Now with M15 released there are a bunch more cards being passed around, a lot of them are new and some of them are reprints like Chord of Calling.
With this release we would like to introduce the Core Format. It consists of all the cards in core sets, from Fourth Edition through Magic 2015 and all future core sets.
Its been determined that the best we can tell is that it is actually a very healthy and diverse pool with cards that are playing together that have never really seen play together before. Like any format, some things in the overall game are either physically broken, or outdated- so a ban list will be introduced. The current total card pool is 2186 cards and will grow each summer with the new release of Core sets.
If you think some of these cards are too weak to be considered banned or there are other cards listed or not that should definitely be banned, please say so, and give your reasoning!
(This is not official Wizards of the Coast or sanctioned, but we would like to work toward that direction with this idea).
As much as I love blowing up peoples lands, strip mine is definitely too good. Especially in a slightly slower format like I imagine this is. Manabases are going to be pretty bad, and theres few good utility lands in core sets. Really just muta vault and mishras factory, and lightning bolt or StP takes care of those. Strip mine should definitely be banned.
Ponder, preordain, flash and seething song are 100% fine. I would not even considering banning those cards (unless something like Hulk gets reprinted soon). Song is certainly far less scary than dark ritual.
Mind twist might be fine. Most people would agree, it shouldn't even be on the legacy banned list. I could care less either way though. The card is nothing too exciting.
Vamp and mystical tutor might be safe. Mystical more so. Vampiric is a little scary though.
The other bannings seem fine and I cant think of anything else that should be on there.
I imagine esper control or GBW goodstuff.dec being pretty good. I wish there was something good that could be done with doomsday, but I cant think of anything off the top of my head.
Sounds like a fun format. Might need some tweaking in terms of the cutoff and ban list (maybe core sets from Modern forward?), but I like the core concept (pun intended) of the format.
Nice format. I'll probably test it. I feel like UWx control with Winter Orb and Stasis would be powerful, but not oppressive. Having access to Enlightened Tutor, Ponder, Preordain, and Brainstorm to find the lock might be a little much, though.
Sounds like a fun format. Might need some tweaking in terms of the cutoff and ban list (maybe core sets from Modern forward?), but I like the core concept (pun intended) of the format.
Nice format. I'll probably test it. I feel like UWx control with Winter Orb and Stasis would be powerful, but not oppressive. Having access to Enlightened Tutor, Ponder, Preordain, and Brainstorm to find the lock might be a little much, though.
It definitely needs tweaking, but it has to be more simplified so as far as what sets are to be included, this will not change. 4thED and up will be the format's card pool.
As far as tutors and draw power is concerned we wanted to allow that to start off as being more open. This should bring out more of the stronger cards to watch out for initially. A decent amount of these cards only see play together in EDH, if at all. Once it is understood as to what the more powerful synergies, combos, and locks are, more adjustments can be made accordingly.
Strip Mine will likely be the next ban, but it isn't solely winning anything and doesn't fit into what is developing.
If anyone would like to playtest please PM me, or use this thread to set up playtesting.
What can seething song do? Made me laugh that you mentioned seething song but not the one that is far more broken/dark ritual.
Strip mine is overpowered to hell and back. Auto ban that card. You know what else? Crucible of worlds is in 10th edition. If that isn't enough reason I don't know what is. I love striplocking people. You haven't banned vampiric tutor either, so you can reasonably assemble the combo more easily with v. tutor and enlightened tutor for crucible as well.
Ponder is weak without shuffles. Preordain is far superior in this format.
What does flash sacrifice anyways? Pretty sure it's safe as I can't think of anything like protean hulk or academy rector in a core set.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
With this release we would like to introduce the Core Format. It consists of all the cards in core sets, from Fourth Edition through Magic 2015 and all future core sets..........
Its been determined that the best we can tell is that it is actually a very healthy and diverse pool.....
(This is not official Wizards of the Coast or sanctioned, but we would like to work toward that direction with this idea).
Not to be a stickler, but you have a total of 6 posts on this forum - so I am curious who this "we" is that is doing all this "determination." Or is this just something you came up with on your own?
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Old enough to know better, much too young to care.
With this release we would like to introduce the Core Format. It consists of all the cards in core sets, from Fourth Edition through Magic 2015 and all future core sets..........
Its been determined that the best we can tell is that it is actually a very healthy and diverse pool.....
(This is not official Wizards of the Coast or sanctioned, but we would like to work toward that direction with this idea).
Not to be a stickler, but you have a total of 6 posts on this forum - so I am curious who this "we" is that is doing all this "determination." Or is this just something you came up with on your own?
A few people are using Cockatrice to test, it was originally my idea, but the idea itself is greater than the sum of its parts. If this were to get attention from Wizards it would obviously go to them. Anything we do here is just to make the playtesting more balanced and to gather people that would like to enjoy a different competitive format.
Id' imagine lack of fetches severely depowers brainstorm.
You can still do similar things, where you know you will need more blue sources, so you could Brainstorm, put 2 things you don't need back, and then Evolving Wilds or something to shuffle. Its obviously not as strong as it is in legacy, but it could be a fair equivalent of this format, and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth makes it so you don't lose value later on. But yes, it is depowered.
The Watchlist / Being considered, in no way means the listed cards will be banned, it also in no way means they won't. It is just that, a watch list or a note that it is being considered like Strip Mine, which once I talk with a few of the other people tomorrow, will likely be banned, unless more people favor Crucible of Worlds or just not to ban it with enough rhetoric or play testing to show other wise.
My personal goal with this is to preserve and ensure diversity. If something can prove to reduce the diversity significantly enough (like Necropotence), it has a higher chance of being banned.
I understand why Necro and Balance are banned but were they tested in the format?
Separately, why are only two Ante cards on the list, IIRC there are more from 4th Ed. than just the two.
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For Lists, Click Here EDH: GW: Selvala, Let us help YOU. UB: Mirko Vosk, when outmatched cheat BW: Vish Kal, The Arbiter of Reanimation UG: Prime Speaker Zegana, the science of sorcery RB: Malfegor, Traitor's Haven UW: Daxos, Control-Fort-Tron BG: Pharika, Goddess of Stax RW: Gisela, Boros Control RG: Ruric Thar, a Primal Surge deck RU: Niv-Mizzet the Firemind, Spellslinger?!?! B:(Pauper) Mikaeus the Unhallowed R: Kurkesh, Onakke Ancient: The Power of Engineering
I had a meeting with some other players Sunday, that were interested in the idea. Notes from said meeting were that Strip Mine was obviously powerful, Flash was more akin to a legacy-style format but not influential enough, Winter Orb has potential to be oppressive, and Crucible of Worlds with Strip Mine is oppressive, but more because of each other and less as individual values.
Please, if anyone would like to add to that, I would be happy to just hear some more educated, in depth insight.
Not to burst your bubble or anything, but Core Sets are gonna get canned. The final Core Set is gonna be Magic 2016 in the summer of 2015 and that's it.
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With this release we would like to introduce the Core Format. It consists of all the cards in core sets, from Fourth Edition through Magic 2015 and all future core sets.
Its been determined that the best we can tell is that it is actually a very healthy and diverse pool with cards that are playing together that have never really seen play together before. Like any format, some things in the overall game are either physically broken, or outdated- so a ban list will be introduced. The current total card pool is 2186 cards and will grow each summer with the new release of Core sets.
Banned:
Being Considered:
Watch List:
If you think some of these cards are too weak to be considered banned or there are other cards listed or not that should definitely be banned, please say so, and give your reasoning!
(This is not official Wizards of the Coast or sanctioned, but we would like to work toward that direction with this idea).
A few suggestions:
As much as I love blowing up peoples lands, strip mine is definitely too good. Especially in a slightly slower format like I imagine this is. Manabases are going to be pretty bad, and theres few good utility lands in core sets. Really just muta vault and mishras factory, and lightning bolt or StP takes care of those. Strip mine should definitely be banned.
Ponder, preordain, flash and seething song are 100% fine. I would not even considering banning those cards (unless something like Hulk gets reprinted soon). Song is certainly far less scary than dark ritual.
Mind twist might be fine. Most people would agree, it shouldn't even be on the legacy banned list. I could care less either way though. The card is nothing too exciting.
Vamp and mystical tutor might be safe. Mystical more so. Vampiric is a little scary though.
The other bannings seem fine and I cant think of anything else that should be on there.
I imagine esper control or GBW goodstuff.dec being pretty good. I wish there was something good that could be done with doomsday, but I cant think of anything off the top of my head.
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It definitely needs tweaking, but it has to be more simplified so as far as what sets are to be included, this will not change. 4thED and up will be the format's card pool.
As far as tutors and draw power is concerned we wanted to allow that to start off as being more open. This should bring out more of the stronger cards to watch out for initially. A decent amount of these cards only see play together in EDH, if at all. Once it is understood as to what the more powerful synergies, combos, and locks are, more adjustments can be made accordingly.
Strip Mine will likely be the next ban, but it isn't solely winning anything and doesn't fit into what is developing.
If anyone would like to playtest please PM me, or use this thread to set up playtesting.
I'm pretty sure you are doing something wrong if strip mine isn't in all the non-combo decks you are making.
Definitely keep it 4th up. Pre-modern is where all the fun cards are.
Ponder loses a lot of its power without fetches, and brainstorm is worse than serum visions without fetchlands. I would not worry about these cards.
Strip mine is overpowered to hell and back. Auto ban that card. You know what else? Crucible of worlds is in 10th edition. If that isn't enough reason I don't know what is. I love striplocking people. You haven't banned vampiric tutor either, so you can reasonably assemble the combo more easily with v. tutor and enlightened tutor for crucible as well.
Ponder is weak without shuffles. Preordain is far superior in this format.
What does flash sacrifice anyways? Pretty sure it's safe as I can't think of anything like protean hulk or academy rector in a core set.
Currently Playing:
Retired
I do apologize for any confusion.
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
The Watchlist / Being considered, in no way means the listed cards will be banned, it also in no way means they won't. It is just that, a watch list or a note that it is being considered like Strip Mine, which once I talk with a few of the other people tomorrow, will likely be banned, unless more people favor Crucible of Worlds or just not to ban it with enough rhetoric or play testing to show other wise.
My personal goal with this is to preserve and ensure diversity. If something can prove to reduce the diversity significantly enough (like Necropotence), it has a higher chance of being banned.
Separately, why are only two Ante cards on the list, IIRC there are more from 4th Ed. than just the two.
For Lists, Click Here
EDH:
GW: Selvala, Let us help YOU.
UB: Mirko Vosk, when outmatched cheat
BW: Vish Kal, The Arbiter of Reanimation
UG: Prime Speaker Zegana, the science of sorcery
RB: Malfegor, Traitor's Haven
UW: Daxos, Control-Fort-Tron
BG: Pharika, Goddess of Stax
RW: Gisela, Boros Control
RG: Ruric Thar, a Primal Surge deck
RU: Niv-Mizzet the Firemind, Spellslinger?!?!
B:(Pauper) Mikaeus the Unhallowed
R: Kurkesh, Onakke Ancient: The Power of Engineering
Balance was not tested, Necro was.
You are also correct on the ground of the 'ante' cards, there are three from 4thED and up all of which are already on the list.
That should clear that up.
Please, if anyone would like to add to that, I would be happy to just hear some more educated, in depth insight.
- Goblin Chieftain
- Goblin Recruiter
- Goblin Matron
- Goblin King
- Mogg Fanatic
- Goblin Grenade
And the Krenko, Mob Boss / Intruder Alarm combo.Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Here's probably what I'd try to run (rough draft):
4 Adarkar Wastes
8 Island
8 Plains
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Preordain
4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Mana Leak
4 Counterspell
4 Raise the Alarm
2 Triplicate Spirits
4 Opposition
1 Mobilization
1 Icy Manipulator
4 Coral Barrier
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
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I knew Intruder Alarm would combo with something, I really don't know how I overlooked Krenko.
How do you win with that Static Orb deck? @_@ Just Mobilization?
Vintage Core: 4th Edition and up.
Modern Core: M10 and up.
Either way. I would love to see this as an official format.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!