Those previous posts got my hype up thinking they were the revised update, so I wasn't expecting it this time. Great read, as always!
Thank you for the kind words! Unfortunately the new guide isn't done just yet but I needed a place where I could work. I'll update the OP when I'm satisfied with what I have .
Hey team, I'm looking for some specific feedback. First of all, what do people think about the new look for the creatures and spell sections? Does color coding help to differentiate between the various power-levels of the cards being discussed? I can obviously tweak the colors/labels so I'd like to hear any and all feedback on the subject. Clearly I blatantly ripped-off the American homeland security index but I personally think that it adds a lot to the guide.
Otherwise I'm curious as to whether or not anyone reads the "General Strategies" section? I'm probably going to re-name it at some point but I'm curious as to whether or not people find those mini-articles helpful. It's entirely possible that no one reads them anyways and that I'm wasting my time but I'd love to hear specific input on that aspect of the guide.
I do read the "General Strategies" section, but the creature and spells lists are my favorite. That yellow color for "Competitive" cards is a bit of an eyesore, though.
I do read the "General Strategies" section, but the creature and spells lists are my favorite. That yellow color for "Competitive" cards is a bit of an eyesore, though.
Yeah I see your point. Does anyone know of a relevant color scheme that I could employ? I realize that I could use any colors insofar as I was consistent but I'd be cool if there was something "proven" that I could borrow.
I do read the "General Strategies" section, but the creature and spells lists are my favorite. That yellow color for "Competitive" cards is a bit of an eyesore, though.
I clicked open all the eight spoilers under "Strongest Creatures and Spells" and checked which cards you list and why.
I like the few-word-reasonings, they attract my attention and help me decide whether a card fits my style and is worth the bother (and euro's).
Ordering in themes and casting costs helps too, just a cold list of cards is too little info.
(I never check the decklists in your guides.)
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In magic there's Harry Dresden, Fizban, Sethra Lavode, Dorotea Senjak and me...
My meta: 3 or 4 player free for all, anything goes but boring games or broken decks cause a vote to end that game.
First of all, thanks a ton for all the work you put in these. They are a great resource for novice and experienced players alike and your reasoning behind choices leads to better understanding of the role of each card.
I mostly read the card lists. I really like the idea of the color code, but I would love it to be a bullet point of the appropriate color instead of what you have now. I have no clue if you can change the colors of bullet points, but it would lighten up the text.
I haven't read the general strategies yet, but looking at the topics I'll definitely get around to it. Never noticed it in your other guides. Have to go look (again!).
I don't usually read the decklists (mostly because all I do is cube now), so can't comment on those.
Once again thanks for the guides, looking forward to the black one
By the way, would you consider doing artifacts and lands? I know CB has one, but it is outdated i believe. And yes, this is just me being needy.
I mostly read the card lists. I really like the idea of the color code, but I would love it to be a bullet point of the appropriate color instead of what you have now. I have no clue if you can change the colors of bullet points, but it would lighten up the text.
Yeah I'm still not sure what the best way to do this is but I know that I want something that I can use to distinguish between the power-levels of the cards at play. I don't think that I can do colored bullet points though.
I don't usually read the decklists (mostly because all I do is cube now), so can't comment on those.
Decklists are my least favorite aspect of this guide. There's so many arbitrary stipulations that I can choose to follow and so it's tough to know what people are looking for. In previous iterations I've had combo decks and such but for the time being the ones listed are all Legacy-legal, don't go infinite and generally don't field cards that cost more than $5.00 USD. Obviously I'm at the mercy of the market forces though and so if I want to build around a card like Lurking Predators then there's literally nothing that I can do about it if it happens to cost a bit more than that.
That being said I have no idea how much of this is relevant. Maybe people like combos. Maybe no one cares about Legality and I should be posting a ton of Skullclamp decks. Maybe most people play Modern. I have no idea. If I'm being brutally honest I would enjoy these guides a lot more if I didn't feel compelled to post decklists.
Once again thanks for the guides, looking forward to the black one
By the way, would you consider doing artifacts and lands? I know CB has one, but it is outdated i believe. And yes, this is just me being needy.
Black is happening in the foreseeable future.
Artifacts is a definite possibility but I think that it would closer to my Gold Cards guide than anything else. I think that lists of relevant cards is probably the best way to present them.
Lands are tough. I personally use this way more than any other resource and think that it's probably the best way to tackle the problem. I know that you're obviously curious about specialty lands such as Academy Ruins and Volrath's Stronghold too but I think that any Land Guide worth its salt would have look something like the one that I just posted and then include info on the relevant "spell lands" afterwards. Full credit to the person who made that land cheat sheet though, I highly recommend it.
If I'm being brutally honest I would enjoy these guides a lot more if I didn't feel compelled to post decklists.
Man, you should just skip that part then! There is already a TON of info to digest in these guides. Also, if you don't post lists, people will have to think for themselves which probably leads to a better understanding of the cards themselves. Or if they have questions, it sparks discussion for the boards. Win win!
If I'm being brutally honest I would enjoy these guides a lot more if I didn't feel compelled to post decklists.
Man, you should just skip that part then! There is already a TON of info to digest in these guides. Also, if you don't post lists, people will have to think for themselves which probably leads to a better understanding of the cards themselves. Or if they have questions, it sparks discussion for the boards. Win win!
I've been messaged by a fair number of lurkers who've expressed gratitude for having easy access to budget-minded decklists. Even if they don't copy them card-for-card is still gives them a rough idea of how to go about building a full deck.
I know lots of people who love the decklists, especially when they are budget oriented. One thing I am constantly told by others when I point them in your direction is that they love the fact that while the decklists are budget, you frequently talk about cards which can be substituted to make the list "more competitive".
When I first started crafting MP decks, I looked at your guides (still do) and got a base idea. I made changes based on my meta and based on my wallet.
Decklists are fun, but need to be looked at yearly in an effort to include the latest new tech
I know lots of people who love the decklists, especially when they are budget oriented. One thing I am constantly told by others when I point them in your direction is that they love the fact that while the decklists are budget, you frequently talk about cards which can be substituted to make the list "more competitive".
When I first started crafting MP decks, I looked at your guides (still do) and got a base idea. I made changes based on my meta and based on my wallet.
Decklists are fun, but need to be looked at yearly in an effort to include the latest new tech
excellent job Prid3
Thank you for the kind words. I think that moving forward I'm going to put a bit more effort into the decklists sections, especially when it comes to the later entries. I usually start off strong with proper explanations but since I find it incredibly boring to force myself to create a dozen or so arbitrary decks to goldfish on Cockatrice by the time that I get to later ones I can barely muster more than a sentence or two. Knowing me I probably have a Doomsday combo deck posted somewhere with an explanation along the lines of "the deck plays itself assuming you ignore the 600 different lines that you could take at any given moment."
Alright, having read the general strategies, I'm totally digging it. Your piece on fast ramp vs slow ramp was very convincing and informative (others as well, but I personally learned more from that one). Going to look back in your other guides now. Thanks for the great content
Alright, having read the general strategies, I'm totally digging it. Your piece on fast ramp vs slow ramp was very convincing and informative (others as well, but I personally learned more from that one). Going to look back in your other guides now. Thanks for the great content
Be prepared to be disappointed unless you read the Blue one next. The White/Red guides don't have anything there I don't think. That being said I'm currently working on the Black Guide so I can't fix that just yet.
I remember checking out these guides many years ago when I was getting into magic again after many years away from it. It seems you've changed your multiplayer card suggestions and strategies quite a bit. I'm loving the 4x Green Sun's Zenith inclusion. I'm very budget conscious and can't bring myself to shell out for sets of spenno cards; having four of those allows me to include a lot of the singletons of very expensive cards I do own.
I'd also like to see suggestions for cards or combos you think are generally considered too un-fun or dull for more friendly multiplayer games.
I was going through my box today and I found a couple copies of Reap. Card seems nuts if someone's reliably playing black. Even if there's only a single black permanent on the board, it's an instant-speed Regrowth. Worth adding to the list?
I was going through my box today and I found a couple copies of Reap. Card seems nuts if someone's reliably playing black. Even if there's only a single black permanent on the board, it's an instant-speed Regrowth. Worth adding to the list?
It's definitely worth adding to the list but in my experience the card isn't as nuts as it reads. Not being a creature hurts because it means that you can't easily tutor for it nor cheat it into play using your myriad of Lurking Predators-esque effects. I've said it before and I'll say it again but Eternal Witness is more powerful than Regrowth in the vast majority of Green decks due to the existence of spells such as Green Sun's Zenith, Survival of the Fittest, Evolutionary Leap, Eldritch Evolution, Lifecrafter's Bestiary, Chord of Calling, Genesis Wave, Birthing Pod, Lurking Predators, Woodland Bellower, Craterhoof Behemoth, etc. Black decks are also rarely "wide" in nature and while I've certainly seen this recur 2-3 cards it's rarely a gargantuan blowout. Whereas a card like Compost can come down on turn 1-2 and benefit from every Dark Ritual, Terror, Sign in Blood, Damnation, etc. a card like Reap isn't guaranteed to be absurd even when there's a Black player present. In that sense I don't value it the same way that I value a card like Carpet of Flowers or Compost which basically only ask "is someone playing this color?" as opposed to "is someone playing this color and meeting this requirement?" in addition to "do I have a meaningful set of spells to recur?" I would virtually always play Compost over Reap for that reason alone hence why I promote that card instead. Don't get me wrong, the card is solid and I'm not dismissing your suggestion by any means, I'm just explaining why I haven't gone out of my way to champion the thing like I have with Carpet of Flowers and Compost.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Thank you for the kind words! Unfortunately the new guide isn't done just yet but I needed a place where I could work. I'll update the OP when I'm satisfied with what I have .
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Otherwise I'm curious as to whether or not anyone reads the "General Strategies" section? I'm probably going to re-name it at some point but I'm curious as to whether or not people find those mini-articles helpful. It's entirely possible that no one reads them anyways and that I'm wasting my time but I'd love to hear specific input on that aspect of the guide.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Yeah I see your point. Does anyone know of a relevant color scheme that I could employ? I realize that I could use any colors insofar as I was consistent but I'd be cool if there was something "proven" that I could borrow.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
How about now?
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Not sure if I'm average in that.
My meta: 3 or 4 player free for all, anything goes but boring games or broken decks cause a vote to end that game.
By card lists do you mean just the Creatures and Spells sections?
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
I like the few-word-reasonings, they attract my attention and help me decide whether a card fits my style and is worth the bother (and euro's).
Ordering in themes and casting costs helps too, just a cold list of cards is too little info.
(I never check the decklists in your guides.)
My meta: 3 or 4 player free for all, anything goes but boring games or broken decks cause a vote to end that game.
I mostly read the card lists. I really like the idea of the color code, but I would love it to be a bullet point of the appropriate color instead of what you have now. I have no clue if you can change the colors of bullet points, but it would lighten up the text.
I haven't read the general strategies yet, but looking at the topics I'll definitely get around to it. Never noticed it in your other guides. Have to go look (again!).
I don't usually read the decklists (mostly because all I do is cube now), so can't comment on those.
Once again thanks for the guides, looking forward to the black one
By the way, would you consider doing artifacts and lands? I know CB has one, but it is outdated i believe. And yes, this is just me being needy.
My 450ish 1vs1 cube
Yeah I'm still not sure what the best way to do this is but I know that I want something that I can use to distinguish between the power-levels of the cards at play. I don't think that I can do colored bullet points though.
Decklists are my least favorite aspect of this guide. There's so many arbitrary stipulations that I can choose to follow and so it's tough to know what people are looking for. In previous iterations I've had combo decks and such but for the time being the ones listed are all Legacy-legal, don't go infinite and generally don't field cards that cost more than $5.00 USD. Obviously I'm at the mercy of the market forces though and so if I want to build around a card like Lurking Predators then there's literally nothing that I can do about it if it happens to cost a bit more than that.
That being said I have no idea how much of this is relevant. Maybe people like combos. Maybe no one cares about Legality and I should be posting a ton of Skullclamp decks. Maybe most people play Modern. I have no idea. If I'm being brutally honest I would enjoy these guides a lot more if I didn't feel compelled to post decklists.
Black is happening in the foreseeable future.
Artifacts is a definite possibility but I think that it would closer to my Gold Cards guide than anything else. I think that lists of relevant cards is probably the best way to present them.
Lands are tough. I personally use this way more than any other resource and think that it's probably the best way to tackle the problem. I know that you're obviously curious about specialty lands such as Academy Ruins and Volrath's Stronghold too but I think that any Land Guide worth its salt would have look something like the one that I just posted and then include info on the relevant "spell lands" afterwards. Full credit to the person who made that land cheat sheet though, I highly recommend it.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Man, you should just skip that part then! There is already a TON of info to digest in these guides. Also, if you don't post lists, people will have to think for themselves which probably leads to a better understanding of the cards themselves. Or if they have questions, it sparks discussion for the boards. Win win!
My 450ish 1vs1 cube
I've been messaged by a fair number of lurkers who've expressed gratitude for having easy access to budget-minded decklists. Even if they don't copy them card-for-card is still gives them a rough idea of how to go about building a full deck.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
They're not going anywhere for now. I'm going to try and roll out the new Black guide in the new few days with massively updated decklists.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
When I first started crafting MP decks, I looked at your guides (still do) and got a base idea. I made changes based on my meta and based on my wallet.
Decklists are fun, but need to be looked at yearly in an effort to include the latest new tech
excellent job Prid3
Thank you for the kind words. I think that moving forward I'm going to put a bit more effort into the decklists sections, especially when it comes to the later entries. I usually start off strong with proper explanations but since I find it incredibly boring to force myself to create a dozen or so arbitrary decks to goldfish on Cockatrice by the time that I get to later ones I can barely muster more than a sentence or two. Knowing me I probably have a Doomsday combo deck posted somewhere with an explanation along the lines of "the deck plays itself assuming you ignore the 600 different lines that you could take at any given moment."
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
My 450ish 1vs1 cube
Be prepared to be disappointed unless you read the Blue one next. The White/Red guides don't have anything there I don't think. That being said I'm currently working on the Black Guide so I can't fix that just yet.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
I'd also like to see suggestions for cards or combos you think are generally considered too un-fun or dull for more friendly multiplayer games.
My singleton Masters Cube
It's definitely worth adding to the list but in my experience the card isn't as nuts as it reads. Not being a creature hurts because it means that you can't easily tutor for it nor cheat it into play using your myriad of Lurking Predators-esque effects. I've said it before and I'll say it again but Eternal Witness is more powerful than Regrowth in the vast majority of Green decks due to the existence of spells such as Green Sun's Zenith, Survival of the Fittest, Evolutionary Leap, Eldritch Evolution, Lifecrafter's Bestiary, Chord of Calling, Genesis Wave, Birthing Pod, Lurking Predators, Woodland Bellower, Craterhoof Behemoth, etc. Black decks are also rarely "wide" in nature and while I've certainly seen this recur 2-3 cards it's rarely a gargantuan blowout. Whereas a card like Compost can come down on turn 1-2 and benefit from every Dark Ritual, Terror, Sign in Blood, Damnation, etc. a card like Reap isn't guaranteed to be absurd even when there's a Black player present. In that sense I don't value it the same way that I value a card like Carpet of Flowers or Compost which basically only ask "is someone playing this color?" as opposed to "is someone playing this color and meeting this requirement?" in addition to "do I have a meaningful set of spells to recur?" I would virtually always play Compost over Reap for that reason alone hence why I promote that card instead. Don't get me wrong, the card is solid and I'm not dismissing your suggestion by any means, I'm just explaining why I haven't gone out of my way to champion the thing like I have with Carpet of Flowers and Compost.
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
My meta: 3 or 4 player free for all, anything goes but boring games or broken decks cause a vote to end that game.