Hey everyone. So I've had a UG Prophet of Kruphix deck for awhile that never really gets played because I'm not a fan of playing a bunch of combo cards on each other players turn (Cloudstone Curio, ramp creatures, Deranged Hermit, Opposition, etc.) and it seems like everyone else at the table has a deck that runs it. So how about something slightly less interactive that is still fun to play with? I'm thinking of something like this:
What are everyone's UG decks looking like? I like Prophet of Kruphix, but sometimes the card bores me and is TOO oppressive when combined with token makers and Opposition to lock everyone out of only playing instants on their turns.
Breeding Pool makes the deck a lot more unfair. I don't like recommending expensive lands if I don't have to but when you run 4x Sylvan Primordial + DENs/Sabertooth adding extra Forests makes a significant difference. If you could remove 4x Island for 4x Breeding Pool it would make the deck substantially better. In an ideal world you want 14 or more lands that can cast Burgeoning on turn 1. Even things like Aether Hub are fantastic because that card pairs amazingly well with your 8x Bouncelands and Summer Blooms. I usually run 2 myself (I currently run Crumbling Vestige but Aether Hub is strictly better). Gemstone Mine, Tendo Ice Bridge, anything that enables you to cast your spells on-curve is great since you can constantly bounce them as needed.
Prid3: Thanks for the ideas. What other 4 bounce lands would you use besides the obvious Simic Growth Chamber? I'm actually thinking a Leviathan theme would be pretty sweet in this sort of deck due to all the heavy mana. I also contemplated about a Living Wish board as well. I think I may just keep the bounce lands at 4 and have some other dual Simic lands in order to reliably cast each spell I need.
Decks seems pretty sweet so far in testing. I obviously had to put the Whelming Wave+Mnemonic Wall combo in there. I'm okay with Sylvan Primordial continuously getting bounced so that I can keep destroying key permanents. I think the threat level is okay. I'm drawing and reshuffling cards like crazy so it's hard not do draw into something this way.
Just so we're clear I was only mentioning Day's Undoing for people who don't want to use cards that are banned in Legacy. It's also arguably better (not "strictly") since it always draws you into 7 new cards (no, Windfall doesn't) but your initial Windfalls were fine. Still, it was mostly an alternative for other players.
Day's Undoing is actually quite bad in your new deck. It dismantles your Whelming Wave combo and since it exiles itself you can't recur it with Archaeomancer. Windfall is way better in your new list.
Prid3: Thanks for the ideas. What other 4 bounce lands would you use besides the obvious Simic Growth Chamber?
It's largely irrelevant. The new deck that you posted is base-Blue so probably 3 Blue ones and 1 Green one. None of the "splash" colors are relevant so it doesn't matter which ones.
I think I may just keep the bounce lands at 4 and have some other dual Simic lands in order to reliably cast each spell I need.
That's fine, but then how are you justifying 4x Burgeoning and 4x Summer Bloom if you can't reliably abuse them? Maybe the deck works fine with only 4 but that seems a bit loose to me.
FWIW Aether Hub et al. are way better when you can reliably bounce them. Assuming that you only field 4 Bouncelands that's going to be easier said than done.
The reason I like Day's Undoing slightly better is because I can always reliably draw 7. I also like it better because if I need to dig for something like Burgeoning, I don't have to worry about losing any creatures to discard like with Windfall. I feel like I would rather take the chance and shuffle Wave back into my library in order to dig and be able to cast multiple threats on the same turn. I guess that's just something I'll have to play test with and see which style would perform better.
I added in the 4 extra bounce lands in the previous list. It is insane when you can get 6+ mana from them on turn 2.
The reason I like Day's Undoing slightly better is because I can always reliably draw 7. I also like it better because if I need to dig for something like Burgeoning, I don't have to worry about losing any creatures to discard like with Windfall. I feel like I would rather take the chance and shuffle Wave back into my library in order to dig and be able to cast multiple threats on the same turn. I guess that's just something I'll have to play test with and see which style would perform better.
You could always try and split and see how they fare. Personally I would play 4x Windfall in a deck with Archaeomancers since filling your GY is actively good whereas shuffling it away is actively bad. In that sense I don't really understand the switch. After all, the deck has so much draw so who cares if you bin some critters?
Btw Plasm Capture seems rather superfluous and reasonably hard to cast. You could still run some permission/interaction if you wanted but IMO this deck needs Beast Within more than it needs a 4 CMC ramp spell. 4x Burg 4x Bloom should suffice. Hell, 4x Bloom is probably overkill (like I said in my initial reply I typically only run 2).
Good call on Mind's Dilation. I run that in a UB Eldrazi deck, but I think it would be rather good in here too. Is there a good card I can use to dump all that mana with? Soul of Zendikar? Kamahl, Fist of Krosa with WW would be pretty lol.
Good call on Mind's Dilation. I run that in a UB Eldrazi deck, but I think it would be rather good in here too. Is there a good card I can use to dump all that mana with? Soul of Zendikar? Kamahl, Fist of Krosa with WW would be pretty lol.
Selvala's Stampede is sweet because you will always get your value creatures. The only thing is maybe to take out Kederekt Leviathan because all your creatures will get bounced if you end up casting this at an inconvenient time.
I've seen a lot of people find Mind's Dilation very underwhelming, but I'm still tempted to try it. Maybe in more so of a creatureless ramp shell:
Seems competitive enough. Stall early with Whelming Wave and Moment's Peace. I'm just worried how effective this deck will be if you don't see a Mind's Dilation until 6+ turns.
You have 4 Mystic Remoras, 2 Trade Secrets, 4 Windfalls, 3 Skullwinders, and 4 Mind's Dilations. To not see it before T6+ would be incredibly bad luck, and will not be close to the norm.
@iemsparticus: Very true. In play testing it seems to do fairly consistent. As long as I can get enough lands out to cast it is always the true test. I'm thinking about adding some early game durdles and Elephant Grass to help me out. Switching out Windfall for Day's Undoing to get repeatable Fogs and Shardless Agent triggers seems smart. Maybe a single Centaur Glade or Orochi Hatchery for another form of mana dump and late game activation with Garruk Wildspeaker would be in the mix too.
Creatures (20)
4 Coiling Oracle
1 Yavimaya Elder
1 Skullwinder
2 Mystic Snake
1 Temur Sabertooth
2 Deranged Hermit
2 Deadeye Navigator
4 Sylvan Primordial
2 Avenger of Zendikar
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
4 Mystic Remora
4 Windfall
1 Dense Foliage
2 Genesis Wave
1 Opposition
Lands (24)
1 Alchemist's Refuge
9 Forest
4 Hinterland Harbor
4 Island
2 Simic Growth Chamber
4 Temple of Mystery
The deck still has fun combos with ole Deadeye Navigator and you can bounce all your stuff with Temur Sabertooth (I do have 2xCloudstone Curio though). Obviously Burgeoning+Windfall+Mystic Remora can help fuel turn 3 Sylvan Primordials which from then on is probably game. I have Rhystic Study in a few of my other decks, but I was also thinking of replacing Genesis Wave and Windfall in place of Rhystic Study+Concordant Crossroads+Dosan the Falling Leaf+Primal Surge since I'll have the lands to easily cast it.
What are everyone's UG decks looking like? I like Prophet of Kruphix, but sometimes the card bores me and is TOO oppressive when combined with token makers and Opposition to lock everyone out of only playing instants on their turns.
I recommend trying a build with 8x Bouncelands and Summer Bloom (at least 2) over Coiling Oracle. It's irrelevant if you can't use the additional colored sources for anything other than colorless mana. Bouncelands are amazing in Burgeoning decks because otherwise it's difficult to reliably untap with 4+ lands in play for turn 2. Your nut draw is something along the lines of "Land, Burgeoning, Bounceland, Bounceland, Mystic Remora, Windfall/Day's Undoing." Turn 2 you untap with 5 mana in play and can jam Mystic Remora + Day's Undoing immediately. All else fails you jam a turn 2 Summer Bloom and ramp like boss then re-fuel with either Mystic Remora or Windfall.
Breeding Pool makes the deck a lot more unfair. I don't like recommending expensive lands if I don't have to but when you run 4x Sylvan Primordial + DENs/Sabertooth adding extra Forests makes a significant difference. If you could remove 4x Island for 4x Breeding Pool it would make the deck substantially better. In an ideal world you want 14 or more lands that can cast Burgeoning on turn 1. Even things like Aether Hub are fantastic because that card pairs amazingly well with your 8x Bouncelands and Summer Blooms. I usually run 2 myself (I currently run Crumbling Vestige but Aether Hub is strictly better). Gemstone Mine, Tendo Ice Bridge, anything that enables you to cast your spells on-curve is great since you can constantly bounce them as needed.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Creatures (13)
2x Mnemonic Wall
4x Simic Sky Swallower
4x Sylvan Primordial
1x Stormtide Leviathan
2x Inkwell Leviathan
Spells (23)
4x Burgeoning
4x Mystic Remora
1x Spell Burst
4x Summer Bloom
4x Day's Undoing
4x Whelming Wave
2x Plasm Capture
2x Aether Hub
10x Forest
3x Izzet Boilerworks
1x Gruul Turf
4x Simic Growth Chamber
4x Temple of Mystery
Decks seems pretty sweet so far in testing. I obviously had to put the Whelming Wave+Mnemonic Wall combo in there. I'm okay with Sylvan Primordial continuously getting bounced so that I can keep destroying key permanents. I think the threat level is okay. I'm drawing and reshuffling cards like crazy so it's hard not do draw into something this way.
Day's Undoing is actually quite bad in your new deck. It dismantles your Whelming Wave combo and since it exiles itself you can't recur it with Archaeomancer. Windfall is way better in your new list.
It's largely irrelevant. The new deck that you posted is base-Blue so probably 3 Blue ones and 1 Green one. None of the "splash" colors are relevant so it doesn't matter which ones.
That's fine, but then how are you justifying 4x Burgeoning and 4x Summer Bloom if you can't reliably abuse them? Maybe the deck works fine with only 4 but that seems a bit loose to me.
FWIW Aether Hub et al. are way better when you can reliably bounce them. Assuming that you only field 4 Bouncelands that's going to be easier said than done.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
I added in the 4 extra bounce lands in the previous list. It is insane when you can get 6+ mana from them on turn 2.
You could always try and split and see how they fare. Personally I would play 4x Windfall in a deck with Archaeomancers since filling your GY is actively good whereas shuffling it away is actively bad. In that sense I don't really understand the switch. After all, the deck has so much draw so who cares if you bin some critters?
Btw Plasm Capture seems rather superfluous and reasonably hard to cast. You could still run some permission/interaction if you wanted but IMO this deck needs Beast Within more than it needs a 4 CMC ramp spell. 4x Burg 4x Bloom should suffice. Hell, 4x Bloom is probably overkill (like I said in my initial reply I typically only run 2).
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
4 Sage of Fables
4 Glen Elendra Archmage
4 Psychosis Crawler
4 Consecrated Sphinx
1 Sylvan Primordial
1 Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur
4 Burgeoning
4 Mystic Remora
1 Cyclonic Rift
4 Windfall
1 Rite of Replication
4 Mind's Dilation
4 Azorius Chancery
4 Breeding Pool
5 Forest
6 Island
1 Reliquary Tower
4 Simic Growth Chamber
Turn 3 Mind's Dilation seems absurd .
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Creatures (14)
2x Skullwinder
4x Simic Sky Swallower
4x Sylvan Primordial
2x Stormtide Leviathan
2x Inkwell Leviathan
Spells (23)
4x Burgeoning
4x Mystic Remora
1x Spell Burst
2x Summer Bloom
2x Beast Within
4x Windfall
4x Whelming Wave
1x Biorhythm
2x Aether Hub
10x Forest
3x Izzet Boilerworks
1x Gruul Turf
4x Simic Growth Chamber
4x Temple of Mystery
Good call on Mind's Dilation. I run that in a UB Eldrazi deck, but I think it would be rather good in here too. Is there a good card I can use to dump all that mana with? Soul of Zendikar? Kamahl, Fist of Krosa with WW would be pretty lol.
Kessig Wolf Run, Capsize, Deadeye Navigator, Memnarch
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Creatures (15)
2x Skullwinder
4x Simic Sky Swallower
4x Sylvan Primordial
1x Stormtide Leviathan
2x Kederekt Leviathan
2x Inkwell Leviathan
Spells (21)
4x Burgeoning
4x Mystic Remora
1x Spell Burst
2x Summer Bloom
4x Windfall
4x Whelming Wave
2x Selvala's Stampede
1x Aether Hub
6x Forest
3x Izzet Boilerworks
1x Gruul Turf
1x Kessig Wolf Run
4x Simic Growth Chamber
4x Temple of Mystery
4x Breeding Pool
Selvala's Stampede is sweet because you will always get your value creatures. The only thing is maybe to take out Kederekt Leviathan because all your creatures will get bounced if you end up casting this at an inconvenient time.
I've seen a lot of people find Mind's Dilation very underwhelming, but I'm still tempted to try it. Maybe in more so of a creatureless ramp shell:
Creatures (3)
3x Skullwinder
Spells (33)
4x Burgeoning
4x Mystic Remora
1x Spell Burst
2x Summer Bloom
1x Cyclonic Rift
2x Moment's Peace
3x Beast Within
2x Trade Secrets
4x Windfall
4x Whelming Wave
2x Garruk Wildspeaker
4x Mind's Dilation
1x Aether Hub
10x Forest
1x Gruul Turf
3x Izzet Boilerworks
1x Kessig Wolf Run
4x Simic Growth Chamber
4x Temple of Mystery
Seems competitive enough. Stall early with Whelming Wave and Moment's Peace. I'm just worried how effective this deck will be if you don't see a Mind's Dilation until 6+ turns.
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cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Creatures (4)
4x Shardless Agent
Spells (32)
2x Summer Bloom
4x Burgeoning
3x Elephant Grass
4x Mystic Remora
1x Cyclonic Rift
2x Moment's Peace
4x Day's Undoing
2x Trade Secrets
3x Beast Within
2x Garruk Wildspeaker
1x Centaur Glade
4x Mind's Dilation
1x Aether Hub
6x Forest
1x Kessig Wolf Run
4x Temple of Mystery
4x Exotic Orchard
2x Gruul Turf
2x Izzet Boilerworks
4x Simic Growth Chamber