The most blatantly worthless thing about posting this is that those 20 cards are not the only cards in the deck. The U will be specifically for card draw, and counterspells. Those weren't listed in the shell, because they aren't the shell of the deck.
In that case, here is my favorite Jeskai Control shell:
This deck is a blast to play, and really does some disgusting things - I have greatly undervalued Swans of Bryn Argoll... that card is a major "attack someone else please" blocker, who happens to have evasion... and chains delightfully well into Revs.
I highly recommend this shell to anyone who hasn't tried it.
I am curious - when you posted this, had you actually tried it? It just seemed unlikely that everyone in the group would have been unfamiliar with the card. Particularly with a couple of the recentarticles.
Um, yes, I have tried it. If I hadn't, I wouldn't have been able to say that it is a blast to play, and that it does disgusting things. What kind of a question is that? The situation never actually came up where anyone did actual damage to the Swan other than myself, so my misread never came to light...
What kind of a question is that? The situation never actually came up where anyone did actual damage to the Swan other than myself, so my misread never came to light...
Too pointed of a question? My apologies.
It just seemed incongruous that it was acting as a rattlesnake instead of folks attacking into it for free cards. I was wondering if "tried out" meant goldfished.
What kind of a question is that? The situation never actually came up where anyone did actual damage to the Swan other than myself, so my misread never came to light...
Too pointed of a question? My apologies.
It just seemed incongruous that it was acting as a rattlesnake instead of folks attacking into it for free cards. I was wondering if "tried out" meant goldfished.
Yeah... I thought it WOULD act as a rattlesnake card - but like I said, the situation never really arose. The board stayed pretty clear, and Boros Reckoner is a rattlesnake himself. I'm glad it never did come up... I would have felt silly.
I understand your definition. I'm just calling it impractical.
Just because it's not easy to use and/or understand doesn't mean that it's wrong or bad. If it provides additional benefits and possess no significant drawbacks once learned then the practical applications are obvious.
I wasn't naming a specific deck, but rather explaining how I would specifically categorize a specific subset of decks. I would call anti-Show decks "Anti-Show X" where X is the appropriate label to provide the deck.
And just because it's impractical does not mean that it is too hard to understand. If you're dead set on throwing around fallacies, at least get the fallacies right.
I did get it right. You said that it was impractical, i.e that it's difficult to use. The exact quote that I used was "it's not easy to useand/or understand." Not use AND understand, use and/OR understand. That is, is if a system is a difficult to use, it's still considered to be impractical according to the definition that I provided. Keep grasping at straws.
The 1-of Terminus has actually been greatly over performing for me. This deck is a blast to play, and really does some disgusting things - I have greatly undervalued Swans of Bryn Argoll... that card is a major "attack someone else please" blocker, who happens to have evasion... and chains delightfully well into Revs.
I highly recommend this shell to anyone who hasn't tried it.
I want to thank you for asking your original question. I've recently returned to the game after a long hiatus and have been running Pauper mono-G and GW decks. While they do fine in 1v1 or 2HG, they just can't compete in some of our larger (5-6) FFA matches and have been looking at expanding into something different to surprise my meta and Jeskai/America has been in the back of my head for a few days.
I suppose I have a question though, why run the fetch lands that ping rather than a dual-land like Azorius Guildgate or Azorius Chancery? I recognize you're far more likely to regain the life throughout the course of the game.
I suppose I have a question though, why run the fetch lands that ping rather than a dual-land like Azorius Guildgate or Azorius Chancery? I recognize you're far more likely to regain the life throughout the course of the game.
The fetches provide far more consistency and flexibility over the course of the game. If I draw an Azorius Guildgate I am locked into playing a u/w ETB tapped land. If I draw a Flooded Strand, I can play Island, Plains, Hallowed Fountain (and choose to have it ETB tapped or not), Sacred Foundry (and again, choose ETB or not), or Steam Vents tapped or not. And I can do it any time, in response to something, which means I don't have to commit to any one color/combo of colors too early.
They are certainly not needed: you could totally play Mystic Monastery, gain lands, guild gates, bounce lands, check lands, etc... And that is probably a particularly reasonable way to go if you don't own the fetches already, because they cost a zillion dollars.
Indeed, I don't own any fetch lands and I don't know if the group I play with would be willing to part with any of theirs. Haha. Mystic Monastery was one I was looking to add as well as some of the other dual-lands I can afford.
That's definitely good advice. I have always been pleased with bounce lands. Not so fun to have an opening hand full of them, but in so far as you are running 6 combined, that's not likely to happen much.
Meh I wouldn't play six Karoos in this style of deck. You don't have many early game plays at all and since you're always on the draw you can't just run them out on turn 2 or 3 w/o discarding to hand size. By the time that you want to cast them it's usually like turn 5 or 6 but even then it's hard to actually cast one and resolve a spell which can sometimes be problematic. Again, normally you can just slam ETBT lands early on and not have to think twice about it but you just can't do that with Karoos. You need to cast a spell first and when your deck starts at 3 or 4 that's often very awkward.
Personally I play Exotic Orchards, tri-lands and Reflecting Pools in my 3 color decks but that's because I'm willing to do some legwork and swap them across all of them. The initial investment always sucks but the manabase is basically good "forever" so I'm happy enough about it. Orchards aren't too bad and if you look long + hard enough you can find $5 Pools from Conspiracy. Tri-lands obviously aren't free either but I mean Magic just isn't a fun game if you can't blow some real paper money on decks every now and then. The 12 "tri-lands" (8 of which ETBU) is usually enough to fulfill color reqs so the rest of the mana base can often be bad/cheap stuff (up to and including basics). I know that dropping ~$30.00 on Orchards and Pools is annoying but if you're going to build decks and play MTG for decades then it's hard to go wrong with it. It's obviously not perfect, some % of the time it doesn't pan out, but for something that I paid ~30 bucks for I'm happy enough with the results.
Meh I wouldn't play six Karoos in this style of deck. You don't have many early game plays at all and since you're always on the draw you can't just run them out on turn 2 or 3 w/o discarding to hand size. By the time that you want to cast them it's usually like turn 5 or 6 but even then it's hard to actually cast one and resolve a spell which can sometimes be problematic. Again, normally you can just slam ETBT lands early on and not have to think twice about it but you just can't do that with Karoos. You need to cast a spell first and when your deck starts at 3 or 4 that's often very awkward.
Personally I play Exotic Orchards, tri-lands and Reflecting Pools in my 3 color decks but that's because I'm willing to do some legwork and swap them across all of them. The initial investment always sucks but the manabase is basically good "forever" so I'm happy enough about it. Orchards aren't too bad and if you look long + hard enough you can find $5 Pools from Conspiracy. Tri-lands obviously aren't free either but I mean Magic just isn't a fun game if you can't blow some real paper money on decks every now and then. The 12 "tri-lands" (8 of which ETBU) is usually enough to fulfill color reqs so the rest of the mana base can often be bad/cheap stuff (up to and including basics). I know that dropping ~$30.00 on Orchards and Pools is annoying but if you're going to build decks and play MTG for decades then it's hard to go wrong with it. It's obviously not perfect, some % of the time it doesn't pan out, but for something that I paid ~30 bucks for I'm happy enough with the results.
Meh I wouldn't play six Karoos in this style of deck.
Neither would I... I would play my fetches and shocks.
Seriously, though, you make a decent point. It never feels good to force a spell or discard. You do have a few early plays, so orchards and pools would be good budget alternative.
I do fully support investing in mana base. It makes a huge difference.
And that's not even counting what happens if you're not already at 7 cards in which case the bounceland practically reads "draw a land".
Don't get me wrong, I like free 2-for-1s, it's just I find that that a lot of MP deck have like literally no 1-3 drops (nothing that you'd actually cast anyways) so a huge % of the time you just plain cannot cast them early without losing a card. While I've been known to run the old turn 2 Night's Whisper myself that's only when I'm playing a deck that can actually puts it GY to use (Animate Dead for example). If this deck had oh, say, Dig Through Time, sure, looting is fine. I'll trade a random card for a "Demonic Tutor." Still, with no Delve, no recursion, etc. I'm not thrilled about the prospect of discarding.
Hey guys, been playing around with this and having a ton of fun. I've found the bounce lands with Halimar Depths in play makes for a lot of help. Looking to swap in some shock lands, I've found that not having one of the few basic lands I have in the deck out makes for a slower game play in terms of having Clifftop Retreat, Glacial Fortress, or Sulfur Falls ETB tapped. Here's the current land base I've been running:
Hey guys, been playing around with this and having a ton of fun. I've found the bounce lands with Halimar Depths in play makes for a lot of help. Looking to swap in some shock lands, I've found that not having one of the few basic lands I have in the deck out makes for a slower game play in terms of having Clifftop Retreat, Glacial Fortress, or Sulfur Falls ETB tapped. Here's the current land base I've been running:
I would start with building up a playset of Sacred Foundry. It will turn on all of your check lands, and U is your splash color here, making Sacred Foundry the best shock land in the deck by a good margin. I would probably just start losing the gain lands for them, myself.
FYI: The mana base in the list I posted is an extremely optimized modern legal setup. If I was a rich man, I would get myself a legacy land base, but the modern mana base is pretty fast itself... just more painful. It has access to the exact amount of each color it needs to be able to cast things on curve (if need be) 90% of the time. As you make the move to buy into a more expensive mana base, keep this in mind. That being said, notice that I am playing 4x Sacred Foundry.
I'll allow the thread necro this time, but I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for the poster to answer to your question about Swans. The last time they posted was in February 2017.
I know, that this thread is 3 years old now. But is there still anybody out there using this kind of build? On my quest on building a good MTG Multiplayer Deck for each color combination I am still struggling with Jeskai.
Did you ever deck yourself with the Swans?
I brewed something very similar and I am open to suggestions
I don't think it is likely, as they will be dead from reckoner damage by then.
Star doesn't work in this deck AFAIK though. You lack the ramp for it, all of the traditional spells in the deck top out at CMC4 and you are adding a 7 mana spell into the mix without accounting for that.
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Pauper: UB Wight Phantasm RB Burn UR Faerie Rites of Initiation
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Because THAT is intelligent counterpoint to my argument... Well played sir... #turnoffsarcasmnow
Um, yes, I have tried it. If I hadn't, I wouldn't have been able to say that it is a blast to play, and that it does disgusting things. What kind of a question is that? The situation never actually came up where anyone did actual damage to the Swan other than myself, so my misread never came to light...
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Yeah... I thought it WOULD act as a rattlesnake card - but like I said, the situation never really arose. The board stayed pretty clear, and Boros Reckoner is a rattlesnake himself. I'm glad it never did come up... I would have felt silly.
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Well, right here for one thing:
Just because it's not easy to use and/or understand doesn't mean that it's wrong or bad. If it provides additional benefits and possess no significant drawbacks once learned then the practical applications are obvious.
Grapeshot Elves.
UB/g ANT.
I wasn't naming a specific deck, but rather explaining how I would specifically categorize a specific subset of decks. I would call anti-Show decks "Anti-Show X" where X is the appropriate label to provide the deck.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
I did get it right. You said that it was impractical, i.e that it's difficult to use. The exact quote that I used was "it's not easy to use and/or understand." Not use AND understand, use and/OR understand. That is, is if a system is a difficult to use, it's still considered to be impractical according to the definition that I provided. Keep grasping at straws.
No, just Grapeshot Elves.
B/u Control
You don't think it's relevant to know whether or not a Merfolk deck has access to generic creature removal?
Jeskai Fiend.
Just MUD.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
I want to thank you for asking your original question. I've recently returned to the game after a long hiatus and have been running Pauper mono-G and GW decks. While they do fine in 1v1 or 2HG, they just can't compete in some of our larger (5-6) FFA matches and have been looking at expanding into something different to surprise my meta and Jeskai/America has been in the back of my head for a few days.
The fetches provide far more consistency and flexibility over the course of the game. If I draw an Azorius Guildgate I am locked into playing a u/w ETB tapped land. If I draw a Flooded Strand, I can play Island, Plains, Hallowed Fountain (and choose to have it ETB tapped or not), Sacred Foundry (and again, choose ETB or not), or Steam Vents tapped or not. And I can do it any time, in response to something, which means I don't have to commit to any one color/combo of colors too early.
They are certainly not needed: you could totally play Mystic Monastery, gain lands, guild gates, bounce lands, check lands, etc... And that is probably a particularly reasonable way to go if you don't own the fetches already, because they cost a zillion dollars.
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
That's definitely good advice. I have always been pleased with bounce lands. Not so fun to have an opening hand full of them, but in so far as you are running 6 combined, that's not likely to happen much.
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Personally I play Exotic Orchards, tri-lands and Reflecting Pools in my 3 color decks but that's because I'm willing to do some legwork and swap them across all of them. The initial investment always sucks but the manabase is basically good "forever" so I'm happy enough about it. Orchards aren't too bad and if you look long + hard enough you can find $5 Pools from Conspiracy. Tri-lands obviously aren't free either but I mean Magic just isn't a fun game if you can't blow some real paper money on decks every now and then. The 12 "tri-lands" (8 of which ETBU) is usually enough to fulfill color reqs so the rest of the mana base can often be bad/cheap stuff (up to and including basics). I know that dropping ~$30.00 on Orchards and Pools is annoying but if you're going to build decks and play MTG for decades then it's hard to go wrong with it. It's obviously not perfect, some % of the time it doesn't pan out, but for something that I paid ~30 bucks for I'm happy enough with the results.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Neither would I... I would play my fetches and shocks.
Seriously, though, you make a decent point. It never feels good to force a spell or discard. You do have a few early plays, so orchards and pools would be good budget alternative.
I do fully support investing in mana base. It makes a huge difference.
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Don't get me wrong, I like free 2-for-1s, it's just I find that that a lot of MP deck have like literally no 1-3 drops (nothing that you'd actually cast anyways) so a huge % of the time you just plain cannot cast them early without losing a card. While I've been known to run the old turn 2 Night's Whisper myself that's only when I'm playing a deck that can actually puts it GY to use (Animate Dead for example). If this deck had oh, say, Dig Through Time, sure, looting is fine. I'll trade a random card for a "Demonic Tutor." Still, with no Delve, no recursion, etc. I'm not thrilled about the prospect of discarding.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
2x Boros Garrison
2x Clifftop Retreat
2x Glacial Fortress
1x Halimar Depths
1x Island
2x Izzet Boilerworks
1x Mountain
4x Mystic Monastery
2x Plains
2x Sulfur Falls
2x Swiftwater Cliffs
2x Tranquil Cove
I would start with building up a playset of Sacred Foundry. It will turn on all of your check lands, and U is your splash color here, making Sacred Foundry the best shock land in the deck by a good margin. I would probably just start losing the gain lands for them, myself.
FYI: The mana base in the list I posted is an extremely optimized modern legal setup. If I was a rich man, I would get myself a legacy land base, but the modern mana base is pretty fast itself... just more painful. It has access to the exact amount of each color it needs to be able to cast things on curve (if need be) 90% of the time. As you make the move to buy into a more expensive mana base, keep this in mind. That being said, notice that I am playing 4x Sacred Foundry.
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Deck is still sweet. Only change I am making is Brainstorm for Preordain.
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
3x Arid Mesa
2x Clifftop Retreat
2x Flooded Strand
2x Scalding Tarn
1x Hallowed Fountain
3x Celestial Colonnade
1x Island
1x Mountain
2x Plains
4x Sacred Foundry
2x Steam Vents
2x Sulfur Falls
4x Boros Reckoner
3x Soulfire Grand Master
4x Swans of Bryn Argoll
Other Spells (24):
4x Blasphemous Act
2x Chain Reaction
2x Dissipate
2x Return to Dust
1x Austere Command
2x Rolling Earthquake
1x Final Judgment
1x Elixir of Immortality
4x Sphinx's Revelation
1x Terminus
4x Brainstorm
Updated decklist.
Changes are Brainstorm in for Preordain, and Rolling Earthquake in for Earthquake.
PSA: Rolling Earthquake was reprinted, so its now super cheap. >:)
My Powered 610 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
I don't think it is likely, as they will be dead from reckoner damage by then.
Star doesn't work in this deck AFAIK though. You lack the ramp for it, all of the traditional spells in the deck top out at CMC4 and you are adding a 7 mana spell into the mix without accounting for that.
UB Wight Phantasm
RB Burn
UR Faerie Rites of Initiation
Legacy:
R Burn
CG-Post