"Those who seize power must have the means to hold it."
Introduction
So this is my first deck posting on MTGSalvation, but I'm a back and forth player looking to stick around this time. I had mostly standard experience when I last played, but since then have made the move into being strictly a EDH/Legacy player.
But not onto this deck and more relevant things. This deck was an idea I had for awhile. It original started out as a weird combination of superfriends/stax/pillowfort. After just 10 games its was dismantled, it was too slow and had very little direction, so I left it there for about a month in pieces. I settled on forming a more focused stax deck, something I haven't tried before. So this deck is my project that surely will undergo many revisions as I continue to understand stax and how much The Queen can abuse it.
Why to play Marchesa?
You want to play the long game
You don't mind being a target
You enjoy playing politics
You like thinking and analyzing the board state
Why not to play Marchesa?
You want to play the long game
You dont like being hated when you go online
You like quick games
You like creatures being on board a lot
OTHER COMMANDERS
Atraxa, Praetors' Voice
Atraxa is probably the second strongest stax commander right now, having all four colors cripples the mana base a bit, but having blue involved brings in all the control you need if you ever start slowly. It opens up a few valuable walkers as well. In addition, getting green in there allows for stronger ramp, which can give a much quicker start if opponents don't keep pace. Personally, I found more value in the destruction red offers and the card draw that Marchesa offers, but if I was to pick someone else, Atraxa would likely be my choice.
Brago, King Eternal
Brago allows for a lot of dirty plays in stax. Despite being only two colors, you have the ability to reset your cards like smokestack and tangle wire, which having the benefits of static orb with very little of the drawbacks. The blink is insanely strong, needless to say, which may make him the strongest stax commander in the game. Obvioiusly just my opinion there, but I have seen it do dirty things to games.
Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
This commander allows for a lot of cheese, you can lock down and almost always have the mana to keep Derevi's pressure on the board. As long as you're able to keep lands low and prevent their creatures, this could be very dominant. These colors offer a lot of tutoring and draw. I feel that Marchesa's pressure and the monarch draw is strong enough to be valued over the advantages Derevi offers.
Daretti, Scrap Savant
Great commander for quick control, but restricted past that due to mono-color. That was a huge turn off for me (I rarely make decks that are monocolor), and despite the power of this card alone offers, i felt that it wasn't strong enough for me to give into monocolor.
As I said above, initially I went for a pillowfort-style deck. It was great in 1v1, but in multiplayer it struggled a lot to go online, surely some of that fault was me being a poor pilot of the deck. After doing a few revisions, I scrapped the deck pretty quickly, and it led me to this version, a more stax focused version of the deck. The biggest struggle I had so far was balancing between Stax and Control cards, I haven't hit the sweet spot just yet, but I'll get there I'm sure.
I made this deck because I wanted something different, my meta has a lot of combo and some aggro, but no one in it really plays stax, so I wanted to introduce it after threatening it for a few months. Whenever it gets pulled out there is usually an 'ugh', so I feel pretty proud to be the guy to introduce this style of magic.
Basics - We run bloodmoon/magus of the moon. We dont want to necessarily hurt ourselves while dening our opponents.
Dual Lands(Badlands, Plateau, Scrubland) - Just the strongest land options we have in the game, allows mana flexibility with no drawbacks whatsoever.
Shock Lands(Blood Crypt, Godless Shrine, Sacred Foundry) - Solid lands that cost 2 life, pretty insigificant of a cost, plus fetchable if we need some options
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale - So so so so strong against creature based decks, also makes opponents have to consider how valuable creatures are incase that land is stuck tapped for awhile. No real alternative for this, so just replace with a basic.
Tainted AEther - Really punishes opponents after a MLD spell
Strategy
The Early Game
So what is important in the early stages of this deck? It's focused on slwoing the game down from turn 1, so any rocks are usually a good keep if you have a orb or even a risky bloodmoon/magus of the moo, and Thalia, Heretic Cathar can make some big advantages early. The game plan is to drop Marchesa t2/t3 and then lock the board down with cards like Tangle Wire or Winter Orb, or even Tainted Aether after that point. Keep pressure up, but don't lock yourself out completely. The goal is patient control here. If Queen Marchesa and some Stax/Tax is still around, you're in a super good position at this point.
The Mid Game
So if plan A worked and your early game has succeeded here is where we stop any chance of our throne being usurped. Abuse being a very protected Monarch, and this is where we look to capitalize on our MLD(Mass Land Destruction) spells. Armageddon, Catastrophe, and Ravages of War are our desired cards here, so feel free to tutor for them (if you haven't hit it already from drawing a few cards off the Monarch). This is also where we look to use our creature wipes to keep the board under our foot, just incase someone is trying to sneak something in.
If we haven't seized the throne yet, fear not cause the game is not over. This is where we try to set up Solitary Confinement, or Contamination paired with either Queen Marchesa, Bitterblossom, or Assemble the Legion, which hopefully will answer most of our remaining problems. This is also the time it is safe to play Static Orb, I view this card similar to Contamination, but be careful when you play it as it can hurt us pretty hard as well.
The Late Game
By now we either made enough enemies, failed to keep them at bay, and are dead, like dead DEAD. If that happened, it was probably an unfortunate starting hand or we got focused and the combo player is about to go off now that everyone spent resources on you.
If your heart is still beating and you're safely on the throne still, this is where we close out the game. Cards that we may have secured earlier, like Assemble the Legion or Luminarch Ascension can be destroying by tokens here. Alternatively if Queen Marchesa stuck, then Elspeth, Knight-Errant can speed things up.
I did some more testing today and got the nut-draw game 1 and ran away with the game. I only got land screwed on one hand (kept a risky 1 lander and didnt hit the second land for 2 turns so was little behind but caught up). Is 32 lands considered too low in this style deck? I figured with the amount of rocks I have available it would be enough.
Roar of Reclamation is there incase of a hard board wipe, or mass artifact removal. I haven't encountered a situation that i needed it yet though, but I will definitely be looking into possible replacements for it since it is so high of a cost.
Death Cloud was another card I was playing with, it hasn't had any times to shine, the mana denial has been strong enough to not need it yet. The hard cost may be a reason to be replaced but I like and see some potential in this card if a game starts to come back.
Words of Waste was my testing discard style stax in here too, but once again normally by the time I have dropped it, control of the board has already been obtained.
Static Orb was a concern, but a piece I think is super strong. Despite me not having a way to break myself from it, it also offers that struggle to my opponents. If dropped with Gilded Lotus, there is a huge advantage, otherwise I see the possibility of it being very damaging. It is a card I would like to keep in the deck, but you have a valid point. Are there any good cards that will allow me to be more abusive in combination with Static Orb?
I usually opt for the talismans, but I was slightly concerned with handsize with all of the draw if I ever need additional resources, it would save me from doing some discard at the expense of being colorless. I only hit this card about 3 times so far and in all situations I had other rocks, but usually my hand has been sitting between 4-7 cards once I do a land-wipe. I may have been over-concerned with the hand limit.
Karn was put in with uncertainty, I felt like I needed another finisher in the case of my opponents having some blockers left or they manage to control the board enough, or they were holding an answer to helm+RIP.
For your suggestions, Engineered Plague if definitely going to be placed into the deck, we have an elf tribal player in our group and I wasn't aware of the card, This will probably replace Words of Waste.
Linvala is also a great suggestion, I was hesitant to put a lot of creatures into the deck, but I feel like she can do some work.
So with mana denial stax, aren't Stony Silence and Null Rod bad, as they will shut down all my rocks and make it difficult to wipe lands? I can see Kataki's Wars wage because the deck has enough rocks that can pay for two or more other rocks. Can you explain how they are beneficial cards to play and won't be detrimental to the mana denial?
Thanks for the time and insight to help me improve this project
"Those who seize power must have the means to hold it."
Introduction
So this is my first deck posting on MTGSalvation, but I'm a back and forth player looking to stick around this time. I had mostly standard experience when I last played, but since then have made the move into being strictly a EDH/Legacy player.
But not onto this deck and more relevant things. This deck was an idea I had for awhile. It original started out as a weird combination of superfriends/stax/pillowfort. After just 10 games its was dismantled, it was too slow and had very little direction, so I left it there for about a month in pieces. I settled on forming a more focused stax deck, something I haven't tried before. So this deck is my project that surely will undergo many revisions as I continue to understand stax and how much The Queen can abuse it.
Why to play Marchesa?
You want to play the long game
You don't mind being a target
You enjoy playing politics
You like thinking and analyzing the board state
Why not to play Marchesa?
You want to play the long game
You dont like being hated when you go online
You like quick games
You like creatures being on board a lot
OTHER COMMANDERS
Atraxa, Praetors' Voice
Atraxa is probably the second strongest stax commander right now, having all four colors cripples the mana base a bit, but having blue involved brings in all the control you need if you ever start slowly. It opens up a few valuable walkers as well. In addition, getting green in there allows for stronger ramp, which can give a much quicker start if opponents don't keep pace. Personally, I found more value in the destruction red offers and the card draw that Marchesa offers, but if I was to pick someone else, Atraxa would likely be my choice.
Brago, King Eternal
Brago allows for a lot of dirty plays in stax. Despite being only two colors, you have the ability to reset your cards like smokestack and tangle wire, which having the benefits of static orb with very little of the drawbacks. The blink is insanely strong, needless to say, which may make him the strongest stax commander in the game. Obvioiusly just my opinion there, but I have seen it do dirty things to games.
Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
This commander allows for a lot of cheese, you can lock down and almost always have the mana to keep Derevi's pressure on the board. As long as you're able to keep lands low and prevent their creatures, this could be very dominant. These colors offer a lot of tutoring and draw. I feel that Marchesa's pressure and the monarch draw is strong enough to be valued over the advantages Derevi offers.
Daretti, Scrap Savant
Great commander for quick control, but restricted past that due to mono-color. That was a huge turn off for me (I rarely make decks that are monocolor), and despite the power of this card alone offers, i felt that it wasn't strong enough for me to give into monocolor.
As I said above, initially I went for a pillowfort-style deck. It was great in 1v1, but in multiplayer it struggled a lot to go online, surely some of that fault was me being a poor pilot of the deck. After doing a few revisions, I scrapped the deck pretty quickly, and it led me to this version, a more stax focused version of the deck. The biggest struggle I had so far was balancing between Stax and Control cards, I haven't hit the sweet spot just yet, but I'll get there I'm sure.
I made this deck because I wanted something different, my meta has a lot of combo and some aggro, but no one in it really plays stax, so I wanted to introduce it after threatening it for a few months. Whenever it gets pulled out there is usually an 'ugh', so I feel pretty proud to be the guy to introduce this style of magic.
DECKS IN MY META
Basics - We run bloodmoon/magus of the moon. We dont want to necessarily hurt ourselves while dening our opponents.
Dual Lands(Badlands, Plateau, Scrubland) - Just the strongest land options we have in the game, allows mana flexibility with no drawbacks whatsoever.
Shock Lands(Blood Crypt, Godless Shrine, Sacred Foundry) - Solid lands that cost 2 life, pretty insigificant of a cost, plus fetchable if we need some options
Vesuva - Mostly for Dark Depths finisher, but can also clone a dual land in needed situations
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale - So so so so strong against creature based decks, also makes opponents have to consider how valuable creatures are incase that land is stuck tapped for awhile. No real alternative for this, so just replace with a basic.
Dark Depths - Combo with Vesuva and potential mana sink if we control the board strong enough, combo isnt needed, replace with Shizo, Death's Storehouse
Instants
Anguished Unmaking - Flexible and exile, bonus as an instant? Can't think of what more you could want
Enlightened Tutor - find artifact/enchantment pieces you're looking for with no drawback (can even do on your turn as a monarch)
Elspeth, Knight-Errant - Wincon after wipes, make Marchesa bigger or make dudes on command. If ult pops basically guaranteed the game
Karn Liberated - Wincon, really high cost but can run away with games if unanswered
Strategy
The Early Game
So what is important in the early stages of this deck? It's focused on slwoing the game down from turn 1, so any rocks are usually a good keep if you have a orb or even a risky bloodmoon/magus of the moo, and Thalia, Heretic Cathar can make some big advantages early. The game plan is to drop Marchesa t2/t3 and then lock the board down with cards like Tangle Wire or Winter Orb, or even Tainted Aether after that point. Keep pressure up, but don't lock yourself out completely. The goal is patient control here. If Queen Marchesa and some Stax/Tax is still around, you're in a super good position at this point.
The Mid Game
So if plan A worked and your early game has succeeded here is where we stop any chance of our throne being usurped. Abuse being a very protected Monarch, and this is where we look to capitalize on our MLD(Mass Land Destruction) spells. Armageddon, Catastrophe, and Ravages of War are our desired cards here, so feel free to tutor for them (if you haven't hit it already from drawing a few cards off the Monarch). This is also where we look to use our creature wipes to keep the board under our foot, just incase someone is trying to sneak something in.
If we haven't seized the throne yet, fear not cause the game is not over. This is where we try to set up Solitary Confinement, or Contamination paired with either Queen Marchesa, Bitterblossom, or Assemble the Legion, which hopefully will answer most of our remaining problems. This is also the time it is safe to play Static Orb, I view this card similar to Contamination, but be careful when you play it as it can hurt us pretty hard as well.
The Late Game
By now we either made enough enemies, failed to keep them at bay, and are dead, like dead DEAD. If that happened, it was probably an unfortunate starting hand or we got focused and the combo player is about to go off now that everyone spent resources on you.
If your heart is still beating and you're safely on the throne still, this is where we close out the game. Cards that we may have secured earlier, like Assemble the Legion or Luminarch Ascension can be destroying by tokens here. Alternatively if Queen Marchesa stuck, then Elspeth, Knight-Errant can speed things up. Karn Liberated is our last resort win condition, Ideally we restart with a strong creature and something that will choke our opponents early.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
After testing some more, the mana base was a little inconsistent, so I added some lands. I also dealt most my damage to myself, so looked for some lifegain cards, decided to try to play more conservatively and try Inventors' Fair to slow the bleed a little bit. Going to look into other ways as well, but struggling to find some fitting cards in these colors.
Cut a lot of the high end and dropped my curve from ~3.5 to ~2.6, so the deck should keep up, also added a bit more draw power so I'm less punished by bad draws (last few games I mulligan'd like a champ, then drew dead for a bit and couldn't maintain the lock I established early).
Definitely moving in the right direction but far from final.
So with mana denial stax, aren't Stony Silence and Null Rod bad, as they will shut down all my rocks and make it difficult to wipe lands? I can see Kataki's Wars wage because the deck has enough rocks that can pay for two or more other rocks. Can you explain how they are beneficial cards to play and won't be detrimental to the mana denial?
i dont say you shall ramp with your rocks and then play null rod - makes no sense of course.
most of the good decks in the format play rocks but more important alot of decks need those rocks or other artifacts with activated abilities to win/ get in the lead position/ catch up.
multipe sdcenarios where rod can be good:
-someone has that typical uber-sol-start and drops even more signets/talismen/gildedwhatevers. thay might also resolve a handrefilling spell. here is the crucial point - as long as rod neuters the rocks they arent in the lead and e3ven a full grip is no more devastating now.
(some decks ramp so hard they can play with 2 lands the whole game - geddon isnt as usefull here as rod)
-someone is going to grim monolithpowerartifact the table.
-you are in the lead with something like a sacrifice engine and a taxer. as long as this scenario is midgame people probably have some board presence. this can act like a sweeper for cheaper.
the best about null rod is it doesnt neuter the big business cards. smokestack tangle wire winter orb - whatever it is - as long as it is a static it works.
now i see your counterargument "but there is Vandalblast". yes but imo there is a big difference about cmc5 or cmc2.
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i like the changes
if you still are unsatisfied maybe more information is needed what gives you trouble.
i have a feeling that you might want something that might not be possible - atleast where you play. or it might need other colors/another commander to reach your goal.
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about the life total problem
yeah its pretty funny but often bad decks /plays give me the most trouble. the guy that plays an early threat with no backup. everyone is fighting over recoureces and he cannot get his fatties out but that Managorger Hydra from the earlygame is suddenly very relevant if i lock the board.
i dont like wasting deckslots to life gain as it makes everything else worse. know that you need to remove creatures when you go for a lock. thats another reason why i prefer a smokestack lock over like the typicall derevi plus orbs. it removes everything.
if your meta is creatureheavy stax is definitly not a good choice as fast combo could be.
stax punishes those spellslinger 28-land greedy decks (which might race others but not so much a good lockdeck with enough slowdown-cards).
I see, thanks for the clarity on Null Rod, I'm gonna try playing around with it and see how that works. My concern was never being able to Armageddon with it on board since I would be in a very rough spot. I can see some lines of play with the deck that can make it a big shift on control back if I ever fall behind to the strong ramp game.
I'm gonna do a dozen or two games with the changes and see if I am still having problems, and I'll have more information for what exactly I am seeing problems with.
In my last set of tests, Mana Crypt has dealt about 20 damage to me on average per game, making me a bit of an easy target. Part of the losses was failing to draw valued resources (inspired a lot of the changes drawing some of the same cards and not seeing a good situation with them), and once a bad tutor choice bit me later.
Thanks for the advice with the deck, it has been quite helpful. I think giving up after just a few weeks would be taking the easy way out, so I plan to stick it out for a few months to try to revise it into a functioning deck. If not I am probably going to shift towards Breya for a different attempt.
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"Those who seize power must have the means to hold it."
Roar of Reclamation is there incase of a hard board wipe, or mass artifact removal. I haven't encountered a situation that i needed it yet though, but I will definitely be looking into possible replacements for it since it is so high of a cost.
Death Cloud was another card I was playing with, it hasn't had any times to shine, the mana denial has been strong enough to not need it yet. The hard cost may be a reason to be replaced but I like and see some potential in this card if a game starts to come back.
Words of Waste was my testing discard style stax in here too, but once again normally by the time I have dropped it, control of the board has already been obtained.
Static Orb was a concern, but a piece I think is super strong. Despite me not having a way to break myself from it, it also offers that struggle to my opponents. If dropped with Gilded Lotus, there is a huge advantage, otherwise I see the possibility of it being very damaging. It is a card I would like to keep in the deck, but you have a valid point. Are there any good cards that will allow me to be more abusive in combination with Static Orb?
I usually opt for the talismans, but I was slightly concerned with handsize with all of the draw if I ever need additional resources, it would save me from doing some discard at the expense of being colorless. I only hit this card about 3 times so far and in all situations I had other rocks, but usually my hand has been sitting between 4-7 cards once I do a land-wipe. I may have been over-concerned with the hand limit.
Karn was put in with uncertainty, I felt like I needed another finisher in the case of my opponents having some blockers left or they manage to control the board enough, or they were holding an answer to helm+RIP.
For your suggestions, Engineered Plague if definitely going to be placed into the deck, we have an elf tribal player in our group and I wasn't aware of the card, This will probably replace Words of Waste.
Linvala is also a great suggestion, I was hesitant to put a lot of creatures into the deck, but I feel like she can do some work.
So with mana denial stax, aren't Stony Silence and Null Rod bad, as they will shut down all my rocks and make it difficult to wipe lands? I can see Kataki's Wars wage because the deck has enough rocks that can pay for two or more other rocks. Can you explain how they are beneficial cards to play and won't be detrimental to the mana denial?
Thanks for the time and insight to help me improve this project
"Those who seize power must have the means to hold it."
I hope that helps!
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Cut a lot of the high end and dropped my curve from ~3.5 to ~2.6, so the deck should keep up, also added a bit more draw power so I'm less punished by bad draws (last few games I mulligan'd like a champ, then drew dead for a bit and couldn't maintain the lock I established early).
Definitely moving in the right direction but far from final.
I see, thanks for the clarity on Null Rod, I'm gonna try playing around with it and see how that works. My concern was never being able to Armageddon with it on board since I would be in a very rough spot. I can see some lines of play with the deck that can make it a big shift on control back if I ever fall behind to the strong ramp game.
I'm gonna do a dozen or two games with the changes and see if I am still having problems, and I'll have more information for what exactly I am seeing problems with.
In my last set of tests, Mana Crypt has dealt about 20 damage to me on average per game, making me a bit of an easy target. Part of the losses was failing to draw valued resources (inspired a lot of the changes drawing some of the same cards and not seeing a good situation with them), and once a bad tutor choice bit me later.
Thanks for the advice with the deck, it has been quite helpful. I think giving up after just a few weeks would be taking the easy way out, so I plan to stick it out for a few months to try to revise it into a functioning deck. If not I am probably going to shift towards Breya for a different attempt.