Hey guys. So i've been playing Zur recently and, while very competitive, it just isn't very.... fun. It plays the same game every time and while very good, I'm bored and want something new to play. So I thought Radha, Heir to Keld was a perfect choice for commander. I love turning creatures sideways.
While the deck is designed to be fun for me, it is also designed to be very competitive. Land destruction is not the most loved strategy, but it wins. Radha provides good colours for the best LD spells, and allows reliable acceleration into them to allow for a consistent turn three mana denial plan.
Before anybody mentions banlist problems, i'm running off my local banlist, which allows a lot more than the French banlist. Here's the banlist for those that are interested: http://www.nextlevelgames.com.au/2013/05/01/99bossrules/
So this deck focuses pretty heavily on the mana disruption plan. My meta is very greedy when it comes to three colour generals, so this is a very viable plan. I realise i am missing a few key cards though, such as Blood Moon and MotM, TecEdge and Ghost Quarter, as well as a few agressive one drops (Goblin Guide an the likes) although advice on how many and which one drops to run would be greatly appreciated.
I'm not playing a usual all-in aggressive Radha deck, this is a bit more controlling, with lots of creatures and LD. The damage just accumulates slowly turn by turn and eventually i build up enough of a board to run the opponent over. Individual match-ups will come, as i test our against different decks.
Any advice on cuts and additions are welcome though. I'm always happy to admit my deck isn't perfect.
I tried running more LD, but i just found that with more, the deck lacked answers to threats other decks might drop. Removal is lacking in these colours as it is.
I'm not a huge fan of Charmbreaker Devils. It seems kinda..... forced. So far, I've found that the beats just happen. Destroy their land, and they have a very empty board for a lot of the game. This usually means open swings for Radha or 'Goyf for Thrun.
Terravore is an obvious one. I can't believe i forgot that. He'll be going right in.
Hua Tuo..... I'm not sold. I can see how he would be good, but this deck doesn't really care about losing creatures. Although it does give more graveyard shenanigans.... I'll test him out. Could be good.
Thanks for the response, would love to see your decklist to compare.
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Barring no interest in MW, you could also play an artifact ramp heavy version of Thraximundar with all of the same spells included. Yawgmoth's Bargain is legal in your format, and its so good I almost feel it makes Thraximundar a better choice than MW.
If you're set on Radha, I would find room for Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, which is an easy way to end a game when combined with any enter the battlefield - destroy a land creature. This deck also needs Harmonize to restock up on LD cards.
Birthing Pod is also without question an absolutely necessary addition.
I would second Fluxuate's suggestion of MW as your best bet for MLD.dec, especially when broken artifact mana makes him easily a turn faster than French. It lets you take advantage of Wildfire-type cards which also wipe the board. I think this deck could get in a pickle if your opponent manages to land a threat under your LD and you're stuck with a grip of Stone Rains. Much better to play a bunch of low-curve beats and finish off with Boom//Bust style cards. If you go that route, definitely consider Winter Orb (not on that abomination of a banlist) and Tangle Wire. Actually, consider Tangle Wire regardless, especially once you add some more cheap beats
I think I would avoid GG if you want to stick with targeted LD. Giving your opponent free card advantage (and the very resource you're trying to deny) isn't worth it in this instance. Maybe Kird Ape? I would also suggest Tin Street Holligan as an aggressive 2-drop, especially in a format where Sol Ring is legal.
Speaking of which, I would still play Zur in a tournament setting, especially with that banlist. LD isn't exactly any more endearing to your opponents, and you're playing in a banlist where Necropotence is legal, which ain't a bad Zur target. Actually, that whole banlist is kinda mind-boggling. I guess I can kind of understand Emrakul being banned if you have access to crypt/sol/vault, but that indicates to me that the rocks should be banned, not Emmy. And ****ing Bargain AND necropotence? I'm not trying to talk down to your shop's format, but are games balanced at all? I'm looking at that Sharuum decktech and just imagining turn 1 wurmcoils and turn 2 blightsteels. Workshop, metalworker, fast mana... also, still looking at his list, Mind Twist in a format with access to that much fast mana? Who thought this was a good idea?
Actually, I really think you need to go back to the drawing board. Stone rain.dec is just not going to be fast enough in that format. I mean, you can Crucible+fastbond in that format with a fetch and pump out 10 lands for a paltry 20 life. You can do that turn 1. The availability of broken plays like that really screw with what you're trying to accomplish here.
I mean, you can Crucible+fastbond in that format with a fetch and pump out 10 lands for a paltry 20 life. You can do that turn 1. The availability of broken plays like that really screw with what you're trying to accomplish here.
My meta is fast. But every single deck is fast. With the right build, Zur can be a consistent turn three play. But lets be realistic here. 10 lands turn one? God hand. One game in a million. And if that happens, I scoop and admit that it was just TOO good. However, like I said. Every deck is fast. I'm still missing Fastbond, Mana Crypt, Sol Ring (which is in there now. YAY!), Mox Diamond, Domri for CA, Pod for tutors, and more. I plan to make this a fast deck. It's just not quite there yet. But we'll get there. Eventually.
Speaking of which, I would still play Zur in a tournament setting, especially with that banlist.
Zur will still be my go to deck until this is optimized. It's so good in this format. Necropotence, Bitterblossom, Vanishing, Pemmin's. That combination of cards will beat almost everything bar MW, and there's a 15 card sideboard for that.
Heartwood Storyteller seems extremely out of place
Decimate (How often are all 4 permanent types controlled by your opponent?)
Lava Blister (Giving your opponent the choice almost always makes a card bad - especially in a format with 30 life)
Price of Progress (a sweet card, but counterintuitive in a land destruction deck)
Heartwood Storyteller has already been replaced. I agree, it wasn't great. However it seems like a good sideboard card against a counterspell heavy deck. Wydwen is the deck to beat in our meta.
Decimate is a house! I definitely can see why I shouldn't play it, but the pros definitely outweigh the cons at this stage.
Lava Blister i agree with and is out as well. The choice was too easy. And the 6 life was nice, but not enough to warrant a spot.
Price of Progress holds the same fate as Heartwood Storyteller; the sideboard. Three colour decks hate to see it. I hate to see it against anything less than three colours.
I made some extra changes to the deck. Added a few more creatures, as i found my creature count was a bit lacking. I took out a few LD spells because I found i was either getting too many per game and not enough threats to finish, or not enough and they got around my sub-par threats. So i've fixed that and in testing against Rafiq and Glissa, it comes up about even. So more testing is needed.
Anyway, changes I've made so far:
-1 Dwarven Miner
-1 Ravenous Baboons
-1 Annihilating Fire
-1 Molten Rain
-1 Boom // Bust
-1 Scorched Earth
-1 Deus of Calamity
+1 Life from the Loam
+1 Domri Rade
+1 Thundermaw Hellkite
+1 Mistcutter Hydra
+1 Stromkirk Noble
+1 Birds of Paradise
+1 Terravore
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Hey matt, I agree with most of your choices so far, but here are a few I would have made:
I would still play price of progress mainboard, as most of the decks down at nlg are 3 colour and it screws up all the good two colour decks (such as geist) and leaves you with at least one of your colours still accessible.
I would also cut deus of calamity as it really isn't that good. 99% of the time its just a 6/6 with trample for 5 r/g and is extremely underwhelming. Perhaps replace him with Flametongue Kavu or Thragtusk?
Another thing to note is that now you no longer run Scorched Earth so 39 lands is very excessive. Try 34 or 35 lands.
Also consider playing Worldly Tutor since you have few tutors in the deck.
But other than those things the deck list looks pretty solid! Keep me posted on the progress of the deck and its match-ups (unless the game was against me :P)
_______________________________________________
Current Decks: GW Gaddock Teeg (Duel Commander Variant) GW BBB Mono Black Control (Pauper) BBB
GENERATION 16: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. social experiment.
_______________________________________________
Current Decks: GW Gaddock Teeg (Duel Commander Variant) GW BBB Mono Black Control (Pauper) BBB
GENERATION 16: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. social experiment.
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Weiss Schwarz Sets
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
This is the first time I've seen a list posted using ADC rules, is the format popular?
The format is still small, but it is growing really quickly. Tournaments have been running once a month for only a few months. Have you played the format?
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While the deck is designed to be fun for me, it is also designed to be very competitive. Land destruction is not the most loved strategy, but it wins. Radha provides good colours for the best LD spells, and allows reliable acceleration into them to allow for a consistent turn three mana denial plan.
Before anybody mentions banlist problems, i'm running off my local banlist, which allows a lot more than the French banlist. Here's the banlist for those that are interested: http://www.nextlevelgames.com.au/2013/05/01/99bossrules/
Without further ado, heres my Radha decklist.
1 Radha, Heir to Keld
Creatures (27)
1 Experiment One
1 Grim Lavamancer
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Stromkirk Noble
1 Tarmogoyf
1 Orchish Settlers
1 Vexing Shusher
1 Dwarven Blastminer
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Flinthoof Boar
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Stormblood Berserker
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Lotus Cobra
1 Eternal Witness
1 Goblin Ruinblaster
1 Terravore
1 Hellrider
1 Ghor-Clan Rampager
1 Vengevine
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Avalanche Riders
1 Bloodbraid Elf
1 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Acidic Slime
1 Thundermaw Hellkite
1 Inferno Titan
1 Mistcutter Hydra
Planeswalker (1):
1 Xenagos, the Reveler
1 Domri Rade
Enchantments (2):
1 Shivan Harvest
1 Sylvan Library
Artifacts (4):
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sol Ring
1 Skullclamp
Instants (10):
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Magma Jet
1 Beast Within
1 Worldly Tutor
1 Searing Spear
1 Price of Progress
1 Magma Spray
1 Crop Rotation
1 Lightning Strike
Sorceries (16):
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Life from the Loam
1 Raze
1 Mwonvuli Acid Moss
1 Flame Slash
1 Pillage
1 Ice Storm
1 Wreak Havoc
1 Stone Rain
1 Winter's Grasp
1 Decimate
1 Hull Breach
1 Regrowth
1 Thermokarst
12 Mountains
9 Forests
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Taiga
1 Stomping Ground
1 Command Tower
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Arid Mesa
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Wasteland
1 Dust Bowl
1 Treetop Village
1 Barbarian Ring
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Dryad Arbor
So this deck focuses pretty heavily on the mana disruption plan. My meta is very greedy when it comes to three colour generals, so this is a very viable plan. I realise i am missing a few key cards though, such as Blood Moon and MotM, TecEdge and Ghost Quarter, as well as a few agressive one drops (Goblin Guide an the likes) although advice on how many and which one drops to run would be greatly appreciated.
I'm not playing a usual all-in aggressive Radha deck, this is a bit more controlling, with lots of creatures and LD. The damage just accumulates slowly turn by turn and eventually i build up enough of a board to run the opponent over. Individual match-ups will come, as i test our against different decks.
Any advice on cuts and additions are welcome though. I'm always happy to admit my deck isn't perfect.
I'm not a huge fan of Charmbreaker Devils. It seems kinda..... forced. So far, I've found that the beats just happen. Destroy their land, and they have a very empty board for a lot of the game. This usually means open swings for Radha or 'Goyf for Thrun.
Terravore is an obvious one. I can't believe i forgot that. He'll be going right in.
Hua Tuo..... I'm not sold. I can see how he would be good, but this deck doesn't really care about losing creatures. Although it does give more graveyard shenanigans.... I'll test him out. Could be good.
Thanks for the response, would love to see your decklist to compare.
You'll get MW early super consistently (I would even run Trinket Mage to tutor the busted artifact ramp cards), and then can cascade into goodies like Wildfire / Destructive Force / Devastation / Upheaval / Rite of Ruin
Barring no interest in MW, you could also play an artifact ramp heavy version of Thraximundar with all of the same spells included. Yawgmoth's Bargain is legal in your format, and its so good I almost feel it makes Thraximundar a better choice than MW.
If you're set on Radha, I would find room for Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, which is an easy way to end a game when combined with any enter the battlefield - destroy a land creature. This deck also needs Harmonize to restock up on LD cards.
Birthing Pod is also without question an absolutely necessary addition.
Cards I would cut:
Heartwood Storyteller seems extremely out of place
Decimate (How often are all 4 permanent types controlled by your opponent?)
Lava Blister (Giving your opponent the choice almost always makes a card bad - especially in a format with 30 life)
Price of Progress (a sweet card, but counterintuitive in a land destruction deck)
I think I would avoid GG if you want to stick with targeted LD. Giving your opponent free card advantage (and the very resource you're trying to deny) isn't worth it in this instance. Maybe Kird Ape? I would also suggest Tin Street Holligan as an aggressive 2-drop, especially in a format where Sol Ring is legal.
Speaking of which, I would still play Zur in a tournament setting, especially with that banlist. LD isn't exactly any more endearing to your opponents, and you're playing in a banlist where Necropotence is legal, which ain't a bad Zur target. Actually, that whole banlist is kinda mind-boggling. I guess I can kind of understand Emrakul being banned if you have access to crypt/sol/vault, but that indicates to me that the rocks should be banned, not Emmy. And ****ing Bargain AND necropotence? I'm not trying to talk down to your shop's format, but are games balanced at all? I'm looking at that Sharuum decktech and just imagining turn 1 wurmcoils and turn 2 blightsteels. Workshop, metalworker, fast mana... also, still looking at his list, Mind Twist in a format with access to that much fast mana? Who thought this was a good idea?
Actually, I really think you need to go back to the drawing board. Stone rain.dec is just not going to be fast enough in that format. I mean, you can Crucible+fastbond in that format with a fetch and pump out 10 lands for a paltry 20 life. You can do that turn 1. The availability of broken plays like that really screw with what you're trying to accomplish here.
My meta is fast. But every single deck is fast. With the right build, Zur can be a consistent turn three play. But lets be realistic here. 10 lands turn one? God hand. One game in a million. And if that happens, I scoop and admit that it was just TOO good. However, like I said. Every deck is fast. I'm still missing Fastbond, Mana Crypt, Sol Ring (which is in there now. YAY!), Mox Diamond, Domri for CA, Pod for tutors, and more. I plan to make this a fast deck. It's just not quite there yet. But we'll get there. Eventually.
Zur will still be my go to deck until this is optimized. It's so good in this format. Necropotence, Bitterblossom, Vanishing, Pemmin's. That combination of cards will beat almost everything bar MW, and there's a 15 card sideboard for that.
I really appreciate the insight though.
Heartwood Storyteller has already been replaced. I agree, it wasn't great. However it seems like a good sideboard card against a counterspell heavy deck. Wydwen is the deck to beat in our meta.
Decimate is a house! I definitely can see why I shouldn't play it, but the pros definitely outweigh the cons at this stage.
Lava Blister i agree with and is out as well. The choice was too easy. And the 6 life was nice, but not enough to warrant a spot.
Price of Progress holds the same fate as Heartwood Storyteller; the sideboard. Three colour decks hate to see it. I hate to see it against anything less than three colours.
I have made some changes outside these.
Out:
-1 Llanowar Elves
-1 Birds of Paradise
-1 Seismic Spike
-1 Heartwood Storyteller
-1 Lava Blister
-1 Hero of Oxid Ridge
-1 Forest
+1 Sol Ring
+1 Lightning Strike
+1 Annihilating Fire
+1 Stormbreath Dragon
+1 Skullclamp
+1 Grim Lavamancer
+1 Command Tower
Other cards I'm considering removing at this stage:
-Price to Progress
-Wreak Havoc
-Stormblood Berserker
-Vexing Shusher
Anyway, loving the suggestions so far. Keep 'em coming guys.
Anyway, changes I've made so far:
-1 Dwarven Miner
-1 Ravenous Baboons
-1 Annihilating Fire
-1 Molten Rain
-1 Boom // Bust
-1 Scorched Earth
-1 Deus of Calamity
+1 Life from the Loam
+1 Domri Rade
+1 Thundermaw Hellkite
+1 Mistcutter Hydra
+1 Stromkirk Noble
+1 Birds of Paradise
+1 Terravore
I would still play price of progress mainboard, as most of the decks down at nlg are 3 colour and it screws up all the good two colour decks (such as geist) and leaves you with at least one of your colours still accessible.
I would also cut deus of calamity as it really isn't that good. 99% of the time its just a 6/6 with trample for 5 r/g and is extremely underwhelming. Perhaps replace him with Flametongue Kavu or Thragtusk?
You are also missing some great cards that are within your colours, and you may not be running enough creatures. Cards such as Boggart Ram-Gang,Zealous Conscripts, Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker and Imperial Recruiter all provide excellent tempo whilst still keeping the mana curve relatively low, especially Imperial Recruiter and Kiki-Jiki since they can tutor for or copy your ETB land destruction creatures.
Another thing to note is that now you no longer run Scorched Earth so 39 lands is very excessive. Try 34 or 35 lands.
Also consider playing Worldly Tutor since you have few tutors in the deck.
But other than those things the deck list looks pretty solid! Keep me posted on the progress of the deck and its match-ups (unless the game was against me :P)
Current Decks:
GW Gaddock Teeg (Duel Commander Variant) GW
BBB Mono Black Control (Pauper) BBB
GENERATION 16: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. social experiment.
Current Decks:
GW Gaddock Teeg (Duel Commander Variant) GW
BBB Mono Black Control (Pauper) BBB
GENERATION 16: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. social experiment.
Main Decks
Diaochan, Iroas, God of Victory, Kaalia, Marton, Ulasht, Volrath,
Kaervek, Prossh, Titania
Amusing or Themed
Progenitus
Pauper Guildmages
Azorius Boros Dimir Golgari Gruul Izzet Korozda
Orzhov Rakdos Rix Maadi Selesyna Simic Skarrg Zameck
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
Wixoss - Just trial decks for now!
The format is still small, but it is growing really quickly. Tournaments have been running once a month for only a few months. Have you played the format?