Hey all,
I have been lurking for a while and these forms have really improved my playgroups multiplayer decks and I hope to be posting multiple lists to get help with.
We play with the modern banlist and a soft house rule of cards over $10 limited to 2x.
So the deck that im trying to build right now started from trying to use Creakwood Liege and Cryptolith Rite to fire off a large Torment of Hailfire unfortunately I don't think the Liege makes the cut. The current list I have is as follows:
It would be cool to have some sort of combo, drawing a card for each creature we control, drawing our deck, untaping with ready // willing, and casting a fat torment.
I am now trying to make this from a generic GWb token deck to a saproling token deck specifically(Probably Mono Green). I know Tendershoot Dryad is the star of the deck, not sure if I want to go white or black as the main secondary color and if ill even include a third color. New cards that I think are worth considering are Slimefoot, the Stowaway, sporecrown Thallid, Song of Freyalise.
You may have too little early plays.
I’d definitely run (more) card draw.
Are artifacts and enchantments a problem?
Don’t you need air defense?
And please run 24 lands, unless you have a valid reason to run less.
You might drop two of your four-ofs.
You might look critically at which cards actually trigger in a game.
As an inspiration, these are my deckbuilding “rules, they’re more like guidelines”:
24 lands
3x 12 cards ordered by casting cost: 0,1&2 and 3&4 and 5 plus
This guarantees that I hardly ever sit idle.
Depending on your opponents you must decide how much artifact/enchantment/land destruction you must run.
Also decide whether you need airdefense or creature-sweepers.
Why? He can come out, gobble up 4 creatures, be a 12/12 then dump 8 saporlings out next upkeep. I did bring him down to a 1x but I think cutting verdant force and going up to 2x is better.
I don't think I really want sweepers here as hopefully I have the widest board. I agree I need some card draw, but not sure what to cut/add. 3 targeted removal seems appropriate, maybe Beast within but again, what to cut? And the 6 ramping mana seems high, up cryptolith rite up to a four of?
Thanks for the help already! Can't wait to see this deck come together.
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I am restricted to the modern legal card-pool. (Unless it's EDH)
Why? He can come out, gobble up 4 creatures, be a 12/12 then dump 8 saporlings out next upkeep. I did bring him down to a 1x but I think cutting verdant force and going up to 2x is better.
Sure in the best case scenario he is nuts. If you indeed eat the 4 or more tokens he is pretty much all you ever need. But he also opens you up for removal. First you kill your own dudes and then the opponents will Doom Blade the fungus itself. Also if you don't have creatures on board (for example post-wrath) it would most likely be better to have something else instead.
Right, I have a bad habit of seeing best case scenarios. Worst case hes a 5 mana 4/4, or as you said a self wrath, so ill be staying at 1 of for the fun factor.
And i generally buy 4 of's if its not too expensive and tweak numbers as I play. What I really need help with is cutting for ramp/removal/draw, and the cards that I should add to fill those slots.
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I am restricted to the modern legal card-pool. (Unless it's EDH)
Once upon a time, this forum supplied me with a GW tokens build that had, at it's heart, three things: 1) unfair mana acceleration through Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary, 2) a lean GSZ package, and 3) a mix of asymmetrical token producers. The Modern banlist would of course impact your card selection, but the concepts can still apply.
For ramp, the most efficient options are probably lands or Elves. If Wrath is common, then the land approach is probably better. Either way, topping out your curve with Primeval Titan and Sylvan Primordial is pretty good; the former can find your Gavony Township / Kessig Wolf Run and both can really power up your X or Kicker spells.
Lands (24) X Forest X Plains X Temple Garden X Wooded Foothills X Windswept Heath 2 Gavony Township
Feel free to add Tendershoot Dryad. Deck needs things in the middle of the curve; I'd look hard for 2-3 drops when filling it out (replace the Good Stuff placeholder...).
Eldrazi Monument is "fine" - though I haven't found that I needed it to win (4 person FFA - with larger group, these things are more useful). While Earthcraft (if it wasn't banned) is incredible - i.e., goes infinite with something as seemingly innocuous as Ant Queen & Parallel Lives, I haven't found Cryptolith Rite or Growing Rites necessary.
So I've gone ahead and changed the name of the thread to suit the direction that i'm going, Mono Green Saprolings.
(should I remove this and just start a new thread?)
What else would you critique within the constraint of Saproling tokens and modern legal cards?
(Doubling Season with the spore counter thalid would be cool but doubling season is out of my price range atm)
1. Yes. Zualport Cutthroat is also bonkers.
2. Yes to good, no to swap. If anything I would cut your 1 drops and play these kinds of cards instead (no mana dorks/ramp).
3. Plots is heinous and should be cut. Things like Shamanic Revelation are vastly superior.
4. Sprawl is amazing but I'd rather see you employ the Rites/Song plan given that this is a token deck.
5. It's a reasonable 1-2 of. Card is immensely powerful once it gets going.
6. I wouldn't touch either with a 10-foot pole.
1. Yes. Zualport Cutthroat is also bonkers.
2. Yes to good, no to swap. If anything I would cut your 1 drops and play these kinds of cards instead (no mana dorks/ramp).
3. Plots is heinous and should be cut. Things like Shamanic Revelation are vastly superior.
4. Sprawl is amazing but I'd rather see you employ the Rites/Song plan given that this is a token deck.
5. It's a reasonable 1-2 of. Card is immensely powerful once it gets going.
6. I wouldn't touch either with a 10-foot pole.
Ive updated the deck to include the suggestions. Just seems with no mana dorks/utopia sprawl, it'll take a little to long for my mana ramp to come online and no 1 drops that the deck is a little slow. And because I cut the dorks does that make my mana math change (less 1 drops, less ramp) so up from 20 to 24 lands?
Sure. You're way too focused on your curls because your deadlift is a joke and my girlfriend can squat heavier than you. I get that big arms = beefcake but you need to round out your routine to work additional muscle groups.
Moving on to your deck, you have too much top end. Monument, Revelation and Mycoloth all occupy the same space and all compete with Tendershoot Dryad. Ten 5 drops is just too many. I like the numbers on most of the other cards (maybe shave a Slimefoot) but in general you need more 2s and 3s so that you can build for the turn 2 spell, turn 3 spell, turn 4 Parallel Lives, turn 5 Dryad curve every game.
FWIW I don't hate Khalni Garden as a virtual 1 drop that works well on Song/Rite draws. I realize that it's a Plant but given the choice of casting or Forest on turn 1 it's not remotely close.
I also think that 4x Saproling Migration is a must. After all, what else are you happy to cast on turn 2? Just Rites. Song is legit bad in most scenarios so you need more good 2 drops.
The "card draw" spell that I tend to play in token now is 2x Evolutionary Leap. Card is cheap, digs into your bombs and is a reasonable turn 3 play (it uses your mana effectively if nothing else).
So with the release of m19, do you guys think Poisin-Tip Archer has any place over slimefoot or zulaport? Reach is good because eldrazi monument is my only flyer protection, and the fact that if someone goes to board-wipe, I probably just win the game, or atleast its a big deterrent to wiping.
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I am restricted to the modern legal card-pool. (Unless it's EDH)
I have been lurking for a while and these forms have really improved my playgroups multiplayer decks and I hope to be posting multiple lists to get help with.
We play with the modern banlist and a soft house rule of cards over $10 limited to 2x.
So the deck that im trying to build right now started from trying to use Creakwood Liege and Cryptolith Rite to fire off a large Torment of Hailfire unfortunately I don't think the Liege makes the cut. The current list I have is as follows:
4x Champion of Lambholt
1x Mycoloth
2x Siege Rhino
4x Soul's Attendant
4x Tendershoot Dryad
1x Verdant Force
1x Verdeloth the Ancient
2x Voice of Resurgence
2x Wolfbriar Elemental
2x Intangible Virtue
2x Cryptolith Rite
2x Eldrazi Monument
Instant/Sorcery
2x Gruesome Fate
2x Lingering Souls
2x Ready // Willing
1x Torment of Hailfire
1x Sylvan Offering
1x Martial Coup
1x Grim Backwoods
3x Murmuring Bosk
2x Vault of the Archangel
2x Forest
1x Godless Shrine
1x Overgrown Tomb
2x Plains
1x Swamp
3x Temple Garden
4x Windswept Heath
4x Wooded Foothills
It would be cool to have some sort of combo, drawing a card for each creature we control, drawing our deck, untaping with ready // willing, and casting a fat torment.
I am now trying to make this from a generic GWb token deck to a saproling token deck specifically(Probably Mono Green). I know Tendershoot Dryad is the star of the deck, not sure if I want to go white or black as the main secondary color and if ill even include a third color. New cards that I think are worth considering are Slimefoot, the Stowaway, sporecrown Thallid, Song of Freyalise.
2x Mycoloth
3x Slimefoot, the Stowaway
2x Zulaport Cutthroat
4x Tendershoot Dryad
Artifact
2x Eldrazi Monument
Enchantment
2x Evolutionary leap
3x Song of Freyalise
2x Beastmaster Ascension
3x Cryptolith Rite
4x Parallel Lives
3x Beast Within
2x Heroic Intervention
2x Spore Swarm
2x Sprout Swarm
Land
11x Forest
1x Overgrown Tomb
4x Temple of Malady
4x Windswept Heath
4x Saproling Migration
Any constructive criticism is welcome, if any critical info is missing please let me know!
I’d definitely run (more) card draw.
Are artifacts and enchantments a problem?
Don’t you need air defense?
And please run 24 lands, unless you have a valid reason to run less.
You might drop two of your four-ofs.
You might look critically at which cards actually trigger in a game.
As an inspiration, these are my deckbuilding “rules, they’re more like guidelines”:
24 lands
3x 12 cards ordered by casting cost: 0,1&2 and 3&4 and 5 plus
This guarantees that I hardly ever sit idle.
Depending on your opponents you must decide how much artifact/enchantment/land destruction you must run.
Also decide whether you need airdefense or creature-sweepers.
6 card draw
6 ramping mana
3 targeted removal
3 sweepers
My meta: 3 or 4 player free for all, anything goes but boring games or broken decks cause a vote to end that game.
Removed 1x mycoloth, 2x lingering souls, added in 1x sylving offering and martial coup. I do like the idea of x tokens, maybe white sun's zenith?
Why? He can come out, gobble up 4 creatures, be a 12/12 then dump 8 saporlings out next upkeep. I did bring him down to a 1x but I think cutting verdant force and going up to 2x is better.
As far as early plays, I have 11/12 that you recommend, probably need to drop a 3 drop for another 1-2 drop.
Artifacts and enchantments are a slight problem and sundering growth will certainly be side boarded in.
For air defense, there arnt a whole lot of flyers, so im hoping that the now two lingering souls and two eldrazi monument will be adequate.
Now have 24 lands =}
I don't think I really want sweepers here as hopefully I have the widest board. I agree I need some card draw, but not sure what to cut/add. 3 targeted removal seems appropriate, maybe Beast within but again, what to cut? And the 6 ramping mana seems high, up cryptolith rite up to a four of?
Thanks for the help already! Can't wait to see this deck come together.
Right, I have a bad habit of seeing best case scenarios. Worst case hes a 5 mana 4/4, or as you said a self wrath, so ill be staying at 1 of for the fun factor.
And i generally buy 4 of's if its not too expensive and tweak numbers as I play. What I really need help with is cutting for ramp/removal/draw, and the cards that I should add to fill those slots.
And I’d up the Martial Coup’s for sweeper.
Maybe run Shamanic Revelation for card draw?
My meta: 3 or 4 player free for all, anything goes but boring games or broken decks cause a vote to end that game.
Glare of Subdual
Reconnaissance (this basically gives vigilance to all your creatures and saves the tiny blocked ones, check it out)
Khalni Garden
Sterling Grove
Nest invader
Beastmaster Ascension
Garruk Wildspeaker
Knight-Captain of Eos
Windbrisk heights
Elspeth Tirel
Druids' Repository
Skullclamp (if not banned in your playgroup)
Aura Shards
Cloudgoat Ranger
For ramp, the most efficient options are probably lands or Elves. If Wrath is common, then the land approach is probably better. Either way, topping out your curve with Primeval Titan and Sylvan Primordial is pretty good; the former can find your Gavony Township / Kessig Wolf Run and both can really power up your X or Kicker spells.
For asymmetrical tokens producers, Sylvan Offering is a card I would urge you to run as a 4-of. While it looks symmetrical in the face, once you have a Parallel Lives or Doubling Season or Beastmaster Ascension or Cathars' Crusade in play, there is basically no drawback. I want to see that card in EVERY game. I would also run Benevolent Offering over Lingering Souls for basically the same reason.
I'd also cut Black and tone down the life gain (are you always The Threat?)
With a Modern banlist, I'd start with something like the following -
4 Arbor Elf
4 Utopia Sprawl
2 Joraga Treespeaker
1 Rhys the Redeemed
4 Good Stuff
2 Benevolent Offering
1 Ant Queen
1 Primeval Titan
1 Hornet Queen
1 Sylvan Primordial
1 Avenger of Zendikar
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
4 Sylvan Offering
2 Wolfbriar Elemental
1 Intangible Virtue
4 Parallel Lives
1 Anointed Procession
1 Cathars' Crusade
Lands (24)
X Forest
X Plains
X Temple Garden
X Wooded Foothills
X Windswept Heath
2 Gavony Township
Feel free to add Tendershoot Dryad. Deck needs things in the middle of the curve; I'd look hard for 2-3 drops when filling it out (replace the Good Stuff placeholder...).
Eldrazi Monument is "fine" - though I haven't found that I needed it to win (4 person FFA - with larger group, these things are more useful). While Earthcraft (if it wasn't banned) is incredible - i.e., goes infinite with something as seemingly innocuous as Ant Queen & Parallel Lives, I haven't found Cryptolith Rite or Growing Rites necessary.
Edit: Another Saproling option is building around Sprout Swarm / Seedborn Muse / Parallel Lives.
(should I remove this and just start a new thread?)
2x Mycoloth
4x Slimefoot, the Stowaway
2x Zulaport Cutthroat
4x Tendershoot Dryad
Artifact
2x Eldrazi Monument
Enchantment
4x Song of Freyalise
2x Beastmaster Ascension
2x Cryptolith Rite
4x Parallel Lives
4x Beast Within
2x Heroic Intervention
2x Spore Swarm
2x Sprout Swarm
Land
11x Forest
1x Overgrown Tomb
4x Temple of Malady
4x Windswept Heath
2x Saproling Migration
2x Shamanic Revelation
My questions now are, is (1) Slimefoot, The Stowaway worth the splash of black?
(2) Is Song of Freyalise any good/ worth putting in over Cryptolith Rite?
(3) Is Fungal Plots just bad card draw? What would be better? (Restricted to modern)
(4) Should I try going up to four of Utopia Sprawl?
(5) Is Beastmaster Ascension anygood here?
(6) Worth putting in Champion of Lambholt to push through damage? Or Essence Warden for incremental life-gain?
What else would you critique within the constraint of Saproling tokens and modern legal cards?
(Doubling Season with the spore counter thalid would be cool but doubling season is out of my price range atm)
2. Yes to good, no to swap. If anything I would cut your 1 drops and play these kinds of cards instead (no mana dorks/ramp).
3. Plots is heinous and should be cut. Things like Shamanic Revelation are vastly superior.
4. Sprawl is amazing but I'd rather see you employ the Rites/Song plan given that this is a token deck.
5. It's a reasonable 1-2 of. Card is immensely powerful once it gets going.
6. I wouldn't touch either with a 10-foot pole.
Any reason why you're not playing Sprout Swarm?
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
Thanks for the response!
Ive updated the deck to include the suggestions. Just seems with no mana dorks/utopia sprawl, it'll take a little to long for my mana ramp to come online and no 1 drops that the deck is a little slow. And because I cut the dorks does that make my mana math change (less 1 drops, less ramp) so up from 20 to 24 lands?
Cut the lord for Zulaport Cutthroat just seems better.
As for sprout swarm, no just that I don't have any in my paper card pool so it just didn't occur to me.
Could you just critique my numbers?
Sure. You're way too focused on your curls because your deadlift is a joke and my girlfriend can squat heavier than you. I get that big arms = beefcake but you need to round out your routine to work additional muscle groups.
Moving on to your deck, you have too much top end. Monument, Revelation and Mycoloth all occupy the same space and all compete with Tendershoot Dryad. Ten 5 drops is just too many. I like the numbers on most of the other cards (maybe shave a Slimefoot) but in general you need more 2s and 3s so that you can build for the turn 2 spell, turn 3 spell, turn 4 Parallel Lives, turn 5 Dryad curve every game.
FWIW I don't hate Khalni Garden as a virtual 1 drop that works well on Song/Rite draws. I realize that it's a Plant but given the choice of casting or Forest on turn 1 it's not remotely close.
I also think that 4x Saproling Migration is a must. After all, what else are you happy to cast on turn 2? Just Rites. Song is legit bad in most scenarios so you need more good 2 drops.
The "card draw" spell that I tend to play in token now is 2x Evolutionary Leap. Card is cheap, digs into your bombs and is a reasonable turn 3 play (it uses your mana effectively if nothing else).
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold
With 24 lands 6 Elves and 4 Sprawls? ~98.4314575%
Guilds of Ravnica - Commander 2018 - Core 2019 - Battlebond - Dominaria - Rivals of Ixalan - Ixalan - Commander 2017 - Hour of Devastation - Amonket - Aether Revolt - Commander 2016 - Kaladesh - Conspiracy 2 - Eldritch Moon - Shadows Over Innistrad - Oath of the Gatewatch - Commander 2015 - Battle for Zendikar - Magic Origins - Dragons of Tarkir
Green - Blue - Red - White - Gold