I acquired my last Hedron Crab last night, so I decided to post one of my personal favorites, my mono-blue mill deck, for your critique.
Before we start, note that there are many ways to skin a cat, the way I've chosen to skin this particular cat is with:
Anyway, this deck relies on low cmc instants and sorceries, high amounts of draw, and a few of the usual MBM suspects. My goal is to mill at least 10 cards per turn beyond the second turn. It is pretty easy to make up from falling short of that goal with Jace, Memory Adept, Hedron Crab, as well as the deck's staple; Brain Freeze. THE OBJECTIVE OF THIS DECK includes sacrificing mostly defense for speedy milling. I am aware that there isn't much to do about any threats aside from block, but much like a mono-red burn deck, you sort of have to throw caution into the wind and hope you win the big race. I take the 'winning with 1 life is still winning' approach here, but rarely does it get that close if I win.
After my sixth turn is when a 60 card deck buys the farm, this is a consistent statistic, sometimes I get lucky though..
Because I so lovingly collected each of these cards over a period of time, here's a break-down:
Mind Sculpt: Heavy mill, low cost, gets me to that quote pretty easily (especially on turn 2 when Hedron Crab is out).
Dream Twist: A debatable above average choice, the three card mill is sort of poopy, but the 1 cmc and flashback make it worth using with Brain Freeze lurking about, to the say the least about reach with a high mana pool and small hand.
Increasing Confusion: A terrible card, I don't particularly like it for the sole reason of having to put it into the graveyard for it to be worth using. And on that note, it is very worth sinking mana into once it's in the graveyard. It's late-game reach at best, but I'm looking to replace it once I get another Fog Bank.
Tome Scour: bread and butter. Perfect for this deck, low cmc, high mill, very worth-while.
Visions of Beyond: Hand recovery. More often than not does it fuel a Brain Freeze spree, dig me up a land for Hedron Crab(s), or provide an otherwise useful addition to my strategy.
Brain Freeze: The card that really ties the room together. I don't need to get into how great storm is with 1 and 2 cmc instants. Personally, I will not cast this spell unless it can be copied 3 times at least. Typically, on a turn that Brain Freeze is used in this way, 15-34 cards can be milled. Worst case scenario: Though Scour>Dream Twist>Brain Freeze, mill 14 for 4 mana. Best case scenario: Evolving Wilds tap/sac with Hedron Crab out>Jace, Mind Sculptor's 0 ability>Tome Scour>Dream Twist>Thought Scour (or doubles/triples of one of those)>Brain Freeze! Mill 38 for 5 mana (on turn 6). Mill 43 if I have 3 Tome Scours, but I don't think that's ever happened.. yet. Either way, even without the Evolving Wilds/Hedron Crab and Jace, Mind Sculptor's ability, that's 22 cards. THEN, there is the instant speed factor. If my opponent is blazing through low cmc cards like I am, I can always cast it at the end of THEIR turn for a similar effect.
Thought Scour: Utility and mill, draws me a card while milling them two. Sure, why not?
Cackling Counterpart: Not the best choice I admit, but it's excellent for doubling up on what few creatures I am packing. Another candidate for replacement by Fog Bank/Guard Gomazoa. It is excellent for copying Hedron Crab among the rest.
Jace's Phantasm: Both a PLAN B and a sturdy blocker. More times than not do I attack with it to create a dual front of threatening circumstances, but he is an excellent wall for the turns this deck exists/flourishes in. It has made for a simple win a couple of times, but usually saves my Jace, Memory Adept for another turn.
Fog Bank: Tough to deal with defense, I like it. Vulnerable to burns of course..
Rhystic Study: Slightly taxing for the opponent, but plays a psychological affect, I've seen. When you see your deck shrinking, you tend to want to get your plan up and running faster. One mana may seem small, but it can mean the difference in what gets placed on the board during turns that matter. Then again the foolish opponent usually just casts carelessly and I draw happily.
Jace, Memory Adept: An expensive blow-hard. I usually just use him for his 10 mill ability. I rarely expect him to last past a turn or two, and he usually doesn't. Every turn he is out though, I can more than double my mill quota. He's worth is for sure, but he's only an addition to Brain Freeze. On the other side of the coin, he serves as a gimpy Thought Scour in my hour of need. His ultimate is an obvious face melter. Three is enough.
Evolving Wilds: Double the effects of Hedron Crab, a sleazy trick with worthwhile outcomes. Mill 6, 12, 18, 24, 36, or 44 for a tapped land, woot woot.
Lonely Sandbar: Frustrating when you direly need land, great when you don't really need all the mana you can produce on one turn, excellent when you don't need land at all.
So there you have it, plain and simple. Aside from wanting to drop 2 Increasing Confusions for 1 more Fog Bank and 1 Jace's Archivist (maybe) OR 1 Trade Secrets, I'm not sure what other improvements can be made. Help me out with that
This is making me rethink my control U/B mill deck. Since that deck has been like a child to me; a pain in the butt at times, but it's one of my first decks and that satisfies my desires to win unconventionally. Because of that deck, I've always had a soft spot for mill decks. Good job sir. However, one card I've noticed that often pulverizes my opponent is Dreadwaters. I'm not sure if that's too expensive for your intended mana curve, but if you get enough mana it becomes much more useful than X mill spells such as Psychic Drain. I've never used Increasing Confusion, so I don't know if it's better than that, but for my deck it works quite well.
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Haven't played anything but EDH and casual for over a year
For Thought Scour, did you include it just because it is a mill card with "draw a card" tacked on? If you aren't extremely tied to it or want something more efficient, you could use Memory Sluice instead. It's almost as good as Tome Scour, but does twice as much work towards your win condition than Though Scour. And if you happen to have a pair of Crabs around, you can double up the effect.
I have a Jace themed mill deck in my signature. With all the card draw you've got going on Jace's Erasure may be a good addition. It may not be necessary, but you could be a real jerk and use Isochron Scepter with Brain Freeze.
That's a nifty trick, though I'd split use between Brain Freeze and Mind Sculpt for maximum lols.
If you aren't extremely tied to it or want something more efficient, you could use Memory Sluice instead.
I didn't consider that card, in fact, I forgot it existed. But alas, it's pretty shoddy considering my low creature count, perhaps it could find a 1 or 2 slot here; but in my experience, having 2 creatures to tap isn't reliablesauce in this deck.
However, one card I've noticed that often pulverizes my opponent is Dreadwaters. I'm not sure if that's too expensive for your intended mana curve, but if you get enough mana it becomes much more useful than X mill spells such as Psychic Drain.
Dreadwaters costs too much, at best I have 6 lands when the opponent's deck has bitten the big one. Though, I really need to get rid of one or both Increasing Confusions.. Maybe I'll sideboard it.
Speaking of, I should come up with a sideboard..
Is there an Unsummon with mill out there somewhere? If I could mesh milling and defense, I'd be nearly unstoppable..
The only defensive mill cards I know of is Riddlekeeper and Memory Erosion (kind of defensive). Other than those, I don't think any others exist.
On a different note, do player's search their libraries a lot in your playgroup? If they do, Archive Trap will stomp their decks into oblivion. Actually, even without the trap cost, it still seems better than Increasing Confusion if you only get about 6 lands before the game ends.
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Haven't played anything but EDH and casual for over a year
Have you considered splashing black to play Glimpse the Unthinkable? It's by no means budget friendly, but it's the most efficient, straight-forward mill spell there is. Playing black would also give you access to Mind Funeral and creature removal if you think your deck needs it. I'm sure your deck could get a big boost by replacing some of its more underwhelming cards (Though Scour, Increasing Confusion, etc) with these powerhouse mill staples.
Have you considered splashing black to play Glimpse the Unthinkable? It's by no means budget friendly, but it's the most efficient, straight-forward mill spell there is. Playing black would also give you access to Mind Funeral and creature removal if you think your deck needs it. I'm sure your deck could get a big boost by replacing some of its more underwhelming cards (Though Scour, Increasing Confusion, etc) with these powerhouse mill staples.
My thought is that I shouldn't have to lean on black to get the job done. I would splash black for those 8 cards though, they're excellent additions and I could plausibly just run mostly duals. But no, Mono blue. With me and colors, it's very 'If you give a mouse a cookie', so once I start splashing; there's no telling what I'll end up turning the deck into. They are enticing though, if they weren't so expensive; I'd put them in (mostly just Glimpse of the Unthinkable).
I'll defend Thought Scour until I DIE! More often than not do I use it to draw into another mill card usable that turn. And don't forget, I'm trying to maintain a full-ish hand past turn 3, I need all the draw I can get if I'm dropping 3-4 cards per turn
Have you considered splashing black to play Glimpse the Unthinkable? It's by no means budget friendly, but it's the most efficient, straight-forward mill spell there is. Playing black would also give you access to Mind Funeral and creature removal if you think your deck needs it. I'm sure your deck could get a big boost by replacing some of its more underwhelming cards (Though Scour, Increasing Confusion, etc) with these powerhouse mill staples.
Congratulations. You may have just pushed me over the edge for turning my blue mill deck into a black/blue mill deck. I've been considering it but haven't looked up any of the cards haha.
Back on topic, have you considered Panoptic Mirror? It's a bit pricey at 5 mana and may take you 3 turns to take full advantage of it but if your opponents can't deal with it then they're screwed. I was once able to pull off a Panoptic Mirror + Time Warp combo on my meta and I just took extra turns until I milled everyone at the table. That's a more expensive way to use the mirror, but you could always imprint a Thought Scour on there and every turn you would mill 2, draw 1 for free.
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My casual decks
:symg::symb: Titans
:symw::symb: Control
:symb::symr: Destruction
Eldrazi
Goblins
Lifegain
Mill
Congratulations. You may have just pushed me over the edge for turning my blue mill deck into a black/blue mill deck. I've been considering it but haven't looked up any of the cards haha.
Back on topic, have you considered Panoptic Mirror? It's a bit pricey at 5 mana and may take you 3 turns to take full advantage of it but if your opponents can't deal with it then they're screwed. I was once able to pull off a Panoptic Mirror + Time Warp combo on my meta and I just took extra turns until I milled everyone at the table. That's a more expensive way to use the mirror, but you could always imprint a Thought Scour on there and every turn you would mill 2, draw 1 for free.
I'd use Panoptic Mirror, but only one, it looks like it could be an extra win condition to my otherwise combined effort win condition. But does it travel to the land of over-kill, I wonder? I suppose it would, but then again my only other powerful 5 cmc is Jace, Memory Adept.
It could be considered overkill when you combo with a Time Warp or another similarly powered spell but at the same time, it's not like you're busting that out on turn 2 and destroying everyone. When I pulled that off, we were several turns into the game when I played the mirror, and then my next turn I imprinted the warp on there and then on turn 3 I put it to work. They had a chance to deal with it. Plus you may or may not have a card to imprint on it in your hand.
Private Mod Note
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My casual decks
:symg::symb: Titans
:symw::symb: Control
:symb::symr: Destruction
Eldrazi
Goblins
Lifegain
Mill
Hi, thanks for the replies. I don't think the recent suggestions are too cost effective for my deck's theme of low cost instants and sorceries. Though, I have heavily considered Cyclonic Rift because a board sweeper is just what I'd like. However, I don't know if it should ever get to that point, where I have 7 mana to spare for a wiper.
Though, with your suggestions in tow, here is an updated version:
I acquired my last Hedron Crab last night, so I decided to post one of my personal favorites, my mono-blue mill deck, for your critique.
Before we start, note that there are many ways to skin a cat, the way I've chosen to skin this particular cat is with:
Anyway, this deck relies on low cmc instants and sorceries, high amounts of draw, and a few of the usual MBM suspects. My goal is to mill at least 10 cards per turn beyond the second turn. It is pretty easy to make up from falling short of that goal with Jace, Memory Adept, Hedron Crab, as well as the deck's staple; Brain Freeze. THE OBJECTIVE OF THIS DECK includes sacrificing mostly defense for speedy milling. I am aware that there isn't much to do about any threats aside from block, but much like a mono-red burn deck, you sort of have to throw caution into the wind and hope you win the big race. I take the 'winning with 1 life is still winning' approach here, but rarely does it get that close if I win.
After my sixth turn is when a 60 card deck buys the farm, this is a consistent statistic, sometimes I get lucky though..
Anyway, here it is:
4 Dream Twist
2 Increasing Confusion
4 Tome Scour
4 Visions of Beyond
4 Brain Freeze
4 Thought Scour
1 Cackling Counterpart
4 Jace's Phantasm
3 Fog Bank
2 Rhystic Study
3 Jace, Memory Adept
3 Lonely Sandbar
14 Island
Because I so lovingly collected each of these cards over a period of time, here's a break-down:
Mind Sculpt: Heavy mill, low cost, gets me to that quote pretty easily (especially on turn 2 when Hedron Crab is out).
Dream Twist: A debatable above average choice, the three card mill is sort of poopy, but the 1 cmc and flashback make it worth using with Brain Freeze lurking about, to the say the least about reach with a high mana pool and small hand.
Increasing Confusion: A terrible card, I don't particularly like it for the sole reason of having to put it into the graveyard for it to be worth using. And on that note, it is very worth sinking mana into once it's in the graveyard. It's late-game reach at best, but I'm looking to replace it once I get another Fog Bank.
Tome Scour: bread and butter. Perfect for this deck, low cmc, high mill, very worth-while.
Visions of Beyond: Hand recovery. More often than not does it fuel a Brain Freeze spree, dig me up a land for Hedron Crab(s), or provide an otherwise useful addition to my strategy.
Brain Freeze: The card that really ties the room together. I don't need to get into how great storm is with 1 and 2 cmc instants. Personally, I will not cast this spell unless it can be copied 3 times at least. Typically, on a turn that Brain Freeze is used in this way, 15-34 cards can be milled. Worst case scenario: Though Scour>Dream Twist>Brain Freeze, mill 14 for 4 mana. Best case scenario: Evolving Wilds tap/sac with Hedron Crab out>Jace, Mind Sculptor's 0 ability>Tome Scour>Dream Twist>Thought Scour (or doubles/triples of one of those)>Brain Freeze! Mill 38 for 5 mana (on turn 6). Mill 43 if I have 3 Tome Scours, but I don't think that's ever happened.. yet. Either way, even without the Evolving Wilds/Hedron Crab and Jace, Mind Sculptor's ability, that's 22 cards. THEN, there is the instant speed factor. If my opponent is blazing through low cmc cards like I am, I can always cast it at the end of THEIR turn for a similar effect.
Thought Scour: Utility and mill, draws me a card while milling them two. Sure, why not?
Cackling Counterpart: Not the best choice I admit, but it's excellent for doubling up on what few creatures I am packing. Another candidate for replacement by Fog Bank/Guard Gomazoa. It is excellent for copying Hedron Crab among the rest.
Hedron Crab: Staple mill card. 3 mill for free, 1 cmc, nuff' said. See Evolving Wilds.
Jace's Phantasm: Both a PLAN B and a sturdy blocker. More times than not do I attack with it to create a dual front of threatening circumstances, but he is an excellent wall for the turns this deck exists/flourishes in. It has made for a simple win a couple of times, but usually saves my Jace, Memory Adept for another turn.
Fog Bank: Tough to deal with defense, I like it. Vulnerable to burns of course..
Rhystic Study: Slightly taxing for the opponent, but plays a psychological affect, I've seen. When you see your deck shrinking, you tend to want to get your plan up and running faster. One mana may seem small, but it can mean the difference in what gets placed on the board during turns that matter. Then again the foolish opponent usually just casts carelessly and I draw happily.
Jace, Memory Adept: An expensive blow-hard. I usually just use him for his 10 mill ability. I rarely expect him to last past a turn or two, and he usually doesn't. Every turn he is out though, I can more than double my mill quota. He's worth is for sure, but he's only an addition to Brain Freeze. On the other side of the coin, he serves as a gimpy Thought Scour in my hour of need. His ultimate is an obvious face melter. Three is enough.
Evolving Wilds: Double the effects of Hedron Crab, a sleazy trick with worthwhile outcomes. Mill 6, 12, 18, 24, 36, or 44 for a tapped land, woot woot.
Lonely Sandbar: Frustrating when you direly need land, great when you don't really need all the mana you can produce on one turn, excellent when you don't need land at all.
Island: Worst card in the deck.
So there you have it, plain and simple. Aside from wanting to drop 2 Increasing Confusions for 1 more Fog Bank and 1 Jace's Archivist (maybe) OR 1 Trade Secrets, I'm not sure what other improvements can be made. Help me out with that
T-T-T-THOUGHTS?
That's a nifty trick, though I'd split use between Brain Freeze and Mind Sculpt for maximum lols.
I didn't consider that card, in fact, I forgot it existed. But alas, it's pretty shoddy considering my low creature count, perhaps it could find a 1 or 2 slot here; but in my experience, having 2 creatures to tap isn't reliablesauce in this deck.
Dreadwaters costs too much, at best I have 6 lands when the opponent's deck has bitten the big one. Though, I really need to get rid of one or both Increasing Confusions.. Maybe I'll sideboard it.
Speaking of, I should come up with a sideboard..
Is there an Unsummon with mill out there somewhere? If I could mesh milling and defense, I'd be nearly unstoppable..
On a different note, do player's search their libraries a lot in your playgroup? If they do, Archive Trap will stomp their decks into oblivion. Actually, even without the trap cost, it still seems better than Increasing Confusion if you only get about 6 lands before the game ends.
Sasky for the Sig.
I am in your [PACK]. Watching you... do... something.
My thought is that I shouldn't have to lean on black to get the job done. I would splash black for those 8 cards though, they're excellent additions and I could plausibly just run mostly duals. But no, Mono blue. With me and colors, it's very 'If you give a mouse a cookie', so once I start splashing; there's no telling what I'll end up turning the deck into. They are enticing though, if they weren't so expensive; I'd put them in (mostly just Glimpse of the Unthinkable).
I'll defend Thought Scour until I DIE! More often than not do I use it to draw into another mill card usable that turn. And don't forget, I'm trying to maintain a full-ish hand past turn 3, I need all the draw I can get if I'm dropping 3-4 cards per turn
Congratulations. You may have just pushed me over the edge for turning my blue mill deck into a black/blue mill deck. I've been considering it but haven't looked up any of the cards haha.
Back on topic, have you considered Panoptic Mirror? It's a bit pricey at 5 mana and may take you 3 turns to take full advantage of it but if your opponents can't deal with it then they're screwed. I was once able to pull off a Panoptic Mirror + Time Warp combo on my meta and I just took extra turns until I milled everyone at the table. That's a more expensive way to use the mirror, but you could always imprint a Thought Scour on there and every turn you would mill 2, draw 1 for free.
My casual decks
:symg::symb: Titans
:symw::symb: Control
:symb::symr: Destruction
Eldrazi
Goblins
Lifegain
Mill
Those are some expensive bananas Jh1h15233, I've had the chance to scoop some up, but didn't want to part with my Entreat the Angels'. Mind Funeral isn't so bad though. I'd only really want to splash black for 4 Glimpse of the Unthinkables and 2ish Mind Funerals..
I'd use Panoptic Mirror, but only one, it looks like it could be an extra win condition to my otherwise combined effort win condition. But does it travel to the land of over-kill, I wonder? I suppose it would, but then again my only other powerful 5 cmc is Jace, Memory Adept.
My casual decks
:symg::symb: Titans
:symw::symb: Control
:symb::symr: Destruction
Eldrazi
Goblins
Lifegain
Mill
Theres Belltower Sphinx but I think he costs too much mana wise.
Though, with your suggestions in tow, here is an updated version:
4 Dream Twist
4 Tome Scour
4 Visions of Beyond
4 Brain Freeze
4 Thought Scour
4 Hedron Crab
4 Jace's Phantasm
4 Fog Bank
2 Isochron Scepter
3 Jace, Memory Adept
4 Evolving Wilds
3 Lonely Sandbar
14 Island
I'm still waiting for a new sweet blue mill card for U/B in gatecrash.. Maybe then I will splash black.