Your deck may win slightly more than mine, but it still feels like something could be added, and also mine may need to have Mystical tutor removed. I really like reckless charge as well, but Windfall doesn't seem to work well since I lay all my cards out so there is little to discard.
Yeah, there definitely could be more tweaks done to perfect it. I tested 2 copies of Lion's Eye Diamond (over a Windfall and a Mana Vault) and found the card quite versatile, since you can use it to pay for Reckless Charge flashback or just float the mana while resolving a draw7 or Ancestral.
With Windfall the idea is that you're assuming the opponent still has 5-7 cards in hand, so you would draw 5-7 off it, like a mini-Wheel of Fortune. If you don't make that assumption, then yes, it's terrible.
What could replace Windfall? Maybe Demonic Tutor, though the 3rd color could get awkward. Black also enables Yawgmoth's win. I would definitely run black if your casual format allows Contract from Below.
Another idea is to cut all Windfalls but run 4 Burning Wish + 4 Lion's Eye Diamond. Wish is extremely versatile here. You can hide 1 copy of Wheel of Fortune and Tinker and Reckless Charge in the SB, then have the option to Wish into a draw 7, a Tinker or a haste enabler, making Wish basically Demonic Tutor in on-color mana.
I built that exact deck, and tested it out. The sideboard is there as well, but I think ill just have to figure out the right variation while playing if I stick with this turn one win. This is the deck: http://deckstats.net/decks/21851/250801-mana-exploit?saved=1&lng=en
The lion's eye diamond is a good card, but I haven't been able to properly use it with this deck, and in most cases id rather have a one colored mana source instead of it.
I want to know if Tinker/Blightsteel Colossus is the most reliable turn one win deck. I will still use this deck, but just in case there is another method that wins every time almost id like to know of that build as well.
Ironically with that new version I've won with Tendrils about 1/3 of the time, instead of Blightsteel. Can't tell if it is actually winning more than the previous version (though the previous version's consistency relied on assuming Windfall would draw you 5+ based on opponent's hand).
What problem are you having with LED? Once I got an awkward hand with two LED and not enough initial mana sources, but otherwise it has been pretty strong for me. The deck is usually casting something you can pop LED to in response (Burning Wish, Timetwister, Wheel of Fortune, even Ancestral). Also, you dump your hand pretty quickly, and the cards you can't dump immediately are usually dead spots you don't care about (e.g. Blightsteel, redundant draw 7s, Reckless Charge that is perfectly happy in the GY, extra land). Maybe 3 copies is correct instead of 4, as you don't want 2 LED in the opener.
I find sometimes I want to Burning Wish for mana. There must be some sorcery that nets a ton of mana that would be useful. Something that untaps artifacts?
As for the most consistent turn 1 win, that'd probably be a storm deck (with similar shell but getting to run more power cards and mana sources instead of conditional stuff like Tinker, Blightsteel, Reckless Charge, Greaves). But I thought your goal was to have a Turn 1 Blightsteel deck?
I was just interested to find out if their was another method for turn one winning, and yes I am still gonna use this deck. The burning wish for mana might solve mana problem, and it could be an artifact from your discard pile to your hand such as a lotus. The deck variations are looking good, and all of them work about the same with maybe wheel of fortune increasing one of their odds.
Ok. Then to answer your question: Tendrils of Agony is a good way to win on turn 1.
Even with this deck, in the Burning Wish version, I'm winning with Tendrils a good chunk of the time instead of Blightsteel. After a single Timetwister/Wheel of Fortune, if you draw into a Burning Wish, you probably have Storm 10 and it's pretty easy to just go for Tendrils, using either Black Lotus or LED to make the double black mana. I only Wish for Tinker or Charge if I already have the other piece and can't make the black mana.
In a completely different deck, you could cut all the Blightsteel-related cards and add black for Demonic Tutor, Dark Ritual, Yawgmoth's Will and 1 maindeck Tendrils of Agony. Maybe Mind's Desires. That would be another turn 1 win deck, and probably more consistent.
I thought about it, and tried it, and this is probably the closest I can get it to perfect. The Draw power really helps in this deck, and I've eliminated any need for a tutor in it. I will probably just make another thread for just the subject of turn one winning so if anyone wanted they could just post their ideas.
Well here it is Blue/Red, and I thought blue green was more powerful... http://deckstats.net/decks/21851/127369-the-best-mtg-artifact-deck?saved=1&lng=en
The deck could be beaten quite easily, but only if most opponents were trying to defend against it. I know it is insane, but what if you played the best variation of this deck against the best deck in Modern mtg Format.
The deck could be beaten quite easily, but only if most opponents were trying to defend against it. I know it is insane, but what if you played the best variation of this deck against the best deck in Modern mtg Format.
Modern decks aren't well equipped to handle decks capable of Turn 1 wins. Chalice of the Void on 0 would be pretty strong against this deck but the majority of top Modern decks don't play it.
Don't think he means Modern.format.
He probably means decks made in recent times. Obviously it would have to be compared to other decks with no Banned/Restricted list in order to be a fair comparison. Comparing it to decks from a different format with a different cardpool is inherently unfair.
As for the decklist, I'm not convinced that lands 5&6 and lack of Burning Wish is better. Using a land drop on anything that isn't a Tolarian Academy seems like a waste of time. Either way, deck looks pretty strong for goldfishing.
Sometimes I don't get tolarian academy, and so I play tested, and it works ok with those two extra lands. The deck is still a drawing machine so I think it is my favorite variation so far.
Yeah I meant the best of today's Modern mtg cards (say 2015 or 2014) against the best variation of this deck.
Turn 1 win if you allow every card in magic: Play a land. Play a mana vault, tap for 3. Use 2 for 2 for mana vaults, tap them for a total of 7 mana. Play a Kuldotha Forgesmaster and Lightning Greaves. Equip the Forgemaster with the Greaves, tap him, sacrifice your 3 mana vaults, get Blighsteel Colossus. Equip with Greaves, swing for 11 infect damage, GG.
Turn 1 win if you allow every card in magic: Play a land. Play a mana vault, tap for 3. Use 2 for 2 for mana vaults, tap them for a total of 7 mana. Play a Kuldotha Forgesmaster and Lightning Greaves. Equip the Forgemaster with the Greaves, tap him, sacrifice your 3 mana vaults, get Blighsteel Colossus. Equip with Greaves, swing for 11 infect damage, GG.
The current deck can do the same thing a lot more easily with Tinker instead of Kuldotha Forgemaster (which is a slowed-down version of Tinker)...
Yours: http://deckstats.net/decks/21851/250801-mana-exploit?saved=1&lng=en
Mine: http://deckstats.net/decks/21851/127369-the-best-mtg-artifact-deck?saved=1&lng=en
Your deck may win slightly more than mine, but it still feels like something could be added, and also mine may need to have Mystical tutor removed. I really like reckless charge as well, but Windfall doesn't seem to work well since I lay all my cards out so there is little to discard.
With Windfall the idea is that you're assuming the opponent still has 5-7 cards in hand, so you would draw 5-7 off it, like a mini-Wheel of Fortune. If you don't make that assumption, then yes, it's terrible.
What could replace Windfall? Maybe Demonic Tutor, though the 3rd color could get awkward. Black also enables Yawgmoth's win. I would definitely run black if your casual format allows Contract from Below.
Another idea is to cut all Windfalls but run 4 Burning Wish + 4 Lion's Eye Diamond. Wish is extremely versatile here. You can hide 1 copy of Wheel of Fortune and Tinker and Reckless Charge in the SB, then have the option to Wish into a draw 7, a Tinker or a haste enabler, making Wish basically Demonic Tutor in on-color mana.
e.g.
4 Black Lotus
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Mox Sapphire
4 Mox Ruby
4 Mox Opal
4 Lotus Petal
4 Mana Crypt
4 Tolarian Academy
2 Mox Jet
2 Blightsteel Colossus
3 Reckless Charge
2 Lightning Greaves
//Search: 19
4 Ancestral Recall
4 Burning Wish
4 Timetwister
3 Wheel of Fortune
3 Tinker
1 Windfall
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Windfall
1 Tinker
1 Reckless Charge
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Void Snare
1 Chain Lightning
1 Vandalblast
1 Shattering Spree
1 Yawgmoth's Will
4 Pact of Negation
The lion's eye diamond is a good card, but I haven't been able to properly use it with this deck, and in most cases id rather have a one colored mana source instead of it.
I want to know if Tinker/Blightsteel Colossus is the most reliable turn one win deck. I will still use this deck, but just in case there is another method that wins every time almost id like to know of that build as well.
What problem are you having with LED? Once I got an awkward hand with two LED and not enough initial mana sources, but otherwise it has been pretty strong for me. The deck is usually casting something you can pop LED to in response (Burning Wish, Timetwister, Wheel of Fortune, even Ancestral). Also, you dump your hand pretty quickly, and the cards you can't dump immediately are usually dead spots you don't care about (e.g. Blightsteel, redundant draw 7s, Reckless Charge that is perfectly happy in the GY, extra land). Maybe 3 copies is correct instead of 4, as you don't want 2 LED in the opener.
I find sometimes I want to Burning Wish for mana. There must be some sorcery that nets a ton of mana that would be useful. Something that untaps artifacts?
As for the most consistent turn 1 win, that'd probably be a storm deck (with similar shell but getting to run more power cards and mana sources instead of conditional stuff like Tinker, Blightsteel, Reckless Charge, Greaves). But I thought your goal was to have a Turn 1 Blightsteel deck?
Even with this deck, in the Burning Wish version, I'm winning with Tendrils a good chunk of the time instead of Blightsteel. After a single Timetwister/Wheel of Fortune, if you draw into a Burning Wish, you probably have Storm 10 and it's pretty easy to just go for Tendrils, using either Black Lotus or LED to make the double black mana. I only Wish for Tinker or Charge if I already have the other piece and can't make the black mana.
In a completely different deck, you could cut all the Blightsteel-related cards and add black for Demonic Tutor, Dark Ritual, Yawgmoth's Will and 1 maindeck Tendrils of Agony. Maybe Mind's Desires. That would be another turn 1 win deck, and probably more consistent.
4 Black Lotus
4 Mox Jet
4 Mox Opal
4 Mana Crypt
4 Lotus Petal
4 Dark Ritual
4 Tolarian Academy
3 Lion's Eye Diamond
2 Mox Ruby
2 Mox Sapphire
4 Contract from Below
4 Ancestral Recall
4 Demonic Tutor
4 Burning Wish
4 Mind's Desire
3 Timetwister
1 Yawgmoth's Will
//Win: 1
1 Tendrils of Agony
//Wishboard:
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Past in Flames
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Timetwister
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Void Snare
1 Pyroclasm
1 Flame Slash
1 Vandalblast
1 Shattering Spree
4 Pact of Negation
Timetwisters is the weakest card in the deck. Never thought I'd be saying that! Maybe could maybe be more Yawg Wills.
Well here it is Blue/Red, and I thought blue green was more powerful...
http://deckstats.net/decks/21851/127369-the-best-mtg-artifact-deck?saved=1&lng=en
4 Tolarian Academy
2 Volcanic Island
//Spells
4 Lotus Petal
4 Timetwister
4 Mox Opal
4 Mox Ruby
4 Mana Crypt
4 Ancestral Recall
4 Black Lotus
2 Lightning Greaves
4 Windfall
4 Mox Sapphire
4 Wheel of Fortune
2 Reckless Charge
4 Time Walk
4 Tinker
2 Blightsteel Colossus
The deck could be beaten quite easily, but only if most opponents were trying to defend against it. I know it is insane, but what if you played the best variation of this deck against the best deck in Modern mtg Format.
Modern decks aren't well equipped to handle decks capable of Turn 1 wins. Chalice of the Void on 0 would be pretty strong against this deck but the majority of top Modern decks don't play it.
He probably means decks made in recent times. Obviously it would have to be compared to other decks with no Banned/Restricted list in order to be a fair comparison. Comparing it to decks from a different format with a different cardpool is inherently unfair.
As for the decklist, I'm not convinced that lands 5&6 and lack of Burning Wish is better. Using a land drop on anything that isn't a Tolarian Academy seems like a waste of time. Either way, deck looks pretty strong for goldfishing.
Yeah I meant the best of today's Modern mtg cards (say 2015 or 2014) against the best variation of this deck.
Necro-Locked
-ThatRedwood
The current deck can do the same thing a lot more easily with Tinker instead of Kuldotha Forgemaster (which is a slowed-down version of Tinker)...
Necropotence is way too slow for this format. It gives the opponent a free Time Walk (i.e. a 5th).
I meant that the mod would lock it for necroing it lol
I repeat. In this thread, Necropotence=loss, because it just leaves him open to Uthden Troll beating down with Hatred.