MTG Salvation

Greetings all,

I have been excited by all of the recent cards being printed in B/W. While I already have one Orzhov B/W deck, it is creature-less control. I wanted to try out a more creature based approach. This is what I am working on thus far. Keep in mind that about half the decks in this meta contain 6+ wraths so the deck needs to be able to recover from/survive that. I know skullclamp can be a bit too powerful (or weak depending on the opposition), but this seems like the perfect deck for it.

Been jamming a similar deck myself. 4x Ayli is far too many in my preliminary tests because the card isn't actually all that great unless you're already winning. She's a fine 1-2 of but I think that running 4 is a big mistake Oh, and yes, I recognize the fact that she can always trade off with other creatures. In practice you should always have the board anyways (barring mass removal) so that's rarely been relevant for me in my games.

It's nitpicky but I actually prefer Blood Artist to ZC in Genesis Chamber decks. It's no big deal either way and both cards would work fine.

Vizkopa Guildmage is more of a 6 drop than a 2 drop (and a conditional 6 drop at that) so I don't usually run more than 2.

I really like Ajani's Pridemate. I usually run the full 4.

What about adding a Oreskos Explorer Emeria, the Sky Ruin package and increasing your Godless Shrine count to 4?

If you run 3 Return to the Ranks add something that gives all creatures haste, or lifelink, or both.

whip of erebos
path of bravery
Akroma's Memorial

Adding onto the Oreskos Explorer idea:
Scrubland

A solid mana combo if you have a way to find "any land" instead of "basic lands":
urborg, tomb of yawgmoth
cabal coffers
expedition map

I think the mana base should be made simpler, if anything. You're playing two colors and realistically all you need to do is guarantee W on turn 1 and WB by turn 3. Scoured Barrens seems like a free upgrade to Orzhov Basilica. With 4 Skullclamp it's not like you need the 2-for-1 the bounce lands give you. I don't know how much trouble you'll have keeping your life total high, but all those painlands and shocklands might turn Ayli off more often than you'd like.

Thrull Parasite is only there to Extort and you could just as easily replace it with Tithe Drinker if you still want something you can cash in to the Clamp later on. This means you can skew your landbase a little more towards white and help guarantee that T1 Warden. I wouldn't go with more complicated engines because Return to the Ranks will put you massively ahead on life as soon as it resolves. The deck looks sick overall though, and these are all just minor gripes.

Quote from thomeyis »

I think the mana base should be made simpler, if anything. You're playing two colors and realistically all you need to do is guarantee W on turn 1 and WB by turn 3. Scoured Barrens seems like a free upgrade to Orzhov Basilica. With 4 Skullclamp it's not like you need the 2-for-1 the bounce lands give you. I don't know how much trouble you'll have keeping your life total high, but all those painlands and shocklands might turn Ayli off more often than you'd like.

Thrull Parasite is only there to Extort and you could just as easily replace it with Tithe Drinker if you still want something you can cash in to the Clamp later on. This means you can skew your landbase a little more towards white and help guarantee that T1 Warden. I wouldn't go with more complicated engines because Return to the Ranks will put you massively ahead on life as soon as it resolves. The deck looks sick overall though, and these are all just minor gripes.

If you add Tithe Drinker you can even consider maindecking/sideboarding some Immortal Servitudes. The card is beastly!

I decided to take the deck Abzan because who doesn't like to stress a mana base to its limits. I dropped the genesis chambers and switched to abzan ascendancy and spirit bonds for more wrath protection/recovery (and to avoid the oppressiveness that is chamber + clamps). It is unfortunate that spirit bonds can't save Karlov (it should have stated non-token rather than non-spirit) but I digress. I wanted a place to put siege rhino now that he's a dollar and didn't want to build a whole new deck just for him so in he went.

I have an Emeria deck already (at least mostly built) and traded off my spare coffers so this is going to stick to an unfortunately painful mana base. All the life gain should make up for it tenfold however.

This is what I am thinking for the deck, the only land I still need is the temple garden (mine is in another deck). Alternative thoughts on the mana base to help ensure a turn 1 Soul Sister and a Karlov by at least turn 3 (preferably t2) and a turn 4 rhino? Fetches and true duals are not an option nor are more shocks.

I know that it's not budget-friendly but I have to point out the synergy between Spirit Bonds and Bloodghast (in addition to Clamp, Ascendancy, on and on and on). I've never found a Spirit Bonds deck that I've actually liked until I started pairing it with the 'Ghast.

Tempting, I actually own two copies of bloodghast. Is it just the ability to sac him to make anyone else indestructible repeatedly that makes him good with spirit bonds or the ability to turn lands into more spirit tokens (or the gestalt)? Seems tough to cast, but maybe just discard him to a full hand.

Not sure what to drop then probably cutthroats or essence wardens. Would it be better to run a different token engine than spirit bonds if I don't run the bloodghasts? More ascendancys or maybe lingering souls?

Quote from CoolLink19 »

Tempting, I actually own two copies of bloodghast. Is it just the ability to sac him to make anyone else indestructible repeatedly that makes him good with spirit bonds or the ability to turn lands into more spirit tokens (or the gestalt)? Seems tough to cast, but maybe just discard him to a full hand.

It's everything. No one individual synergy is broken but their combination makes the card formidable.

He's not that tough to cast and he's not even a 2 drop really. Even if you cast him on turn 4 that's fine. He can't block and attacking for 2 isn't relevant so there's no need to run him out early on.

Quote from CoolLink19 »

Not sure what to drop then probably cutthroats or essence wardens. Would it be better to run a different token engine than spirit bonds if I don't run the bloodghasts? More ascendancys or maybe lingering souls?

I think that Spirit Bonds sucks in general so yes, I would definitely cut it if you don't add Ghasts.

I agree that Abzan Rally is tight for deck slots but there's room to fit everything. For starter you want 4x draw 4x value 4x recursion which would basically be 4x Skullclamp 4x Abzan Ascendancy and for recursion it could be anything from Return to the Ranks to Living Death but 4x Ranks will work just fine. Assuming that you cut bonds that makes room for your Ascendancies but since you still need 2x revival slots the only cuts are 1x Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim (1 is the right number in my testing) and the only other flex slot is Essence Warden so one of those has to go.

Lingering Souls + Abzan Ascendancy is too much of a nonbo so I don't recommend playing both in the same deck.

For what it's worth I'd also cut the other Essence Warden for a land. Also, yes, the difference between a free effect such as Ascendancy and a "pay" effect such as Spirit Bonds is the difference between "competitive" and "unplayable trash."

I think I'll leave the bloodghasts out and remove the spirit bonds. I could trade the ghasts for half of a new deck since the price has jumped on them. Spirit bonds made more sense before I added green, but abzan ascendancy is way better as wrath protection giving me an army of spirits that can be used to convoke return to the ranks to get everything else (except poor siege rhino) back.



Dropped the Essence Wardens, 10 sisters is probably overkill. I like Ayli as an answer to problematic non-creature permanents. One may be the correct number, but I think I'll stick with 2 for now. Having another land may make the mana base more stable, but time will tell if I drop her down to a single copy.

Is there a version of this deck that doesn't use Skullclamp for those of us who follow some semblance of a ban list? I had a B/W Humans deck that used Mesmeric Orb to fill up the graveyard before casting or resurrecting an Angel of Glory's Rise, but too many of the creatures that work with this strategy aren't humans. Maybe skew things more toward 2 CMC and pack Immortal Servitude for X=2 with all your self-mill?

Vampiric rites and/or well of lost dreams might work. Grim Haruspex works for the non-token deaths. Mentor of the meek is another option. Dark Prophecy could work if sticking to just B/W (too hard to cast for abzan).

I don't have a specific banned list, but build all of my multiplayer decks to be of roughly equal power level. Clamp may be too powerful for legacy and modern, but multiplayer is a completely different format. When creature based decks need to be able to survive against decks packing 6-10 wraths with card draw such as mystic remora and syphon mind (another option btw), clamp doesn't seem so overpowered.

Quote from thomeyis »

Is there a version of this deck that doesn't use Skullclamp for those of us who follow some semblance of a ban list? I had a B/W Humans deck that used Mesmeric Orb to fill up the graveyard before casting or resurrecting an Angel of Glory's Rise, but too many of the creatures that work with this strategy aren't humans. Maybe skew things more toward 2 CMC and pack Immortal Servitude for X=2 with all your self-mill?

You can absolutely play the deck w/o Clamp. Any 4 draw spells will work. Well of Lost Dreams is a perfectly playable option and so are things like Syphon Mind (given enough players). Mentor of the Meek, Bygone Bishop, Collected Company, Grim Haruspex, Phyrexian Arena, Necrologia, it literally just has to say "draw... card" on it and it will probably work fine.

After playing the deck a bit, I'm going back to B/W. Three colors strained the mana base too much and didn't really add anything that B/W couldn't do on its own. When I handed the deck to newer players, they never wanted to lose a creature to use skullclamp (IDK why). Genesis chamber should resolve that and get them to play the deck more efficiently. The new fast lands are awesome too and I'll definitely be picking them up for this deck.
This is what I'm thinking for the new version. While it can swing in with Karlov for huge amounts, it can also grind out opponents with death triggers. Ghost Council of Orzhova + Genesis Chamber gets several triggers a round for any of the other creatures. This is pretty much the finished version; thought I would post it to help others. Suggestions are always welcome, but I likely won't be changing it.

Quote from CoolLink19 »

When I handed the deck to newer players, they never wanted to lose a creature to use skullclamp (IDK why).

Because they don't understand the value of their actions and see them as being detrimental. Don't forget that when Necropotence was released it was heralded as being one of the worst cards ever printed.

Quote from Prid3 »

Quote from CoolLink19 »

When I handed the deck to newer players, they never wanted to lose a creature to use skullclamp (IDK why).

Because they don't understand the value of their actions and see them as being detrimental.

Yeah, hopefully having the option to clamp myr is more appealing to them since they are 'only tokens'