R/W Humans

  • #176
    My list right now on MTGO

    Wynner64's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    4 Doomed Traveler
    4 Champion of the Parish
    2 Geist-Honored Monk
    4 Hellrider
    2 Elite Inquisitor
    3 Fiend Hunter
    3 Cloistered Youth

    3 Brimstone Volley
    4 Gather the Townsfolk
    3 Midnight Haunting
    2 Rally the Peasants
    3 Devil's Play

    7 Mountain
    13 Plains
    4 Clifftop Retreat



    Been having really good results in tournament practice. The deck whips up on Gnaw to the Bone, which is a really nice change of pace, because before DKA I lost to that deck about every time. It also does nicely against Delver and Mono Black. Jund and RG give it problems, as well as the mirror (when it has Thalia). I've been considering adding Thalia or Mikaeus to the deck, but not quite sure if either one is necessary. The one card I really don't like right now is Geist-Honored Monk. He's either just sitting in my hand, or when he does hit the board the game is already over.
  • #177
    A lot of people have been main decking Stromkirk Noble. With so many Boros running around in the block format having 4 of is a good idea. However, I think the new Vexing Devil will replace him.
  • #178
    Quote from twowheelsup
    A lot of people have been main decking Stromkirk Noble. With so many Boros running around in the block format having 4 of is a good idea. However, I think the new Vexing Devil will replace him.


    I've been pondering the idea of throwing him in the sideboard. I don't think I like him maindeck though because the majority of the time you won't be able to cast him first turn, plus he doesn't make Champs bigger.

    Also, I've been getting killed by RG lately...this deck just doesn't seem to hold its own against werewolves. How do you guys handle this matchup and how would you suggest sideboarding against it?
    Last edited by Wynner64: 4/12/2012 2:24:51 AM
  • #179
    I made the mistake of thinking RW was competitive until I ran into the Jund deck in the 2-mans. Yeah, not so much. Turns out you DO have to play with real cards to win after all. Whenever I go in with RW, suddenly *I* am the idiot with the cheap deck that the guys with real decks prey upon. Not a good place to be.
  • #180
    Quote from cjwynes
    I made the mistake of thinking RW was competitive until I ran into the Jund deck in the 2-mans. Yeah, not so much. Turns out you DO have to play with real cards to win after all. Whenever I go in with RW, suddenly *I* am the idiot with the cheap deck that the guys with real decks prey upon. Not a good place to be.



    Cheer up my fellow Missourian. RW still makes tons of appearances in the dailies and is still a competitive deck. Jund is the best around, but it can be beaten. Also, the new set looks to have some nice additions to the arsenal. I like the idea of phasing Slayer of the Wicked in and out to destroy all of their werewolves.
  • #181
    Here's a deck I took down a GPT for Anaheim with. Before AVR, this deck proves that RW Humans is still viable.

    TheTrueShyGuy's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Last edited by TheTrueShyGuy: 4/15/2012 7:17:59 PM
    *I COLLECT EHAN106 ALTERS. GOT ANY?*

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  • #182
    Quote from cjwynes
    I made the mistake of thinking RW was competitive until I ran into the Jund deck in the 2-mans. Yeah, not so much. Turns out you DO have to play with real cards to win after all. Whenever I go in with RW, suddenly *I* am the idiot with the cheap deck that the guys with real decks prey upon. Not a good place to be.


    i dont know how you feel that way, i have a very good match up with jund
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  • #183
    Does anybody have any advice for sideboarding? Specifically options for the mirror? Thanks in advance.
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  • #184
    I'm having a big problem against the control decks in block (Jund?) They run curse of death's hold, garruk, sorin, etc.

    What are the sideboard cards that make sense against this deck? What about strategies to beat them out?
  • #185
    This is the list I'm trying right now.

    anakyn's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    4 Clifftop retreat
    3 Cavern of souls
    9 Mountain
    8 Plains

    4 Champion of the parish
    4 Doomed traveler
    3 Thalia, guardian of Thraben
    4 Lightning Mauler
    3 Elite inquisitor
    3 Kessig malcontents
    3 Silverblade paladin
    2 Fiend hunter
    4 Hellrider

    4 Gather the townsfolk
    2 Thatcher Revolt




    I think AVR has given GREAT cards for this archetype and imho this deck should use even more humans than before: cards like Kessig Malcontents require this approach, and Lightning Mauler / Silverblade Paladin are so broken you should use them anyways.

    Another good reason to insist on as many humans as possible is the new land Cavern of souls, which makes them uncounterable.

    Only non-human creature is Hellrider, but that's an obvious choice for an aggro-tokens deck.

    Sideboard is still a work in progress because I didn't have many chances to test it.
    Riders of gavony and Devout chaplain are interesting cards but I don't know if they are efficient enough: especially the Chaplain seems to me a bit too slow and conditional to become truly effective.


    Some other explanations:

    - why more mountains (9) then plains (8) if we have 8 W creatures we absolutely want to play on 1st turn?
    Because those creatures are humans, so we can use Cavern of souls as a W source, and that means we have a total of 11 sources of W we can find at the start of the game. That should be enough.
    The other reason is Hellrider requires RR, and since Cavern can't be used for him, the deck has a total of 13 R mana sources cause we absolutely want at least 2 of them on the board on 4th turn.

    - why Thatcher Revolt?
    I use just 2 of them and I consider this card as a sort of finisher, because if at least 1 Hellrider is in play, it means 6 dmg for 3 mana.
    Being human tokens means they can pump the Champion and they can combo with Kessig malcontents, but Champion has a better synergy with Gather the townsfolk (2 mana instead of 3 --> faster pump), and the synergy with Malcontents requires way too mana (6 mana total) to work in this deck.
    So they're here only for Hellrider, and without Hellrider I wouldn't play them.


    Cards I've tried and then taken out from the deck:
    - Angelic overseer: I really love this angel but she required to use more lands --> more lands means less creatures --> not good. I prefer speed over the chance of playing a big creature a turn later.
    - Burn at the stake: similar to Overseer, it requires too much mana and I didn't want to cut on creatures to put more lands. It's really mana intensive on red and that's even worse than Overseer. It could be a pretty strong finisher which ends the game itself, but most of the time when we have a lot of creatures on the board Hellrider should be enough to kill the opponent
    - Mentor of the meek: just too slow. We simply want to hit hard and fast, and he doesn't help a lot for this kind of plan. Drawing is really good of course, but I prefer a bigger threat over the chance to have 1-2 more cards in hand. I think he's better for decks with less pace and more mana to spend (G/W humans).
    - Vexing devil: this was very tricky to decide. Most of the time it's 1 red mana = 4 dmg for opponent, and that's obviously good. But not being human, and the fact most of the time he doesn't stay on board, are big drawbacks for a deck that want a lot of human creatures on the board to use the potential of Kessig Malcontents and Hellrider, or to grow Champion of the parish even bigger.
    Another great card that imho suits better in a different kind of deck.
    Last edited by anakyn: 11/8/2012 2:42:21 AM
  • #186
    Wont your Mauler generally end up paired with something irrelevant and not have the ability to grant haste to what needs it? especially in such a swarmy deck?
    Cyme we inne frið, fram the grip of deaþ to lif inne ðis smylte land.
  • #187
    Quote from Ramenth
    Wont your Mauler generally end up paired with something irrelevant and not have the ability to grant haste to what needs it? especially in such a swarmy deck?



    Well, the deck is build in such a way that nothing can be considered "irrelevant" in my opinion.


    Goal is very simple: 20 dmg really fast.

    For Mauler, what's important is he doesn't enter the battlefield alone, because that's the only situation when he's useless (but just for that very turn).
    If there's simply a Traveler, it means 2 dmg more for 2 mana, which isn't bad.
    If there's a Champion, it means 3 dmg more cause he pumps him, and that's even better.

    But the really broken mechanic about Mauler is the ability to give haste to anything that enters AFTER him: there are a lot of times when I'm on 3rd turn and my board is nothing fearful (1 traveler + 1 mauler or so), and the second after I'm swinging for 8 cause I've just casted a Silverblade paladin, which gives double strike to Mauler and receives haste from Mauler itself.
    That's really a lot of damage, really fast.
    Requires the opponent to react or he's dead in a couple of turns. If the turn after I have the Malcontents to cast, it means TEN more dmg and the match could be over on the 4th turn.

    The more I look the Mauler the more I like him.
    He gives to you so much damage.
    He becomes immediately the main target for opponent's removal, and for a 2-mana creature in a deck full of even bigger (Paladin, Hellrider) or even more annoying (Thalia) threats it means a lot.

    I used 3 at the beginning because I didn't want they entered the battlefield alone, but since now I've seen that this should happen very rarely and 4 is the right number imho.

    I hope they won't ban him like it happened with Lingering souls.
    Last edited by anakyn: 5/6/2012 4:39:24 AM
  • #188
    If your Mauler is bonded with your Traveler, it cant soulbound with the Paladin. As I understand it based on the text, you can only soulbond if the creature is unbound. Mauler does not, as I understand it, read 'Every card after me gets Haste.'
    Cyme we inne frið, fram the grip of deaþ to lif inne ðis smylte land.
  • #189
    Yep both creatures need to be unpaired to pair them, if you bonded your Mauler to your 1 drop you cant bond it to your 3 drop unless you no longer control your 1 drop.
  • #190
    Hi everybody!
    I was looking for deck ideas, and I read this thread.
    I'm a little confused about this deck.
    As far as I can see, you use mostly white for creatures and red for spells.
    Because, let's say it, red creatures aren't so good...
    However, every list has 3 Thalia, which doesn't work properly with spells.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I do not see the speed of the deck,
    and having a Thalia in play can slow your burn plan.

    I would like to suggest:

    alus84's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    4 Clifftop Retreat
    9 Mountain
    10 Plains

    4 Champion of the Parish
    4 Stromkirk Noble
    4 Lightning Mauler
    4 Elite Inquisitor
    3 Silverblade Paladin
    3 Fiend Hunter
    3 Hellrider

    4 Gather the Townsfolk
    4 Pillar of Flame
    4 Brimstone Volley



    If you find that Fiend Hunter is too slow, you can replace it with Loyal Cathar.
    However, your only removal will be the burn spells, which sometimes aren't enough.
    I think that Instigator Gang is no more viable.
    You could replace it with Riders of Gavony as a finisher,
    or Angel of Jubilation.
    Those cards could replace Hellrider or Paladin in my list.
    Last edited by alus84: 5/7/2012 9:58:20 AM
  • #191
    Quote from anakyn

    But the really broken mechanic about Mauler is the ability to give haste to anything that enters AFTER him: there are a lot of times when I'm on 3rd turn and my board is nothing fearful (1 traveler + 1 mauler or so), and the second after I'm swinging for 8 cause I've just casted a Silverblade paladin, which gives double strike to Mauler and receives haste from Mauler itself.

    I hope they won't ban him like it happened with Lingering souls.


    He is pretty good... but ban worthy? I dont think so. You probably have seen those deck boxes or sleeves with RTFC on it and that probably should be done here.

    Soulbond (You may pair this creature with another unpaired creature when either enter the battlefield. They remained paired for as long as you control both of them.)

    That means that he can't be paired to something if he is already paired. So in the scenario of T1 Champion, T2 Mauler (pair with Champion), T3 Silverblade... you could not pair Mauler to Silverblade to give it haste (unless Champion dies), you could not pair Silverblade with Champion to give it Double Strike (unless Mauler dies).

    Now, pairing is a MAY ability. In that particular scenario, I would say T1 Champion, T2 Mauler (no pair) swing with Champion for 2, T3 Silverblade (pair with Mauler) swing for 3+2DS+2DS seems pretty good!

    I guess I am just not sure that if I conditional Haste is good enough to make the cut in this deck. Possibly if you played Emancipation Angel, Restoration Angel, or Cloudshift where you could control what gets Haste and when (the exile removes the bond)... But then you aren't playing Humans then are you?
  • #192
    I3astille's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    4 Clifftop Retreat
    9 Mountain
    6 Plains
    4 Cavern of Souls

    4 Champion of the Parish
    4 Elite Inquisitor
    3 Lightning Mauler
    3 Huntmaster of the Fells
    3 Silverblade Paladin
    2 Fiend Hunter
    4 Hellrider

    2 Rally the Peasants
    4 Gather the Townsfolk
    4 Pillar of Flame
    4 Brimstone Volley




    Just an idea to use cavern to splash for huntsmaster as hes pretty bomb and uncounterable. still undecided on the numbers in the middle also Thatcher Revolt might have a place in this deck T5+ thatcher can hurt if you have hellrider, CotP on the board, or rally in yard. just some ideas to play around with
  • #193
    Guys, of course the Mauler can't give haste to EVERYTHING that comes after him, you're right on this, but have you read my example about the Paladin and the 8 dmg out of nothing? That remains completely real.
    You AREN'T OBLIGED to pair the Mauler as soon as he's played, you can simply wait the very next turn to pair him with a Paladin (very likely and very often: it happens to me a lot of times), but also giving haste to a Malcontent or an Inquisitor seems pretty good to me, don't you think?

    Oh, and another thing: if you have both Mauler and Paladin on the battlefield and the opponent has a spot removal to play, what do you think he'll remove? Probably the Paladin, right? In that case the next creature you play will get haste again...

    Best scenario: 8 dmg out of nothing at 3rd turn paired with Paladin, and if your 1st turn was a Champion your opponent is suddenly below 10 life.
    Normal scenario: at 3rd turn you pair him with Malcontents, and it's likely 3 dmg from Malcontent itself, other 5 dmg from Malcontent and Mauler attack, and probably another 1st-turn-casted-creature attacking as well.

    In both scenarios, a 4th turn Hellrider can be game over.

    I'm not saying that's GUARANTEED damage because obviously the opponent can react, but what I say is this kind of deck has REALLY A LOT of potential damage for a block constructed deck.
    He can kill 4th turn also if you are NOT very lucky, and that's nuts in my opinion.
    And the main part of this damage comes from Mauler.


    However, I've found that 4 Maulers are maybe too many, and I slightly changed my list: now I use 1 less Mauler and 1 more Hunter.
    Also, I've included 2 Bonfire of the damned in sideboard, but I'm still not sure about them because of their anti-sinergy with Thalia.


    The new list:

    anakyn's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    4 Clifftop retreat
    3 Cavern of souls
    9 Mountain
    8 Plains

    4 Champion of the parish
    4 Doomed traveler
    3 Thalia, guardian of Thraben
    3 Lightning Mauler
    3 Elite inquisitor
    3 Kessig malcontents
    3 Silverblade paladin
    3 Fiend hunter
    4 Hellrider

    4 Gather the townsfolk
    2 Thatcher Revolt




    And yes, blink abilities works well with Soulbond, but in my opinion they slow the deck too much.
    I prefer a more straightforward strategy because I think that's better for block constructed while I would prefer a more control build if I were playing Standard.

    So I bet all my fiches with Humans and that's why I play 3 Malcontents.
    Last edited by the_cardfather: 6/13/2012 11:00:41 AM
  • #194
    Quote from Bastille
    Just an idea to use cavern to splash for huntsmaster



    That's an attractive idea and Huntmaster is a card I tried to find a place for in this deck, but I think that relying on merely 4 G sources is a bit too risky... if you don't find a Cavern all your Huntmasters are dead cards, and this deck has no way to draw neither tutoring for lands.

    You should splash more green mana, but that way it can become difficult to find early WW for Inquisitor/Hunter or RR for Hellrider.
    So at that point you should play more lands --> less threats and less potential damage.


    The real problem imho is that in a WRG build, we can use only 1 dual land for WR, as there are no dual lands for WG or RG.
    This really hurts, especially in a deck that wants to be very fast and can't spend time fixing his mana.

    But I guess a WRG Humans deck can be pretty strong in Standard, right?
    Last edited by anakyn: 5/9/2012 3:50:43 AM
  • #195
    Quote from anakyn

    But I guess a WRG Humans deck can be pretty strong in Standard, right?


    Standard has Hero of Bladehold...
    No real reason to ever want Huntmaster.

    Standard Discussion is Not Permitted. t_C Spam Warning
    Last edited by the_cardfather: 6/13/2012 11:02:32 AM
  • #196
    Quote from Flaming_Sword
    Standard has Hero of Bladehold...
    No real reason to ever want Huntmaster.


    Ummm, this is the block constructed forum and hero of bladehold isn't legal in Innistrad block constructed last I checked. Also, hero of bladehold isn't strictly better than huntmaster in fact I think huntmaster is the more powerful card overall. For one thing, hero has to stick around a turn to actually DO something. Whereas when huntmaster hits, you immediately get value. But that's beside the point.

    I wouldn't destabilize the manabase to include green in this deck, it just isn't worth it. Huntmaster is a helluva card, but not worth splashing for in my eyes due to him being a 4 drop. I'd rather drop instigator gang and smash face, which is what this deck is trying to do.
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  • #197
    Quote from anakyn
    That's an attractive idea and Huntmaster is a card I tried to find a place for in this deck, but I think that relying on merely 4 G sources is a bit too risky... if you don't find a Cavern all your Huntmasters are dead cards, and this deck has no way to draw neither tutoring for lands.

    You should splash more green mana, but that way it can become difficult to find early WW for Inquisitor/Hunter or RR for Hellrider.
    So at that point you should play more lands --> less threats and less potential damage.


    The real problem imho is that in a WRG build, we can use only 1 dual land for WR, as there are no dual lands for WG or RG.
    This really hurts, especially in a deck that wants to be very fast and can't spend time fixing his mana.

    But I guess a WRG Humans deck can be pretty strong in Standard, right?


    You could always play a single Forest and some Evolving Wilds as well... that also let's you start playing stuff like Gavony Township. That being said, I don't think it really works with the theme of this deck. R/W is looking to hit hard and fast which requires hitting your land drops and dropping creatures that have an immediate effect. Hellrider fits this role way better, not to mention he doesn't require splashing into green.
  • #198
    I'm interested in this deck, but for T2 playing, it can be competitive enough?

    T2 as in Standard? This is Block Constructed, and this comment is spam t_c
    Last edited by the_cardfather: 5/9/2012 6:30:01 PM
  • #199
    @Bread Connoisseur: my comment was directed at a post saying g/w/r sounds good in standard because of huntmaster.

    As to huntmaster as a whole, I don't see how he fits into a balls to the wall aggro deck like this even if you could make the mana work. Other 4 drops like hellrider, instigator gang, angel of jubilation and even goldknight commander further the deck's gameplan more than huntmaster does.
  • #200
    What do you guys think about maindecking the Thalia?

    To me, she just seems to get in the way of my Burn (I play sixteen spells in the moment. Will obviously tune it down if I play her) too much. Besides, with her 1-toughness, she's a huge target for a two-mana Geistflame.

    But in the light of today's metagame (heavily Jund-based), maybe she's the right play, as Champion usually eats the first Geistflame, leaving her protected to it for four turns.
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