MTG Salvation

Ok, so the lack of a 4-colored general is really getting to me. I know that there are nephilim from the first Ravnica block, but they're not really legendary creatures in the eyes of all. I was thinking around a bit and thought that maybe the problem was trying to do this with one creature. Maybe it can be done with two creatures. The result: Boss & Mini-Boss.

The rules are quite simple:

Deck Construction:

• Boss has to be a legendary creature.
• Mini-Boss has to be a legendary creature.
• Both start in the command zone.
• Mini-Boss's CMC has to be less than Boss's.
• Mini-Boss's combined power & toughness has to be less than Boss's combined power & toughness.
• Boss and Mini-Boss can have different color identities granted they share at least one color. In order to use a colorless Boss or Mini-Boss, they'd have to both be colorless (remembering that cards like Memnarch, Bosh, Iron Golem, etc. have a color identity per Commander's rules so they are considered to be blue and red, respectively).
• Decks contain 100 cards - including Boss and Mini-Boss.
• Decks can only contain one copy of each card that's not a basic land.
• Decks can only contain cards of the color identity of both Boss and Mini-Boss.
• Banned list is the same as the official Commander banlist.
• Creatures that are banned as commanders for EDH are also banned for both Boss and Mini-Boss.
• Planeswalkers that would otherwise be allowed to be commanders are only allowed to be either a Boss or Mini-Boss if their starting loyalty is considered (if the casting cost and twice the starting loyalty of the planeswalker is greater than the casting cost and combined power & toughness of the miniboss then it could be a boss; if the casting cost and twice the starting loyalty is less than the casting cost and combined power & toughness of a boss than it can be a miniboss).

General Rules:

• Boss can't be cast unless Mini-Boss has been cast at least once.
• Boss and Mini-Boss have a cast-from-command-zone tax of 2 per time cast.
• If the Boss or Mini-Boss were to be returned to the hand, it may go to the command zone instead.
• If the Boss or Mini-Boss were to be shuffled into the deck, it may go to the command zone instead.
• If a player is dealt 21 points of combat damage from a single Boss, that player loses.
• If a player is dealt 21 points of combat damage from a single Mini-Boss, that player loses.
• Mulligan is Partial Paris

I think this could open up a ride range of possibilities for Commander-esque games versus simply just opening the doors to strictly 4-colored decks. More strategies can be involved for combat being as there are two sources of "commander damage".

Any suggestions, ideas, thoughts, or comments are more than welcome!

EDIT:
7/10/2015
Rules changes:

• Boss and Mini-Boss may go to the command zone when bounced or tucked
• Partial Paris mulligan is the default mullign

8/2/2015
Rules changes:

• the inclusion of the 5 planeswalkers with the ability to be used as commander to be used as either boss or miniboss
• more flexibility with the p/t clause (the values are combined instead of evaluated individually)

11/11/16
Rules changes:

• if both commanders have partner, use the Boss & Mini-Boss rules if that's what your match is

12/24/2016
Rules were adapted to allow:

• Boss and Mini-Boss will have same commander tax to avoid complexity

Already tinkering with a Sidisi, Brood Tyrant and Roon of the Hidden Realm tag team for the variant. Clearly, Sidisi being the mini-boss and Roon being the boss. This should be pretty interesting being as Roon compliments Sidisi's ability quite nicely.

this is a really cool idea, i will have to try this out for sure!

Thanks! Spread the word! Maybe this could become a new thing! Also, the rules aren't necessarily written in stone, but the new rules are in place to provide bonuses for having the miniboss in play and whatnot :P.

cool i really like this idea gonna make a bosh, iron golem and tuktuk the explorer combo.

Yeah! That works! MonoR but with "two" commanders! Really helps abuse Tuktuk.

After thinking for a long time, ive think im gonna try out Ruhan of the Fomori as the boss and Thassa, God of the Sea as the miniboss. Im still looking around for mini bosses thou, I wanted to do Iroas, God of Victory but they cost the same -___-

That sounds pretty solid! Remember that Thassa allows for scrying and blocking when she becomes a creature. Her unblockable ability can't hurt either, especially since Ruhan is crazy and will attack anyone at random, thus needing some protection. What better way than always being able to cast Thassa one turn before Ruhan? That's a pretty sweet combo indeed!

Tolsimir boss, rhys miniboss. All the tokens!

Quote from DementedKirby »

That sounds pretty solid! Remember that Thassa allows for scrying and blocking when she becomes a creature. Her unblockable ability can't hurt either, especially since Ruhan is crazy and will attack anyone at random, thus needing some protection. What better way than always being able to cast Thassa one turn before Ruhan? That's a pretty sweet combo indeed!

ive been thinking about it some more, and while it would be very potent, i do not think i would do it. IF anything, its just a more consistent Ruhan deck, and i wouldnt build the deck any differently then a regular commander Ruhan deck. In the spirit of this game, i would rather be able to create new opportunities for combos and synergy, rather than just improving upon an already good idea.

That is true, which is what I've been working on with Roon + Sidisi.

Quote from poison counter »

Tolsimir boss, rhys miniboss. All the tokens!

Damn! All the tokens, indeed!! They'd all be 3/3 with Voja being 4/4! And just imaging if you had Mirror Gallery in play! All the Vojas!

How does Dakkon Blackblade work? Does his P/T count as 0/0?

I want to combine him with Karametra, God of Harvests but i do not know if it will work P/T wise :/

Why are the planeswalker commanders banned.

Since they're not creatures they don't have any p/t to compare to a miniboss. I'm still thinking about their inclusion though and how I can warrant it. It's not a rule yet set in stone. But if the miniboss/boss comparative is to be followed, then the planeswalkers don't fit the criteria.

Starting loyalty could be used as power and toughness, and another question would the origins planeswalkers be banned as well, or not because they start out as a creature. If they planeswalkers where legal i would make a Daretti, Scrap Savant and Feldon of the third path deck.

The Origins planeswalkers are creatures before transforming, so they're legal. The starting loyalty for planeswalkers that are allowed to be commanders is actually a great idea. If the casting cost and starting loyalty is greater than the casting cost and p/t of the miniboss then it could be a boss. If the casting cost and starting loyalty is less than the casting cost and p/t of a boss than it can be a miniboss. That's actually a great idea!

Quote from rshizz »

How does Dakkon Blackblade work? Does his P/T count as 0/0?

I want to combine him with Karametra, God of Harvests but i do not know if it will work P/T wise :/

Outside of the game when it is unable to calculate the */*, he is treated as a 0/0.

It might balance out well to because they have a cost of four or higher so you would need a vey higher cost legendary or a low cost weiny.

Quote from cryogen »

Quote from rshizz »

How does Dakkon Blackblade work? Does his P/T count as 0/0?

I want to combine him with Karametra, God of Harvests but i do not know if it will work P/T wise :/

Outside of the game when it is unable to calculate the */*, he is treated as a 0/0.

Thanks for the clarification, thats what i thought, as much as i didnt want it to count. Back to the drawing board once again

Yeah, lol, poor Dakkon. Dakkon Blackblade + Karametra, God of Harvests would've been super epic! Nice combo!

On a side note, I'm still working on my Sidisi + Roon deck. These four colors allow for so many things that I wouldn't even know where to continue! So many cards! And the combination itself of Sidisi + Roon already has a bunch of synergy! I hope to post a decklist soon!

Quote from rshizz »

Quote from cryogen »

Quote from rshizz »

How does Dakkon Blackblade work? Does his P/T count as 0/0?

I want to combine him with Karametra, God of Harvests but i do not know if it will work P/T wise :/

Outside of the game when it is unable to calculate the */*, he is treated as a 0/0.

Thanks for the clarification, thats what i thought, as much as i didnt want it to count. Back to the drawing board once again

For reasons like this I'm considering limiting the Miniboss to simply having a combined p/t less than the Boss and not force the Boss to also have a higher CMC. Any opinions on this possible change?

Quote from DementedKirby »

Quote from rshizz »

Quote from cryogen »

Quote from rshizz »

How does Dakkon Blackblade work? Does his P/T count as 0/0?

I want to combine him with Karametra, God of Harvests but i do not know if it will work P/T wise :/

Outside of the game when it is unable to calculate the */*, he is treated as a 0/0.

Thanks for the clarification, thats what i thought, as much as i didnt want it to count. Back to the drawing board once again

For reasons like this I'm considering limiting the Miniboss to simply having a combined p/t less than the Boss and not force the Boss to also have a higher CMC. Any opinions on this possible change?

while id like it to happen so that i can use both Kametra and Dakkon, I do believe that changing the rules of this would go against the flavor. While it is up to you, i would advocate to keep the same rules.

Hm, I agree. I think I got that right the first time. Oh well, at least I gave it some thought! It stays how it is, then!

finally, I have made a rough draft for a deck list:
While it is just a rough draft for now, I have decided to use Glissa, the Traitor as my mini-boss and Thraximundar as my boss.

I was determined to use Glissa as a mini-boss, and I was stuck for a long time deciding for my boss. My options for boss were: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born, Mogis, God of Slaughter, Teneb, the Harvester, and Thraximundar. I still may change to Teneb, but I liked that Thrax would include 4 colors, and i could put grimgrim and mogis in as well.