i have zur's weirding in my zedruu deck, and for the first time its actually lasted a while and its been amazing, not because of it's top-deck denial ability, but more so that i can play around what everyone else is playing. when someone else picks up a insurrection, everyone would see it, and save up their counters and sac outlets; something which no one would instinctively do because we normally wouldn't know about it.
so after that, i thought wait a sec, why dont i play stuff like telepathy and gitaxian probe in all my decks in colour? any thoughts on its actual use/applications in edh as a whole?
I have the weirding in my Tomorrow, Azami's Familiar but I have yet to have it stick around long enough to make a difference(probably because how stupid that card is with Tomorrow on board...)... but I admit I am sort of curious about how such an effect would on the game.
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X Hope of Ghirapur Swordpile W Ghosty Blinky Anafenza U Nezahal- Big, Blue and HERE! B Gonti Can Afford It R Etali, Primal 'Whatjusthappened?' G Polukranos Wants More Mana WU The Exalted Vizier Temmet WB Home, Athreos WR Basandra, Recursive Aggression WG Karametra, Momma of Lands UB Wrexial Eats Your Brains UR Arjun, the Mad Flame UG The Fable of Prime Speaker BR Hellbent, Malfegor Style BG Jarad, Death is Served RG Running Thromok WUB Varina and ALL the Zombies WUBYennett, the Odd Pain-Train WUR Zedruu the Furyhearted WUG Arcades' Strategy, Shmategy, Sausage and Spam WBR A Case of Mathas' Persistent F*ckery WBRLicia's League of Legendary Lifegain Layabouts WBG The Karador Advantage PackageWRG Gahiji Rattlesnake Collection UBR Jeleva... does... things UBG Damia's Just Deserts URG Yasova's Has More Power Than Sense BRG Wasitora, Bad Kitty WUBRBreya, Eggs, Breya'd Eggs WUBG Tymna and Kydele, Extended Borrowing WURG Kynaios and Tiro, Landfall Impersonations WBRG Saskia Pet Card EnchantressUBRG Yidris of the Chi-Ting Corporation WUBRG Tazri's Amazing Allies
Gitaxian Probe is excellent. I love it. The others are only good with synergy. If you're playing Talrand, Sky Summoner, Young Pyromancer, Guttersnipe and similar cards, sure. If you're playing them on their own they're meh. Seer's Vision is the only one I'd play aside from Probe, and it might not make the cut given that I've yet to test it.
These do get much better in combo, if that's your style.
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUBCheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
Control: GWBGhave, Guru of Adaptability, UBWrexial, Milling Deep UAzami, Lady of No Infinite Combos GWU Derevi, Tempo Beats
Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
yea im not much of a combo player, but as far as ive seen, it feels like it neuters combo (i pretty much exclusively multiplayer), since anyone can point out the combo dude's win-con, and everyone then suddenly points hate that way. i think its' severity is a lot less here just cuz almost no one here plays insta-win combo.
wow, tomorrow and weirding is pretty awesome. if i figured the replacement rules right, you can effectively pay 2 life every turn to stop everyone else drawing cards, while you can just replace your draw with tomorrow, right (i.e. no one else can pay life to stop you brainstorming)?
i've kinda had my eye on telepathy actually. my guess would be that my opponents would reveal some really scary stuff in their hands, and that would send the hate away from me (since they won't know whats in my hand either). either that or im waaaay over-valuing information.
Information is good, but the real question is Information is only as good as what you can do with it.
Not necessarily. It's also as good as what your opponents can do with it. You can see "oh hey, that guy has a counterspell" and "hey, that guy has a tooth and nail". So now you know that you can safely tap out, at least in regards to the tooth and nail, because the counterspell player has it under control, and you can pass priority when asked for responses, even if you do have a counter. In this case it's critical that the counterspeller see the tooth and nail, or he might waste it on something else, or not keep mana up. Anyway, it's just nice all-around. There's not even much motivation to kill it, since everyone already saw everything anyway.
Seer's vision seems really really bad to me. 4 for that effect seems hugely overcosted. Slightly less awful in lazav since you can find the best creature in all hands, but I'd still vastly prefer a removal spell instead, for the purposes of turning lazav into something else.
I don't think cards like Gitaxian Probe are worth it since they are only one time effects, unless you're playing Storm or Talrand or something. As for Telepathy, I love it in my Wywden deck - it lets you know what your opponents have, but no one knows what you have, also people see threats in other peoples hands and want to deal with them before they want to deal with you, etc.
I can't really speak for the others spells, but i've ran telepathy before. Its either one of two things:
-In a casual meta or meta where players have bad recognition of board/hand presence: its bad. People just gun for you for "showing everyones hands".
-In a (somewhat) competitive meta: its good. People don't really care you showed everyone because it shows there opponents hands too. The hate that would normally be directed toward you gets aimed at the people trying to combo out or do other crazy plays.
That being said though, I took my telepathy out. It was a fantastic card in a draw-go deck (which had lots of card draw to mitigate that slot loss) as i could see what to counter and what to expect from upcoming plays. I took it out because its always in the top 120 cards, but never in the top 99 for me personally.
hmm it sounds like i need to shove some more of these effects into my group hug decks actually. it seems like so long as i have a decent enough political pull, i could probably use these to work in my favour.
I don't think cards like Gitaxian Probe are worth it since they are only one time effects, unless you're playing Storm or Talrand or something. As for Telepathy, I love it in my Wywden deck - it lets you know what your opponents have, but no one knows what you have, also people see threats in other peoples hands and want to deal with them before they want to deal with you, etc.
This is a fallacious view of such cards imo. I used to hear this argument a lot against running brainstorm in EDH amd it's just false. Whether a card is worth it depends on how much effect it has divided by how much it costs. Ok, sure, looking at a hand once isn't a very large effect. But what's the cost? Practically zero. The cost of running telepathy is much higher because it doesn't replace itself. Especially in competitive games where they might not make it past turn 5, being able to see if player X is about to assemble his combo - and thus, if you need to keep counter mana open or whatever - can be very valuable information to have for the low cost of 2 life or a blue mana.
Now, that said, cards like gitaxian probe and brainstorm are really easy to cut because their effect doesn't usually have a dramatic impact on your game, so I do get that feeling. You want to run more card that "do stuff". But even though it makes it easier to deckbuild, that doesn't really mean it's the right call.
I don't think cards like Gitaxian Probe are worth it since they are only one time effects, unless you're playing Storm or Talrand or something. As for Telepathy, I love it in my Wywden deck - it lets you know what your opponents have, but no one knows what you have, also people see threats in other peoples hands and want to deal with them before they want to deal with you, etc.
This is a fallacious view of such cards imo. I used to hear this argument a lot against running brainstorm in EDH amd it's just false. Whether a card is worth it depends on how much effect it has divided by how much it costs. Ok, sure, looking at a hand once isn't a very large effect. But what's the cost? Practically zero. The cost of running telepathy is much higher because it doesn't replace itself. Especially in competitive games where they might not make it past turn 5, being able to see if player X is about to assemble his combo - and thus, if you need to keep counter mana open or whatever - can be very valuable information to have for the low cost of 2 life or a blue mana.
Now, that said, cards like gitaxian probe and brainstorm are really easy to cut because their effect doesn't usually have a dramatic impact on your game, so I do get that feeling. You want to run more card that "do stuff". But even though it makes it easier to deckbuild, that doesn't really mean it's the right call.
I never mentioned Brainstorm. I run it in the same Wydwen deck I referred to in my previous post. I'm not grouping Gitaxian Probe and Brainstorm in the same category. In reference to OP/question, with cards such as Probe and Peek, I believe that Telepathy is much better, as it provides you a view of all your opponent's hands, and not only a snapshot of a turn, but ideally throughout several turns, revealing to you their draws, how they are playing the game, and what they are planning on doing, etc, along with a multitude of political reasons mentioned in this thread. Brainstorm on the other hand belongs, in my mind, in a category with cards such as Preordain, Serum Visions and Ponder, as they are manipulating the top of your library, fixing your draws, and not being used to view your opponent's hands. Also, the "cost" of running a card such as Gitaxian Probe in a deck that doesn't fully utilize it (such as Talrand, Sky Summoner, Melek, Izzet Paragon, or..you know, Isperia the Inscrutable?) is that it takes up a spot that could be some other, better, card (such as Brainstorm..). Also, I was not speaking with a competitive game in mind, where each player is trying to combo out by turn 5, as I have no experience with such games and I'm sure they play out very differently, I was simply offering my opinion on the cards based on my own experience with them.
Information is good, but the real question is Information is only as good as what you can do with it.
Not necessarily. It's also as good as what your opponents can do with it. You can see "oh hey, that guy has a counterspell" and "hey, that guy has a tooth and nail". So now you know that you can safely tap out, at least in regards to the tooth and nail, because the counterspell player has it under control, and you can pass priority when asked for responses, even if you do have a counter. In this case it's critical that the counterspeller see the tooth and nail, or he might waste it on something else, or not keep mana up. Anyway, it's just nice all-around. There's not even much motivation to kill it, since everyone already saw everything anyway.
Seer's vision seems really really bad to me. 4 for that effect seems hugely overcosted. Slightly less awful in lazav since you can find the best creature in all hands, but I'd still vastly prefer a removal spell instead, for the purposes of turning lazav into something else.
So you prove my quote true? The information was only as good as what you did with it, if you chose to act or not act was affected by the info!
Gitaxian Probe is actually really good, because while it doesn't do a lot, it can tell you if it's safe to cast your wincon and replace itself for 2 life or 1 mana. It's great at all points of the game for that reason. It never slows you down, just provides great value. The only reason to take it out is if you need the slot for something else and every other card in the deck is amazing. Peek is not even 1/4 as good, because it's not free.
I will give thought to Telepathy however. It sounds like it could be a lot better in practice than on paper.
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUBCheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
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Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
I used to play telepathy, but soon took it out. if I turn 1nd telepathy, or even turn 2 or turn 3, everyone sent all of their hate my way, which i did not want to do. yes its a good card, but people will hate you for playing it
You must also remember that most players do not like playing with their hands revealed and it may get them annoyed enough to start killing your stuff.
This is true. I ran Telepathy in my old Sen Triplets deck, both for flavor and the synergy with the Triplet's ability. It was quite useful but it did annoy people, and I was already running a general that seems to annoy people, so I got attacked a lot.
So you prove my quote true? The information was only as good as what you did with it, if you chose to act or not act was affected by the info!
Not completely. Letting the counterspell player know about the tooth and nail (and vice versa) was also useful to you because it keeps the two of them at odds - counterspeller doesn't want T&N to resolve, and T&Ner doesn't want his T&N to get countered. So now they're focused on each other, and you didn't have to do anything.
So you prove my quote true? The information was only as good as what you did with it, if you chose to act or not act was affected by the info!
Not completely. Letting the counterspell player know about the tooth and nail (and vice versa) was also useful to you because it keeps the two of them at odds - counterspeller doesn't want T&N to resolve, and T&Ner doesn't want his T&N to get countered. So now they're focused on each other, and you didn't have to do anything.
But you did you played the Information spell whatever that may have been.
The reason information is underrated in edh is because it's very weak in other formats, where it is east for a skilled player to predict the person's hand. In edh, it is strong and I use it a lot because the decks can be very random in value, size, etc.
IMO, go for it, although Telepathy will make you a target.
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Standard
>implying Modern
>implying Legacy UWMiracles/Countertop EDH UUUMemnarch, Steal your grillUUU RWUZedruu, Queen of ChaosRWU GWUBRReaper KingGWUBR My Trades
So you prove my quote true? The information was only as good as what you did with it, if you chose to act or not act was affected by the info!
Not completely. Letting the counterspell player know about the tooth and nail (and vice versa) was also useful to you because it keeps the two of them at odds - counterspeller doesn't want T&N to resolve, and T&Ner doesn't want his T&N to get countered. So now they're focused on each other, and you didn't have to do anything.
But you did you played the Information spell whatever that may have been.
Are you just being obtuse now?
You asked if information was only as useful as what you can do with it. I said no, because sometimes other people getting information can be useful, even if YOU aren't doing anything with the information.
The information was only as good as what you did with it
False. Information can be useful even if you personally don't act on it.
It's worth noting, of course, that information can backfire too. If everyone else has nothing useful in their hand and all their hands are revealed, and you've got yours concealed, then perhaps everyone will gun for you. Although this is generally less likely in EDH, someone's probably got SOME game-ending bomb.
Peek is strictly better than Gitaxian Probe because you can cast it on their draw step to see an extra card I run all the cantrip versions in Talrand, the information is nice, it lets you use your counterspells and bounce spells better. I've always wanted to run Telepathy but it never ends up making the cut, I just own too many cards, I'd have to make ten blue decks before I ran out of better options.
So you prove my quote true? The information was only as good as what you did with it, if you chose to act or not act was affected by the info!
Not completely. Letting the counterspell player know about the tooth and nail (and vice versa) was also useful to you because it keeps the two of them at odds - counterspeller doesn't want T&N to resolve, and T&Ner doesn't want his T&N to get countered. So now they're focused on each other, and you didn't have to do anything.
But you did you played the Information spell whatever that may have been.
Are you just being obtuse now?
You asked if information was only as useful as what you can do with it. I said no, because sometimes other people getting information can be useful, even if YOU aren't doing anything with the information.
The information was only as good as what you did with it
False. Information can be useful even if you personally don't act on it.
It's worth noting, of course, that information can backfire too. If everyone else has nothing useful in their hand and all their hands are revealed, and you've got yours concealed, then perhaps everyone will gun for you. Although this is generally less likely in EDH, someone's probably got SOME game-ending bomb.
So you're still agreeing with me, I don't see why you keep saying that we are saying something different when we are saying the same thing...
Not being obtuse, the OP asked a question I restated his question, I never asked one.
Not acting based on new information which is the same as doing nothing is still an action. so as we are both saying Information can be useful even if you personally don't act on it.
I feel like your ether not understanding or your trying to pick a fight over us agreeing...
I'm done though in this thread as far as contributing as this has derailed. You're welcome to PM me if you insist to keep agreeing with me but I wont be checking here again.
When it comes to 60 card formats I would never recommend telepathy. it's usually easier to predict your opponents hand in those formats. However in Commander because of the singleton nature of the format, it can be much harder to predict whats in your opponent's hand, making telepathy much more useful.
In practice, its always one of my favorite turn 1 plays. At the very least telepathy seems to always attract a (usually diverse) removal spell. That alone is usually good enough to get value out of it for a single blue mana and that's the worst case scenario.
If telepathy manages to resolve and stay active long enough it can actually give you a pretty overwhelming advantage considering its mana cost. By telling me what's in my opponents hand and it tells me exactly what I need to counter, and reveals to me their options for responses, and when the best time to wrath is.
clairvoyance, gitaxian probe, glasses of urza, lay bare, peek, seer's vision, sorcerous sight, spy network, telepathy, revelation, wandering eye, zur's weirding and others with similar effects.
i have zur's weirding in my zedruu deck, and for the first time its actually lasted a while and its been amazing, not because of it's top-deck denial ability, but more so that i can play around what everyone else is playing. when someone else picks up a insurrection, everyone would see it, and save up their counters and sac outlets; something which no one would instinctively do because we normally wouldn't know about it.
so after that, i thought wait a sec, why dont i play stuff like telepathy and gitaxian probe in all my decks in colour? any thoughts on its actual use/applications in edh as a whole?
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
These do get much better in combo, if that's your style.
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUB Cheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
Control: GWBGhave, Guru of Adaptability, UBWrexial, Milling Deep UAzami, Lady of No Infinite Combos GWU Derevi, Tempo Beats
Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
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StaffI've been tempted to run Telepathy though.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
wow, tomorrow and weirding is pretty awesome. if i figured the replacement rules right, you can effectively pay 2 life every turn to stop everyone else drawing cards, while you can just replace your draw with tomorrow, right (i.e. no one else can pay life to stop you brainstorming)?
i've kinda had my eye on telepathy actually. my guess would be that my opponents would reveal some really scary stuff in their hands, and that would send the hate away from me (since they won't know whats in my hand either). either that or im waaaay over-valuing information.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
URThe Joy of Painting with Nin, the Pain Artist!UR
Not necessarily. It's also as good as what your opponents can do with it. You can see "oh hey, that guy has a counterspell" and "hey, that guy has a tooth and nail". So now you know that you can safely tap out, at least in regards to the tooth and nail, because the counterspell player has it under control, and you can pass priority when asked for responses, even if you do have a counter. In this case it's critical that the counterspeller see the tooth and nail, or he might waste it on something else, or not keep mana up. Anyway, it's just nice all-around. There's not even much motivation to kill it, since everyone already saw everything anyway.
Seer's vision seems really really bad to me. 4 for that effect seems hugely overcosted. Slightly less awful in lazav since you can find the best creature in all hands, but I'd still vastly prefer a removal spell instead, for the purposes of turning lazav into something else.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
-In a casual meta or meta where players have bad recognition of board/hand presence: its bad. People just gun for you for "showing everyones hands".
-In a (somewhat) competitive meta: its good. People don't really care you showed everyone because it shows there opponents hands too. The hate that would normally be directed toward you gets aimed at the people trying to combo out or do other crazy plays.
That being said though, I took my telepathy out. It was a fantastic card in a draw-go deck (which had lots of card draw to mitigate that slot loss) as i could see what to counter and what to expect from upcoming plays. I took it out because its always in the top 120 cards, but never in the top 99 for me personally.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
This is a fallacious view of such cards imo. I used to hear this argument a lot against running brainstorm in EDH amd it's just false. Whether a card is worth it depends on how much effect it has divided by how much it costs. Ok, sure, looking at a hand once isn't a very large effect. But what's the cost? Practically zero. The cost of running telepathy is much higher because it doesn't replace itself. Especially in competitive games where they might not make it past turn 5, being able to see if player X is about to assemble his combo - and thus, if you need to keep counter mana open or whatever - can be very valuable information to have for the low cost of 2 life or a blue mana.
Now, that said, cards like gitaxian probe and brainstorm are really easy to cut because their effect doesn't usually have a dramatic impact on your game, so I do get that feeling. You want to run more card that "do stuff". But even though it makes it easier to deckbuild, that doesn't really mean it's the right call.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
I never mentioned Brainstorm. I run it in the same Wydwen deck I referred to in my previous post. I'm not grouping Gitaxian Probe and Brainstorm in the same category. In reference to OP/question, with cards such as Probe and Peek, I believe that Telepathy is much better, as it provides you a view of all your opponent's hands, and not only a snapshot of a turn, but ideally throughout several turns, revealing to you their draws, how they are playing the game, and what they are planning on doing, etc, along with a multitude of political reasons mentioned in this thread. Brainstorm on the other hand belongs, in my mind, in a category with cards such as Preordain, Serum Visions and Ponder, as they are manipulating the top of your library, fixing your draws, and not being used to view your opponent's hands. Also, the "cost" of running a card such as Gitaxian Probe in a deck that doesn't fully utilize it (such as Talrand, Sky Summoner, Melek, Izzet Paragon, or..you know, Isperia the Inscrutable?) is that it takes up a spot that could be some other, better, card (such as Brainstorm..). Also, I was not speaking with a competitive game in mind, where each player is trying to combo out by turn 5, as I have no experience with such games and I'm sure they play out very differently, I was simply offering my opinion on the cards based on my own experience with them.
WUBRGProgenitus
URGMaelstrom Wanderer
WUBOloro, Ageless Ascetic
WURZedruu, the Greathearted
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher ($100)
GWUDerevi, Empyrial Tactician ($100)
UGKruphix, God of Horizons ($100)(retired)UTalrand, Sky Summoner (French 1v1, $100)
So you prove my quote true? The information was only as good as what you did with it, if you chose to act or not act was affected by the info!
URThe Joy of Painting with Nin, the Pain Artist!UR
I will give thought to Telepathy however. It sounds like it could be a lot better in practice than on paper.
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUB Cheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
Control: GWBGhave, Guru of Adaptability, UBWrexial, Milling Deep UAzami, Lady of No Infinite Combos GWU Derevi, Tempo Beats
Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
This is true. I ran Telepathy in my old Sen Triplets deck, both for flavor and the synergy with the Triplet's ability. It was quite useful but it did annoy people, and I was already running a general that seems to annoy people, so I got attacked a lot.
Not completely. Letting the counterspell player know about the tooth and nail (and vice versa) was also useful to you because it keeps the two of them at odds - counterspeller doesn't want T&N to resolve, and T&Ner doesn't want his T&N to get countered. So now they're focused on each other, and you didn't have to do anything.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
But you did you played the Information spell whatever that may have been.
URThe Joy of Painting with Nin, the Pain Artist!UR
IMO, go for it, although Telepathy will make you a target.
>implying
Modern
>implying
Legacy
UWMiracles/Countertop
EDH
UUUMemnarch, Steal your grillUUU
RWUZedruu, Queen of ChaosRWU
GWUBRReaper KingGWUBR
My Trades
Are you just being obtuse now?
You asked if information was only as useful as what you can do with it. I said no, because sometimes other people getting information can be useful, even if YOU aren't doing anything with the information.
False. Information can be useful even if you personally don't act on it.
It's worth noting, of course, that information can backfire too. If everyone else has nothing useful in their hand and all their hands are revealed, and you've got yours concealed, then perhaps everyone will gun for you. Although this is generally less likely in EDH, someone's probably got SOME game-ending bomb.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
So you're still agreeing with me, I don't see why you keep saying that we are saying something different when we are saying the same thing...
Not being obtuse, the OP asked a question I restated his question, I never asked one.
Not acting based on new information which is the same as doing nothing is still an action. so as we are both saying Information can be useful even if you personally don't act on it.
I feel like your ether not understanding or your trying to pick a fight over us agreeing...
I'm done though in this thread as far as contributing as this has derailed. You're welcome to PM me if you insist to keep agreeing with me but I wont be checking here again.
URThe Joy of Painting with Nin, the Pain Artist!UR
When it comes to 60 card formats I would never recommend telepathy. it's usually easier to predict your opponents hand in those formats. However in Commander because of the singleton nature of the format, it can be much harder to predict whats in your opponent's hand, making telepathy much more useful.
In practice, its always one of my favorite turn 1 plays. At the very least telepathy seems to always attract a (usually diverse) removal spell. That alone is usually good enough to get value out of it for a single blue mana and that's the worst case scenario.
If telepathy manages to resolve and stay active long enough it can actually give you a pretty overwhelming advantage considering its mana cost. By telling me what's in my opponents hand and it tells me exactly what I need to counter, and reveals to me their options for responses, and when the best time to wrath is.
I can honestly say Telepathy has won me games.
I'd play Telepathy but I'm not sure in what.
I play the cantrip-variants in my Storm deck(s), and I generally appreciate seeing them.
Draft my Peasant Cube.