bribery basically reads: 3UU cast the best creature from your opponents deck at a discounted cost. i don't think i need to mention eldrazi or any of the other creatures that have already been discussed. but this is like complaining that your treachery is somehow a bad card because you didn't take exactly what you wanted with it.
bribery is good regardless of you not getting the "perfect" creature with it. you are going to oftentimes cheat a high costing creature into play for only 5 mana… that is the point of the card. it is not meant to be a tutor because you don't tutor your own deck. if you want the perfect targets every time, you should try convincing your friends to just play decks that you handmade for them. otherwise, you are just going to have to keep your chin up when you steal someone's blightsteel and kill them with it the following turn. not ideal, i know.
I don't think I've ever gotten a bad deal with Bribery. 1v1 against a creatureless control or combo deck is about the only situation where it might not be useful, but decks without ANY valuable creatures are a rare thing in EDH. And in multiplayer, there's always at least one player who wants to win with goodstuff fatties. I guess it depends on your playgroup too, but Bribery is an all-around excellent card. It doesn't always give you an unanswerable auto win, but cards don't have to do that to be good.
If you never played against someone and you find out there deck has almost no creatures in it and you're about to get blown out by some combo, then yeah, I guess it's really good? I'm more into sure things, not maybes.
This is EDH. There are no sure things.
There are sure ways decks can play out. Minus all the flip coin shenanigans, or anything thing that indroduces a randomizing event, or grabbing a creature without an ETB effect. Yes, when spells don't get countered, there are sure things outside of getting triggers stiffeled.
Grabbing an eldrazi or blightsteele is less of a sure thing than grabbing a jin or sphinx is less than a ETB effect. That's the facts jack. I run Chain of Vapor, Natures Claim, Chain of Vapor just to stop early animation effects. If anyone else is running that kind of efficient removal, there's no point in grabbing a fatty that doesn't do anything by end of turn. It's a waste of 3UU.
bribery basically reads: 3UU cast the best creature from your opponents deck at a discounted cost. i don't think i need to mention eldrazi or any of the other creatures that have already been discussed. but this is like complaining that your treachery is somehow a bad card because you didn't take exactly what you wanted with it.
bribery is good regardless of you not getting the "perfect" creature with it. you are going to oftentimes cheat a high costing creature into play for only 5 mana… that is the point of the card. it is not meant to be a tutor because you don't tutor your own deck. if you want the perfect targets every time, you should try convincing your friends to just play decks that you handmade for them. otherwise, you are just going to have to keep your chin up when you steal someone's blightsteel and kill them with it the following turn. not ideal, i know.
After thinking this over, If the creature isn't Jin, Sphinx, Sun Titan, Maybe T.don, or Ashen Rider, I'd rather just not run Bribery in multiplayer.
Sure Prophet or Seedborn could be insance, but they could go right back to the blue player's hand too.
If you never played against someone and you find out there deck has almost no creatures in it and you're about to get blown out by some combo, then yeah, I guess it's really good? I'm more into sure things, not maybes.
This is EDH. There are no sure things.
There are sure ways decks can play out. Minus all the flip coin shenanigans, or anything thing that indroduces a randomizing event, or grabbing a creature without an ETB effect. Yes, when spells don't get countered, there are sure things outside of getting triggers stiffeled.
Grabbing an eldrazi or blightsteele is less of a sure thing than grabbing a jin or sphinx is less than a ETB effect. That's the facts jack. I run Chain of Vapor, Natures Claim, Chain of Vapor just to stop early animation effects. If anyone else is running that kind of efficient removal, there's no point in grabbing a fatty that doesn't do anything by end of turn. It's a waste of 3UU.
bribery basically reads: 3UU cast the best creature from your opponents deck at a discounted cost. i don't think i need to mention eldrazi or any of the other creatures that have already been discussed. but this is like complaining that your treachery is somehow a bad card because you didn't take exactly what you wanted with it.
bribery is good regardless of you not getting the "perfect" creature with it. you are going to oftentimes cheat a high costing creature into play for only 5 mana… that is the point of the card. it is not meant to be a tutor because you don't tutor your own deck. if you want the perfect targets every time, you should try convincing your friends to just play decks that you handmade for them. otherwise, you are just going to have to keep your chin up when you steal someone's blightsteel and kill them with it the following turn. not ideal, i know.
After thinking this over, If the creature isn't Jin, Sphinx, Sun Titan, Maybe T.don, or Ashen Rider, I'd rather just not run Bribery in multiplayer.
Sure Prophet or Seedborn could be insance, but they could go right back to the blue player's hand too.
Then... dont run it. You dont seem to want to be convinced otherwise.
If you never played against someone and you find out there deck has almost no creatures in it and you're about to get blown out by some combo, then yeah, I guess it's really good? I'm more into sure things, not maybes.
This is EDH. There are no sure things.
There are sure ways decks can play out. Minus all the flip coin shenanigans, or anything thing that indroduces a randomizing event, or grabbing a creature without an ETB effect. Yes, when spells don't get countered, there are sure things outside of getting triggers stiffeled.
Grabbing an eldrazi or blightsteele is less of a sure thing than grabbing a jin or sphinx is less than a ETB effect. That's the facts jack. I run Chain of Vapor, Natures Claim, Chain of Vapor just to stop early animation effects. If anyone else is running that kind of efficient removal, there's no point in grabbing a fatty that doesn't do anything by end of turn. It's a waste of 3UU.
So your reasoning boils down to... it gets bounced by removal? Okay.
You're not acknowledging that the card is both a tutor and a removal spell for an opposing creature. Yes, if they can bounce the creature back to their hand, it is not as good of a play as it could have been. Yes, if your meta is made up of lots of blue decks with multiple unsummon variants, you might consider not running it. Yes, you are free to not like playing it. Yes, the creature you grab most likely dies to all sorts of removal if the opponent has removal in hand. No, that does not make Bribery a weak card. It's pretty well accepted that it is good at what it does and does its job very well.
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This is why I started playing magic in the first place. It wasn't PT aspirations just making noobs cry by doing things that are perfectly fair.
So your reasoning boils down to... it gets bounced by removal? Okay.
this.
but seriously fedders, what will you play in bribery's spot now that you've convinced us all that it is a bad card? there aren't that many cards out there that don't become "bad" in the face of removal/disruption.
I played a match the other day where I got a guy's Memnarch from Bribery. It was early enough and I had enough mana to turn things into artifacts and steal them to the point that I was able to lock him out and secure a win. OP, I think you're perception of Bribery has some faulty reasoning.
You make it very clear that you'd only be interested in using Bribery on a very specific set of creatures, but that's only putting a cap on the card's potential. It's not necessarily about getting the best creatures in the format at all times. It's about using your opponents resources (their library) as your own and getting what you need at the time. As I've mentioned in a previous post, sometimes grabbing a creature that removes permanents is a stronger political play than grabbing [insert format fatty staple.] It's not Blightsteel, It's not Jin, but it sure did get rid of that threat that was causing people a lot of grief. Or maybe it drew you those extra cards when you really needed them. Or maybe even put some lands on the table after a MLD spell. The point I'm getting at is versatility. Bribery is a spell of possibility.
You claim that the card is unreliable by using a hypothetical example of casting Bribery on a creature-less deck. That's like saying Tooth in Nail is bad because someone could flash in Sadistic Sacrament and pluck the cards you were going to grab. Or that Dark Confidant is bad because it "dies to removal." Guess what? There are uncertainties in this format (and MTG in general, for that matter.) Cards don't always go off without a hitch and do exactly what you want them to. Sometimes they fall flat. That doesn't make them bad cards. It means you were unlucky.
I mean, hey, I don't care if you run Bribery or not. I have a friend who plays a pretty airtight combo deck who refuses to put it in the 99 because he doesn't like the effect. To each their own. I'm just saying I think your arguments for why Bribery is lame are kind of suspect. Bribery is awesome, btw.
It's pretty well accepted that it is good at what it does and does its job very well.
I'd also argue that it's one of the few cards that does what it does overall. If you're looking for this kind of effect, you won't find much better than Bribery.
It's not a bad card, but it was so much better when PT and SP where around.
Grabbing creatures that don't have ETB effects, or effects that go off by EOT,....that still seems like it has potential to be a pretty bad play imo. Creature removal is much more prevalent than Extract effect. Paying 3UU to do nothing is bad any way you slice it. That's what I'm saying. If you tutor up a creature that doesn't do anything, and it gets bounced or reanimated against you. lolz. Yes Bribery is a bad card. But that's because the user made it a bad card.
When I tutor up someone's ETB creature (possibly dies too), then yes, Bribery is a good card. And that's the context in which people should be acknowledging my logic. So no, I won't be grabbing your Eldrazi or Blightsteel Colossus unless opponents have next to zilch cards in hand or I have some kind of counter backup or weird lock state.
So I repeat, Bribery is not a bad card. It's just been severely taken down a peg since the banning of PT and SP. Yes, there are only a few good targets, and possibly you might come across a situation in which the creature nabbed fits the scenario. (Like an unanswered Memnarch). A tight list doesn't always need it.
Therefore you should never play Blightsteel Colossus because I could draw a card to take your Blightsteel.
/thread.
.../s.
Saying "there are only a few good targets" is silly. Every good creature is a good target. There are dozens of good targets. If there are no good targets in your opponent's decks, your opponents aren't playing enough good creatures or are combo/spellslinger heavy decks.
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This is why I started playing magic in the first place. It wasn't PT aspirations just making noobs cry by doing things that are perfectly fair.
It's not a bad card, but it was so much better when PT and SP where around.
So I repeat, Bribery is not a bad card. It's just been severely taken down a peg since the banning of PT and SP. Yes, there are only a few good targets, and possibly you might come across a situation in which the creature nabbed fits the scenario. (Like an unanswered Memnarch). A tight list doesn't always need it.
In reference to the bolded statement above: UMMMM NO!!!
This is entirely opinion, and in no way can be used to justify labeling Bribery as a bad card. I happen to think there are a myriad of GREAT targets for bribery. Many have already said, if you don't like it, don't play it. And yes, "A tight list doesn't always need it.", but that doesn't mean that many others find it extremely useful and flexible.
It can be anything you want it to be. And it only gets better when you have more opponents at the table. I for one really like to get Chancellor of the Spires to give me a 5 mana Tooth and Nail for my opponent's decks. And I can change to a different opponent if I don't like anything else they have. Pretty much any playable 6 drop or higher creature is good value when your only paying 5 mana to get it. And "dies to removal" has never been the sole measure of a good creature in any format, so that point is moot anyway.
I would really only play Bribery in a deck dedicated to stealing other people's crap.
However, with the mana accel in the format it is pretty common to be able to cast a turn 3 or 4 Bribery and stealing a Jin-Git that early can be back breaking. That early in the game it is really hard to lose if you can protect Jin back to your next turn. Especially if you run a fair amount if control, which most blue decks should.
There is a reason why Jin is one of the best targets to suspend with Jhoira behind an Obliterate...it is really hard to do anything with no hand and little land against a blue player with a full grip.
It's not a bad card, but it was so much better when PT and SP where around.
If those were the only cards you were getting, then yes, it's sad. What's even sadder is the implication that those were the only cards you would steal with bribery.
One percent of playing Bribery is resolving it, the other ninety-nine is knowing what to grab with it based on your current situation. I make mistakes like grabbing a Consecrated Sphinx instead of the Eternal Witness I needed to actually improve my position because I was too tempted by the potential gains of waiting on the Sphinx. It's not about grabbing the "best" card, it's about getting the right card.
I've rarely seen it as a dead draw in the hands of players better than me.
Of course, maybe your deck doesn't play with bribery well because of how it is built and the meta it is in. It's entirely plausible that Sun Titan really is the only card worth grabbing in your situation, but I'm not sure that means Bribery is a bad or pointless card in all situations.
There are metagames where Ulamog and Blightsteel start turning up in random decklists as a matter of "lol, if he sticks I win so whatever". Bribery is a way to discourage that.
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Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
Bribery is an absurd card and you are an absurd whiner for complaining that your 5 mana blue sorcery only has maybe a 30% chance of winning the game on the spot.
I've snatched a Teferi out of a mono-U player's deck before, that was nice.
Seedborn/Prophet/Vorinclex/Norn/DEN/Academy Rector, those are all obvious. Just about any deck is going to have a 6+ cmc ETB monster who you can steal for an excellent discount. You just have to know what you're likely to find in any given deck.
It's not a bad card, but it was so much better when PT and SP where around.
If those were the only cards you were getting, then yes, it's sad. What's even sadder is the implication that those were the only cards you would steal with bribery.
Correlating emotion with strategy doesn't make said strategy any better or worse. Also, you are the only person who owns that emotion, however some might share it and some might not. Still doesn't impact the efficiency of a strategy. Attempting to address an argument by making it look bad still isn't addressing it.
I had many of good times grabbing those creatures. Now I just want Jin or Sun Titan, but they don't impact the board state quite as well.
It's not a bad card, but it was so much better when PT and SP where around.
So I repeat, Bribery is not a bad card. It's just been severely taken down a peg since the banning of PT and SP. Yes, there are only a few good targets, and possibly you might come across a situation in which the creature nabbed fits the scenario. (Like an unanswered Memnarch). A tight list doesn't always need it.
In reference to the bolded statement above: UMMMM NO!!!
This is entirely opinion, and in no way can be used to justify labeling Bribery as a bad card. I happen to think there are a myriad of GREAT targets for bribery. Many have already said, if you don't like it, don't play it. And yes, "A tight list doesn't always need it.", but that doesn't mean that many others find it extremely useful and flexible.
It can be anything you want it to be. And it only gets better when you have more opponents at the table. I for one really like to get Chancellor of the Spires to give me a 5 mana Tooth and Nail for my opponent's decks. And I can change to a different opponent if I don't like anything else they have. Pretty much any playable 6 drop or higher creature is good value when your only paying 5 mana to get it. And "dies to removal" has never been the sole measure of a good creature in any format, so that point is moot anyway.
Right on, but the thing is, you actually have to read what Chancellor of the Spires says, because it doesn't grab anything from a deck. In which case, I'm convinced you're just arguing just to argue, and not really thinking about the points I'm making in this thread. Not even that, what's the likelyhood of a T&N actually being in a GY the first few turns of a game? And yet you "like" doing this? How is it you've grown to like performing an illegal action in the first place? If you can't understand simple mechanics, I don't except you to understand why there truly exist on a few good creatures to nab with this spell which will yield consistency and not a coin flip.
Do you not run mana accel? The turn 2 Bribery can happen pretty easily and happens often in our meta. Just last night, Sire of Insanity caused everyone to discard their hand after only 1 turn. I didn't get my second land drop until 3 top decks later. That's an example of a card you might not think to get with Bribery but there's always a player (in this case Kaalia) who will have a deck full of great targets. Even utility creatures like Oracle of Mul Daya or Eternal Witness as was mentioned.
It doesn't matter if turn 2 Ulamog doesn't immediately impact the board state, your opponents are scrambling for answers and have to waste cards to deal with it. Use Bribery for utility, not to win the game.
It doesn't matter if turn 2 Ulamog doesn't immediately impact the board state, your opponents are scrambling for answers and have to waste cards to deal with it. Use Bribery for utility, not to win the game.
This is basically what I was trying to say. Making your opponents panic, using up resources so early to deal with a threat is a tremendous boon to your position as a player. It doesn't actually matter if Ulamog sticks around for any length of time. The simple fact that you're disrupting the flow of everyone else turn is what matters. You can be setting up a better board position while everyone else has a laser point focus on the creature you just nabbed.
This reminds me of a match-up with that combo friend I mentioned previously. I would pack threats with the knowledge that they would be countered. Why would I cast things with the knowledge they would have no staying power? Because him dealing with something like Consecrated Sphinx or Gilded Drake now means he's less likely to counter my win conditions later. I was baiting a response. "Deal with this or it will ruin your day."
This is how I see Bribery. I don't see it as a win condition. I see it as a toolbox card, with the potential to bait responses. Sometimes I grab the utility creature for political reasons, other times I grab the fatty to thin the herd of answers late game. I don't believe the card's intended purpose is to win on the spot, though it certainly can do that in the right circumstances.
I can't believe you play in a meta where no one plays creatures or green decks. If five mana isn't good enough for at least someone's prophet of kruphix I think you may have bigger problems than bribary not being good. I think its worth running alongside tuck effects too, even if you don't want someones commander that bad, its probably a pretty good play to at least take it from them being as that most likely their deck needs it.
I can't believe you play in a meta where no one plays creatures or green decks. If five mana isn't good enough for at least someone's prophet of kruphix I think you may have bigger problems than bribary not being good. I think its worth running alongside tuck effects too, even if you don't want someones commander that bad, its probably a pretty good play to at least take it from them being as that most likely their deck needs it.
I would actually avoid the tuck interaction; it makes it a little too easy for them to get it back, I feel.
it would be easier, but I'm sort of assuming that a deck running tuck and bribery with obvious blue, might also run the counterspell to protect the acquired commander. I had my Jeleva zealous conscripted out from under me a few nights ago and couldn't stop the animar player from beating me because I had exiled a hatred under her...
I was just pointing out a single interaction not to be forgotten when the situation might call for it.
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bribery basically reads: 3UU cast the best creature from your opponents deck at a discounted cost. i don't think i need to mention eldrazi or any of the other creatures that have already been discussed. but this is like complaining that your treachery is somehow a bad card because you didn't take exactly what you wanted with it.
bribery is good regardless of you not getting the "perfect" creature with it. you are going to oftentimes cheat a high costing creature into play for only 5 mana… that is the point of the card. it is not meant to be a tutor because you don't tutor your own deck. if you want the perfect targets every time, you should try convincing your friends to just play decks that you handmade for them. otherwise, you are just going to have to keep your chin up when you steal someone's blightsteel and kill them with it the following turn. not ideal, i know.
There are sure ways decks can play out. Minus all the flip coin shenanigans, or anything thing that indroduces a randomizing event, or grabbing a creature without an ETB effect. Yes, when spells don't get countered, there are sure things outside of getting triggers stiffeled.
Grabbing an eldrazi or blightsteele is less of a sure thing than grabbing a jin or sphinx is less than a ETB effect. That's the facts jack. I run Chain of Vapor, Natures Claim, Chain of Vapor just to stop early animation effects. If anyone else is running that kind of efficient removal, there's no point in grabbing a fatty that doesn't do anything by end of turn. It's a waste of 3UU.
After thinking this over, If the creature isn't Jin, Sphinx, Sun Titan, Maybe T.don, or Ashen Rider, I'd rather just not run Bribery in multiplayer.
Sure Prophet or Seedborn could be insance, but they could go right back to the blue player's hand too.
Then... dont run it. You dont seem to want to be convinced otherwise.
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Concerning when returning to Kamigawa would be acceptable
So your reasoning boils down to... it gets bounced by removal? Okay.
You're not acknowledging that the card is both a tutor and a removal spell for an opposing creature. Yes, if they can bounce the creature back to their hand, it is not as good of a play as it could have been. Yes, if your meta is made up of lots of blue decks with multiple unsummon variants, you might consider not running it. Yes, you are free to not like playing it. Yes, the creature you grab most likely dies to all sorts of removal if the opponent has removal in hand. No, that does not make Bribery a weak card. It's pretty well accepted that it is good at what it does and does its job very well.
this.
but seriously fedders, what will you play in bribery's spot now that you've convinced us all that it is a bad card? there aren't that many cards out there that don't become "bad" in the face of removal/disruption.
You make it very clear that you'd only be interested in using Bribery on a very specific set of creatures, but that's only putting a cap on the card's potential. It's not necessarily about getting the best creatures in the format at all times. It's about using your opponents resources (their library) as your own and getting what you need at the time. As I've mentioned in a previous post, sometimes grabbing a creature that removes permanents is a stronger political play than grabbing [insert format fatty staple.] It's not Blightsteel, It's not Jin, but it sure did get rid of that threat that was causing people a lot of grief. Or maybe it drew you those extra cards when you really needed them. Or maybe even put some lands on the table after a MLD spell. The point I'm getting at is versatility. Bribery is a spell of possibility.
You claim that the card is unreliable by using a hypothetical example of casting Bribery on a creature-less deck. That's like saying Tooth in Nail is bad because someone could flash in Sadistic Sacrament and pluck the cards you were going to grab. Or that Dark Confidant is bad because it "dies to removal." Guess what? There are uncertainties in this format (and MTG in general, for that matter.) Cards don't always go off without a hitch and do exactly what you want them to. Sometimes they fall flat. That doesn't make them bad cards. It means you were unlucky.
I mean, hey, I don't care if you run Bribery or not. I have a friend who plays a pretty airtight combo deck who refuses to put it in the 99 because he doesn't like the effect. To each their own. I'm just saying I think your arguments for why Bribery is lame are kind of suspect. Bribery is awesome, btw.
I'd also argue that it's one of the few cards that does what it does overall. If you're looking for this kind of effect, you won't find much better than Bribery.
UAzami, Locus of All KnowledgeU
BMarrow-Gnawer, Crime Lord of ComboB
WBRTariel, Hellraiser StaxWBR
Annul is really good in EDH
You forgot Thada Adel, Acquisitor she likes rings and boots
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Grabbing creatures that don't have ETB effects, or effects that go off by EOT,....that still seems like it has potential to be a pretty bad play imo. Creature removal is much more prevalent than Extract effect. Paying 3UU to do nothing is bad any way you slice it. That's what I'm saying. If you tutor up a creature that doesn't do anything, and it gets bounced or reanimated against you. lolz. Yes Bribery is a bad card. But that's because the user made it a bad card.
When I tutor up someone's ETB creature (possibly dies too), then yes, Bribery is a good card. And that's the context in which people should be acknowledging my logic. So no, I won't be grabbing your Eldrazi or Blightsteel Colossus unless opponents have next to zilch cards in hand or I have some kind of counter backup or weird lock state.
So I repeat, Bribery is not a bad card. It's just been severely taken down a peg since the banning of PT and SP. Yes, there are only a few good targets, and possibly you might come across a situation in which the creature nabbed fits the scenario. (Like an unanswered Memnarch). A tight list doesn't always need it.
Therefore you should never play Blightsteel Colossus because I could draw a card to take your Blightsteel.
/thread.
.../s.
Saying "there are only a few good targets" is silly. Every good creature is a good target. There are dozens of good targets. If there are no good targets in your opponent's decks, your opponents aren't playing enough good creatures or are combo/spellslinger heavy decks.
In reference to the bolded statement above: UMMMM NO!!!
This is entirely opinion, and in no way can be used to justify labeling Bribery as a bad card. I happen to think there are a myriad of GREAT targets for bribery. Many have already said, if you don't like it, don't play it. And yes, "A tight list doesn't always need it.", but that doesn't mean that many others find it extremely useful and flexible.
It can be anything you want it to be. And it only gets better when you have more opponents at the table. I for one really like to get Chancellor of the Spires to give me a 5 mana Tooth and Nail for my opponent's decks. And I can change to a different opponent if I don't like anything else they have. Pretty much any playable 6 drop or higher creature is good value when your only paying 5 mana to get it. And "dies to removal" has never been the sole measure of a good creature in any format, so that point is moot anyway.
However, with the mana accel in the format it is pretty common to be able to cast a turn 3 or 4 Bribery and stealing a Jin-Git that early can be back breaking. That early in the game it is really hard to lose if you can protect Jin back to your next turn. Especially if you run a fair amount if control, which most blue decks should.
There is a reason why Jin is one of the best targets to suspend with Jhoira behind an Obliterate...it is really hard to do anything with no hand and little land against a blue player with a full grip.
EDH Decks:
WUBOloro, Combo ControlWUB
UBOona Reanimator ComboUB
BRGProssh, Eater of the Blue MageBRG
UBRGrixis StormUBR
Rebuilding Jenara (stealyourstuff.dec)
Pauper Deck:
UBInspired SirenUB
If those were the only cards you were getting, then yes, it's sad. What's even sadder is the implication that those were the only cards you would steal with bribery.
I've rarely seen it as a dead draw in the hands of players better than me.
Of course, maybe your deck doesn't play with bribery well because of how it is built and the meta it is in. It's entirely plausible that Sun Titan really is the only card worth grabbing in your situation, but I'm not sure that means Bribery is a bad or pointless card in all situations.
Seedborn/Prophet/Vorinclex/Norn/DEN/Academy Rector, those are all obvious. Just about any deck is going to have a 6+ cmc ETB monster who you can steal for an excellent discount. You just have to know what you're likely to find in any given deck.
Oh Rider, my heart will go on...
Correlating emotion with strategy doesn't make said strategy any better or worse. Also, you are the only person who owns that emotion, however some might share it and some might not. Still doesn't impact the efficiency of a strategy. Attempting to address an argument by making it look bad still isn't addressing it.
I had many of good times grabbing those creatures. Now I just want Jin or Sun Titan, but they don't impact the board state quite as well.
Right on, but the thing is, you actually have to read what Chancellor of the Spires says, because it doesn't grab anything from a deck. In which case, I'm convinced you're just arguing just to argue, and not really thinking about the points I'm making in this thread. Not even that, what's the likelyhood of a T&N actually being in a GY the first few turns of a game? And yet you "like" doing this? How is it you've grown to like performing an illegal action in the first place? If you can't understand simple mechanics, I don't except you to understand why there truly exist on a few good creatures to nab with this spell which will yield consistency and not a coin flip.
http://mtgcommander.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?p=184598#p184598
It doesn't matter if turn 2 Ulamog doesn't immediately impact the board state, your opponents are scrambling for answers and have to waste cards to deal with it. Use Bribery for utility, not to win the game.
cEDH: [G(U/R) Animar] - [(U/B)(G/W) Redless Wheels] - [(G/U)(W/B) Redless Pod] - [(B/G)W Ghave Metapod]
This is basically what I was trying to say. Making your opponents panic, using up resources so early to deal with a threat is a tremendous boon to your position as a player. It doesn't actually matter if Ulamog sticks around for any length of time. The simple fact that you're disrupting the flow of everyone else turn is what matters. You can be setting up a better board position while everyone else has a laser point focus on the creature you just nabbed.
This reminds me of a match-up with that combo friend I mentioned previously. I would pack threats with the knowledge that they would be countered. Why would I cast things with the knowledge they would have no staying power? Because him dealing with something like Consecrated Sphinx or Gilded Drake now means he's less likely to counter my win conditions later. I was baiting a response. "Deal with this or it will ruin your day."
This is how I see Bribery. I don't see it as a win condition. I see it as a toolbox card, with the potential to bait responses. Sometimes I grab the utility creature for political reasons, other times I grab the fatty to thin the herd of answers late game. I don't believe the card's intended purpose is to win on the spot, though it certainly can do that in the right circumstances.
UAzami, Locus of All KnowledgeU
BMarrow-Gnawer, Crime Lord of ComboB
WBRTariel, Hellraiser StaxWBR
Annul is really good in EDH
I would actually avoid the tuck interaction; it makes it a little too easy for them to get it back, I feel.
I was just pointing out a single interaction not to be forgotten when the situation might call for it.