Hey everyone. I'm updating some of my decks and for the life of me I can never get a UB mill archetype deck to work. It always seems slow and inconsistent. It hasn't helped that I've only played it a few times, but I was hoping someone would have some good input. Here's the list as of now:
Sometimes the land base can be slow and wonky, especially when you need to get some color fixing in the first 3 turns for Fathom Feeder and Nightveil Specter. I've contemplated taking out Fellwar Stone for more card draw or something, but it helps to ramp so you can churn the higher CMC spells one or two turns faster. I've also thought about taking out Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger and All is Dust and playing Coax from the Blind Eternities main deck. One last thing is Dread Summons superior over Mind Grind in this type of deck? I can see wanting some bodies early on beneficial, but MG seems like it's better at closing out. Mind's Dilation may also be worth considering also.
Coax is fantastic if allowed to play with it. It's basically strictly better than playing with actual 7+ drops.
What are you losing to? The deck isn't fast but it was never designed to be. It's always been centered around long-run card advantage and big mana. As far as inconsistency goes all of your cards "do things" so I'm not exactly sure what you're referencing in that sense. The only combo that I can see is Parallax Tide + Oblivion Sower and even then there's only two Tides. All of your other spells you can fire and forget.
I'm mostly losing to a lot of creatures as this deck lacks blockers. Obviously if I miss a land drop I can be pushed behind easily. Maybe replace the Fellwar Stone with some durdle blockers like Fog Bank?
I'm mostly losing to a lot of creatures as this deck lacks blockers. Obviously if I miss a land drop I can be pushed behind easily. Maybe replace the Fellwar Stone with some durdle blockers like Fog Bank?
Wrath of God is sweet, but I'm just not willing to splash white. I would love to put in Damnation if they ever would do a mass reprint on it as a rare. How about a more control based approached with more removal:
Wrath of God is sweet, but I'm just not willing to splash white. I would love to put in Damnation if they ever would do a mass reprint on it as a rare. How about a more control based approached with more removal:
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and Cabal Coffers would be bonkers for this deck. You can tutor the missing piece of the 2 card combo with black tutors or Expedition Map. They work well for playing big colorless, X costing spells, Cyclonic Rift, Lashwrithe, etc. Cabal coffers would also pair well with your Parallax Tide since you can use that to untap your own lands. Alternatively you can just steal someone else's cabal coffers if it gets played.
Time Spiral would combo with both the cabals, and help you avoid milling yourself
Many of your creatures have a nice "when you cast this spell" effect, so a self-bounce would be good. Evacuation perhaps?
Thanks for the suggestions. I've tried a deck with Mesmeric Orb as proxies and things like Wight of Precinct Six and Phenax, God of Deception before and I had an instant target on my head the moment I played it. Plus a playset for them is still pricey.
I have Urbog and Coffers in a couple other decks already. I strictly think green is the way to go with those cards when you have Primeval Titan to pull them both.
I'm thinking the Eldrazi archetype might be a little too weak and slow for my meta.
Mesmeric orb needs to be played calculatingly, play it right after a wrath of god and everyone is tapped, then throw out a glacial chasm at the same time. don't play it as soon as you can on turn 2. run it as a 2-of.
Mesmeric orb needs to be played calculatingly, play it right after a wrath of god and everyone is tapped, then throw out a glacial chasm at the same time. don't play it as soon as you can on turn 2.
Err, no, you blindly run it out on turn 2 when your deck has 7x Delve spells and 3x Yawgmoth's Will. I have no idea why you think and/or would suggest otherwise. Why wouldn't you want to fill your GY as much + as soon as possible? After all, every card that you mill will either become free mana or card advantage so what possible advantage could there be to sitting on the effect?
he was talking about how in his playgroup, it drew too much hate for his liking
Doesn't matter; it's still bad advice to give to someone else. You don't put a card like Mesmeric Orb in your "graveyard matters" deck only to sandbag it so that it can be "played calculatingly."
Ya, I've seen some decent milling done with Sphinx's Tutelage in our meta. One guy always plays around 18-20 lands only, so there's lots of room to mill with it.
If it matters to anyone, here is the list I'm currently trying for Metallurgic Summonings:
I would like to use Nether Spirit with Runechanter's Pike, but I'm pretty stacked at the spell spot. Mishra's Factory works nice as a early game blocker and a late game threat with the Pike if I don't happen to have out summonings. I could use Inkmoth Nexus instead, but they are still really pricey.
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Creatures (20)
4x Fathom Feeder
4x Nightveil Specter
4x Blight Herder
4x Oblivion Sower
2x Sire of Stagnation
2x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
Spells (16)
2x Nihil Spellbomb
4x Fellwar Stone
2x Dread Summons
1x Cyclonic Rift
2x Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
1x Rhystic Study
2x Parallax Tide
1x Recurring Insight
1x All is Dust
4x Bojuka Bog
4x Dimir Aqueduct
9x Island
1x Nephalia Drownyard
2x Reliquary Tower
4x Swamp
Sometimes the land base can be slow and wonky, especially when you need to get some color fixing in the first 3 turns for Fathom Feeder and Nightveil Specter. I've contemplated taking out Fellwar Stone for more card draw or something, but it helps to ramp so you can churn the higher CMC spells one or two turns faster. I've also thought about taking out Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger and All is Dust and playing Coax from the Blind Eternities main deck. One last thing is Dread Summons superior over Mind Grind in this type of deck? I can see wanting some bodies early on beneficial, but MG seems like it's better at closing out. Mind's Dilation may also be worth considering also.
What are you losing to? The deck isn't fast but it was never designed to be. It's always been centered around long-run card advantage and big mana. As far as inconsistency goes all of your cards "do things" so I'm not exactly sure what you're referencing in that sense. The only combo that I can see is Parallax Tide + Oblivion Sower and even then there's only two Tides. All of your other spells you can fire and forget.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Why not add a set of Wrath of Gods?
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Creatures (12)
4x Blight Herder
4x Oblivion Sower
2x Sire of Stagnation
2x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
Spells (23)
2x Massacre
2x Nihil Spellbomb
4x Fellwar Stone
2x Mind Grind
1x Cyclonic Rift
2x Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
1x Rhystic Study
2x Coalition Relic
2x Parallax Tide
1x Sever the Bloodline
2x Crux of Fate
1x Recurring Insight
1x All is Dust
4x Bojuka Bog
4x Dimir Aqueduct
7x Island
1x Nephalia Drownyard
2x Reliquary Tower
3x Swamp
4x Temple of Deceit
I didn't mean literal Wrath of God. I meant things like Massacre, Innocent Blood, Languish, Nevinyrral's Disk, Crux of Fate, All is Dust, Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, etc.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Just include a graveyard->library shuffle card such as Elixir of immortality, Day's undoing, or Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, or 2 Gaea's Blessing.
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and Cabal Coffers would be bonkers for this deck. You can tutor the missing piece of the 2 card combo with black tutors or Expedition Map. They work well for playing big colorless, X costing spells, Cyclonic Rift, Lashwrithe, etc. Cabal coffers would also pair well with your Parallax Tide since you can use that to untap your own lands. Alternatively you can just steal someone else's cabal coffers if it gets played.
Time Spiral would combo with both the cabals, and help you avoid milling yourself
Many of your creatures have a nice "when you cast this spell" effect, so a self-bounce would be good. Evacuation perhaps?
Tax-Rack with Blade of Selves
Tax-Rack with Vicious Shadows
Mesmeric Orb + Lord of Extinction
G/W/K Sun Titan Reanimator
U/G LashWrithe
I have Urbog and Coffers in a couple other decks already. I strictly think green is the way to go with those cards when you have Primeval Titan to pull them both.
I'm thinking the Eldrazi archetype might be a little too weak and slow for my meta.
A Metallurgic Summonings deck looks fun in a UB archetype:
Creatures (0)
Spells (37)
1 Massacre
4 Preordain
3 Innocent Blood
4 Accumulated Knowledge
4 Impulse
1 Frantic Search
1 Forbid
2 Syphon Soul
2 Languish
2 Fact or Fiction
3 Metallurgic Summonings
2 Crux of Fate
1 All is Dust
2 Dig Through Time
4 Treasure Cruise
1 Temporal Trespass
1 Nephalia Drownyard
22 Durdles
Has anyone had fun playing this kind of deck?
But if you're building around Metallurgic Summonings, there are blue instants like force of will and twincast. I especially recommend twincast since you would get a creature token for twincast, and the copied spell. Deflection or redirect are similar but won't give you 2 creatures.
Twincast would also work nicely with big blue miracle spells.
Temporal mastery
Devastation Tide
Vanishment
Some miracle enablers would be:
brainstorm
Mystical Tutor
Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Scroll Rack
Tax-Rack with Blade of Selves
Tax-Rack with Vicious Shadows
Mesmeric Orb + Lord of Extinction
G/W/K Sun Titan Reanimator
U/G LashWrithe
Err, no, you blindly run it out on turn 2 when your deck has 7x Delve spells and 3x Yawgmoth's Will. I have no idea why you think and/or would suggest otherwise. Why wouldn't you want to fill your GY as much + as soon as possible? After all, every card that you mill will either become free mana or card advantage so what possible advantage could there be to sitting on the effect?
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Tax-Rack with Blade of Selves
Tax-Rack with Vicious Shadows
Mesmeric Orb + Lord of Extinction
G/W/K Sun Titan Reanimator
U/G LashWrithe
Doesn't matter; it's still bad advice to give to someone else. You don't put a card like Mesmeric Orb in your "graveyard matters" deck only to sandbag it so that it can be "played calculatingly."
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Insidious Will would work well in the Metallurgic Summonings deck.
Tax-Rack with Blade of Selves
Tax-Rack with Vicious Shadows
Mesmeric Orb + Lord of Extinction
G/W/K Sun Titan Reanimator
U/G LashWrithe
If it matters to anyone, here is the list I'm currently trying for Metallurgic Summonings:
1 Vampiric Tutor
4 Preordain
4 Accumulated Knowledge
4 Impulse
1 Cyclonic Rift
1 Runechanter's Pike
2 Frantic Search
2 Toxic Deluge
2 Fact or Fiction
2 Languish
4 Crux of Fate
3 Metallurgic Summonings
1 Dark Petition
2 Treasure Cruise
2 Dig Through Time
1 Temporal Trespass
4 Mishra's Factory
7 Island
3 Swamp
2 Dimir Aqueduct
4 Drowned Catacomb
4 Temple of Deceit
I would like to use Nether Spirit with Runechanter's Pike, but I'm pretty stacked at the spell spot. Mishra's Factory works nice as a early game blocker and a late game threat with the Pike if I don't happen to have out summonings. I could use Inkmoth Nexus instead, but they are still really pricey.