I was looking for a general in a discard themed deck and 3 came to mind:
Cao Cao, Lord of Wei
Pros:
Access to mono-blackramp.
Access to Contamination
General is mind rot on a stick
I've wanted to build a mono black deck for a while, but hadn't found the proper General
Cons:
One color, no artifact or enchantment removal Gwendlyn Di Corci
Pros:
Discard is random
Access to blue and red
Low cost
Cons:
Small discard effect compared to the other two
Easier to remove
Name is impossible to spell Nicol Bolas
Pros:
Massive discard effect
Giant body with 3 turn clock
Access to blue and red
Mother******* nicol bolas, the biggest and baddest lore character dating all the way back to legends
Cons:
Effect will make people hate me
Huge cost
Only hits 1 player in multiplayer games
Can I get help here? I'm Johnny/Spike, although I'd rather win than inhibit myself for the sake of combo.
Standard
>implying Modern
>implying Legacy UWMiracles/Countertop EDH UUUMemnarch, Steal your grillUUU RWUZedruu, Queen of ChaosRWU GWUBRReaper KingGWUBR My Trades
While not a discard general per se. Wrexial, the risen deep is fantastic as the general of a discard based deck. Not only do your opponents not get to play their spells due to forced discard... but you turn around and play them.
It was a tough call between Cao Cao and Gwendlyn for me, I went with Gwen, because (depending on the situation) I would rather have the discard be random, than let an opponent choose the card(s) to discard (recursion effects can get problematic with that) at least with it being random there's a chance you'll mess with their heads more, which is what I'm supposing you're going for with a discard based deck.
Either could work well really, it just depends on what colors you want to play and what you want the overall feel to be.
I nixed the bolas because that will get you hated off really fast, and I personally hate him... so I'd target you right away if he were your general. Also, you can run him in Gwen if you really want to without being a massive target right off the bat.
On that note, you can run Cao Cao in Gwen also, along with all that glorious ramp. Just throw in some colored mana artifacts and such or a Chromatic Lantern and you should be fine.
EDH Decks
Avacyn, Angel of Hope
Vorel of the Hull Clade
-------------------------
Niv Mizzet, the Firemind
Sharuum, the Hegemon
Kaalia of the Vast
Rafiq of the Many
Scion of the Ur-Dragon
Don't dismiss Nebuchadnezzar out of hand. Blue and Black gives you option to all the best mill as well as discard. Plus he's an original legend. And won't get you insta-hated out.
Greel, Mind Raker can be very strong if you can set up the recursion or a good draw engine, one of the few that can do instant-speed discard which can nearly lock someone out if you do it during their draw step. Zhang Liao, Hero of Hefei can do the same thing if you can get a ping effect like Thornbite Staff.
Nath is easily the best discard general. Gives you control and discard.
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Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
er guys, nicol bolas doesn't need to connect in combat. give him a Livewire Lash, wolfhunter's quiver or viridian longbow, and bolas pretty much becomes "t: target opponent discards his or her hand". i'm sure there are more efficient ways of doing this, but my casual leanings make it difficult to think of better synergies. possibly adding in a mind over matter, Pemmin's Aura or Thassa's Ire to untap nicol bolas a couple of times.
yea it costs 7, but i think style points and grixis ramp spells (dreamscape artist and gem of becoming come to mind) would kinda reduce it's jankyness.
Thanks, looks like I'm going with Gwendlyn.
Also, the reason I'm not playing nath is because another player in my group runs him, although more themed around elves, and 2 of the same general will feel kind of wierd.
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Standard
>implying Modern
>implying Legacy UWMiracles/Countertop EDH UUUMemnarch, Steal your grillUUU RWUZedruu, Queen of ChaosRWU GWUBRReaper KingGWUBR My Trades
I'm voting for Nath of the Gilt-Leaf. Or Wrexial, the risen deep.
Bit hhave good colors and good abilities. Nath is good, random discard for free and generates you tokens. As mentioned above, with Sadistic Hypnotist and things such as Megrim it is very deadly.
On the other hand, Wrexial doesn't have discard on his own, so you would need to run some discards, but he utilize the discarded cards and also exile them. Good against flashback decks or decks, which can cast spells from GY. Also, discarding that blue control Time Stretch and casting it for free... yes, why not. Do'nt forget he is in best control colors, with Island and Swamp-walk abilities, so he is unblockable to most opponents. And if not, you pull out that Urborg, tomb of yawgmoth and he will be.
Gwendlyn is a nice choice that I almost went with for my grixis discard (going to be replacing Crosis with Marchesa, the Black Rose when Conspiracy rolls out since the deck is more aggro-centric).
Some benefits for having red and blue in your black discard deck: Hellfire Mongrel/Lavaborn Muse Sedraxis Specter/Blazing Specter/Blizzard Specter
Access to counterspells; access to bounce; access to LD; access to damage-based boardwipes.
That said, even my deck is at least 60% black in the nonland department, so the benefits aren't that huge.
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X Hope of Ghirapur Swordpile W Ghosty Blinky Anafenza U Nezahal- Big, Blue and HERE! B Gonti Can Afford It R Etali, Primal 'Whatjusthappened?' G Polukranos Wants More Mana WU The Exalted Vizier Temmet WB Home, Athreos WR Basandra, Recursive Aggression WG Karametra, Momma of Lands UB Wrexial Eats Your Brains UR Arjun, the Mad Flame UG The Fable of Prime Speaker BR Hellbent, Malfegor Style BG Jarad, Death is Served RG Running Thromok WUB Varina and ALL the Zombies WUBYennett, the Odd Pain-Train WUR Zedruu the Furyhearted WUG Arcades' Strategy, Shmategy, Sausage and Spam WBR A Case of Mathas' Persistent F*ckery WBRLicia's League of Legendary Lifegain Layabouts WBG The Karador Advantage PackageWRG Gahiji Rattlesnake Collection UBR Jeleva... does... things UBG Damia's Just Deserts URG Yasova's Has More Power Than Sense BRG Wasitora, Bad Kitty WUBRBreya, Eggs, Breya'd Eggs WUBG Tymna and Kydele, Extended Borrowing WURG Kynaios and Tiro, Landfall Impersonations WBRG Saskia Pet Card EnchantressUBRG Yidris of the Chi-Ting Corporation WUBRG Tazri's Amazing Allies
I vote for the big Nicol Bolas. The lack of a combat damage qualifier on him is huge as schweinefett mentioned.
If you're afraid of people hating on you, don't run discard. Go big or go home!
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My Decks:
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUBCheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
Control: GWBGhave, Guru of Adaptability, UBWrexial, Milling Deep UAzami, Lady of No Infinite Combos GWU Derevi, Tempo Beats
Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
When I ran a heavy hand hate/discard deck I went with Geth, Lord of the Vault, mono black just felt right for discard and being able to then turn all those things your opponents discarded into threats for you was also pretty fun.
Of the three you listed I do like Bolas, just because there is something fun about running the old dragons, and using his effect off pingers is just awesome.
Access to blue for a tapping discard general gives you stuff that can untap repeatedly, like Crab Umbra, Freed From the Real, Pemmin's Aura, even Thousand Year Elixir, Thassa's Ire, Second Wind and Aura of Dominion, most of which are possibly good for Gwen. If you eat their whole hand for UUUUUU or so, who cares if it's random? Mind Twist on a dude seems fantastic.
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UUU Talrand, Sky Summoner // (W/U)(W/U)(W/U) Grand Arbiter Augustin IV // RRR Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker // (R/G)(R/G)(R/G) Wort, the Raidmother // URG Riku of Two Reflections // RWU Ruhan of the Fomori
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This is why I started playing magic in the first place. It wasn't PT aspirations just making noobs cry by doing things that are perfectly fair.
I use Nicol Bolas, there's a lot of strength with him. You just Cyclonic Rift and then blow out one person's entire board status to the graveyard and then just Bog or Crypt it. It also means that other bounce effects are a way to go as well. Bolas can effectively create political strategies against strong opponents during an attack phase and swing the game back towards yourself incrementally. I've found him to be an extremely mean deck, but effective if you know how to play him.
There's a huge effect out of ultimating Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker and having your general on the board as well swing in.
It's sort of like playing Vegeta and Nappa.
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Life is a beautiful engineer, yet a brutal scientist.
Cao Cao, Lord of Wei
Pros:
Access to mono-black ramp.
Access to Contamination
General is mind rot on a stick
I've wanted to build a mono black deck for a while, but hadn't found the proper General
Cons:
One color, no artifact or enchantment removal
Gwendlyn Di Corci
Pros:
Discard is random
Access to blue and red
Low cost
Cons:
Small discard effect compared to the other two
Easier to remove
Name is impossible to spell
Nicol Bolas
Pros:
Massive discard effect
Giant body with 3 turn clock
Access to blue and red
Mother******* nicol bolas, the biggest and baddest lore character dating all the way back to legends
Cons:
Effect will make people hate me
Huge cost
Only hits 1 player in multiplayer games
Can I get help here? I'm Johnny/Spike, although I'd rather win than inhibit myself for the sake of combo.
>implying
Modern
>implying
Legacy
UWMiracles/Countertop
EDH
UUUMemnarch, Steal your grillUUU
RWUZedruu, Queen of ChaosRWU
GWUBRReaper KingGWUBR
My Trades
Isaac
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=63536
Don't for get to put have and want tags in your trade threads! If you want to know how, ask!
Either could work well really, it just depends on what colors you want to play and what you want the overall feel to be.
I nixed the bolas because that will get you hated off really fast, and I personally hate him... so I'd target you right away if he were your general. Also, you can run him in Gwen if you really want to without being a massive target right off the bat.
On that note, you can run Cao Cao in Gwen also, along with all that glorious ramp. Just throw in some colored mana artifacts and such or a Chromatic Lantern and you should be fine.
Avacyn, Angel of Hope
Vorel of the Hull Clade
-------------------------
Niv Mizzet, the Firemind
Sharuum, the Hegemon
Kaalia of the Vast
Rafiq of the Many
Scion of the Ur-Dragon
I was expecting Nath of the Gilt Leaf here. GB gives you big mana and shores up the removal issues. Nath is also nuts with Sadistic Hypnotist.
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
But of your three choices........go Gwendyln..........because why not? When was the last time you sat down at a table and saw her?
GMasumaro, First to KillG
......meow
UBBreya's Toybox (Competitive, Combo)WR
RGodzilla, King of the MonstersG
-Retired Decks-
UBLazav, Dimir Mastermind (Competitive, UB Voltron/Control)UB
"Knowledge is such a burden. Release it. Release all your fears to me."
—Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
Pretty much this.
Nath is easily the best discard general. Gives you control and discard.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
yea it costs 7, but i think style points and grixis ramp spells (dreamscape artist and gem of becoming come to mind) would kinda reduce it's jankyness.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
Also, the reason I'm not playing nath is because another player in my group runs him, although more themed around elves, and 2 of the same general will feel kind of wierd.
>implying
Modern
>implying
Legacy
UWMiracles/Countertop
EDH
UUUMemnarch, Steal your grillUUU
RWUZedruu, Queen of ChaosRWU
GWUBRReaper KingGWUBR
My Trades
Bit hhave good colors and good abilities. Nath is good, random discard for free and generates you tokens. As mentioned above, with Sadistic Hypnotist and things such as Megrim it is very deadly.
On the other hand, Wrexial doesn't have discard on his own, so you would need to run some discards, but he utilize the discarded cards and also exile them. Good against flashback decks or decks, which can cast spells from GY. Also, discarding that blue control Time Stretch and casting it for free... yes, why not. Do'nt forget he is in best control colors, with Island and Swamp-walk abilities, so he is unblockable to most opponents. And if not, you pull out that Urborg, tomb of yawgmoth and he will be.
Some benefits for having red and blue in your black discard deck:
Hellfire Mongrel/Lavaborn Muse
Sedraxis Specter/Blazing Specter/Blizzard Specter
Access to counterspells; access to bounce; access to LD; access to damage-based boardwipes.
That said, even my deck is at least 60% black in the nonland department, so the benefits aren't that huge.
If you're afraid of people hating on you, don't run discard. Go big or go home!
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUB Cheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
Control: GWBGhave, Guru of Adaptability, UBWrexial, Milling Deep UAzami, Lady of No Infinite Combos GWU Derevi, Tempo Beats
Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
Of the three you listed I do like Bolas, just because there is something fun about running the old dragons, and using his effect off pingers is just awesome.
|One Red Mountain - A adventure in MTG Trading|
There's a huge effect out of ultimating Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker and having your general on the board as well swing in.
It's sort of like playing Vegeta and Nappa.
Modern
Commander
Cube
<a href="http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/the-cube-forum/cube-lists/588020-unpowered-themed-enchantment-an-enchanted-evening">An Enchanted Evening Cube </a>
He forces your opponents to discard randomly, and is a discard outlet for yourself, so re animator shenanigans can ensue