So, The Gitrog Monster was spoiled less than 24 hours ago and it already fits like a glove in a shell that I've been developing for a long time in Duel Commander. My first iteration of this idea was with Nissa, Vastwood Seer as Commander. I based that deck using some concepts of the Eternal Garden deck in Legacy, of using different lands as tools, while ramping to flip Nissa. Like a mix between that old and nostalgic monogreen ramp decks (before elfball was even a thing) and the Eternal Garden. It was doing just fine until the change in Mulligan Rule. Without the old mulligan, the deck became almost unplayable. Like any other ramp deck, the finishers in the early hands was AWFUL.
But I think the Frog will do better in this shell.
Deck Tech
Like Eternal Garden, I know the list seems clunky, but it is a lot more organic that it looks.
Lands
The focus of the deck is Utility Lands, and we're packed with them.
Wincon Lands
Ah... The good and old Thespian's Stage + Dark Depths combo. This is not an Eternal Garden deck if we don't have this combo.
Ramp Lands
This Deck is very mana intensive and we need some lands that give us more mana than usual to help us ramp to big threats and the Commander itself. Cabal Coffers or Lake of the Dead + Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth are always nice ways to have a ton of B. Crystal Vein, Hickory Woodlot, Peat Bog and Phyrexian Tower generates 2 mana, it feels just like a Time Walk on your opponent and the drawback of losing the land later on is compensated with card draw from our Frog.
Anti-Aggro Package
This deck is much slower than the Aggro Decks and we need a way to stop them, or at least slow them down,, and Glacial Chasm and Maze of Ith are here for this. Each of them is better in one situation or another. While Glacial Chasm is a very powerful land, it's drawback is as powerful as well. Blighted Fen helps against Geist as well.
The standard LD Package as always: Dust Bowl, Ghost Quarter, Tectonic Edge and Wasteland. Ghost Quarter is here to deal with an early Dust Bowl from the opponent, also being a good card advantage targeting my own lands, drawing 2 cards and searching for a basic untapped.
Tutors
With that many tools in hand using Lands, we need Tutors for them. So I put as many as possible, they are never dead draws because we have a wide range of choice at any point of the game. Sylvan Scrying, Expedition Map and Crop Rotation are standard, but Realms Uncharted deserves a spotlight. Realms Uncharted with Petrified Field is awesome, besides the card draw trigger.
Recursion Crucible of Worlds and Life from the Loam are the engine of this deck. They go around the drawback of our Commander. Especially Life from the Loam that can be Dredged by itself if you mill land cards. But we also have Yawgmoth's Will to use your whole graveyard once more.
We have Retrace cards as well, like Worm Harvest to win the game and Raven's Crime to strip out the opponent's hand.
Titania, Protector of Argoth also help us with recursion, but I see her more like a Wincon than a recursion tool only.
Misc.
Don't be too afraid of using Dark Confidant and Dark Tutelage at the same time. The curve of the deck is very low, being almost all lands.
Conclusion
This deck is WIP, but I think this idea has some potential that I already saw when I was playing with my Nissa deck.
With a few tests, I saw that:
Glacial Chasm really holds up Aggro. I didn't realized the power of this land before I tested it in Nissa.
My old Nissa deck was monogreen and I don't know if I'm using too many utility lands while having an extra color to explore. My main goal is using lands as spells, but I don't know how good this strategy is comparing with real spells.
It relies on the rogue factor. I've won a lot of games before my opponent even realized what I was doing. I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing.
If I focus on ramp spells, I do need more basics and I need to cut off some of the Utility Lands.
This is my first decklist (that I'm hoping to be a Primer) and my very first post here in this forum, and I don't speak english that well, so I'm sorry if I wrote something wrong. Thank you for reading all of this.
Academy Ruins
In this section I'll share my personal experience and tests with the deck. I'm going to use some Codenames (that you can find in the Changelog section) for which build I was using in each match.
Grand Arbiter Augustin IV Codename "Tadpole" matches:
The tax-effect of Augustin doesn't affects Lands abilities, and the amount of ramp spells goes around that very well. The discard spells hurt the UW Control shell too much, as well of have many ways to find that Cavern of Souls.
The Frog hit Augustin in every front, it seemed a very good matchup.
The only game that I lost was because I had been Mana Screwed for 3 turns in a row. (Yeah, I know, Mana Screwed with 50 lands. ) Codename "Grounded" matches:
With those changes, deck became less consistent, but that`s not necessarily a bad thing. With Manabond the deck has the aspect of being more explosive in the early game, besides being.a fine discard engine later on the game. In the other hand, if this strategy was slow before, now is even slower.
Against Augustin, that latter is awesome. Like I said before, that uncounterable effects of utility lands and cards hard to deal like Life From The Loam or Raven's Crime were great. And if Augustin likes the late game, so do I.
So that matches were either explosive and overwhelming or with Augustin losing the attrition game.
Geist of Saint Traft Codename "Tadpole" matches:
This was a very bad matchup. The Tempo strategy is very effective against the Control that Lands offers. Hexproof inutilizes Maze of Ith.
Armageddon and Rest in Peace are nasty was well. Codename "Grounded" matches:
Having the explosive element in the deck now, gave us an edge against Geist. If Geist had won the Tempo match before, now that our focus is the late game, we are not that worried of being the active player in the match. We can just wait and react, if they don`t react, we can just wait more and win in the late game with the sheer amount of acummulated resources. If the Frog stays in the battlefield for two or more turns, it already gave us so much draws that we win anyways.
Geist has an worse late game than Augustin, so we are good. And our explosiveness is way quicker than Geist can handle.
Marath, Will of the Wild Codename "Tadpole" matches:
This was a nightmare. With the amount of tutors that Marath has, and the potential of comboing in your face. There's little to no chance against it.
Marath combines every weak spot of the deck. It has many ways to deny your lands, the ability of combo and it can do this with an impressive speed.
This matchup has open up my mind, If I can't deal with Marath, winning against Yisan is just impossible.
I have to shine another light in the deck and change it.
I really needed Dakmor Salvage and Terravore as a finisher in my deck. I took out the cards that were underwhelming. Not enough creatures for Phyrexian Tower, no use for Wood Elves besides being a overcosted ramp spell and Blackmail was not good enough.
Took out all the Ramp Spells that were too clunky, I didn't have that much redundance to be relevant and in the late game it feels like dead draws. Also I felt like aggro was already a good matchup, Toxic Deluge was enough. With no Ramp Spells, I could minimize the Basic Lands. With no ramp spells, I also went more hardcore and explosive, so I added Manabond, Azusa and even Summer Bloom. With some advices, I decided to test Mesmeric Orb, Horn of Greed, Zombie infestation and Restore. Mesmeric Orb is great to fill my graveyard and is a potent draw engine with the Frog online. Horn of Greed synergizes great with the Exploration-effect as a draw engine. Restore fits perfectly with the Lands-Toolbox mindset and Zombie Infestation is a great Discard Outlet.
If I'm focusing on the Lands aspect, some removal Lands are necessary, so Cabal Pit and Quicksand were added. Hissing Quagmire is great for blocking, but it is an amazing manland to attack as well. Temple of Malady because of Scry, Buried Ruins and Volrath's Stronghold are great for bringing back some silver bullets that were milled.
Thanks! eternal witness and mox diamond are in my Maybeboard (I'm gonna edit the post to add the Maybeboard). I like the interactions of this cards but they didn't make the first cut.
But dakmor salvage and terravore were completely out of my radar! Thanks for the tips, I'm going to change that now!
Yeah Dakmor Salvage works pretty well, the game where I drew it it made alot of value, to bad it's a tapland. Groundskeeper isn't a new card by the way sxert, so you should have it on Cockatrice already.
Your deck looks nice, I'm trying a more heavy creature version with dorks and such at the moment, but I will definitely try something like your list as well to see what works best.
I'm going to test it later and I tell you the results.
That's my motivation! I knew that someone was going to do an Elfball version, a BG Rock version, but I was almost sure that no one was going to do the Lands route (because with all the time playing with Nissa, I've never seen any deck quite like mine, and my opponents tell me the same).
What do you think of oracle of mul daya, it seems to fit the theme well, of is it too slow?
Oracle of mul daya is very good, but I didn't find slot for it. I thought that Courser of Kruphix gave me life, it's cheaper to cast and has a better thoughness.
And either way, they are both here for the card advantage, not as much for the ramp. (Although any ramp is very good in this deck.)
l didn't thought that the poxy build was any better than a well bulit braids, and l figured you would want to try to build it as that since she is your sweetheart. So l didn't bother to go that way. l went outside the box and
Zombie infestation was better than you can imagine when you see it on paper. You get a 2/2 and draw a card but if you have dakmor salvage you may end up even on cards and just get the 2/2 for free.
l didn't thought that the poxy build was any better than a well bulit braids, and l figured you would want to try to build it as that since she is your sweetheart. So l didn't bother to go that way. l went outside the box and
Zombie infestation was better than you can imagine when you see it on paper. You get a 2/2 and draw a card but if you have dakmor salvage you may end up even on cards and just get the 2/2 for free.
Orb came up yesterday on fb at around 2am. You weren't online l think.
Orb with him and dredge is a full grave and a smile on your face.
I was writing this post around 2am.
The funny thing is that I used Orb in 3 of my last 5 decks. I really like that card and I feel ashamed that I didn't remember it. Hahahah
Have you considered Harrow instead of rampant growth or Cultivate? It seems like drawing that extra card from the toad makes is a better topdeck lategame. I really like the idea of the deck, thanks for the idea!
I've never really liked Harrow, so I never really consider as a "real" card, but you are right, it's better than the other ramp spells that I'm using. I'm going to change that.
Thanks!
U guys should try a more combo oriented build, with alot of mana elves/ramp, dredge cards and discard outlet, so u can mill your entire library and just cast dread return same turn for win. Ad to that the loam+ land destruction package and an normal reanimater package. This way u have a dedicaded combo deck that can win turn 3 and a resource denial plan B and a reanimate plan C.
Yeah, that's a nice idea, and I think that a lot of people will come with the Combo build that you mentioned, as well as the Control build "BG Rock".
My idea with this post is to do something like a Primer of this specific archetype/build, that I know that no one or very few people even consider.
Feel free to do your idea and share with us. I know it'll be awesome as well and everyone will learn something from different points of view.
I have some ideas to consider ... City of traitors might be a good idea, especially with crucible on the battlefield.
The new land, Drownyard temple, especially to try to keep alive the Frog after a successful [card-Armageddon]geddon[/card] or ravages. Homeward Path is always a useful land because of so many Gilded Drakes and Treacherys found in the meta. Harrow is not a good idea? A draw and two ramp lands...seems good to me... Syphon Life seems to me a great card against control, but still not sure.... Golgari Thug can provide as much a draw as you return that WinCon that got away.
I thought maybe cards with landfall be as useful as cards with dredge in this deck, so I put Undergrowth champion and Ob Nixilis, The fallen as alternative wincons.
Sorry for my bad english and I still dont' no how to link the cards in the post hehe
I have some ideas to consider ... City of traitors might be a good idea, especially with crucible on the battlefield.
The new land, Drownyard temple, especially to try to keep alive the Frog after a successful geddon or ravages. Homeward Path is always a useful land because of so many Gilded Drakes and Treacherys found in the meta. Harrow is not a good idea? A draw and two ramp lands...seems good to me... Syphon Life seems to me a great card against control, but still not sure.... Golgari Thug can provide as much a draw as you return that WinCon that got away.
I thought maybe cards with landfall be as useful as cards with dredge in this deck, so I put Undergrowth champion and Ob Nixilis, The fallen as alternative wincons.
Sorry for my bad english and I still dont' no how to link the cards in the post hehe
Awesome suggestions! Thanks a lot.
Especially Syphon Life and Ob Nixilis, the Fallen. The new cards were not added it up yet just because I'm keeping track of my decklists in Cockatrice and they don't have the new cards yet. But I have a few cards to add from SOI as soon Cockatrice updates his database.
Homeward Path is a card that I always forget do add! Hahahahaha
And Golgari Thug seems like a good dredge engine and a good creature as well. That's really good.
Oooh awesome list! I'm glad someone made a thread for this guy cause I didn't want to host another thread if I didn't have to. I'll study the list a bit further once I have time and I can post my list if you want.
Skirge Familiar: another discard outlet, which lets you go semi-infinite. Especially useful if they decide to ban the ooze, just play the flying spaghetti monster and go for an arbitrary amount of mana and finish him off with the monster or something like Exsanguinate or Drain Life
Bayou: the original dual. This might be a budget issue I guess?
Mox Diamond: a card which gets you to your critical amount of mana. Also useful after dropping our boss and getting salvage to the 'yard.
Deathrite Shaman: sure, this guy might eat your own lands, but beeing able to remove lands and creatures from your opponents graveyards is insane. Also ramps. There is no excuse, not to play him in my opinion.
City of Traitors: a sol-land which gets sacrificed without doing nothing? Easy choice for me.
I built and proxied this list the day they spoilered the frog and it is amazingly consistent. Goldfishing leads to turn 4/5 kills most of the time. I even thought of Worldly Tutor to be able to get that needed discard outlet and Summoner's Pact for the same reasons.
Besides: sxert, I really appreciate your to-be Primer, you might think about adding different playstyles to your OP. In my opinion the combo version is the most consistent of them all.
DrinkMe
Thanks for the recommendations ! Here are a few of my thoughts on em:
Skirge Familiar - I left this one out for now because of it's higher mana cost. After some testing I may decide to put it in for consistency.
Crop Rotation: The problem with this card is it puts Dakmore Salvage onto the battlefield. I'd really prefer it to be in my hand so I can discard loop it. Sure I could sac it but that just adds another piece to the puzzle.
I really like your other recommendations, just not sure what to take out for em. Sounds like you've done some testing (I just play paper and my friends don't like proxys so I'm waiting until I can actually get my hands on a copy), anything you would take out of my list?
"Money" is not really an argument for competitive decks, Bayou isn't even the most expensive biland by far...
I'm not arguing against it, by all means if you have access to one then you must use it. I just don't have one nor do I forsee myself getting one hence why it's not in my list.
This is my list ... is not finished yet until I test against all my goal, but in my preliminary tests is doing very well ...
Aggro decks are still a problem...
Oooh awesome list! I'm glad someone made a thread for this guy cause I didn't want to host another thread if I didn't have to. I'll study the list a bit further once I have time and I can post my list if you want.
Besides: sxert, I really appreciate your to-be Primer, you might think about adding different playstyles to your OP. In my opinion the combo version is the most consistent of them all.
DrinkMe
Yeah, I'm just waiting for the people to post their decklists to add in the main post. I'm writting a motivation section as well.
This is my list ... is not finished yet until I test against all my goal, but in my preliminary tests is doing very well ...
Aggro decks are still a problem...
Some fun interaction I wasn't aware of I discovered on a french forum discussing the deck :
During the Cleanup Step, if you have 8 cards in hand, of which a few are lands, if you discard a land, thus drawing off the Gitrog trigger, the Cleanup Step repeats, meaning you can discards the lands in your hands and the extra lands you draw little by little as the Cleanup Steps repeat, until you have a 7 card hand with no lands, and a graveyard full of extra lands.
Been trying to build a bg stax shell recently and while playtesting yesterday I was able to Rainbow-up the dog up to high 50's. You can also draw your whole deck if you hit a land while dredging. And, let's face it, once you've drawn your whole library, winning is rather easy.
Been trying to build a bg stax shell recently and while playtesting yesterday I was able to Rainbow-up the dog up to high 50's. You can also draw your whole deck if you hit a land while dredging. And, let's face it, once you've drawn your whole library, winning is rather easy.
Many of us are running Dread Return to target Necrotic Ooze and combo out after drawing/dredging our entire hand.
Been trying to build a bg stax shell recently and while playtesting yesterday I was able to Rainbow-up the dog up to high 50's. You can also draw your whole deck if you hit a land while dredging. And, let's face it, once you've drawn your whole library, winning is rather easy.
Many of us are running Dread Return to target Necrotic Ooze and combo out after drawing/dredging our entire hand.
Well, Derp. I'm runnin Ooze combo in my meren. That takes care of a lot of shuffling, lol.
So... Did you guys actually test any of your list against some of the top decks? Because for me, Gitrog has been really, really subpar in all the incarnations I've been testing.
I had a few experiences with this list, that I've put in the main post.
Some fun interaction I wasn't aware of I discovered on a french forum discussing the deck :
During the Cleanup Step, if you have 8 cards in hand, of which a few are lands, if you discard a land, thus drawing off the Gitrog trigger, the Cleanup Step repeats, meaning you can discards the lands in your hands and the extra lands you draw little by little as the Cleanup Steps repeat, until you have a 7 card hand with no lands, and a graveyard full of extra lands.
That's insane.
Some guys in Brazil had some crazy ideas that I'm going to include soon. This week has been a nightmare for me. But I promise that I'm going to update this ASAP!
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Eternal Marsh
1x Barren Moor
1x Bayou
1x Blighted Fen
1x Blighted Woodland
1x Bloodstained Mire
1x Bojuka Bog
1x Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1x Buried Ruin
1x Cabal Coffers
1x Cabal Pit
1x Cavern of Souls
1x Command Beacon
1x Crystal Vein
1x Dakmor Salvage
1x Dark Depths
1x Dryad Arbor
1x Dust Bowl
3x Forest
1x Gemstone Caverns
1x Ghost Quarter
1x Glacial Chasm
1x Hickory Woodlot
1x High Market
1x Hissing Quagmire
1x Lake of the Dead
1x Marsh Flats
1x Maze of Ith
1x Misty Rainforest
1x Myriad Landscape
1x Overgrown Tomb
1x Peat Bog
1x Petrified Field
1x Polluted Delta
1x Quicksand
4x Swamp
1x Tectonic Edge
1x Temple of Malady
1x Thespian's Stage
1x Tranquil Thicket
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Verdant Catacombs
1x Vesuva
1x Volrath's Stronghold
1x Wasteland
1x Windswept Heath
1x Wooded Foothills
1x Azusa, Lost but Seeking
1x Braids, Cabal Minion
1x Courser of Kruphix
1x Dark Confidant
1x Primeval Titan
1x Sylvan Safekeeper
1x Terravore
1x Titania, Protector of Argoth
Sorceries (19)
1x Death Cloud
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Duress
1x Green Sun's Zenith
1x Hymn to Tourach
1x Inquisition of Kozilek
1x Life from the Loam
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Raven's Crime
1x Reanimate
1x Restore
1x Sinkhole
1x Smallpox
1x Summer Bloom
1x Sylvan Scrying
1x Thoughtseize
1x Toxic Deluge
1x Worm Harvest
1x Yawgmoth's Will
Instants (5)
1x Abrupt Decay
1x Chord of Calling
1x Crop Rotation
1x Dark Ritual
1x Realms Uncharted
1x Crucible of Worlds
1x Expedition Map
1x Horn of Greed
1x Mesmeric Orb
1x Mox Diamond
Enchantments (9)
1x Burgeoning
1x Dark Tutelage
1x Exploration
1x Manabond
1x Oath of Nissa
1x Pernicious Deed
1x Phyrexian Arena
1x Sylvan Library
1x Zombie Infestation
Planeswalkers (2)
1x Garruk Wildspeaker
1x Liliana of the Veil
But I think the Frog will do better in this shell.
Like Eternal Garden, I know the list seems clunky, but it is a lot more organic that it looks.
Lands
The focus of the deck is Utility Lands, and we're packed with them.
With that many tools in hand using Lands, we need Tutors for them. So I put as many as possible, they are never dead draws because we have a wide range of choice at any point of the game.
Sylvan Scrying, Expedition Map and Crop Rotation are standard, but Realms Uncharted deserves a spotlight. Realms Uncharted with Petrified Field is awesome, besides the card draw trigger.
Recursion
Crucible of Worlds and Life from the Loam are the engine of this deck. They go around the drawback of our Commander. Especially Life from the Loam that can be Dredged by itself if you mill land cards. But we also have Yawgmoth's Will to use your whole graveyard once more.
We have Retrace cards as well, like Worm Harvest to win the game and Raven's Crime to strip out the opponent's hand.
Titania, Protector of Argoth also help us with recursion, but I see her more like a Wincon than a recursion tool only.
Don't be too afraid of using Dark Confidant and Dark Tutelage at the same time. The curve of the deck is very low, being almost all lands.
This deck is WIP, but I think this idea has some potential that I already saw when I was playing with my Nissa deck.
With a few tests, I saw that:
In this section I'll share my personal experience and tests with the deck. I'm going to use some Codenames (that you can find in the Changelog section) for which build I was using in each match.
Codename "Tadpole" matches:
The tax-effect of Augustin doesn't affects Lands abilities, and the amount of ramp spells goes around that very well. The discard spells hurt the UW Control shell too much, as well of have many ways to find that Cavern of Souls.
The Frog hit Augustin in every front, it seemed a very good matchup.
The only game that I lost was because I had been Mana Screwed for 3 turns in a row. (Yeah, I know, Mana Screwed with 50 lands. )
Codename "Grounded" matches:
With those changes, deck became less consistent, but that`s not necessarily a bad thing. With Manabond the deck has the aspect of being more explosive in the early game, besides being.a fine discard engine later on the game. In the other hand, if this strategy was slow before, now is even slower.
Against Augustin, that latter is awesome. Like I said before, that uncounterable effects of utility lands and cards hard to deal like Life From The Loam or Raven's Crime were great. And if Augustin likes the late game, so do I.
So that matches were either explosive and overwhelming or with Augustin losing the attrition game.
Codename "Tadpole" matches:
This was a very bad matchup. The Tempo strategy is very effective against the Control that Lands offers. Hexproof inutilizes Maze of Ith.
I won with Blighted Fen, used over and over again with the Recursion Package. Again, the uncounterable effects are very good against Counterspell-based Controls. But I've lost matches with Exploration, Crucible of Worlds, Dark Depths + Thespian's Stage online with just bounce spells and attacking with Geist.
Armageddon and Rest in Peace are nasty was well.
Codename "Grounded" matches:
Having the explosive element in the deck now, gave us an edge against Geist. If Geist had won the Tempo match before, now that our focus is the late game, we are not that worried of being the active player in the match. We can just wait and react, if they don`t react, we can just wait more and win in the late game with the sheer amount of acummulated resources. If the Frog stays in the battlefield for two or more turns, it already gave us so much draws that we win anyways.
Geist has an worse late game than Augustin, so we are good. And our explosiveness is way quicker than Geist can handle.
Codename "Tadpole" matches:
This was a nightmare. With the amount of tutors that Marath has, and the potential of comboing in your face. There's little to no chance against it.
Marath combines every weak spot of the deck. It has many ways to deny your lands, the ability of combo and it can do this with an impressive speed.
This matchup has open up my mind, If I can't deal with Marath, winning against Yisan is just impossible.
I have to shine another light in the deck and change it.
1x Azusa, Lost but Seeking
1x Bazaar of Baghdad
1x Beseech the Queen
1x Constant Mists
1x Distress
1x Down / Dirty
1x Eternal Witness
1x Garruk Relentless
1x Mox Diamond
1x Night's Whisper
1x Nissa's Pilgrimage
1x Oracle of Mul Daya
1x Regrowth
1x Restore
1x Rishadan Port
1x Scapeshift
1x Sign in Blood
1x Sinkhole
1x Smokestack
1x World Breaker
1x Edge of Autumn
1 Wood Elves
1 Blackmail
1 Dakmor Salvage
1 Mox Diamond
3/25/16 Codename "Grounded":
1 Cultivate
1 Farseek
1 Kodama's Reach
1 Nature's Lore
1 Rampant Growth
1 Damnation
1 Rain of Filth
5 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Mesmeric Orb
1 Azusa, Lost but Seeking
1 Manabond
1 Zombie Infestation
1 Restore
1 Summer Bloom
1 Buried Ruins
1 Cabal Pit
1 Hissing Quagmire
1 Quicksand
1 Temple of Malady
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Gemstone Caverns
If I'm focusing on the Lands aspect, some removal Lands are necessary, so Cabal Pit and Quicksand were added. Hissing Quagmire is great for blocking, but it is an amazing manland to attack as well. Temple of Malady because of Scry, Buried Ruins and Volrath's Stronghold are great for bringing back some silver bullets that were milled.
Thanks! I still didn't add the new cards in this list because I'd get lost in Cockatrice.
Besides Traverse the Ulvenwald, I was thinking of adding Groundskeeper and Drownyard Temple as well from the new set.
Thanks!
eternal witness and mox diamond are in my Maybeboard (I'm gonna edit the post to add the Maybeboard). I like the interactions of this cards but they didn't make the first cut.
But dakmor salvage and terravore were completely out of my radar! Thanks for the tips, I'm going to change that now!
Especially Dakmor Salvage, this card helps me bypass the drawback of The Gitrog Monster in only one card. Amazing...
I'm going to test it later and I tell you the results.
That's my motivation! I knew that someone was going to do an Elfball version, a BG Rock version, but I was almost sure that no one was going to do the Lands route (because with all the time playing with Nissa, I've never seen any deck quite like mine, and my opponents tell me the same).
Diversity of ideas is always welcomed!
Oracle of mul daya is very good, but I didn't find slot for it. I thought that Courser of Kruphix gave me life, it's cheaper to cast and has a better thoughness.
And either way, they are both here for the card advantage, not as much for the ramp. (Although any ramp is very good in this deck.)
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/sapao/
l didn't thought that the poxy build was any better than a well bulit braids, and l figured you would want to try to build it as that since she is your sweetheart. So l didn't bother to go that way. l went outside the box and
Zombie infestation was better than you can imagine when you see it on paper. You get a 2/2 and draw a card but if you have dakmor salvage you may end up even on cards and just get the 2/2 for free.
l'm yet to live the dream of decking myself and Dread Return-ing my Craterhoof Behemoth for the win.
Yeah, my friend is going to build the Braids way. Hahahahah
I was discussing with my playgroup about a solid Discard Outlet. Zombie Infestation was the main candidate.
This is a key card for the changes I'm about to make in the deck, but I've completely forgot about it. This is a must have.
Orb with him and dredge is a full grave and a smile on your face.
1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
1 Windswept Heath
1 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Bayou
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Life from the Loam
1 Creakwood Liege
1 Deathrite Shaman
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Grisly Salvage
1 Putrefy
1 Azusa, Lost but Seeking
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Bloodghast
1 Brain Maggot
1 Wasteland
1 Dust Bowl
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Wood Elves
1 Crop Rotation
1 Cultivate
1 Drown in Filth
1 Edge of Autumn
1 Exploration
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Realms Uncharted
1 Dark Confidant
1 Raven's Crime
1 Mesmeric Fiend
1 Satyr Wayfinder
1 Primeval Titan
1 Sylvan Library
6 Forest
5 Swamp
1 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Worm Harvest
1 Sprouting Vines
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Barren Moor
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Command Tower
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Hissing Quagmire
1 Llanowar Wastes
1 Mana Confluence
1 Slippery Karst
1 Temple of Malady
1 Tranquil Thicket
1 Twilight Mire
1 Woodland Cemetery
1 Petrified Field
1 Tilling Treefolk
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
1 Woodland Bellower
1 Khalni Heart Expedition
1 Braids, Cabal Minion
1 Hero's Downfall
1 Skullclamp
1 Murderous Cut
1 Bloom Tender
1 Llanowar Elves
1 Elves of Deep Shadow
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Chord of Calling
1 Liliana of the Veil
1 Terravore
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Dakmor Salvage
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Dismember
1 Go for the Throat
1 Horn of Greed
1 Phyrexian Obliterator
1 Elvish Mystic
1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
This is my current list! It's a jumble and I'll fix it later. The cycling lands are really good here.
The funny thing is that I used Orb in 3 of my last 5 decks. I really like that card and I feel ashamed that I didn't remember it. Hahahah
I've formatted the post, now it is less horrible.
Thanks!
Yeah, that's a nice idea, and I think that a lot of people will come with the Combo build that you mentioned, as well as the Control build "BG Rock".
My idea with this post is to do something like a Primer of this specific archetype/build, that I know that no one or very few people even consider.
Feel free to do your idea and share with us. I know it'll be awesome as well and everyone will learn something from different points of view.
I added my experience and tests with the deck. Change a lot of cards in the last update.
City of traitors might be a good idea, especially with crucible on the battlefield.
The new land, Drownyard temple, especially to try to keep alive the Frog after a successful [card-Armageddon]geddon[/card] or ravages.
Homeward Path is always a useful land because of so many Gilded Drakes and Treacherys found in the meta.
Harrow is not a good idea? A draw and two ramp lands...seems good to me...
Syphon Life seems to me a great card against control, but still not sure....
Golgari Thug can provide as much a draw as you return that WinCon that got away.
I thought maybe cards with landfall be as useful as cards with dredge in this deck, so I put Undergrowth champion and Ob Nixilis, The fallen as alternative wincons.
Sorry for my bad english and I still dont' no how to link the cards in the post hehe
Especially Syphon Life and Ob Nixilis, the Fallen. The new cards were not added it up yet just because I'm keeping track of my decklists in Cockatrice and they don't have the new cards yet. But I have a few cards to add from SOI as soon Cockatrice updates his database.
Homeward Path is a card that I always forget do add! Hahahahaha
And Golgari Thug seems like a good dredge engine and a good creature as well. That's really good.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
5 The Gitrog Monster
Lands (40)
0 Blighted Fen
0 Bloodstained Mire
0 City of Brass
0 Command Tower
0 Dakmor Salvage
0 Dryad Arbor
0 Dust Bowl
0 Encroaching Wastes
6 Forest
0 Glacial Chasm
0 Hissing Quagmire
0 Lake of the Dead
0 Llanowar Wastes
0 Lotus Vale
0 Mana Confluence
0 Marsh Flats
0 Misty Rainforest
0 Overgrown Tomb
0 Phyrexian Tower
0 Polluted Delta
5 Swamp
0 Tainted Wood
0 Tectonic Edge
0 Temple of Malady
0 Twilight Mire
0 Urborg, Tomb of yawgmoth
0 Verdant Catacombs
0 Wasteland
0 Windswept Heath
0 Wooded Foothills
0 Woodland Cemetery
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Boreal Druid
1 Elves of Deep Shadow
1 Elvish Mystic
1 Fyndhorn Elves
1 Llanowar Elves
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Putrid Imp
2 Bloodghast
2 Devoted Druid
2 Wild Mongrel
2 Dark Confidant
2 Dregscape Zombie
2 Oona's Prowler
3 Bloodrite Invoker
3 Stinkweed imp
3 Quillspike
4 Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
4 Necrotic Ooze
5 Golgari Grave-Troll
5 Titania, Protector of Argoth
6 Primeval Titan
Instants (11)
1 Skeletal Scrying
1 Nature's Claim
1 Dark Ritual
1 Darkblast
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Victim of Night
2 Go for the Throat
3 Beast Within
3 Realms Uncharted
3 Putrefy
3 Dismember
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Duress
1 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Raven's Crime
1 Reanimate
1 Thoughtseize
1 Traverse the Ulvenwald
2 Life from the loam
2 Sylvan Scrying
2 Demonic Tutor
2 Diabolic Intent
3 Toxic Deluge
3 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Damnation
4 Dread Return
4 Jarad's Orders
Enchantments (7)
1 Exploration
1 Utopia Sprawl
1 Wild Growth
2 Survival of the Fittest
2 Sylvan Library
2 Animate Dead
3 Pernicious Dead
Artifact (2)
1 Expedition Map
3 Crucible of Worlds
Planeswalkers (1)
1 Liliana of the Veil
I know there are some peculiar cards in there so feel free to ask questions. The weird ones are likely linked to a combo.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Thanks for the recommendations ! Here are a few of my thoughts on em:
Skirge Familiar - I left this one out for now because of it's higher mana cost. After some testing I may decide to put it in for consistency.
Bayou - Money
Crop Rotation: The problem with this card is it puts Dakmore Salvage onto the battlefield. I'd really prefer it to be in my hand so I can discard loop it. Sure I could sac it but that just adds another piece to the puzzle.
City of Traitors - I'd hate to see it in my opening hand.
Ebon Stronghold, Havenwood Battleground, Barren Moor, Tranquil Thicket - The ramp/cycling is nice but imo etb tapped is a bit of a dealbreaker. I'd hate to see em in my opening hand but I suppose I should at least test em.
I really like your other recommendations, just not sure what to take out for em. Sounds like you've done some testing (I just play paper and my friends don't like proxys so I'm waiting until I can actually get my hands on a copy), anything you would take out of my list?
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Skirge Familiar may cost more but, it is as much as Froggy. It also has a perk : you can discard any card for mana. This dude works VERY well.
"Money" is not really an argument for competitive decks, Bayou isn't even the most expensive biland by far...
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Aggro decks are still a problem...
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/dendrobates/
Yeah, I'm just waiting for the people to post their decklists to add in the main post. I'm writting a motivation section as well.
Can I put that in the main post?
EDIT: I've just update the post with some more testing with the new changes.
Sure!
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Been trying to build a bg stax shell recently and while playtesting yesterday I was able to Rainbow-up the dog up to high 50's. You can also draw your whole deck if you hit a land while dredging. And, let's face it, once you've drawn your whole library, winning is rather easy.
BChainer, Dementia Master(Big Mana/Reanimator)
BRRakdos, The Showstopper (Mass Life Loss/Ramp)
BUThe Scarab God (Zombie Tribal/Control)
BWKarlov of the Ghost Council (Life Gain)
BGJarad, Golgari Lich Lord (Stompy/Dredge)
BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher (Tokens/Non-infinite Combo)
Well, Derp. I'm runnin Ooze combo in my meren. That takes care of a lot of shuffling, lol.
That's insane.
Some guys in Brazil had some crazy ideas that I'm going to include soon. This week has been a nightmare for me. But I promise that I'm going to update this ASAP!