I have the Roon issue with Yarok in that I can guess the opponent's entire deck the moment I see Yarok in the command zone. I can also guess it's gonna have some really annoying things in it like Venser, Shaper Savant, Acidic Slime, Deadeye Navigator...
I have the Roon issue with Yarok in that I can guess the opponent's entire deck the moment I see Yarok in the command zone. I can also guess it's gonna have some really annoying things in it like Venser, Shaper Savant, Acidic Slime, Deadeye Navigator...
Unless you're playing Jank I think I can do that for any general
I have the Roon issue with Yarok in that I can guess the opponent's entire deck the moment I see Yarok in the command zone. I can also guess it's gonna have some really annoying things in it like Venser, Shaper Savant, Acidic Slime, Deadeye Navigator...
jokes on you, i was playing elemental tribal/evoke matters/landfall matters!
... and still i ran those cards...
by the way, aren't you all happy that now kaalia has another angel that makes her indestructible?
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
Also: Those hating on Yarok; that's just like, your opinion man.
Obviously?
And I don't believe DirkGently and I were putting people down for liking Yarok, we just don't like the design. It's a powerful legend with strong stats and ability, there's no down side to it, no restriction, no thinking required, just "value". You don't need to give Yarok a failsafe and Yarok doesn't need to take other players into consideration, it's a solitaire of its own. In a format like EDH Yarok kills imagination, because it builds deck itself, instead of players building their own deck with unique ideas and personality. EDH is suppose to be less boring than tournament formats.
In a format like EDH Yarok kills imagination, because it builds deck itself, instead of players building their own deck with unique ideas and personality. EDH is suppose to be less boring than tournament formats.
I don't think this is a reasonable critique of Yarok. ETBs are pretty wide open, even constrained to those colors. There are over a thousand creatures with ETB effects and at least a couple dozen noncreatures that trigger when a creature ETBs in those colors. There are certainly some cards, like Reclamation Sage that I'd expect to see in most Yarok decks, but the rest of the deck can vary pretty wildly. Yes, you can do control/general ETB value and it's likely to be popular. You could also build stax, tokens, reanimator, combo, and probably numerous other varieties of deck. Yarok is kind of boring but it's not railroading you into building one particular deck. If that's what ends up happening it's on the players more than the general.
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[Pr]Jaya | Estrid | A rotating cast of decks built out of my box.
In a format like EDH Yarok kills imagination, because it builds deck itself, instead of players building their own deck with unique ideas and personality. EDH is suppose to be less boring than tournament formats.
I don't think this is a reasonable critique of Yarok. ETBs are pretty wide open, even constrained to those colors. There are over a thousand creatures with ETB effects and at least a couple dozen noncreatures that trigger when a creature ETBs in those colors. There are certainly some cards, like Reclamation Sage that I'd expect to see in most Yarok decks, but the rest of the deck can vary pretty wildly. Yes, you can do control/general ETB value and it's likely to be popular. You could also build stax, tokens, reanimator, combo, and probably numerous other varieties of deck. Yarok is kind of boring but it's not railroading you into building one particular deck. If that's what ends up happening it's on the players more than the general.
I agree with you. The deck certainly doesn't build itself. I like decks like Karlov of the Ghost Council, Sidisi, Brood Tyrant, Edgar Markov etc. These decks build themselves. You have a clear and narrow strategy with a fairly limited card pool. One of the things that turns me off of Yarok is I have no idea what to do here. Sure blink shenanigans but which ones? Literally pick a strategy and it works. You could go landfall, reanimator, dredge, discard, elemental tribal, goodstuff, artifacts, enchantments, control. Like damn
New abzan elf is mad weird. Cost reduction and recursion, cool, but... legendary tribal? In abzan? I was super hype for a new choice in that wedge, but I guess I'll stick with Doran, who isn't crammed headfirst into the world's smallest pigeonhole.
New abzan elf is mad weird. Cost reduction and recursion, cool, but... legendary tribal? In abzan? I was super hype for a new choice in that wedge, but I guess I'll stick with Doran, who isn't crammed headfirst into the world's smallest pigeonhole.
Well, Primevals' Glorious Rebirth is Black/White and deals with recursion so I would think it would have been worse if they had done something like this without those 2 colors. I am not saying they had to do this design but they did, it seems cool, and 2 of the 3 colors were probably already locked in based on that card. Also, White, Black, and Green make sense for any sort of recursion based card.
As being in a pigeonhole, I am not sure that is true. If you wanted Abzan Superfriends (because Atraxa is played out), here you go. If you wanted to be able to go down the stax/control/combo route with the Thalias, Night of Souls' Betrayal, or any other Legendary enchantment/artifact/creature then here you go. If you really like Sisay but wanted to be able to play Black, here you go.
I am not saying you have to like it but "smallest pigeonhole" seems kind of over the top.
I don't think this is a reasonable critique of Yarok. ETBs are pretty wide open, even constrained to those colors. There are over a thousand creatures with ETB effects and at least a couple dozen noncreatures that trigger when a creature ETBs in those colors. There are certainly some cards, like Reclamation Sage that I'd expect to see in most Yarok decks, but the rest of the deck can vary pretty wildly. Yes, you can do control/general ETB value and it's likely to be popular. You could also build stax, tokens, reanimator, combo, and probably numerous other varieties of deck. Yarok is kind of boring but it's not railroading you into building one particular deck. If that's what ends up happening it's on the players more than the general.
It's more precise to say, Yarok railroading towards one direction, "Permanents, meet trigger." If you look at Kykar, you could go full control with him, or storm, spirit/bird/wizard tribal, spirit/arcane, generic tokens, flyers tribe, stax, vehicle, egg, enchantress, prison, superfriend, etc. I can acknowledge Yarok's power, but ultimately he doesn't strain me in deck building because of his all-gain-no-loss straightforwardness.
Now, if we look at Kethis, the Hidden Hand, that's a commander I could get behind. With the errata of changing all PWs into legendary, his door is wide open, allows and requires you to ponder what cards to exile to play what card from grave, even a Realms Uncharted/Buried Alive become a reanimation spell with the right composition, a dead Flagstones of Trokair could fuel your next strategy after fetching you a plains, etc. I'm kinda glad Squee, the Immortal isn't here to cheapen Kethis.
Yeah I have to say, as fun as all of these are, this new abzan legend presents something that is powerful but not obvious, creative and looks fun. Reminds me of Karador a lot. I want to build him.
I have the Roon issue with Yarok in that I can guess the opponent's entire deck the moment I see Yarok in the command zone. I can also guess it's gonna have some really annoying things in it like Venser, Shaper Savant, Acidic Slime, Deadeye Navigator...
Unless you're playing Jank I think I can do that for any general
I feel like those ones are open-ended in a good way. Not that flexibility is always good, but it does give commanders more durability in these days of edhrec.
I feel like the only one genuinely disappointed by the new Abzan commander. I mean, I guess he isn't a counters/tokens commander which is a relief, but his narrow focus is something I find underwhelming. It's card advantage which is something I was looking for in an Abzan general considering it's in the absolute best colors for removal, and yet, it's so specific as to lend itself to a very obvious and very boring deck. I kind of feel the same way about all the new wedge commanders that aren't Kykar, actually.
I feel like those ones are open-ended in a good way. Not that flexibility is always good, but it does give commanders more durability in these days of edhrec.
6 out of 7 are non-commander set generals! MUCH respect for that.
It's been a long time since I have played a game where commanders from normal sets out-numbered commanders from Commander sets and/or supplemental (i.e. Battlebond/Conspiracy) sets.
That new Golos guy will probably get more people playing Maze's End. I've won a lot of games with Maze's End in the last 5 years. I'm glad to see more Lands.dec support and I hope that Golos at least replaces Windgrace. I hate PWs too much.
I feel like those ones are open-ended in a good way. Not that flexibility is always good, but it does give commanders more durability in these days of edhrec.
6 out of 7 are non-commander set generals! MUCH respect for that.
Sadly usually the commander generals are pretty straightforward if not outright broken. One of them i would add to this list is Gahiji, honored one
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
jokes on you, i was playing elemental tribal/evoke matters/landfall matters!
... and still i ran those cards...
by the way, aren't you all happy that now kaalia has another angel that makes her indestructible?
Obviously?
And I don't believe DirkGently and I were putting people down for liking Yarok, we just don't like the design. It's a powerful legend with strong stats and ability, there's no down side to it, no restriction, no thinking required, just "value". You don't need to give Yarok a failsafe and Yarok doesn't need to take other players into consideration, it's a solitaire of its own. In a format like EDH Yarok kills imagination, because it builds deck itself, instead of players building their own deck with unique ideas and personality. EDH is suppose to be less boring than tournament formats.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
As being in a pigeonhole, I am not sure that is true. If you wanted Abzan Superfriends (because Atraxa is played out), here you go. If you wanted to be able to go down the stax/control/combo route with the Thalias, Night of Souls' Betrayal, or any other Legendary enchantment/artifact/creature then here you go. If you really like Sisay but wanted to be able to play Black, here you go.
I am not saying you have to like it but "smallest pigeonhole" seems kind of over the top.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
It's more precise to say, Yarok railroading towards one direction, "Permanents, meet trigger." If you look at Kykar, you could go full control with him, or storm, spirit/bird/wizard tribal, spirit/arcane, generic tokens, flyers tribe, stax, vehicle, egg, enchantress, prison, superfriend, etc. I can acknowledge Yarok's power, but ultimately he doesn't strain me in deck building because of his all-gain-no-loss straightforwardness.
Now, if we look at Kethis, the Hidden Hand, that's a commander I could get behind. With the errata of changing all PWs into legendary, his door is wide open, allows and requires you to ponder what cards to exile to play what card from grave, even a Realms Uncharted/Buried Alive become a reanimation spell with the right composition, a dead Flagstones of Trokair could fuel your next strategy after fetching you a plains, etc. I'm kinda glad Squee, the Immortal isn't here to cheapen Kethis.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
Only the blue knight remains
I feel like those ones are open-ended in a good way. Not that flexibility is always good, but it does give commanders more durability in these days of edhrec.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
People forget that.
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
[Primer] Erebos, God of the Dead
HONK HONK
You are not. i mean my favorite Abzan Commander is Ghave so i may be bias, but he is (In my opinion) bad, like really bad.
And Loyal Retainers/Time of Need.
Check my brewing thread for options: https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/811648-kethis-the-hidden-green-thumb-lets-brew
While Kamigawa is known to have numerous lack luster legendary stuff, they are perfect fuels for Kethis on this regard.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
It's been a long time since I have played a game where commanders from normal sets out-numbered commanders from Commander sets and/or supplemental (i.e. Battlebond/Conspiracy) sets.
That new Golos guy will probably get more people playing Maze's End. I've won a lot of games with Maze's End in the last 5 years. I'm glad to see more Lands.dec support and I hope that Golos at least replaces Windgrace. I hate PWs too much.
Sadly usually the commander generals are pretty straightforward if not outright broken. One of them i would add to this list is Gahiji, honored one
only responds to creature etb triggers doesnt stop other variants of yarok (landfall, constellation, artifact fall)
alright an actual hydra tribal legendary now
reduces hydras by 4
and fights creatures when yours get targeted itself included
only con is mono green which isnt that bad since almost every hydra is mono green
gruul would have ben perfect since you would get
and a couple of mono red hydras
so again mono green not so bad since most are mono green
reuction of four is crazy, but luckily it is only while on field. I don; suspect seeing one of these popping at my LGS though/