I need some help figuring out how to deal with Iso-Silence. I play alot of multiplayer commander, and one of the guys in our Playgroup drops this combo every game and silences everyone for the majority of the game.
I thought of Witchbane orb, but I don't think that would work.
For reference, I am running a U/R instant/sorcery based deck. He is running Khalia of the Vast. Thanks in advance, and sorry for the poor format of the thread. Posting from a phone sucks.
I need some help figuring out how to deal with Iso-Silence. I play alot of multiplayer commander, and one of the guys in our Playgroup drops this combo every game and silences everyone for the majority of the game.
Ok, how?
Multiplayer. Isochron Scepter needs to tap. He can silence one player per go around, on their turn. If that player has instants, he can play them in other turns. Also, that player can still attack him. So can the other players. Why are you guys not just wiping the table with him?
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"[Screw] you and the green you ramped in on." - My EDH battle cry. If I had one. Which I don't.
I guess I should restate that. He picks people off one at a time, and the other guys don't realize that he is a threat and are content with blasting the poor sod who is silenced. He typically silences me first thanks to a few of the combos and spells in my deck and because he hadn't won a single game till he put that in there.
I guess I should restate that. He picks people off one at a time, and the other guys don't realize that he is a threat and are content with blasting the poor sod who is silenced. He typically silences me first thanks to a few of the combos and spells in my deck and because he hadn't won a single game till he put that in there.
Looks like you found the problem.
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"[Screw] you and the green you ramped in on." - My EDH battle cry. If I had one. Which I don't.
I guess I should restate that. He picks people off one at a time, and the other guys don't realize that he is a threat and are content with blasting the poor sod who is silenced. He typically silences me first thanks to a few of the combos and spells in my deck and because he hadn't won a single game till he put that in there.
just like stated above, poor threat assessment. Nothing wrong with being verbal ("Ok guys, we can't let that resolve or stay there")
If you're in U/R then you have access to instant artifact removal and bounce spells. Silence shouldn't be game ending for you.
Bingo. Bounce or destroy the Iso once and the combo is broken, you should have no trouble with this unless you are just playing a tremendously removal-light deck.
Bingo. Bounce or destroy the Iso once and the combo is broken, you should have no trouble with this unless you are just playing a tremendously removal-light deck.
Sadly, my deck is tremendously removal light. And it worked all the time until this guy joined up. I think I'm going to sprinkle in some artifact removal and a few more bounce spells. That does hurt my wincon a bit but I'll just have to be careful with the cards I pull out.
just like stated above, poor threat assessment. Nothing wrong with being verbal ("Ok guys, we can't let that resolve or stay there")
Oh trust me, I've tried that. They still refuse to believe he is a threat. Even after he won 4 games. "He's not a big threat, he just keeps getting lucky."
I'm not saying this to be mean, but honestly, I figured this much out from your OP. I mean, you are in two of the best colors to deal with artifacts and you didn't have an answer, so it goes without saying.
Oh trust me, I've tried that. They still refuse to believe he is a threat. Even after he won 4 games. "He's not a big threat, he just keeps getting lucky."
Maybe I just need a new playgroup...
Be patient, it'll change. Four games may seem like luck. Especially if you've been the top dog for a while, they're just happy to see someone who can bring you down and they'll justify any excuse that means they're not actually bad players.
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"[Screw] you and the green you ramped in on." - My EDH battle cry. If I had one. Which I don't.
Take it from a fellow U/R player. Run some (more) instant speed answers. You are learning a hard lesson that every player learns in this game as they gain experience: Removal. Is. Good. 1 for 1 or not, it will let you survive long enough to get your plan in motion.
If you are getting owned by the same combo every game, it's up to you to adapt. Or you could just keep getting owned, I guess? Either way, definitely don't blame your playgroup for their poor threat assessment and not bailing you out. You shouldn't rely on anyone's charity or game state assessment if you can help it. YOUR deck and YOUR play are all you can control, so make the most of it.
I'm not saying this to be mean, but honestly, I figured this much out from your OP. I mean, you are in two of the best colors to deal with artifacts and you didn't have an answer, so it goes without saying.
Ha. Yeah. When I initially came up with the deck, the basic theme was "Beat everyone around the table senseless before they can do anything about it." Which actually ended with some hilarious games of basically 3 on 1. I'm gonna balance it out though. Its pretty much a one-trick pony at this point.
Quote from You"re looking at this the entirely wrong way. It doesn"t hurt your wincon to be able to survive to use it.[/QUOTE »
Yeah. It does mean I have less to slap people with. But I'll just make the stuff I have count.
[QUOTE=Be patient, it'll change. Four games may seem like luck. Especially if you've been the top dog for a while, they're just happy to see someone who can bring you down and they'll justify any excuse that means they're not actually bad players.
I wouldn't say I was top dog, I just saw some fun stuff that I could do with instants and sorceries. We all won and lost our fair shares before this guy showed up.
Sadly, my deck is tremendously removal light. And it worked all the time until this guy joined up. I think I'm going to sprinkle in some artifact removal and a few more bounce spells. That does hurt my wincon a bit but I'll just have to be careful with the cards I pull out.
Try stuff like Chaos Warp, Capsize, and Cyclonic Rift. They will provide you with some strong catch-all answers that all have some serious upside in particular situations (Chaos Warp vs generals, Capsize when you have tons of mana or benefit from casting instants, Cyclonic Rift as a kinda-board wipe), and they all stop his combo easily.
The main thing here is that almost every deck needs a suite of instant speed answers. They win games. Sometimes you're about to play Mind Over Matter with a Temple Bell out (Instant Speed Mill for every enemy, they don't even get to wait until their turn.) and someone plays Counterspell, I'd bet you'll be much happier that you decided to pack that Pact of Negation.
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUBCheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
Control: GWBGhave, Guru of Adaptability, UBWrexial, Milling Deep UAzami, Lady of No Infinite Combos GWU Derevi, Tempo Beats
Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
im just curious OP, are you running any kind of disruption in your deck? UR should have tons of ways to stop this combo. countermagic, artifact destruction, bounce, heck even stifle and trickbind shut down the imprint trigger so they have a scepter that taps and does nothing. its not like kaalia can play many counterspells either.
is the problem one of finding deck slots for these types of cards? i am just having a hard time imagining your deck other than its UR colors. im guessing you are more combo oriented and less control oriented right now?
as others have said, you gotta adapt. if you are playing with the same people all the time, then there is no reason you shouldn't tweak your deck to wreck theirs. i play with a group all the time where a guy has a nasty jarad deck. but i started playing grave hate, and now he gets blown out instead of flinging a lord of extinction at everyone's face for the win.
im just curious OP, are you running any kind of disruption in your deck? UR should have tons of ways to stop this combo. countermagic, artifact destruction, bounce, heck even stifle and trickbind shut down the imprint trigger so they have a scepter that taps and does nothing. its not like kaalia can play many counterspells either.
is the problem one of finding deck slots for these types of cards? i am just having a hard time imagining your deck other than its UR colors. im guessing you are more combo oriented and less control oriented right now?
as others have said, you gotta adapt. if you are playing with the same people all the time, then there is no reason you shouldn't tweak your deck to wreck theirs. i play with a group all the time where a guy has a nasty jarad deck. but i started playing grave hate, and now he gets blown out instead of flinging a lord of extinction at everyone's face for the win.
Yeah, the problem is finding slots for the cards, which is what I am doing right now. I do have some counter/control type stuff in there, but not enough I guess. It doesn't help that my budget at this point is practically zero. Oh the joys of being a broke college student...
As a fellow player and a lover of glass cannons, I feel your pain. Cantripping removal and counters, like Dismiss, Smash, Scatter Arc, and Into the Roil won't slow down your spell chains.
Don't get too discouraged. This is a lesson every glass cannon or one-trick-pony player has to learn, and it's an opportunity for you to be at the forefront of research into how we can make glass cannon strategies more resilient in EDH.
Or, you can do what I did and build a few big dumb aggro decks to give your brain a rest every once in a while.
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2UURRniv mizzet, the firemind endless fiery mind wheels of death 3WRjor kadeen, the prevailer weenies and extra combat forever 3RRzirilan of the claw dragons and damage doublers 4:SymRG::SymRG:wort, the raidmother burn is now EDH viable 2WUkangee, aerie keeper birds 1UBRjeleva, nephalia's scourge spellslinger/storm
here are the mana costs of generals i no longer play: 2BR3BB3UBG4UB:SymUB::SymUB:2URRG3WWU2UU2GGUUBGG
I thought of Witchbane orb, but I don't think that would work.
For reference, I am running a U/R instant/sorcery based deck. He is running Khalia of the Vast. Thanks in advance, and sorry for the poor format of the thread. Posting from a phone sucks.
Ok, how?
Multiplayer. Isochron Scepter needs to tap. He can silence one player per go around, on their turn. If that player has instants, he can play them in other turns. Also, that player can still attack him. So can the other players. Why are you guys not just wiping the table with him?
Pristaxcontrombmodruu!
Looks like you found the problem.
Pristaxcontrombmodruu!
BRGKarrthus, Tyrant of Jund
UTeferi, Mage of Zhalfir
UBWZur the Enchanter
WUBRGChild of Alara
WUBRGSliver Queen
Or in response to the silence.
Here's a quick list of answers:
//gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?text=+[destroy">+[target]+[artifact]&type=+[Instant]"]http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?text=+[destroy]+[target]+[artifact]&type=+[Instant]
just like stated above, poor threat assessment. Nothing wrong with being verbal ("Ok guys, we can't let that resolve or stay there")
I buy HP and Damaged cards!
Only EDH:
Sigarda, Host of Herons: Enchantress' Enchantments
Jenara, Asura of War: ETB Value Town
Purphoros, God of the Forge: Global Punishment
Xenagos, God of Revels: Ramp, Sneak, & Heavy Hitters
Ghave, Guru of Spores: Dies_to_Doom_Blade's stax list
Edric, Spymaster of Trest: Donald's list
Kamahl, Fist of Krosa | Korlash, Heir to Blackblade | Karador Apostles | Brago, King Eternal | Talrand the Sky Summoner | Mageta the Lion
Vandalblast, Cyclonic Rift and Chaos Warp would be my go-to's.
Pithing needle and Witchbane orb should help - but really, y'all should be able to team up on him before he kills everyone.
EDIT:
So you're in the best possible colors to stop this, too.
Pristaxcontrombmodruu!
Ding, ding, ding! Add Null Rod for fun and consider Vedalken Orrery for redundancy + helping out the timing of your sorcery-speed deck.
Edit: I always forget that Winding Canyons is creature-only. It's still great as I'm betting that you run several creatures like Izzet Chronarch, Anarchist, Nivix Guildmage, Archaeomancer, ...
Bingo. Bounce or destroy the Iso once and the combo is broken, you should have no trouble with this unless you are just playing a tremendously removal-light deck.
Sadly, my deck is tremendously removal light. And it worked all the time until this guy joined up. I think I'm going to sprinkle in some artifact removal and a few more bounce spells. That does hurt my wincon a bit but I'll just have to be careful with the cards I pull out.
Oh trust me, I've tried that. They still refuse to believe he is a threat. Even after he won 4 games. "He's not a big threat, he just keeps getting lucky."
Maybe I just need a new playgroup...
I'm not saying this to be mean, but honestly, I figured this much out from your OP. I mean, you are in two of the best colors to deal with artifacts and you didn't have an answer, so it goes without saying.
You're looking at this the entirely wrong way. It doesn't hurt your wincon to be able to survive to use it.
Be patient, it'll change. Four games may seem like luck. Especially if you've been the top dog for a while, they're just happy to see someone who can bring you down and they'll justify any excuse that means they're not actually bad players.
Pristaxcontrombmodruu!
If you are getting owned by the same combo every game, it's up to you to adapt. Or you could just keep getting owned, I guess? Either way, definitely don't blame your playgroup for their poor threat assessment and not bailing you out. You shouldn't rely on anyone's charity or game state assessment if you can help it. YOUR deck and YOUR play are all you can control, so make the most of it.
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
Thada Adel Stax WIP
Ha. Yeah. When I initially came up with the deck, the basic theme was "Beat everyone around the table senseless before they can do anything about it." Which actually ended with some hilarious games of basically 3 on 1. I'm gonna balance it out though. Its pretty much a one-trick pony at this point.
I wouldn't say I was top dog, I just saw some fun stuff that I could do with instants and sorceries. We all won and lost our fair shares before this guy showed up.
Try stuff like Chaos Warp, Capsize, and Cyclonic Rift. They will provide you with some strong catch-all answers that all have some serious upside in particular situations (Chaos Warp vs generals, Capsize when you have tons of mana or benefit from casting instants, Cyclonic Rift as a kinda-board wipe), and they all stop his combo easily.
I'm thinking I'll add that and some of the bounce/control/removal spells.
I once played a guy's Phage the Untouchable deck. He tutored and dropped Sundial of the Infinite because I was playing green (Riku of Two Reflections.) and Naturalizeing a Torpor Orb would lose him the game.
He casts Phage, I tap three mana and play Krosan Grip. I was pretty much screwed if I didn't pack removal, but instead instantly won.
Most of the time it doesn't literally win you games like that, but makes it so you can survive long enough to win.
If you hate to leave mana open for removal and then sometimes not use it, which was a big problem for me, pack things like Leyline of Anticipation, Winding Canyons, Alchemist's Refuge, Vedalken Orrery and mana sinks like Azure Mage.
Aggro: WUBRGHorde of Notions Goodstuff, RUB Cheesy Aggro, GR Xenagod Gruul Goodstuff
Control: GWBGhave, Guru of Adaptability, UBWrexial, Milling Deep UAzami, Lady of No Infinite Combos GWU Derevi, Tempo Beats
Other: URGRiku of Too Much Mana, WUBRG Sliver Queen Enchantress
is the problem one of finding deck slots for these types of cards? i am just having a hard time imagining your deck other than its UR colors. im guessing you are more combo oriented and less control oriented right now?
as others have said, you gotta adapt. if you are playing with the same people all the time, then there is no reason you shouldn't tweak your deck to wreck theirs. i play with a group all the time where a guy has a nasty jarad deck. but i started playing grave hate, and now he gets blown out instead of flinging a lord of extinction at everyone's face for the win.
Yeah, the problem is finding slots for the cards, which is what I am doing right now. I do have some counter/control type stuff in there, but not enough I guess. It doesn't help that my budget at this point is practically zero. Oh the joys of being a broke college student...
Don't get too discouraged. This is a lesson every glass cannon or one-trick-pony player has to learn, and it's an opportunity for you to be at the forefront of research into how we can make glass cannon strategies more resilient in EDH.
Or, you can do what I did and build a few big dumb aggro decks to give your brain a rest every once in a while.
3WR jor kadeen, the prevailer weenies and extra combat forever
3RR zirilan of the claw dragons and damage doublers
4:SymRG::SymRG: wort, the raidmother burn is now EDH viable
2WU kangee, aerie keeper birds
1UBR jeleva, nephalia's scourge spellslinger/storm
here are the mana costs of generals i no longer play: 2BR3BB3UBG4UB:SymUB::SymUB:2URRG3WWU2UU2GGUUBGG
3UWR numot, the devastator of [the spirit of edh]