I am looking for some help in defeating a guy in our play group each week. He's the guy that always plays either life gain, infinite mana (G/U), or white enchantments. Most of the time it is life gain. We usually play team games with two players and four teams. Oh and did I mention that fog and holy day are always in this guys hands? I need some ideas of a build I can make to stop all the madness. Trying to get everybody to attack him each turn isn't working. Maybe something with direct damage? or infect or something? I appreciate the help!
You don't HAVE to use that mana base... you can actually just sleeve 26 Swamps if you can't get any of the other lands and need to make it more budgety... but the power of the deck increases significantly with Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, and Unholy Grotto pairs amazingly with Fleshbags, Wights, and Merchants.
Personally, I refuse to play a deck that is targeted at one specific deck. Why bother? The minute the player stops playing his lifegain deck, all of this is wasted. I recommend the MBC deck because it is good all by itself, and doesn't happen to allow people to abuse dumb strategies like Fog and the like. You just play your deck, and win, no matter what decks the others sleeve up. Why meta your deck so much to focus on one dude's deck and leave yourself open to literally everything else? I don't get it.
Personally, I refuse to play a deck that is targeted at one specific deck. Why bother? The minute the player stops playing his lifegain deck, all of this is wasted. I recommend the MBC deck because it is good all by itself, and doesn't happen to allow people to abuse dumb strategies like Fog and the like. You just play your deck, and win, no matter what decks the others sleeve up. Why meta your deck so much to focus on one dude's deck and leave yourself open to literally everything else? I don't get it.
Basically this. If anything you just play 1-2x Sorin Markov in your MBC deck if lifegain is absolutely running rampant. That's it. You don't need to play some horrendous Everlasting Tormet + Rain of Gore monstrosity that literally can't beat a Grizzly Bears. Like, I have no idea if anyone has ever played a deck with Breath of Malfegor and Everlasting Torment and crap because those kinds of decks are horrendous. Your deck is full of do-nothings that affect 1-2 players tops whereas everyone else has a super easy win against you. It's moronic and nonsensical.
I never blindly recommend Skullclamp or any other cards that are on the Legacy B&R list, because if those cards are on the table, every deck looks so different, and is FAR more competitive. Like, if you can run 4x Skullclamp, why in the world are you wasting time with Mono Black Devotion???
Dark Depths + Vampire Hexmage is big game, but it's also gross. I am not sure what the players around your table are like, but it seems pretty oppressive for casual games.
Basing nearly all damage output on pingers means Fog effects almost never matter, and the wither effect of Everlasting Torment will nearly always work in your favor. Add Basilisk Collar and you've got murder on a stick, and gains you life if you haven't already played an enchantment. Counters might be replaced with burn, bounce, Fog Bank/Guard Gomazoa, or more enchantments, depending on how the deck works out.
You don't need to play some horrendous Everlasting Tormet + Rain of Gore monstrosity that literally can't beat a Grizzly Bears. Like, I have no idea if anyone has ever played a deck with Breath of Malfegor and Everlasting Torment and crap because those kinds of decks are horrendous. Your deck is full of do-nothings that affect 1-2 players tops whereas everyone else has a super easy win against you. It's moronic and nonsensical.
Actually, I don't wanna start that discussion, but...totally veto! If you go for the most effective cards with the highest win chance, then you could say that those cards are uneffective, bad choices or will cause you to loose. But moronic and nonsensical? No. There are playgroups that are not like a swim in a shark pool but have a lower competetive level. Some people build on budget. Some people like building around "not so common" cards. Some people don't want every deck of them becoming some kind of holy "Excalibur" that shatters their foes and crushes their enemies but just want to have another small fun deck that they can grab from time to time. With the expectation of having fun and not the expectation of a certain win.
Saying this Breath of Malfegor and especially Everlasting Torment are cards that can be part of a nice casual deck. Everlasting Torment is useless? Crumbling Ashes, Necroskitter, Kulrath Knight, all interesting synergies. And Breath of Malfegor is an instant that scored me more than one win, casting one just before my turn began and one in my upkeep, dealing 10 points of surprise damage with a mana base of 5 mana. And yes, my playgroup is not the shark pool but they're no kittens either.
So imho those cards have their place and are not useless in general.
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4 Leechridden Swamp
3 Unholy Grotto
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
15 Swamp
Creatures (22):
4 Thrull Parasite
3 Nantuko Shade
3 Wight of Precinct Six
3 Vampire Nighthawk
3 Fleshbag Marauder
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
4 Gray Merchant of Asphodel
3 Tendrils of Corruption
3 Exsanguinate
2 Dictate of Erebos
4 Underworld Connections
You don't HAVE to use that mana base... you can actually just sleeve 26 Swamps if you can't get any of the other lands and need to make it more budgety... but the power of the deck increases significantly with Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, and Unholy Grotto pairs amazingly with Fleshbags, Wights, and Merchants.
If you want to put a little more money into the deck, you can add an Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, replace Underworld Connections with Phyrexian Arenas, and use Grave Pact instead of Dictate of Erebos... but the deck will still perform quite well without those changes. I also use Bloodchief Ascension in place of Thrull Parasite, because that card can win games all by itself.
My Powered 630 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Multiplayer: WBG Junk Rites -- G Lurking Predators Ramp -- WB Orzhov Exsanguinate -- WUB Esper Master Transmuter -- WU Azorius Tokens
Everlasting Torment
Leyline Of Punishment
Mill can be a nice option as well if you can find a good mill list that can do well with multiplayer games.
My meta: 3 or 4 player free for all, anything goes but boring games or broken decks cause a vote to end that game.
Don't play Rain of Gore. Thanks to the actual rules for lifelink, lifelink won't trigger the ability of Rain of Gore.
You can pair it Everlasting Torment with Void, Breath of Malfegor and in case of big creatures Delirium and Backlash.
But there is also Repay in Kind, Soul Conduit and Reverse the Sands (which is really fun in multiplayer if you get to cast it).
My Powered 630 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
Basically this. If anything you just play 1-2x Sorin Markov in your MBC deck if lifegain is absolutely running rampant. That's it. You don't need to play some horrendous Everlasting Tormet + Rain of Gore monstrosity that literally can't beat a Grizzly Bears. Like, I have no idea if anyone has ever played a deck with Breath of Malfegor and Everlasting Torment and crap because those kinds of decks are horrendous. Your deck is full of do-nothings that affect 1-2 players tops whereas everyone else has a super easy win against you. It's moronic and nonsensical.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Dark Depths + Vampire Hexmage is big game, but it's also gross. I am not sure what the players around your table are like, but it seems pretty oppressive for casual games.
My Powered 630 card Vintage Multiplayer Cube
cEDH: WUBR Blue Farm WUBR, UG Kinnan Flips UG, U Urza Scepter U
4x Grim Lavamancer
4x Razorfin Hunter
4x Trinket Mage
4x Gelectrode
2x Basilisk Collar
2x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Meekstone
Enchantments (5)
3x Everlasting Torment
2x Sulfuric Vortex
4x Mana Leak
3x Counterspell
Sorceries (8)
4x Ponder
4x Preordain
Add 20 Land cards of your choice.
Basing nearly all damage output on pingers means Fog effects almost never matter, and the wither effect of Everlasting Torment will nearly always work in your favor. Add Basilisk Collar and you've got murder on a stick, and gains you life if you haven't already played an enchantment. Counters might be replaced with burn, bounce, Fog Bank/Guard Gomazoa, or more enchantments, depending on how the deck works out.
Powered BUG Cube BUG (Thread)
Powered WUR Cube RWU
Powered RUG Cube URG
480 Unpowered shenanigans
EDH:
Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
Gahiji, Honored One
Daretti, Scrap Savant
For Autocarding: Æ û (Lim-Dûl's Vault)
Actually, I don't wanna start that discussion, but...totally veto! If you go for the most effective cards with the highest win chance, then you could say that those cards are uneffective, bad choices or will cause you to loose. But moronic and nonsensical? No. There are playgroups that are not like a swim in a shark pool but have a lower competetive level. Some people build on budget. Some people like building around "not so common" cards. Some people don't want every deck of them becoming some kind of holy "Excalibur" that shatters their foes and crushes their enemies but just want to have another small fun deck that they can grab from time to time. With the expectation of having fun and not the expectation of a certain win.
Saying this Breath of Malfegor and especially Everlasting Torment are cards that can be part of a nice casual deck. Everlasting Torment is useless? Crumbling Ashes, Necroskitter, Kulrath Knight, all interesting synergies. And Breath of Malfegor is an instant that scored me more than one win, casting one just before my turn began and one in my upkeep, dealing 10 points of surprise damage with a mana base of 5 mana. And yes, my playgroup is not the shark pool but they're no kittens either.
So imho those cards have their place and are not useless in general.