So lately, this has been my go to deck, and I really enjoy playing it. People don't seem to take Chainer too seriously until they realize how absurd simple interactions like looping fleshbag marauders can be.
Too many wrath effects? In general, the way I play the deck, I use Chainer as my finisher. I almost never play him before the first board wipe, and usually not the second. Once he hits the field, he is a huge target, so I try to let everyone burn their resources and control the board, and then sweep in to use either my recursion engines (fleshbag marauder, kokusho loops, runescarred demon, etc) or other peoples fatties to win the game. Still, I think that I might have too many wraths in the deck. If i ever get around to getting one, I think Toxic Deluge is a straight up replacement for mutilate, but that spot might be better suited to a threat, not an answer. It's also a little akward having so many wraths in what is a pretty creature heavy list, as far as mono black goes. Still, I find it hard to cut wrath effects, especially since each has its use. Black Sun's Zenith/Mutilate are variable wraths, and they get around indestructible. Decree of Pain is awsome to cast on 8 and a great utility on 5. Just today I cycled it to kill Talrand + like 5 tokens, while dodging like 4 counters in my opponents hand. Damnation is the go-to, and All is Dust is a great catchall.
More mana rocks? I feel like my list might be a little light on acceleration, especially considering that Mono black and chainer are very mana intensive.
More ways to interact against control? Right now I feel like I only have really one go to card in dealing with control in Mindslicer.
Specific Card comments - A lot of the deck is pretty standard mono black stuff. Here I'll talk about some of the less popular choices
Geth, Lord of the Vault: While in many cases similar to Chainer, I like having redundancy in my deck. He also feeds the GY for more stuff, and unlike Chainer, the reanimation is permanent. He quickly takes over a game, especially against an open board. Also, I love me some fatties. Until recently, I had Grave Titan in my list, just because I think that sometimes you need to cast big creatures with broken abilites.
Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief: This may not be an optimal slot, but I absolutely love this card. It always evokes memories of destroying ROE drafts, and is a card that screams "EDH" to me. Drana is also a great mana sink, and is good at picking off utility creatures/commanders.
Erebos, God of the Dead: This is a card I'm still on the fence about. It is a decent card advantage engine, an ok global enchantment, and sometimes a good creature. Seperately, those effects aren't worth the slot, but together they probably are. It is pretty hilarious dropping Erebos t4 against Oloro.
Bloodline Keeper: Fairly cheap army in a can - creates early blockers and sac fodder.
Steel Hellkite: I like having atleast a roundabout way to deal with non-creatures, but in practice this usually dies before It gets to connect more than once or twice. Still, you gotta get your removal somehow, and Karn usually doesn't last past the turn you cast him.
Bone Shredder V. Shriekmaw: I like that Boneshredder automatically goes to the gy. Makes it easier to recur with Chainer.
Hero's Downfall: I like having atleast one catchall removal spell. It's nice that it also hits pws.
Diabolic Tutor: This card is borderline. Four is a lot for a tutor, but what pushes it over the edge is the ability to be transmuted to with Dimir House Guard. Turning your 4cmc tutor into a tutor for anything has proven to be useful.
Rise of the Dark Realms: This is EDH - Sometimes you just gotta cast 9 mana sorceries.
Yawgmoth's Will: As broken as this card can be in certain decks, usually I end up using it as regrowth for my coffers + extra value on my early plays/tutors.
Necropotence: This card makes me feel so evil when I use it. Really makes you wonder what Wizards was thinking back in the day.
Liliana of the Dark Realms: Another borderline card, but Lilli is a pretty unthreatening pw that feeds a mana hungry deck, and sometimes acts as spot removal.
Pristine Talisman: Not the best mana rock, but offsetting some of the many sources of life loss is nice.
Volrath's Stronghold: Just picked up one of these the other day, and as expected, it is insane. Draws just as many acidic slimes as coffers does.
Wishlist/Cards on my Radar:
Phyrexian Reclamation - I really want to try this card out, but my LGS is out, and I really don't feel like buying one of the precons for a dollar card.
Crucible of Worlds/Black fetches - If I had the fetches, I would run crucible, but it is hard to justify buying pricey fetches just for a niche use, especially in a mono black list
Grim Tutor/Imperial Seal - A man can dream, right?
Gray Merchant of Asphodel/Nythkos, Shrine to Nyx - These two are laziness more than anything. If I were to add merchant, however, I would keep Kokusho in. I am a big proponent of having redundancy in your combos, as evidenced by having both Fleshbag Marauder and Slum Reaper in my deck.
Toxic Deluge: Mentioned it earlier, but variable wrath effect that gets around indesctructible for 3 mana sounds good to me. Life is a resourcce and should be used accordingly, as any mono black player knows.
Beseech the Queen: This card seems good until you realize that it's just a one mana cheaper version of Diabolic Tutor with a restriction. Still might give it a shot.
So anyways, that's my take on Chainer. Any thoughts, comments, and feedback would be greatly appreciated!
The List:
1 Chainer, Dementia Master
Artifacts (11)
1 Caged Sun
1 Coalition Relic
1 Expedition Map
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Phyrexian Altar
1 Pristine Talisman
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Skullclamp
1 Sol ring
1 Spawning Pit
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
Creature (30)
1 Blood Artist
1 Bloodghast
1 Bloodgift Demon
1 Bloodline Keeper
1 Bone Shredder
1 Crypt Ghast
1 Dimir House Guard
1 Disciple of Bolas
1 Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief
1 Duplicant
1 Erebos, God of the Dead
1 Falkenrath Noble
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Geth, Lord of the Vault
1 Graveborn Muse
1 Harvester of Souls
1 Kagemaro, First to Suffer
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Massacre Wurm
1 Mindslicer
1 Nirkana Revenant
1 Reassembling Skeleton
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Sangromancer
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
1 Slum Reaper
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Withered Wretch
1 Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
1 Animate Dead
1 Necropotence
1 Phyrexian Arena
Instant (3)
1 Entomb
1 Hero's Downfall
1 Vampiric Tutor
Planeswalker (2)
1 Karn Liberated
1 Liliana of the Dark Realms
Sorcery (12)
1 All is Dust
1 Black Sun's Zenith
1 Buried Alive
1 Damnation
1 Decree of Pain
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Diabolic tutor
1 Exsanguinate
1 Living Death
1 Mutilate
1 Rise of the Dark Realms
1 Yawgmoth's Will
Lands (38)
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Buried Ruin
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Deserted Temple
1 High Market
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Strip Mine
25 Swamp
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Vesuva
1 Volrath's Stronghold
Thoughts/questions about the deck:
Too many wrath effects? In general, the way I play the deck, I use Chainer as my finisher. I almost never play him before the first board wipe, and usually not the second. Once he hits the field, he is a huge target, so I try to let everyone burn their resources and control the board, and then sweep in to use either my recursion engines (fleshbag marauder, kokusho loops, runescarred demon, etc) or other peoples fatties to win the game. Still, I think that I might have too many wraths in the deck. If i ever get around to getting one, I think Toxic Deluge is a straight up replacement for mutilate, but that spot might be better suited to a threat, not an answer. It's also a little akward having so many wraths in what is a pretty creature heavy list, as far as mono black goes. Still, I find it hard to cut wrath effects, especially since each has its use. Black Sun's Zenith/Mutilate are variable wraths, and they get around indestructible. Decree of Pain is awsome to cast on 8 and a great utility on 5. Just today I cycled it to kill Talrand + like 5 tokens, while dodging like 4 counters in my opponents hand. Damnation is the go-to, and All is Dust is a great catchall.
More mana rocks? I feel like my list might be a little light on acceleration, especially considering that Mono black and chainer are very mana intensive.
More ways to interact against control? Right now I feel like I only have really one go to card in dealing with control in Mindslicer.
Specific Card comments - A lot of the deck is pretty standard mono black stuff. Here I'll talk about some of the less popular choices
Geth, Lord of the Vault: While in many cases similar to Chainer, I like having redundancy in my deck. He also feeds the GY for more stuff, and unlike Chainer, the reanimation is permanent. He quickly takes over a game, especially against an open board. Also, I love me some fatties. Until recently, I had Grave Titan in my list, just because I think that sometimes you need to cast big creatures with broken abilites.
Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief: This may not be an optimal slot, but I absolutely love this card. It always evokes memories of destroying ROE drafts, and is a card that screams "EDH" to me. Drana is also a great mana sink, and is good at picking off utility creatures/commanders.
Erebos, God of the Dead: This is a card I'm still on the fence about. It is a decent card advantage engine, an ok global enchantment, and sometimes a good creature. Seperately, those effects aren't worth the slot, but together they probably are. It is pretty hilarious dropping Erebos t4 against Oloro.
Bloodline Keeper: Fairly cheap army in a can - creates early blockers and sac fodder.
Steel Hellkite: I like having atleast a roundabout way to deal with non-creatures, but in practice this usually dies before It gets to connect more than once or twice. Still, you gotta get your removal somehow, and Karn usually doesn't last past the turn you cast him.
Bone Shredder V. Shriekmaw: I like that Boneshredder automatically goes to the gy. Makes it easier to recur with Chainer.
Hero's Downfall: I like having atleast one catchall removal spell. It's nice that it also hits pws.
Diabolic Tutor: This card is borderline. Four is a lot for a tutor, but what pushes it over the edge is the ability to be transmuted to with Dimir House Guard. Turning your 4cmc tutor into a tutor for anything has proven to be useful.
Rise of the Dark Realms: This is EDH - Sometimes you just gotta cast 9 mana sorceries.
Yawgmoth's Will: As broken as this card can be in certain decks, usually I end up using it as regrowth for my coffers + extra value on my early plays/tutors.
Necropotence: This card makes me feel so evil when I use it. Really makes you wonder what Wizards was thinking back in the day.
Liliana of the Dark Realms: Another borderline card, but Lilli is a pretty unthreatening pw that feeds a mana hungry deck, and sometimes acts as spot removal.
Pristine Talisman: Not the best mana rock, but offsetting some of the many sources of life loss is nice.
Volrath's Stronghold: Just picked up one of these the other day, and as expected, it is insane. Draws just as many acidic slimes as coffers does.
Wishlist/Cards on my Radar:
Phyrexian Reclamation - I really want to try this card out, but my LGS is out, and I really don't feel like buying one of the precons for a dollar card.
Crucible of Worlds/Black fetches - If I had the fetches, I would run crucible, but it is hard to justify buying pricey fetches just for a niche use, especially in a mono black list
Grim Tutor/Imperial Seal - A man can dream, right?
Gray Merchant of Asphodel/Nythkos, Shrine to Nyx - These two are laziness more than anything. If I were to add merchant, however, I would keep Kokusho in. I am a big proponent of having redundancy in your combos, as evidenced by having both Fleshbag Marauder and Slum Reaper in my deck.
Toxic Deluge: Mentioned it earlier, but variable wrath effect that gets around indesctructible for 3 mana sounds good to me. Life is a resourcce and should be used accordingly, as any mono black player knows.
Beseech the Queen: This card seems good until you realize that it's just a one mana cheaper version of Diabolic Tutor with a restriction. Still might give it a shot.
So anyways, that's my take on Chainer. Any thoughts, comments, and feedback would be greatly appreciated!