Extraplanar Lens I smile when I see this card come up because I know I am going to make that player lose a land along with there supposed double mana production.
This is kind of like the opposite of the top 50 list. List 1-3 cards you see everyone play that you think are awful most of the time, but everyone disagrees with you. Post why you think these cards aren't nearly as good as other people think in this format.
I thought that meant what I was seeing in the edh games I was playing. Didn't know a card had to be rated to talk about it. Let me reread these rules for this subforum...
(After looking...)
Nope. I stand by what I said. I think those cards suck, and I see them regularly in edh tournies and in casual play. Given it's pretty much the same players but still...
I get that this card is great in standard, and maybe in competitive EDH where things unfold much faster, but how is this good in a casual format where mana pools get very sizeable very quickly? I may be mistaken. If so, please illuminate.
OP, I'll agree with you on Nevs Disk being overrrated, but on your other two choices...... I'm not sure what to say other than this is why you can't evaluate cards in a vacuum.
1. Debtor's Knell - For 7 mana in Commander you can do SO MUCH more. The only time this card is good is when your flipping it for free off an Academy Rector. This card to me reads - For 7 mana you can play a creature from any graveyard with double summoning sickness. This card does nothing if it gets blown up before your next turn, and very little if it gets blown up the turn after that. You need to get 2 activations out of this card just to be even with other spells you could play for 7. Finally. most of the time you are getting 4-5cmc creatures, you are not gaining much mana advantage or even value on this card in any situation you weren't winning anyway.
In it's proper context, like the Ghost Council deck linked in my sig, If you don't answer Knell quickly, you die, simple. It doesn't always take another turn for it to activate as I generally sac off Rector at your eot, and then at my upkeep it's bringing back something that will significantly damage you every turn.
Or simply - Play Yosei, sac and tap you down, repeat next turn, accept your concession. There are a hundred ways to abuse ongoing graveyard recursion. You don't use the Knell to bring back something to wait a turn and beat with, you use it to abuse etb/ltb abilites.
With a sac outlet, ongoing recursion like Debtors' Knell, and strong etb/ltb creatures, it's a death engine. Whomever it is you've been playing against when you've encoutered Debtors Knell apparently isn't using it correctly or in a proper deck for it.
2. Draining Whelk - Why aren't you playing Gather Specimens?! How is a vanilla flyer good in this format? 99% of the time Gather Specimens will get you a better creature, and it's way better at hosing decks that are entirely reliant on their general. In whelk's defense it is relevant against non creature spellls, but most of the most powerful non creature spells in this format end in a lot of big creatures hitting the battlefield (i.e. Rite of Replication)
Same thing. You've evaluated the card outside of any meaningful context. A vanilla flyer isn't good in edh and again if someones using whelk simply as a one-time cancel + vanilla flyer, they're not using it right. The Grand Arbiter deck also linked in my sig uses Whelk with great success, much more success than Gather Specimens would have in it's place. Being able to bounce and replay, or blink, or instantly recur the Whelk means that I can counter at least one spell you play every turn. Whelk is very good in the proper deck.
It just sounds like your accustomed to playing against decks that just throw "good stuff" together, and in that context then the cards were talking about are sub-par.
A vanilla flyer isn't good in edh and again if someones using whelk simply as a one-time cancel + vanilla flyer, they're not using it right.
To be fair, depending on the deck, this is a more than good enough use. I had a Venser list that would often just kill with a 5/5(or bigger) Whelk. This is for 1 v 1, but still. I had ways to abuse it, but it often wasn't needed.
To be fair, depending on the deck, this is a more than good enough use. I had a Venser list that would often just kill with a 5/5(or bigger) Whelk. This is for 1 v 1, but still. I had ways to abuse it, but it often wasn't needed.
Fair enough. I should have maybe said "to it's fullest potential". Agreed, a hard counter that gives you even a vanilla flyer isn't bad by any means.
Lightning Greaves is definitely not overrated. No other equipment besides Darksteel Plate gives me more fits than Greaves. It blanks spot removal, makes Voltron generals un-Mazeable, and makes generals with a tap activated ability especially dangerous.
Extraplanar Lens... now this is definitely a card I agree with that is overrated. The card literally screams to everyone to 2-for-1 the sucker, and it's really easy to do so. If it doesn't die to artifact destruction, it gets bounced or blinked out. I've actually just started running all snow-covered basics in all my decks on Cockatrice even when there is nothing to take advantage of the snow lands, because I know I can bank on a random player thinking they'll be the only one that benefits when they play their Lens.
I think thawing glaciers is good in some decks. Tonight I won a game where I used it with rings of brighthearth for crazy ramping for a few turns and then dropped a cabal coffers. There have also been times where it's saved me from mana screw. Plus it allows a land drop on turns you would have had nothing.
Extraplanar Lens... now this is definitely a card I agree with that is overrated. The card literally screams to everyone to 2-for-1 the sucker, and it's really easy to do so. If it doesn't die to artifact destruction, it gets bounced or blinked out. I've actually just started running all snow-covered basics in all my decks on Cockatrice even when there is nothing to take advantage of the snow lands, because I know I can bank on a random player thinking they'll be the only one that benefits when they play their Lens.
Card disadvantage AND tempo loss.
I think the only deck that could properly take advantage of Lens while minimizing its drawbacks is mono-white aggro. Everything else, I don't think it's worth it.
I think the only deck that could properly take advantage of Lens while minimizing its drawbacks is mono-white aggro. Everything else, I don't think it's worth it.
Well, I have a mono-green and a mono-red deck that do a pretty good job of utilizing it. The idea is to be built to work off of lots of mana, and include every possible mana doubler there is. Sure it will be the first one to eat a disenchant, but what about the next one? Or the one after that? Untapping with 2x mana usually seals the deal in these decks, so occasionally losing a land isn't such a big drawback when you duress-or-win your opponent or force them into tutor-gymnastics just to deal with a problem permanent.
But if I just wanted some mana doubling, yeah gauntlet of power would be my first non-green choice.
I'll go with Force of Will. The card disadvantage is so much more relevant in long EDH games and hurts you more than it helps you IMO. You can't even play it in anything more than a 2 color deck and I was never happy when I drew it.
Skullclamp cannot really be considered a best for it was banned upon release. I think the best card/most broken card on that list has to be Bloodbraid Elf. That card was too busted.
Getting rid of it is more difficult than getting rid of Land Tax.
...You are playing Eternal Dragon wrong.
You seriously think Pulsemage deserves a slot here, when it's ability is crap?
Seriously, unless they are running Dredge or you have Sword of Mind and Body out, Pulsemage has no value. You give them CA, while all you get is a creature. I'd rather have Emeria/Debtor's Knell over Pulsemage. Those at least don't run the risk of screwing me over.
I don't really care to argue for very long over eternal dragon, all I can say is that whenever I've seen it played it usually either ended up getting more lands the player didn't need or coming into play long after a 5/5 vanilla flyer was very useful. But I'm sure there are ways to abuse it that the people i've seen playing it aren't abusing.
but i will NOT TOLERATE you bashing on my pulsemage, good sir. You don't think it has value? Are you insane? Have you ever played EDH? The larger game I played tonight ended with half my bloody deck in my graveyard (same with everyone else). I could have kept recurring creatures until doomsday with the kind of selection from other player's graveyards I had available (naturally I never drew it...but still).
There is no chance of screwing yourself over if you play pulsemage intelligently. Don't return cards that can be used against you - it's that simple. You're not giving them a free draw, you control exactly what's going into their hand. In a big game there are tons of graves to pick from, so pick the grave with the least threatening stuff in it. On top of that, it's an amazing political ability since it's instant speed, gives you a major kickback in the form of free reanimation, and (as mentioned) gives you total control over what you give them. You're going to attack me? How about if I give you 3 cards back, and instead you attack our mutual enemy? Or how about I'll return that counterspell if you counter that decree of annihilation?
I get that this card is great in standard, and maybe in competitive EDH where things unfold much faster, but how is this good in a casual format where mana pools get very sizeable very quickly? I may be mistaken. If so, please illuminate.
im pretty sure no one runs mana leak in edh. thread is about OVERrated. not just cards that are bad.
This is slightly unrelated, but there is a guy in our cube drafts who always takes thawing glaciers really high, claims that it is one of the best cards in the cube, etc etc. He always gets it, because no one else wants it.
Normally I trust his card evaluation, but whenever I see him play thawing glaciers, I think to myself, "good, let him do that for a while." If I'm beatdown or burn, seeing something that slow just feels like a gift.
Back on track, I'm sure that the card is better in edh, but it still seems like a tempo sacrifice for card advantage that might not be affordable in a lot of match ups.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'll be sad if people don't start calling The Chain Veil "Fleetwood Mac."
You're going to attack me? How about if I give you 3 cards back, and instead you attack our mutual enemy?
"Cool, then I'll attack you to make sure no one else gets a sweet bonus, let alone you."
One person on this board likes P.A. I'm guessing it's the same percentage in the real world.
Anyway, the point about T.Glaciers is that you should have it in a deck that can support it....or probably anything with Rings in it. You can't throw it into every deck, which is how I kinda looked at the topic (because the Top 50 is kinda "Hey, YOU SHOULD PROBABLY HAVE THESE CARDS IN YOUR DECK BECAUSE THEY ARE NIGH-OBJECTIVELY GOOD").
I'll go with Force of Will. The card disadvantage is so much more relevant in long EDH games and hurts you more than it helps you IMO. You can't even play it in anything more than a 2 color deck and I was never happy when I drew it.
Completely disagree with this one. Card disadvantage is important, but 99% of the time I'm using forces alternative cost I would still cast it if read "Discard your hand and half your life total". You need it to prevent Insurrections, Genesis Wave, Tooth and Nails, etc. It's not a value card, it's a get out of jail free. Also, card advantage in EDH is different than other formats when there are multiple easy ways to draw 6-7. In a format with necropotence and the like I'll gladly 2 for 1 myself to stop game winning spells.
Completely disagree with this one. Card disadvantage is important, but 99% of the time I'm using forces alternative cost I would still cast it if read "Discard your hand and half your life total". You need it to prevent Insurrections, Genesis Wave, Tooth and Nails, etc. It's not a value card, it's a get out of jail free. Also, card advantage in EDH is different than other formats when there are multiple easy ways to draw 6-7. In a format with necropotence and the like I'll gladly 2 for 1 myself to stop game winning spells.
I completely agree, I think the mentality needs to change toward deck building in EDH to understand that there are some threats and situations where you will need a card that may not be the most advantageous in terms of ratio to play.
I almost locked down a game last week with Stasis and Temporal Adept, had someone not been packing a swords to plowshare, 1 for 1 with me gaining life, it would have went who knows how many more turns around the table before answered.
The ravnica bounce lands. I've started taking these out of some decks because they either couldn't afford etb tapped lands or were the ideal strip/waste targets. Stripping these feels so bad but you just win if it's in the first 4 or so turns.
The ravnica bounce lands. I've started taking these out of some decks because they either couldn't afford etb tapped lands or were the ideal strip/waste targets. Stripping these feels so bad but you just win if it's in the first 4 or so turns.
On the ravnica front: Signets. I think theyre terrible. Theyre not good ramp, and they dont make mana alone.
If i wanted to make one more mana on turn three, id run so many different cards...
No one targets the Signets, and for dual-colored decks, they can help if you get stuck on one color. Leaving them untapped means your open probably won't know what instants you'll cast. Again, not great for every deck, but they do have their uses (again, though, I find them best in a dual-colored deck)
On the signets: Again, we have to remember to take these cards we discuss in context. The signets' benefit is relative to the rest of your land fixing. If you are playing with Duals, Shocks, Filterlands, Fetches, Reflecting Pool, Orchard, etc in addition to cards like Darksteel Ingot, Coldsteel Heart and Gilded Lotus, then yeah, the signets aren't going to do that much for you. Similarly, in a 5-color deck, the signets are probably way too narrow to be good fixing. But if you can't afford Volcanic Island, Windswept Heath and friends, those signets are pretty invaluable, especially in dual-color decks which are quite common in this format. I'm almost never unhappy to have one and they make a lot of otherwise sketchy opening hands very keepable. And if my opponent is the kind of player who will hit my signet on turn 2 or 3 with removal, I'm probably not too excited to play with that player anyway.
On the signets: Again, we have to remember to take these cards we discuss in context. The signets' benefit is relative to the rest of your land fixing. If you are playing with Duals, Shocks, Filterlands, Fetches, Reflecting Pool, Orchard, etc in addition to cards like Darksteel Ingot, Coldsteel Heart and Gilded Lotus, then yeah, the signets aren't going to do that much for you. Similarly, in a 5-color deck, the signets are probably way too narrow to be good fixing. But if you can't afford Volcanic Island, Windswept Heath and friends, those signets are pretty invaluable, especially in dual-color decks which are quite common in this format. I'm almost never unhappy to have one and they make a lot of otherwise sketchy opening hands very keepable. And if my opponent is the kind of player who will hit my signet on turn 2 or 3 with removal, I'm probably not too excited to play with that player anyway.
I think thats it exactly. With so many better cards, why do we say that these are good? The "you dont have X so Y can make do" doesnt mean Y is good. Not owning a jace's ingenuity doesnt make distant memories good. Yes, it can be used in a pinch, but honestly, with so many better cards, i think theyre overrated. Even in a 2 color deck, where theyre best, id run several cards over them, including cheap ones like coalition relic and darksteel ingot. I mean, i guess those cards dont make for 4 available mana on turn three, but they also are way more versatile after that. I just think signets can be replaced with so many different cards it makes them pretty shoddy.
These are just my opinions (and to be fair, i do run the duals, fetches, filter lands, shocks, and the rest to make my mana base good enough id not need the signets. Maybe im missing something because of that, but even so, i feel like you can run other artifact mana producers that cost very little in cash that do the job better)
GAzusa, Lost but SeekingG
WBVish Kal, Blood ArbiterWB
WBRKaalia of the VastWBR
UBGVorosh, the HunterUBG
WRGisela, Blade of GoldnightWR
WUGJenara, Asura of WarWUG
WBGTeneb, The HarvesterWBG
WUBRGHorde of NotionsWUBRG
B
I thought that meant what I was seeing in the edh games I was playing. Didn't know a card had to be rated to talk about it. Let me reread these rules for this subforum...
(After looking...)
Nope. I stand by what I said. I think those cards suck, and I see them regularly in edh tournies and in casual play. Given it's pretty much the same players but still...
Putting the sexy in Science Fiction!
gamertag: filthychocolate
I get that this card is great in standard, and maybe in competitive EDH where things unfold much faster, but how is this good in a casual format where mana pools get very sizeable very quickly? I may be mistaken. If so, please illuminate.
Modern
RBig RedR
GMean GreenG
WWW AlliesW
BGScavengeBG
WUVenser SilenceWU
EDH
RWAurelia 1 vs 1RW
GWURoonGWU
GWSaffiGW
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
In it's proper context, like the Ghost Council deck linked in my sig, If you don't answer Knell quickly, you die, simple. It doesn't always take another turn for it to activate as I generally sac off Rector at your eot, and then at my upkeep it's bringing back something that will significantly damage you every turn.
Or simply - Play Yosei, sac and tap you down, repeat next turn, accept your concession. There are a hundred ways to abuse ongoing graveyard recursion. You don't use the Knell to bring back something to wait a turn and beat with, you use it to abuse etb/ltb abilites.
With a sac outlet, ongoing recursion like Debtors' Knell, and strong etb/ltb creatures, it's a death engine. Whomever it is you've been playing against when you've encoutered Debtors Knell apparently isn't using it correctly or in a proper deck for it.
Same thing. You've evaluated the card outside of any meaningful context. A vanilla flyer isn't good in edh and again if someones using whelk simply as a one-time cancel + vanilla flyer, they're not using it right. The Grand Arbiter deck also linked in my sig uses Whelk with great success, much more success than Gather Specimens would have in it's place. Being able to bounce and replay, or blink, or instantly recur the Whelk means that I can counter at least one spell you play every turn. Whelk is very good in the proper deck.
It just sounds like your accustomed to playing against decks that just throw "good stuff" together, and in that context then the cards were talking about are sub-par.
Banner by Nakamura, Thanks!
EDH Math
EDH Decks:
Ghost Council: The Magic Mafia of Orzhova
BB Drana: Down with the Sickness
Rasputin: Reality is Broken
Vish Kal Bleeder: Bloody Kisses
Teysa, Orzhov Dominatrix
Stonebrow: Breaking Things
BWR Kaalia Punisher: Heaven's on Fire
Grimgrin: Dead Reckoning
To be fair, depending on the deck, this is a more than good enough use. I had a Venser list that would often just kill with a 5/5(or bigger) Whelk. This is for 1 v 1, but still. I had ways to abuse it, but it often wasn't needed.
Pauper Cube
I cube, I play EDH, and I can't afford Legacy. The other formats can suck it.
Fair enough. I should have maybe said "to it's fullest potential". Agreed, a hard counter that gives you even a vanilla flyer isn't bad by any means.
Banner by Nakamura, Thanks!
EDH Math
EDH Decks:
Ghost Council: The Magic Mafia of Orzhova
BB Drana: Down with the Sickness
Rasputin: Reality is Broken
Vish Kal Bleeder: Bloody Kisses
Teysa, Orzhov Dominatrix
Stonebrow: Breaking Things
BWR Kaalia Punisher: Heaven's on Fire
Grimgrin: Dead Reckoning
Extraplanar Lens... now this is definitely a card I agree with that is overrated. The card literally screams to everyone to 2-for-1 the sucker, and it's really easy to do so. If it doesn't die to artifact destruction, it gets bounced or blinked out. I've actually just started running all snow-covered basics in all my decks on Cockatrice even when there is nothing to take advantage of the snow lands, because I know I can bank on a random player thinking they'll be the only one that benefits when they play their Lens.
I think the only deck that could properly take advantage of Lens while minimizing its drawbacks is mono-white aggro. Everything else, I don't think it's worth it.
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
Well, I have a mono-green and a mono-red deck that do a pretty good job of utilizing it. The idea is to be built to work off of lots of mana, and include every possible mana doubler there is. Sure it will be the first one to eat a disenchant, but what about the next one? Or the one after that? Untapping with 2x mana usually seals the deal in these decks, so occasionally losing a land isn't such a big drawback when you duress-or-win your opponent or force them into tutor-gymnastics just to deal with a problem permanent.
But if I just wanted some mana doubling, yeah gauntlet of power would be my first non-green choice.
I don't really care to argue for very long over eternal dragon, all I can say is that whenever I've seen it played it usually either ended up getting more lands the player didn't need or coming into play long after a 5/5 vanilla flyer was very useful. But I'm sure there are ways to abuse it that the people i've seen playing it aren't abusing.
but i will NOT TOLERATE you bashing on my pulsemage, good sir. You don't think it has value? Are you insane? Have you ever played EDH? The larger game I played tonight ended with half my bloody deck in my graveyard (same with everyone else). I could have kept recurring creatures until doomsday with the kind of selection from other player's graveyards I had available (naturally I never drew it...but still).
There is no chance of screwing yourself over if you play pulsemage intelligently. Don't return cards that can be used against you - it's that simple. You're not giving them a free draw, you control exactly what's going into their hand. In a big game there are tons of graves to pick from, so pick the grave with the least threatening stuff in it. On top of that, it's an amazing political ability since it's instant speed, gives you a major kickback in the form of free reanimation, and (as mentioned) gives you total control over what you give them. You're going to attack me? How about if I give you 3 cards back, and instead you attack our mutual enemy? Or how about I'll return that counterspell if you counter that decree of annihilation?
...You are playing pulsemage advocate wrong.
WUB Merieke Ri Berit BUW
GWU Phelddagrif 1 2 3 4 UWG
BR Kaervek the Merciless RB
B Chainer, Dementia Master B
WUB Sen Triplets BUW
BG Sisters of Stone Death GB
WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon GRBUW
GWU Angus Mackenzie UWG
R Kumano, Master Yamabushi R
WB Teysa BW
U Higure U
B Geth B
WUBRG Child of Alara 1 2GRBUW
R Zirilan R
U Arcum U
UR Nin RU
BRG Sek'Kuar GRB
U Teferi U
G Melira G
GU Edric UG
BG Glissa GB
Casual
GUB Knacksaw Clique BUG
RWU Sunforger UWR
im pretty sure no one runs mana leak in edh. thread is about OVERrated. not just cards that are bad.
Normally I trust his card evaluation, but whenever I see him play thawing glaciers, I think to myself, "good, let him do that for a while." If I'm beatdown or burn, seeing something that slow just feels like a gift.
Back on track, I'm sure that the card is better in edh, but it still seems like a tempo sacrifice for card advantage that might not be affordable in a lot of match ups.
"Cool, then I'll attack you to make sure no one else gets a sweet bonus, let alone you."
One person on this board likes P.A. I'm guessing it's the same percentage in the real world.
Anyway, the point about T.Glaciers is that you should have it in a deck that can support it....or probably anything with Rings in it. You can't throw it into every deck, which is how I kinda looked at the topic (because the Top 50 is kinda "Hey, YOU SHOULD PROBABLY HAVE THESE CARDS IN YOUR DECK BECAUSE THEY ARE NIGH-OBJECTIVELY GOOD").
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
*Eyes go wide*
How could I have never thought of that =(
*orders thawing glaciers*
EDH Decks:
B Toshiro Umezawa B
W Mikaeus, the Lunarch W
G Azusa, Lost but Seeking G
UB Grimgrin, Corpse-Born BU
BGU The Mimeoplasm UGB
GUW Rubinia Soulsinger WUG
GRB Sek'Kuar, Deathkeeper BRG
Completely disagree with this one. Card disadvantage is important, but 99% of the time I'm using forces alternative cost I would still cast it if read "Discard your hand and half your life total". You need it to prevent Insurrections, Genesis Wave, Tooth and Nails, etc. It's not a value card, it's a get out of jail free. Also, card advantage in EDH is different than other formats when there are multiple easy ways to draw 6-7. In a format with necropotence and the like I'll gladly 2 for 1 myself to stop game winning spells.
I completely agree, I think the mentality needs to change toward deck building in EDH to understand that there are some threats and situations where you will need a card that may not be the most advantageous in terms of ratio to play.
I almost locked down a game last week with Stasis and Temporal Adept, had someone not been packing a swords to plowshare, 1 for 1 with me gaining life, it would have went who knows how many more turns around the table before answered.
EDH Decks:
B Toshiro Umezawa B
W Mikaeus, the Lunarch W
G Azusa, Lost but Seeking G
UB Grimgrin, Corpse-Born BU
BGU The Mimeoplasm UGB
GUW Rubinia Soulsinger WUG
GRB Sek'Kuar, Deathkeeper BRG
How is extraplanar lens ever bad in a mono-colored deck?
With so many X spells flying around, and the fact that man advantage is HUGE in EDH I don't understand why you wouldn't run it.
Thats why you don't run it onto the field all willy-nilly, and in multiplayer people who share similar landbases will protect it for you sometimes.
WURDelver
[/MANA]MANA]R[/MANA]GTron
WDeath and Taxes
WSoul Sisters
RWG Pod Combo
URSplinter Twin
URStorm
RBurn
On the ravnica front: Signets. I think theyre terrible. Theyre not good ramp, and they dont make mana alone.
If i wanted to make one more mana on turn three, id run so many different cards...
10.) No taxing cards.
If i wanted to pay 1 more on my Fresh Volunteers, then id just have played Pearled Unicorn.
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
Thada Adel Stax WIP
I think thats it exactly. With so many better cards, why do we say that these are good? The "you dont have X so Y can make do" doesnt mean Y is good. Not owning a jace's ingenuity doesnt make distant memories good. Yes, it can be used in a pinch, but honestly, with so many better cards, i think theyre overrated. Even in a 2 color deck, where theyre best, id run several cards over them, including cheap ones like coalition relic and darksteel ingot. I mean, i guess those cards dont make for 4 available mana on turn three, but they also are way more versatile after that. I just think signets can be replaced with so many different cards it makes them pretty shoddy.
These are just my opinions (and to be fair, i do run the duals, fetches, filter lands, shocks, and the rest to make my mana base good enough id not need the signets. Maybe im missing something because of that, but even so, i feel like you can run other artifact mana producers that cost very little in cash that do the job better)
10.) No taxing cards.
If i wanted to pay 1 more on my Fresh Volunteers, then id just have played Pearled Unicorn.