So I am using it as a win con in a UG deck and it's the only non-permanent in the deck. The problem is that I also have Kederekt Leviathan because it's my only way to wipe the board really. I'm looking for a way to prevent Kederekt from putting everything back in my hand if it turns up with Primal Surge before a win con does like Concordant Crossroads, Beastmaster Ascension, etc. Has to be a permanent and has be UG or artifact.
So I am using it as a win con in a UG deck and it's the only non-permanent in the deck. The problem is that I also have Kederekt Leviathan because it's my only way to wipe the board really. I'm looking for a way to prevent Kederekt from putting everything back in my hand if it turns up with Primal Surge before a win con does like Concordant Crossroads, Beastmaster Ascension, etc. Has to be a permanent and has be UG or artifact.
I would advize not playing it.
If you really want too, make sure it's in your hand.. Survival of the Fittest/etc..
One way to get around troublesome things like this, is to be able to deal with problematic abilities/effects by properly stacking all of your ETB abilities.
For example, if you're using Caged Sun/any other of the artifact mana doublers, you can use Palinchron to generate infinite mana with everything still on the stack. That'll let you replay everything in your deck and win after the Leviathan's ability resolves. You can also use Deadeye Navigator to get around the need for a mana doubler, but again, it makes keeping track of the stacked triggers super important. It also makes you more vulnerable to removal.
Don't forget to have something you can do to keep yourself from dying to targeted/everyone draw abilities.
Interesting with the infinite mana idea. I don't run any of those cards in the deck. I checked and it looks like there is no creatures that can cancel the triggered ability. Looks like I have three ways of dealing with this. Make sure it's in the graveyard or in my hand before I cast Primal Surge, or if it comes up keep flipping cards until I hit reliquary tower. The last thing I could do is not play Kederekt Leviathan, but then I would need a replacement that would work in these colors and not mess up Primal Surge. I don't know of one.
I do the same thing in my momir vig deck...The answer is to have a different win condition...Mine is Labratory maniac. Then play a couple of ways to draw cards with the leviathan trigger on the stack (I play mulldrifter, elvish visionary, simic keystone, among others. (I also play Genesis wave which I can tutor for/out of the way if I need to)...Also playing fairly on only getting to put 20 permanents in play is normally enough with the surge if I do hit the wave.
So I am using it as a win con in a UG deck and it's the only non-permanent in the deck. The problem is that I also have Kederekt Leviathan because it's my only way to wipe the board really. I'm looking for a way to prevent Kederekt from putting everything back in my hand if it turns up with Primal Surge before a win con does like Concordant Crossroads, Beastmaster Ascension, etc. Has to be a permanent and has be UG or artifact.
Interesting with the infinite mana idea. I don't run any of those cards in the deck. I checked and it looks like there is no creatures that can cancel the triggered ability. Looks like I have three ways of dealing with this. Make sure it's in the graveyard or in my hand before I cast Primal Surge, or if it comes up keep flipping cards until I hit reliquary tower. The last thing I could do is not play Kederekt Leviathan, but then I would need a replacement that would work in these colors and not mess up Primal Surge. I don't know of one.
The infinite mana thing with Palinchron runs into the same problem in that it requires both that card and the card it's combo'ing with to be on the same side of your deck from Leviathan. Also, Lab Maniac will be in your hand half the time after the Surge as well, although it's a bit easier on mana to just replay it, replay Top, and win. What you probably want are just replacements for Leviathan.
Ixidron is a great creature wipe out of a permanent card. It can give a lot of Commander-based and recursion-based decks problems because there's no mechanism to turn a face-down card face up unless it has Morph. So creatures just sit there as if under a Prison Term effect. Worth running in a lot of Blue Control, actually. The only question is whether it interferes with any of your creatures. Running a Lab Maniac win-con will miss half the time, but running the Concordant Crossroads-Beastmaster Ascension win-con will be just fine.
The infinite mana thing with Palinchron runs into the same problem in that it requires both that card and the card it's combo'ing with to be on the same side of your deck from Leviathan. Also, Lab Maniac will be in your hand half the time after the Surge as well, although it's a bit easier on mana to just replay it, replay Top, and win. What you probably want are just replacements for Leviathan.
Primal Surge finishes resolving before any abilities are put on the stack (it's not like storm). After it's done resolving, you get to stack all your abilities however you want, no matter which entered the battlefield before the other (as none of them ever had a chance to stack their abilities).
<snip> Ixidron is a great creature wipe out of a permanent card. It can give a lot of Commander-based and recursion-based decks problems because there's no mechanism to turn a face-down card face up unless it has Morph. <snip>
Technically any blink effect will turn a face down card face up. So things such as Ghostway will allow a player to reset all of their creatures.
Primal Surge finishes resolving before any abilities are put on the stack (it's not like storm). After it's done resolving, you get to stack all your abilities however you want, no matter which entered the battlefield before the other (as none of them ever had a chance to stack their abilities).
Oh, ok. So any instant speed ability like Palinchron-DEN or a Top activation is still live. Good to know.
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So I am using it as a win con in a UG deck and it's the only non-permanent in the deck. The problem is that I also have Kederekt Leviathan because it's my only way to wipe the board really. I'm looking for a way to prevent Kederekt from putting everything back in my hand if it turns up with Primal Surge before a win con does like Concordant Crossroads, Beastmaster Ascension, etc. Has to be a permanent and has be UG or artifact.
GAzusa, Lost but SeekingG
WBVish Kal, Blood ArbiterWB
WBRKaalia of the VastWBR
UBGVorosh, the HunterUBG
WRGisela, Blade of GoldnightWR
WUGJenara, Asura of WarWUG
WBGTeneb, The HarvesterWBG
WUBRGHorde of NotionsWUBRG
I would advize not playing it.
If you really want too, make sure it's in your hand..
Survival of the Fittest/etc..
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
GAzusa, Lost but SeekingG
WBVish Kal, Blood ArbiterWB
WBRKaalia of the VastWBR
UBGVorosh, the HunterUBG
WRGisela, Blade of GoldnightWR
WUGJenara, Asura of WarWUG
WBGTeneb, The HarvesterWBG
WUBRGHorde of NotionsWUBRG
For example, if you're using Caged Sun/any other of the artifact mana doublers, you can use Palinchron to generate infinite mana with everything still on the stack. That'll let you replay everything in your deck and win after the Leviathan's ability resolves. You can also use Deadeye Navigator to get around the need for a mana doubler, but again, it makes keeping track of the stacked triggers super important. It also makes you more vulnerable to removal.
Don't forget to have something you can do to keep yourself from dying to targeted/everyone draw abilities.
Casual EDH Player
GAzusa, Lost but SeekingG
WBVish Kal, Blood ArbiterWB
WBRKaalia of the VastWBR
UBGVorosh, the HunterUBG
WRGisela, Blade of GoldnightWR
WUGJenara, Asura of WarWUG
WBGTeneb, The HarvesterWBG
WUBRGHorde of NotionsWUBRG
PS: also Laboratory manic wins are fun in EDH.
I mean, Kederekt Leviathan shouldn't stop a primal surge deck.
Just run Mulldrifter, Laboratory Maniac, and City of Solitude. Stack the Mulldrifter trigger on top of the Leviathan trigger and win.
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW
GAzusa, Lost but SeekingG
WBVish Kal, Blood ArbiterWB
WBRKaalia of the VastWBR
UBGVorosh, the HunterUBG
WRGisela, Blade of GoldnightWR
WUGJenara, Asura of WarWUG
WBGTeneb, The HarvesterWBG
WUBRGHorde of NotionsWUBRG
The infinite mana thing with Palinchron runs into the same problem in that it requires both that card and the card it's combo'ing with to be on the same side of your deck from Leviathan. Also, Lab Maniac will be in your hand half the time after the Surge as well, although it's a bit easier on mana to just replay it, replay Top, and win. What you probably want are just replacements for Leviathan.
Ixidron is a great creature wipe out of a permanent card. It can give a lot of Commander-based and recursion-based decks problems because there's no mechanism to turn a face-down card face up unless it has Morph. So creatures just sit there as if under a Prison Term effect. Worth running in a lot of Blue Control, actually. The only question is whether it interferes with any of your creatures. Running a Lab Maniac win-con will miss half the time, but running the Concordant Crossroads-Beastmaster Ascension win-con will be just fine.
Also, there are Nevinyyral's Disk and Oblivion Stone that won't interfere with Primal Surge. They happen to be good cards on their own as well because Academy Ruins will recur them. There are also permanent-based tutors for them in Tezzeret, the Seeker and Drift of Phantasms.
Primal Surge finishes resolving before any abilities are put on the stack (it's not like storm). After it's done resolving, you get to stack all your abilities however you want, no matter which entered the battlefield before the other (as none of them ever had a chance to stack their abilities).
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW
Technically any blink effect will turn a face down card face up. So things such as Ghostway will allow a player to reset all of their creatures.
EDH
WBG Karador's Sepulcher GBW
Oh, ok. So any instant speed ability like Palinchron-DEN or a Top activation is still live. Good to know.