Just wondering if anyone had any advice or observations on my decklist before I drop the money to complete it. I'll be using the deck for multiplayer and 1v1 duels.
Is there anything necessary that I forgot, or anything in there that's purpose would be better served by something else? How do my numbers look? I sorta feel like I should have more card draw, but I'm not really sure what to add for that, or what to cut to add it. Are there any obvious weak spots?
Dragon Tyrant is beef incarnate (well, second only to Bull Aurochs, but now we're mixing definitions). It has a much lower upkeep cost than Draco and is cheaper to cast. More important for a one-shot Zirilan smack: it tramples and breaths fire. Combine that with double strike, and he hurts.
If you have both Gratuitous Violence and Zirilan in play, you can pay 7 to smack someone for 40 flying trampling damage.
Spawn of Thraxes will nuke something without the mana investment some of your other dragons require. Thunder Dragon brings the Anger of the Gods when he hits play -- which, conveniently, just misses killing your own Zirilan. Siege Dragon's two damage is starting to get a little low, so if it is relevant would start depending on your metagame (I run it).
Disaster Radius can be a decent X - 1 sided wrath (where X = number of players) given all your high CMC creatures. Earthquake variants would kill your commander, but they'd leave your dragons unharmed.
I also like Ugin's Nexus in this deck. It stops blue players from taking extra turns, and discourages them from removing it (possibly leaving dead Time Warps in hand). Towards the end of the game, when you're getting ready to close it out, you can also tutor for the hoard-smelter and pump it to 10 (or 13) power. It is a nice option to have while doing the math, to push through the last bit.
Sword of Feast and Famine is a great card. You may also find yourself in a position where it simply wins you the game: have 12 mana, this and your commander in play, and no opponents have flying blockers? Hellkite Charger!
If you're running Evolving Wilds and Terramorphic Expanse just because they play well with Rings of Brighthearth, might I recommend Thawing Glaciers? The glaciers also play well with Deserted Temple: because they only return to hand at the end of your turn, wait until the glaciers untap during your untap step, and then the temple gives you two activations before the glaciers bounces to your hand, putting you ahead on lands in play. If you have them, you don't worry about mana screw.
The downside, of course, is that they're slow. As far as dragon-flavor is concerned: there is a reason they're melting, and giving way to mountains, isn't there? Wayfarer's Bauble and Myriad Landscape are other choices. All in all, if you're willing to run Evolving Wilds and Terramorphic Expanse in a mono-colored deck, I would definitely recommend these options also.
Blood Moon is sweet.
You don't play with your graveyard, so I would strongly recommend Relic of Progenitus. Cheap, cantrips, and plenty of people do broken things with their 'yard.
Scion of the Ur-Dragon; Teferi, Temporal Archmage; Karador, Ghost Chieftain; Prime Speaker Zegana; Maelstrom Wanderer; Sliver Overlord; Zirilan of the Claw; Volrath the Fallen; Thromok the Insatiable
Tawnos's Coffin is a wonderful way to keep your dragons, protect protect Z, save a creature from a wipe, reuse ETB effects, imprison bothersome creatures, etc. Can be used very diplomatically.
Thornbite Staff pairs particularly well with Z since he is a Shaman. 1) Dig for a Bogardan Hellkite. 2) Kill a few small fries and get multiple untaps. 3) Dig for a few beatsticks. 4) Swing for the fences. Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker also fits will with Z and with the staff.
I cut Dragon Tyrant for the list right before I posted it just because Draco has always been in the deck for me since I first made it years ago, but Dragon Tyrant is clearly better than Draco, so nostalgia is a poor reason not to make the switch.
Spawn of Thraxes and Thunder Dragon make more sense now that someone else has explained their uses to me, since I had trouble seeing it myself. Made room for them. Siege Dragon still seems underwhelming to me. I love the card and its flavor, but it just doesn't seem worth it to me. Perhaps I'm overlooking something still.
Disaster Radius is obvious. I misread the card thinking it damaged all creatures, but since it's just opponent's creatures, it definitely can find a spot.
I actually cut Minion Reflector for Flameshadow Conjuring as soon as it was spoiled. I never considered just running both. I wonder if it's actually worth finding room for the redundancy of the effect versus other effects I'd have to cut...
I have a Savage Beating that used to be in the deck way back when, but I'm not sure if there's room for it.
As for Ugin's Nexus, I think I'm gonna wait and see how much it'll actually help me in my meta, because I'm honestly not too sure.
Evolving Wilds and Terramorphic Expanse were already in my stack and I just didn't see a reason not to run them. I honestly didn't even consider the bonus that Rings of Brighthearth gives them, though they are kinda slow, now that you bring it up. I'm gonna cut one for Thawing Glaciers since I already have one and that fact that it combos with two cards in the deck rather than just the Rings. Think I'm gonna replace the other with Myriad Landscape, just because it actually ramps and still combos with the Rings, but I'm not sure.
*Sigh* And somehow I've ended up with 101 cards... This seems to always happen no matter how careful I am... What to cut, what to cut...?
What are everyone's thoughts on Thunderbreak Regent? Am I correct in assuming that it'll usually only get in 3 damage since it'll always be the first one targeted with removal once it hits? How many multi-target cards are there that I'd want to tutor it in response to? I think it might be the card I cut...
EDIT: Thunderbreak is gone. It just doesn't seem that useful to me, though I may be wrong.
Preyseizer Dragon is a nice average cmc dragon that can help sac a few temp buddys from zirilan and has a very scary effect. When I ran zirilan I never had time to sink mana into something like Flameblast Dragon and thinking back I would have liked Preyseizer over Flameblast for this reason.
Also since you have a 24 dragons in the deck (nearly 25%) Kilnmouth Dragon would make for a fantastic inclusion for a very similar reason (revealing two = +6 counters). Really wish he had haste, but if the opponent can't deal with this then you will likely ave a cannon on board.
Well, I've already cut Flameblast since I was over 100, but Preyseizer doesn't as effective to me as other choices.
Kilnmouth Dragon definitely seems nteresting, but what to cut for it?
If I ran Zirilan, I'd totally run this list. It looks really fun. Anyway, sac outlets (Goblin Bombardment, Ashnod's Altar, etc) should get around the exile effect, then you could dig them back out with Feldon of the Third Path. Also, Conjurer's Closet should get around the exile effect as both go onto the stack at the same time, but if Closet's effect resolves before Zirilan's exile effect blinking the creature in question, it should remove the instance of that creature needing exiled. I'm 97% certain that's how it works, but you might want to double-check with a judge. Additionally, Conjurer's Closet works phenomenally with Flameshadow Conjuring, Warstorm Surge, Scourge of Valkas, Spawn of Thraxes, and Thunder Dragon.
I think dragon tempest is better than Scourge of Valkas unlike a lot of multi colour dragon decks I am really only going to have one dragon in play at a time. My play style of my version of the deck is a lot of whittling away as part of my control game into an explosive knock out.
dragon tempest gives you a bonus even when you don't have a stack of dragons. Also I have used the damage ability to fight through maze of ith which is a massive pain in the arse normally.
Haven't seen anyone mention Cold Storage yet. That's another way to keep your dragons. Also, while I understand that it's type line says "land" I don't like thinking of Safe Haven as a land because it doesn't tap for mana.
Private Mod Note
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You would never guess, at the terrifying sight of the man, that Hunding was as charming a companion as one could wish for.
I had some big plays with it. In response to Cyclonic rift to keep my board.. to stop spot removal on my hammer of purphoros I needed to set up a kill the next turn.. and to kill everyone with Valakaut the molten pinnacle. It's upside is great.
but.. I just drew it too many times and its just so so bad when its in your hand.. that I cut it (for changeling berserker)
1 Zirilan of the Claw
Untap 5
1 Illusionist's Bracers
1 Magewright's Stone
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Thousand-Year Elixir
1 Sword of the Paruns
Storage 4
1 Synod Sanctum
1 Tel-Jilad Stylus
1 Sundial of the Infinite
1 Conjurer's Closet
Protection 6
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Swiftfoot Boots
1 Darksteel Plate
1 Glacial Crevasses
1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Thunderbreak Regent
Utility 8
1 Dragon Mage
1 Hellkite Tyrant
1 Hoarding Dragon
1 Hunted Dragon
1 Lightning Shrieker
1 Changeling Berserker
1 Expedition Map
1 Mind's Eye
1 Sarkhan's Triumph
Beef 2
1 Draco
1 Furyborn Hellkite
Damage Boost 12
1 Hellkite Charger
1 Moonveil Dragon
1 Mana-Charged Dragon
1 Scourge of the Throne
1 Utvara Hellkite
1 Aggravated Assault
1 Crucible of Fire
1 Flameshadow Conjuring
1 Curse of Bloodletting
1 Gratuitous Violence
1 Rage Reflection
1 Warstorm Surge
1 Ancient Hellkite
1 Balefire Dragon
1 Bogardan Hellkite
1 Flameblast Dragon
1 Hoard-Smelter Dragon
1 Mordant Dragon
1 Rimescale Dragon
1 Scourge of the Kher Ridges
1 Scourge of Valkas
1 Shivan Hellkite
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Thundermaw Hellkite
1 Tyrant's Familiar
Mana 16
1 Everflowing Chalice
1 Ruby Medallion
1 Sol Ring
1 Mind Stone
1 Basalt Monolith
1 Worn Powerstone
1 Thran Dynamo
1 Gilded Lotus
1 Dreamstone Hedron
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Caged Sun
1 Braid of Fire
1 Soulbright Flamekin
1 Dragonloard's Servant
1 Dragonspeaker Shaman
1 Arena
1 Buried Ruin
1 Deserted Temple
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Hall of the Bandit Lord
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Rogue's Passage
1 Safe Haven
1 Scrying Sheets
1 Spinerock Knoll
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Temple of the False God
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
21 Snow-Covered Mountain
Is there anything necessary that I forgot, or anything in there that's purpose would be better served by something else? How do my numbers look? I sorta feel like I should have more card draw, but I'm not really sure what to add for that, or what to cut to add it. Are there any obvious weak spots?
Any help is greatly appreciated!
Commander Decks
WDarien, King of KjeldorW - WYomiji, Who Bars the WayW - UIxidor, Reality SculptorU
BPhage the UntouchableB - BShirei,
Shadowborn Ap-Shizo's CaretakerB - RZirilan of the ClawR(W/U)Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper(W/U) - (2/G)Phelddagrif Politics(W/U) - (U/B)Mishra, Artificer Prodigy(U/R) - Karona, God of Voltron
If you have both Gratuitous Violence and Zirilan in play, you can pay 7 to smack someone for 40 flying trampling damage.
Spawn of Thraxes will nuke something without the mana investment some of your other dragons require.
Thunder Dragon brings the Anger of the Gods when he hits play -- which, conveniently, just misses killing your own Zirilan. Siege Dragon's two damage is starting to get a little low, so if it is relevant would start depending on your metagame (I run it).
Disaster Radius can be a decent X - 1 sided wrath (where X = number of players) given all your high CMC creatures. Earthquake variants would kill your commander, but they'd leave your dragons unharmed.
Minion Reflector is a second Flameshadow Conjuring that Hoarding Dragon can find. While it may not be on the top of the list of artifacts you want to have, without the ability to sac it*, you might prefer to gamble on a card it doesn't hurt so much to lose.
Seize the Day isn't terrible if you typically only have one large creature at a time, while Savage Beating can be a Savage Beating.
*High Market may also be worthwhile.
I also like Ugin's Nexus in this deck. It stops blue players from taking extra turns, and discourages them from removing it (possibly leaving dead Time Warps in hand). Towards the end of the game, when you're getting ready to close it out, you can also tutor for the hoard-smelter and pump it to 10 (or 13) power. It is a nice option to have while doing the math, to push through the last bit.
Sword of Feast and Famine is a great card. You may also find yourself in a position where it simply wins you the game: have 12 mana, this and your commander in play, and no opponents have flying blockers? Hellkite Charger!
Inquisitor's Flail could serve as a lesser Gratuitous Violence. As your dragons fly, the symmetry shouldn't be too much of an issue.
If you're running Evolving Wilds and Terramorphic Expanse just because they play well with Rings of Brighthearth, might I recommend Thawing Glaciers? The glaciers also play well with Deserted Temple: because they only return to hand at the end of your turn, wait until the glaciers untap during your untap step, and then the temple gives you two activations before the glaciers bounces to your hand, putting you ahead on lands in play. If you have them, you don't worry about mana screw.
The downside, of course, is that they're slow. As far as dragon-flavor is concerned: there is a reason they're melting, and giving way to mountains, isn't there?
Wayfarer's Bauble and Myriad Landscape are other choices. All in all, if you're willing to run Evolving Wilds and Terramorphic Expanse in a mono-colored deck, I would definitely recommend these options also.
Blood Moon is sweet.
You don't play with your graveyard, so I would strongly recommend Relic of Progenitus. Cheap, cantrips, and plenty of people do broken things with their 'yard.
If you can afford it, Gauntlet of Might is fantastic.
Quicksilver Amulet and Belbe's Portal may be worth considering for the dragons you draw.
Mycosynth Lattice is an all-star with Hellkite Tyrant.
Worldgorger Dragon is an auto-win if dug-up in response to a full board wipe like Jokulhaups or Decree of Annihilation.
Tawnos's Coffin is a wonderful way to keep your dragons, protect protect Z, save a creature from a wipe, reuse ETB effects, imprison bothersome creatures, etc. Can be used very diplomatically.
Thornbite Staff pairs particularly well with Z since he is a Shaman. 1) Dig for a Bogardan Hellkite. 2) Kill a few small fries and get multiple untaps. 3) Dig for a few beatsticks. 4) Swing for the fences. Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker also fits will with Z and with the staff.
Sac outlets. Phyrexian Altar, Ashnod's Altar and Shivan Harvest are all good.
Sensei's Divining Top and Scroll Rack also have increased effectiveness due to the constant shuffling inherit with Z.
Spawn of Thraxes and Thunder Dragon make more sense now that someone else has explained their uses to me, since I had trouble seeing it myself. Made room for them. Siege Dragon still seems underwhelming to me. I love the card and its flavor, but it just doesn't seem worth it to me. Perhaps I'm overlooking something still.
Disaster Radius is obvious. I misread the card thinking it damaged all creatures, but since it's just opponent's creatures, it definitely can find a spot.
I actually cut Minion Reflector for Flameshadow Conjuring as soon as it was spoiled. I never considered just running both. I wonder if it's actually worth finding room for the redundancy of the effect versus other effects I'd have to cut...
I have a Savage Beating that used to be in the deck way back when, but I'm not sure if there's room for it.
As for Ugin's Nexus, I think I'm gonna wait and see how much it'll actually help me in my meta, because I'm honestly not too sure.
Evolving Wilds and Terramorphic Expanse were already in my stack and I just didn't see a reason not to run them. I honestly didn't even consider the bonus that Rings of Brighthearth gives them, though they are kinda slow, now that you bring it up. I'm gonna cut one for Thawing Glaciers since I already have one and that fact that it combos with two cards in the deck rather than just the Rings. Think I'm gonna replace the other with Myriad Landscape, just because it actually ramps and still combos with the Rings, but I'm not sure.
This is my updated list:
1 Zirilan of the Claw
Untap 4
1 Illusionist's Bracers
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Thousand-Year Elixir
1 Sword of the Paruns
Storage 4
1 Synod Sanctum
1 Tel-Jilad Stylus
1 Sundial of the Infinite
1 Conjurer's Closet
Protection 5
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Swiftfoot Boots
1 Darksteel Plate
1 Glacial Crevasses
1 Whispersilk Cloak
Utility 8
1 Dragon Mage
1 Hellkite Tyrant
1 Hoarding Dragon
1 Hunted Dragon
1 Changeling Berserker
1 Expedition Map
1 Mind's Eye
1 Sarkhan's Triumph
Beef 2
1 Dragon Tyrant
1 Furyborn Hellkite
Damage Boost 12
1 Hellkite Charger
1 Moonveil Dragon
1 Mana-Charged Dragon
1 Scourge of the Throne
1 Utvara Hellkite
1 Aggravated Assault
1 Crucible of Fire
1 Flameshadow Conjuring
1 Curse of Bloodletting
1 Gratuitous Violence
1 Rage Reflection
1 Warstorm Surge
1 Ancient Hellkite
1 Balefire Dragon
1 Bogardan Hellkite
1 Hoard-Smelter Dragon
1 Kilnmouth Dragon
1 Rimescale Dragon
1 Scourge of Kher Ridges
1 Scourge of Valkas
1 Spawn of Thraxes
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Thunder Dragon
1 Thundermaw Hellkite
1 Tyrant's Familiar
1 Disaster Radius
Mana 14
1 Everflowing Chalice
1 Sol Ring
1 Mind Stone
1 Basalt Monolith
1 Worn Powerstone
1 Thran Dynamo
1 Gilded Lotus
1 Dreamstone Hedron
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Caged Sun
1 Soulbright Flamekin
1 Dragonlord's Servant
1 Dragonspeaker Shaman
1 Buried Ruin
1 Deserted Temple
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Hall of the Bandit Lord
1 Myriad Landscape
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Rogue's Passage
1 Safe Haven
1 Scrying Sheets
1 Spinerock Knoll
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Temple of the False God
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
20 Snow-Covered Mountain
*Sigh* And somehow I've ended up with 101 cards... This seems to always happen no matter how careful I am... What to cut, what to cut...?
What are everyone's thoughts on Thunderbreak Regent? Am I correct in assuming that it'll usually only get in 3 damage since it'll always be the first one targeted with removal once it hits? How many multi-target cards are there that I'd want to tutor it in response to? I think it might be the card I cut...EDIT: Thunderbreak is gone. It just doesn't seem that useful to me, though I may be wrong.
Commander Decks
WDarien, King of KjeldorW - WYomiji, Who Bars the WayW - UIxidor, Reality SculptorU
BPhage the UntouchableB - BShirei,
Shadowborn Ap-Shizo's CaretakerB - RZirilan of the ClawR(W/U)Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper(W/U) - (2/G)Phelddagrif Politics(W/U) - (U/B)Mishra, Artificer Prodigy(U/R) - Karona, God of Voltron
Well, I've already cut Flameblast since I was over 100, but Preyseizer doesn't as effective to me as other choices.
Kilnmouth Dragon definitely seems nteresting, but what to cut for it?
EDIT: Took out Arena for Kilnmouth.
Commander Decks
WDarien, King of KjeldorW - WYomiji, Who Bars the WayW - UIxidor, Reality SculptorU
BPhage the UntouchableB - BShirei,
Shadowborn Ap-Shizo's CaretakerB - RZirilan of the ClawR(W/U)Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper(W/U) - (2/G)Phelddagrif Politics(W/U) - (U/B)Mishra, Artificer Prodigy(U/R) - Karona, God of Voltron
UR Mizzix of the Izmagnus ~~~ Build your own win-condition: Finite Spellslinging
UR Brudiclad, Telchor Engineer ~~~ We are the Borg. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own.
WUB Oloro, Ageless Ascetic ~~~ A Guide to dying slowly
UBR Marchesa, the Black Rose ~~~ Marchesa's undying Marionettes
RGW Mayael the Anima ~~~ All Hail the Big Chungus
GWU Chulane, Teller of Tales ~~~ Permanents Only ETB Shenanigans
BGU Sidisi, Brood Tyrant ~~~ Sidisi's Restless Servants
WUBRG The Ur-Dragon ~~~ Dragons eat your face
I've got a Bladewing the Risen deck that works similarly to this, here's the link if you're interested http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/572383-fire-blood-warstorm-reanimator-bladewing-origins
| Omnath | Zada | Alesha | Scion |
| Mazirek | Animar |
Modern
UR Storm RU
UBRG Dredge GRBU
Standard
UR Thermo-Thing RU
dragon tempest gives you a bonus even when you don't have a stack of dragons. Also I have used the damage ability to fight through maze of ith which is a massive pain in the arse normally.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
| Omnath | Zada | Alesha | Scion |
| Mazirek | Animar |
Modern
UR Storm RU
UBRG Dredge GRBU
Standard
UR Thermo-Thing RU
I had some big plays with it. In response to Cyclonic rift to keep my board.. to stop spot removal on my hammer of purphoros I needed to set up a kill the next turn.. and to kill everyone with Valakaut the molten pinnacle. It's upside is great.
but.. I just drew it too many times and its just so so bad when its in your hand.. that I cut it (for changeling berserker)
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own