I haven't successfully sleeved an EDH deck in almost a year, although I think about deck ideas constantly. I have a bunch of decks that I'd like to make, but the brewing process usually goes like this:
1. Come up with deck concept/theme
2. Make a list of any card I could ever possibly want in the deck (usually winds up being between 125-175 cards)
3. Try to make a deck on paper using the card list I created.
4. Get overwhelmed, distracted, discouraged and abandon the concept.
5. Go back to step 1.
Does anyone have a suggestion about how to overcome this?
I typically get the idea for a deck 2-12 months before I actually build it.
I will let it kick around in the noggin for a LONG time - and the ideas that survive the wait get the first step of being built.
Then, I'll pick up the supporting cards I don't already own in trades for a few weeks and see what happens.
If I'm still feeling it, I'll eventually petition all the players in my local playgroup's Facebook group to help me source the randoms from their collections - and I'll trade for the stacks that come in as I get them. Usually, once it's 60%+ built I'll proxy the cards I still need and roll with it to start testing.
Then - once built, the deck will need to survive 6-10 games before I get a solid idea on if it's viable or how to tweak it.
I find my biggest problem is that I don't have a live person to talk to, toss ideas around, help test, etc. When I do have someone to actually interact with the process goes much faster for me.
I think the problem is step 2. that's far more cards than I select in my "initial list" of all the cards I would want in the deck. This is my basic process and it works for me:
Step one: select general
step two: select win conditions. I'll choose how I want to win the game. I usually have two main "categories" of wins that i will seek. For example, my Prossh, Skyraider of Kher deck seeks to win in two main ways: combo and general damage. Once I eliminate other possible main gameplans that my general enables (like token swarm in prossh's case), that limits the scope of cards that I will consider. That is not to say that a token swarm win wouldn't be possible in the deck, just that I will devote most (if not all) slots to my two main win conditions and make a point to include cards that expand the deck's versatility (for instance in prossh, beastmaster ascension is a combo finisher as well as a card that enables an honest-to-goodness token beating, so I will include it).
i think that focusing on win conditions first, rather than just compiling a list of cards that work well with your general, is the best way to avoid having an unmanageable list of cards to start off with.
I find that focusing on two main paths to victory will generally limit my first list of cards to 75 or so.
Step three: first cuts
I'll then look at the whole list and try to identify the "odd men out" - cards that might be great by themselves but don't synergize with a lot of other cards on the list. These will be the first to go, and generally I can get rid of 10-15 cards from the list based on this criteria. this is also where I make cuts based on efficiency and "strictly-betterness," for example if my deck wants an edric/coastal piracy effect, I'll choose the most efficient card that does the job (like Bident of Thassa in this example) and eliminate the others. Later, if I decide I need redundancy, I'll consider putting more cards in.
Step four: fine tuning
I'll then make a list of the spells I am left with, hopefully no more than 75 spells after steps 1-3 (usually less). If I have 80 spells I am still considering, I'll make a deck with 65 of those spells and rotate in the extra ones and see what works best in the deck. this is where meta choices and flavor choices also come in.
I haven't successfully sleeved an EDH deck in almost a year, although I think about deck ideas constantly. I have a bunch of decks that I'd like to make, but the brewing process usually goes like this:
1. Come up with deck concept/theme
2. Make a list of any card I could ever possibly want in the deck (usually winds up being between 125-175 cards)
3. Try to make a deck on paper using the card list I created.
4. Get overwhelmed, distracted, discouraged and abandon the concept.
5. Go back to step 1.
Does anyone have a suggestion about how to overcome this?
I'm in the same boat as you when it comes to builders block. I'm constantly getting an idea for a deck, but I have a hard time actually building it. It's bad for me because I can't theorize a deck without seeing the cards in front of me.
Without knowing the size of your collection, my suggestion is to try to build the deck during step 3, even if you have to substitute worse cards or proxies. Once it's built and you can test it, you'll either want to tune it or abandon it.
I'm out of ideas myself. I keep remaking old decks, albeit better than before. My new plan is not to necessarily create new decks but rather different specs for my existing decks. They have to be 15 cards and I have to exchange the entire spec when switching, not just a few like you would a sideboard. I'm going to try a Stax or Prison spec soon.
I have a great amount of cards I love and always want to try out someday/build a deck around someday and when I see it in a trade binder I go for it. Like that it's a "step too far" and I can't go back. Eventually I'll build it, and break it down again until I make a deck I want to keep "forever"
Which is only two decks atm so, keep building, keep breaking and rebuilding.
1. Pick the kind of deck
2. Find general representing the theme
3. List all cards fitting theme and colors
4. Over build deck
5. Test test test and rebuild eliminating or adding depending on meta
About 3 months ago, I just had no inspiration at all; I couldn't find a General I wanted to build around, or any cards I wanted to play period, so I just put the cards aside and didn't touch them for weeks. About 2-3 weeks ago, I got the itch to build, and just kind of looked through every legendary creature, and thought Prossh looked interesting. From there, it was just a matter of hashing out a list and making cuts, and I am now pretty jazzed about playing the list.
I think people need to play the actual decks more to get a better feel for what works otherwise there's the danger of never exiting the "tinker phase".
it's also a good way to mine for "hidden gems", get 90 cards together and throw in ten or so maybe cards or unknown power level cards. But you've got to play to get those juices flowing.
You are thinking too much. You need to go with your gut when you are making your initial deck. It should only take 10-15 minutes. Making a list of 125-175 cards is silly. The 99 should generally assemble itself really quickly if you are doing it right.
Heres my process for deck building.
1. Get an idea for a deck.
2. Grab Binder. Get 99 good cards. Double check to make sure everything I want is in there. (Sometimes you forget you wanted to put Skullclamp in or something).
4. Play games.
5. Modify according to meta. Print out proxies. Done until meta changes or new cards are released.
All other decision making processes should be automatic, like reflexes. Your problem is you are in your head too much. Its easy with EDH because you just sort of know "This is a good card/EDH staple. I'll put this in my deck. Hey look good cards win me games!"
Go to the place your head goes when building a deck when it puts down the obligatory, "Sensei's Divining Top, Sol Ring" and that's where you should be the entire time when the initial build is happening.
If something is out of your realm of knowledge for cards, as in you are missing slots in your deck, and you know what you want there, but can't figure out if the card exists, or what it's name is, then use gatherer.
I have kind of the reverse problem. I have too many decks I want to build. There are four different Derevi decks I want to make. In addition, I'd like to build:
Prossh
Jeleva
Nekusar
Oloro
Lazav
Melek
Purphoros
And that's just generals from last year.
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Legacy: Something U/W Controlish EDH Cube
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I have an issue where i cant stop.brewing, regardless of game. Even warmachine. I wanna try X deck, or Y faction now. And then get all these cards/models and have loads of fun yeah!
Then i find that playstyle isnt for me and i get burned out on magic/wm. Its happened in both games for me in the past 3 years. I almost did it again with magic... i have to be careful, and know what i like. Ill brew an edh netdeck and never playtest it before building to see if its my "style", get all the cards, then lose over and over and not really like how it plays out. Netdecks do take time to learn, but I know I need to stick with a few decks i know well, rather than building a new one every two weeks.
We've got probably about 25 regulars in my meta and little overlap with generals. A big factor in my process is considering commanders who are underplayed or unclaimed.
My process:
Pick a General
Try to figure out what cards I want in the deck
Get bored and go through my collection and put stuff that I have that could work into a pile
Sleeve it up and play it
If the idea works, go back and figure out how to refine it into what I actually want or just start over again
first you need to be of drinking age and then drink some beer. beer is known to help you be more creative. Drink coffee once you have an idea to help flesh it out.
1. Come up with deck concept/theme
2. Make a list of any card I could ever possibly want in the deck (usually winds up being between 125-175 cards)
3. Try to make a deck on paper using the card list I created.
4. Get overwhelmed, distracted, discouraged and abandon the concept.
5. Go back to step 1.
Does anyone have a suggestion about how to overcome this?
I will let it kick around in the noggin for a LONG time - and the ideas that survive the wait get the first step of being built.
Then, I'll pick up the supporting cards I don't already own in trades for a few weeks and see what happens.
If I'm still feeling it, I'll eventually petition all the players in my local playgroup's Facebook group to help me source the randoms from their collections - and I'll trade for the stacks that come in as I get them. Usually, once it's 60%+ built I'll proxy the cards I still need and roll with it to start testing.
Then - once built, the deck will need to survive 6-10 games before I get a solid idea on if it's viable or how to tweak it.
I find my biggest problem is that I don't have a live person to talk to, toss ideas around, help test, etc. When I do have someone to actually interact with the process goes much faster for me.
Step one: select general
step two: select win conditions. I'll choose how I want to win the game. I usually have two main "categories" of wins that i will seek. For example, my Prossh, Skyraider of Kher deck seeks to win in two main ways: combo and general damage. Once I eliminate other possible main gameplans that my general enables (like token swarm in prossh's case), that limits the scope of cards that I will consider. That is not to say that a token swarm win wouldn't be possible in the deck, just that I will devote most (if not all) slots to my two main win conditions and make a point to include cards that expand the deck's versatility (for instance in prossh, beastmaster ascension is a combo finisher as well as a card that enables an honest-to-goodness token beating, so I will include it).
i think that focusing on win conditions first, rather than just compiling a list of cards that work well with your general, is the best way to avoid having an unmanageable list of cards to start off with.
I find that focusing on two main paths to victory will generally limit my first list of cards to 75 or so.
Step three: first cuts
I'll then look at the whole list and try to identify the "odd men out" - cards that might be great by themselves but don't synergize with a lot of other cards on the list. These will be the first to go, and generally I can get rid of 10-15 cards from the list based on this criteria. this is also where I make cuts based on efficiency and "strictly-betterness," for example if my deck wants an edric/coastal piracy effect, I'll choose the most efficient card that does the job (like Bident of Thassa in this example) and eliminate the others. Later, if I decide I need redundancy, I'll consider putting more cards in.
Step four: fine tuning
I'll then make a list of the spells I am left with, hopefully no more than 75 spells after steps 1-3 (usually less). If I have 80 spells I am still considering, I'll make a deck with 65 of those spells and rotate in the extra ones and see what works best in the deck. this is where meta choices and flavor choices also come in.
UBRThe MindrazerRBU
UUUSpymaster of TrestGGG
GGGThe South TreeGGG
RRRHuman AscendantRRR
I'm in the same boat as you when it comes to builders block. I'm constantly getting an idea for a deck, but I have a hard time actually building it. It's bad for me because I can't theorize a deck without seeing the cards in front of me.
Without knowing the size of your collection, my suggestion is to try to build the deck during step 3, even if you have to substitute worse cards or proxies. Once it's built and you can test it, you'll either want to tune it or abandon it.
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Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
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I have a great amount of cards I love and always want to try out someday/build a deck around someday and when I see it in a trade binder I go for it. Like that it's a "step too far" and I can't go back. Eventually I'll build it, and break it down again until I make a deck I want to keep "forever"
Which is only two decks atm so, keep building, keep breaking and rebuilding.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
1. Pick the kind of deck
2. Find general representing the theme
3. List all cards fitting theme and colors
4. Over build deck
5. Test test test and rebuild eliminating or adding depending on meta
Sometimes you just need a break.
This.
& This.
I think people need to play the actual decks more to get a better feel for what works otherwise there's the danger of never exiting the "tinker phase".
it's also a good way to mine for "hidden gems", get 90 cards together and throw in ten or so maybe cards or unknown power level cards. But you've got to play to get those juices flowing.
Heres my process for deck building.
1. Get an idea for a deck.
2. Grab Binder. Get 99 good cards. Double check to make sure everything I want is in there. (Sometimes you forget you wanted to put Skullclamp in or something).
4. Play games.
5. Modify according to meta. Print out proxies. Done until meta changes or new cards are released.
All other decision making processes should be automatic, like reflexes. Your problem is you are in your head too much. Its easy with EDH because you just sort of know "This is a good card/EDH staple. I'll put this in my deck. Hey look good cards win me games!"
Go to the place your head goes when building a deck when it puts down the obligatory, "Sensei's Divining Top, Sol Ring" and that's where you should be the entire time when the initial build is happening.
If something is out of your realm of knowledge for cards, as in you are missing slots in your deck, and you know what you want there, but can't figure out if the card exists, or what it's name is, then use gatherer.
Current
RGWMarath, Will of the WildRGW
GWUPheldagriff Group HugGWU
RGRRuric Thar, the UnbowedGRG
UXBOona ControlUXB
Retired
RGWMayael, the AnimaRGW
XGXGlissa Sunseeker ComboXGX
Prossh
Jeleva
Nekusar
Oloro
Lazav
Melek
Purphoros
And that's just generals from last year.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Then i find that playstyle isnt for me and i get burned out on magic/wm. Its happened in both games for me in the past 3 years. I almost did it again with magic... i have to be careful, and know what i like. Ill brew an edh netdeck and never playtest it before building to see if its my "style", get all the cards, then lose over and over and not really like how it plays out. Netdecks do take time to learn, but I know I need to stick with a few decks i know well, rather than building a new one every two weeks.
GB [Primer][Competitive][Stax][Combo] Meren of Clan Nel Toth 95% RETIRED
UW [Primer][Competitive][Combo][Stax] Brago, King Eternal RETIRED
BR Rakdos, Lord of Riots (75%)
G Titania - 75%
W SRAM - Welcome to the cheeri0s jam 95%
U Teferi - stax 100%
R Neheb - janky mono red eggs combo 90%
B Gonti - 50% valuetown
Normally it is right at the end when everything is revealed there is one.. unexpected forgotten rare that is just great.
e.g Immortal servitude.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
Pick a General
Try to figure out what cards I want in the deck
Get bored and go through my collection and put stuff that I have that could work into a pile
Sleeve it up and play it
If the idea works, go back and figure out how to refine it into what I actually want or just start over again
WWUGeist of Saint TraftUWW
UUBBLazav, Dimir MastermindBBUU
BRMalfegorRB
RGThromok the InsatiableGR
GGWWTrostani, Selesnya's VoiceWWGG
WBTeysa, Orzhov ScionBW
BGGGlissa, the TraitorGGB
GGUUPrime Speaker ZeganaUUGG
URJhoira of the GhituRU
RRWWAurelia, the WarleaderWWRR
UBRJeleva, Nephalias ScourgeRBU
http://lifehacker.com/why-you-should-drink-beer-for-big-ideas-coffee-to-get-513262326
My Saffi deck