62 cards, but thanks to the card drawing engines it runs through the deck very fast while killing opponent for the advantage. I tried out different versions of Owling Mind and I find this one to be the most stable thanks to the combination of cheap force-draw and cheap damage via draw/hand size. Dark Ritual allow first turn Master of the Feast or Underworld Dream, second turn double Mine/Owl, third turn Nekusar or any combination of first + second turn spells. My current concern is the number of Toil//Trouble and Runeflare Trap, both proven to be deadly and I am not sure if I should add more (or just use one of them instead of both). Another version of this deck uses Spiteful Visions, but that card damages both side so given the speed of my own drawing I hesitate to use it, and Nekusar does the job better.
I posted my deck for this same concept about 2 days ago, I started out having it be esper, but was given the idea to go grixis. It has worked out quite well so far
My final deck is at the very bottom
as for your concern about Spiteful visions, I had that same concern, but with the cards I run, my opponents usually end up losing more life than I do, I would love to find a way to make myself immune to that ability so that only opponents are affected, but for now, I have no idea of any cards that could do that for me.
I posted my deck for this same concept about 2 days ago, I started out having it be esper, but was given the idea to go grixis. It has worked out quite well so far
My final deck is at the very bottom
as for your concern about Spiteful visions, I had that same concern, but with the cards I run, my opponents usually end up losing more life than I do, I would love to find a way to make myself immune to that ability so that only opponents are affected, but for now, I have no idea of any cards that could do that for me.
Thx for the suggestions. I think because I use red cards so my deck might be more aggressive than yours, but yours have creatures to stabilize the field which definitely protects you better than mine would. I confess that many times I wish I have more blockers, and I need a little more luck to get the best combination before I could burst damage.
I think both of our decks benefit from Trade Secret, because not only I could force them to draw it also triggers Runeflare Trap or warrant a bigger Toil // Trouble. Maybe I need some mana acceleration to ensure more spells being cast?
Trade Secrets is good, but like I said, I would also take damage because of Spiteful Visions, Unless I can find another R/B alternative or something similar I can't really run anything that encourages my drawing cards . Runeflare trap is similar to Whispering Madness, (Which I suggest you add, since you aren't at risk from Spiteful Visions). You could cast Trouble from Toil // Trouble, then cast Whispering madness for a ton of damage! It would have the same overall cmc as Runeflare trap, but tons more damage!
Trade Secrets is good, but like I said, I would also take damage because of Spiteful Visions, Unless I can find another R/B alternative or something similar I can't really run anything that encourages my drawing cards . Runeflare trap is similar to Whispering Madness, (Which I suggest you add, since you aren't at risk from Spiteful Visions). You could cast Trouble from Toil // Trouble, then cast Whispering madness for a ton of damage! It would have the same overall cmc as Runeflare trap, but tons more damage!
I avoid Spiteful Vision because it's more risky, especially since this kind of decks draw a lot of cards, unless we counter it with... Ivory Tower.
I think my theme is slightly more mixed because not only I want damage from drawing but I also want damage from big hand size. The few tests I ran show that I deal more burst damage with red while more steadily with black. If I go the entire artifact route for force-drawand remove the blue cards, I can add in some creature removal and/or Ivory Tower. The Tower is rather evil though...
In terms of 1v1, yeah, Black Vise is too powerful, and also because Owl can hit all opponents, not just one.
You're right about the Kami being a legend, I think the benefit is that it can block attacking creatures, and cons because it can be destroyed more easily than Dictate of Kruphix. I have mixed feeing about Spiteful Visions, namely because there are other options that could do its job without hurting myself (albeit needing a mix of cards). It does have easier mana requirement, so I will test it out more, perhaps with Ivory Tower mixed in.
As far as blockers, why not get a playset of OrnithopterPhyrexian Walker or Shield Sphere With 0 casting cost and the nature of this deck it shouldn't be too difficult to run a deck with a higher than normal card count.
I will give Dictate a go, it looks promising. I'm a little confused about the combo of Spiteful Vision and Psychic Possession. SV damages you whenever you draw, so wouldn't that hurt you anyway even if you draw via opponent's draw (and opponent likely will draw a lot)?
Trade Secret is 3cc and it draws cards without replacing your current ones, I find it more appealing than the Puzzle Box atm. Psychosis Crawler is an interesting idea, but at 5cc I'll need to test it out with other cards to see how speed goes.
The text on Psychic Possession states that you skip your draw step, if an opponent draws a card, you may. That way you don't draw all those cards and take all that damage. Only however much you feel comfortable with. Everyone may be forced to draw lets say, 7 cards, equating to 7 damage, but you can decide to draw a card everytime your opponent does. Allowing you to draw however many cards you're comfortable with taking damage for; could be 1, 2, 3, etc. You still take damage, but it's a great way to limit and keep a sense of control on your hand and life.
The text on Psychic Possession states that you skip your draw step, if an opponent draws a card, you may. That way you don't draw all those cards and take all that damage. Only however much you feel comfortable with. Everyone may be forced to draw lets say, 7 cards, equating to 7 damage, but you can decide to draw a card everytime your opponent does. Allowing you to draw however many cards you're comfortable with taking damage for; could be 1, 2, 3, etc. You still take damage, but it's a great way to limit and keep a sense of control on your hand and life.
What do you think about Ivory Tower? It does give you life early and persistently after.
pretty good, I suppose it depends on what route you're taking. If you go my way, where you risk taking damage when you draw, then take psychic Possession, if you go your way, then Ivory Tower.
Personally, I didn't want to run only 1 and I was pretty much done getting cards for this deck. I got the idea after I had finalized and ordered, and didn't want to wait another week for the card to arrive so I could play. Also I was out of room in my deck so... :/
pretty good, I suppose it depends on what route you're taking. If you go my way, where you risk taking damage when you draw, then take psychic Possession, if you go your way, then Ivory Tower.
Personally, I didn't want to run only 1 and I was pretty much done getting cards for this deck. I got the idea after I had finalized and ordered, and didn't want to wait another week for the card to arrive so I could play. Also I was out of room in my deck so... :/
Understood. I hesitated to use Ivory Tower because it's rather overpowered in the right deck. I will have to test it with my group first. If they find it distasteful, I will use something else.
I understand completely, I refuse to get cards that would make my deck have cheap win conditions. Plus, my friends would probably refuse to play if I chose cards like that. As cool as combos like those are, they ruin the fun for everyone else
Ooh this Deck looks too cool. I think I will try and make a Deck list too. I kinda want to make the Deck more budget however so i might be cutting a few of the cards. This deck is a challenge too.
4 Master of the Feast
2 Nekusar, the Mindrazer
4 Ebony Owl Netsuke
4 Howling Mine
4 Underworld Dream
4 Boomerang
4 Dark Ritual
2 Runeflare Trap
3 Toil // Trouble
3 Trade Secret
2 Crmbling Necropolis
2 Dragonskull Summit
4 Drowned Catacomb
1 Island
4 Polluted Delta
2 Steam Vents
2 Sulfur Falls
1 Swamp
4 Watery Grave
62 cards, but thanks to the card drawing engines it runs through the deck very fast while killing opponent for the advantage. I tried out different versions of Owling Mind and I find this one to be the most stable thanks to the combination of cheap force-draw and cheap damage via draw/hand size. Dark Ritual allow first turn Master of the Feast or Underworld Dream, second turn double Mine/Owl, third turn Nekusar or any combination of first + second turn spells. My current concern is the number of Toil//Trouble and Runeflare Trap, both proven to be deadly and I am not sure if I should add more (or just use one of them instead of both). Another version of this deck uses Spiteful Visions, but that card damages both side so given the speed of my own drawing I hesitate to use it, and Nekusar does the job better.
Thoughts and suggestions are welcomed.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
My final deck is at the very bottom
Check it out HERE
as for your concern about Spiteful visions, I had that same concern, but with the cards I run, my opponents usually end up losing more life than I do, I would love to find a way to make myself immune to that ability so that only opponents are affected, but for now, I have no idea of any cards that could do that for me.
Thx for the suggestions. I think because I use red cards so my deck might be more aggressive than yours, but yours have creatures to stabilize the field which definitely protects you better than mine would. I confess that many times I wish I have more blockers, and I need a little more luck to get the best combination before I could burst damage.
I think both of our decks benefit from Trade Secret, because not only I could force them to draw it also triggers Runeflare Trap or warrant a bigger Toil // Trouble. Maybe I need some mana acceleration to ensure more spells being cast?
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
I avoid Spiteful Vision because it's more risky, especially since this kind of decks draw a lot of cards, unless we counter it with... Ivory Tower.
I think my theme is slightly more mixed because not only I want damage from drawing but I also want damage from big hand size. The few tests I ran show that I deal more burst damage with red while more steadily with black. If I go the entire artifact route for force-drawand remove the blue cards, I can add in some creature removal and/or Ivory Tower. The Tower is rather evil though...
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
Why no Black Vise? Too "powerful"?
I would just play Wash Out
BUWGRChilds PlayGRWUB
BUWGR Highlander GRWUB
UBSquee's Shapeshifting PetBU
BW Multiplayer Control WB
RG Changeling GR
UR Mana FlareRU
UMerfolkU
B MBMC B
In terms of 1v1, yeah, Black Vise is too powerful, and also because Owl can hit all opponents, not just one.
You're right about the Kami being a legend, I think the benefit is that it can block attacking creatures, and cons because it can be destroyed more easily than Dictate of Kruphix. I have mixed feeing about Spiteful Visions, namely because there are other options that could do its job without hurting myself (albeit needing a mix of cards). It does have easier mana requirement, so I will test it out more, perhaps with Ivory Tower mixed in.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
I designed a deck around a very similar Idea, I just didn't use Ebony owl Netsuke.
I will give Dictate a go, it looks promising. I'm a little confused about the combo of Spiteful Vision and Psychic Possession. SV damages you whenever you draw, so wouldn't that hurt you anyway even if you draw via opponent's draw (and opponent likely will draw a lot)?
Trade Secret is 3cc and it draws cards without replacing your current ones, I find it more appealing than the Puzzle Box atm. Psychosis Crawler is an interesting idea, but at 5cc I'll need to test it out with other cards to see how speed goes.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
What do you think about Ivory Tower? It does give you life early and persistently after.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
Personally, I didn't want to run only 1 and I was pretty much done getting cards for this deck. I got the idea after I had finalized and ordered, and didn't want to wait another week for the card to arrive so I could play. Also I was out of room in my deck so... :/
Understood. I hesitated to use Ivory Tower because it's rather overpowered in the right deck. I will have to test it with my group first. If they find it distasteful, I will use something else.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
My Decks:
All my Decks are budget
EDH:GRWHazezon TamarGRW, RKazuul, Tyrant of the CliffsR, BMikaeus, the UnhallowedB, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GRXenagos, God of RevelsGR, BGPharika, God of AfflictionBG
Standard:BMono Black Control(devotion)B- retired
Casual:UWHeroicUW, UGWall tribalUG, BPhylactery LichB
Modern:UBAbyssal PersecutorUB, WKnight TribalW