omnipotent. Even Future Sight is sort of the same effect, since the more you play off your topdeck, the more cards you see.
For Recycle type effects, about the best I can think of is a storm-type combo with Ornithopter, Midnight Guard, and Retraction Helix. And at that point, you might as well toss in Impact Tremors or Altar of the Brood and call it a wincon right there.
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It really turns a control deck on end and makes it important to just move cards as fast as possible. That said, its really good and it usually does a ton of crazy stuff.
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Ummm, yeah, the poster was asking about infinite draw combos or cards advantageous to run with it, not just Null Profusion good by itself.
How stupid of me. I should know that the only good combos in Magic are 1-card combos, which is the definition of the word "combo." Pardon me while I go correct that stupid dictionary which misled me.