The goal is to design a goblin deck that plays similar to legacy merfolk. Naturally, the sort of one-for-one tempo play typical of merfolk doesn't play well in EDH. Instead this deck uses disruptive elements to slow down the opponent. The deck is intended to have an explosive burst in the early game (often with Goblin Recruiter + Goblin Ringleader), gun down 1-2 opponents out of the gate, then use draw to refuel the hand and do it all again.
Card choice notes
Why Patron of the Akki instead of Krenko or Kiki-Jiki? I believe Patron gives the deck more longevity. Krenko and Kiki both scream "kill me or I'll combo off!" so Patron is a much less threatening general. Also, Krenko and Kiki are great when my board is fairly established, but often when my board is established I'm in a dominant position anyway. Post-wipe when my hand is empty, I like to drop Patron and have either a fat blocker or a three-turn clock. Plus, Patron makes it less risky to alpha strike because I can flash him in to block. That said, Kiki should probably be somewhere in the 99 but I can't figure out where to fit him in.
Thran Foundry: Both graveyard removal, and a way to get Goblin Recruiter and its targets back into my deck after use.
Lands and Curve: I'm running with a very low land count so I can keep up a density of threats. My curve is a bit higher than I'd like it to be but that's because I have so many quality 3- and 4-drops. Currently considering the cycling lands and Valakut, but since my deck is aggressive and full of wheel effects, CIPT is a big drawback for me.
Deck Weaknesses: The deck is very light on removal. Ideally I want removal that can double as threats and/or is tutorable off goblin tutors, but obviously that is rare. Also, lack of reach can be an issue and I'm currently considering ways to incorporate more burn.
Other card considerations
Winter Orb, Boom - to cement a dominant board state, but may be unpopular Mass Mutiny - goodstuff inclusion, helps clear troublesome blockers; its big bro Insurrection is too high-CC and too easy-win for me Ruby Medallion, Urza's Incubator - often better than mana rocks for explosiveness but doesn't help ramp into artifacts Burn at the Stake, Lightning Crafter - reach Goblin Sharpshooter - insane or useless depending on what the table looks like Ward of Bones - keeps opponents stuck at 6 but doesn't help vs ramp, plus won't reliably come down t6 Scroll Rack - big draw, but mana-intensive & my deck is light on shuffle effects Geosurge / Seething Song - for the Wheel or Recruiter turns Goblin Lookout - insane with tokens, bad otherwise
This deck is currently early in the tuning stage, so any advice or suggestions are appreciated.
Ruby Medallion is actually too good to pass up in this instance, since your spells are going to be cheap anyways, giving you access to really bomby spells much earlier then they should be, so you can be a bit more reactive towards things.
Pyrewild Shaman in this deck is OK at best, though it will be consistent, getting a minor bonus when say you have such effects like Caged Sun and Gauntlet of Power active pretty much just makes this a additional pump, I'd consider replacing it with either the ridculousness of Goblin Sharpshooter or just use Geosurge in it's place since you're lacking a bit on the curve, you've got a crazy start with 1/2/3 drops, then your 4 drop department looks a little weak here.
Another consideration for a mass MP game is probably Blasphemous Act since there's gonna be lots of great creatures to nuke, it pretty much does anything you want it to while giving your guys a great strike point, if you want to take the tokens route Eldrazi Monument or Akroma's Memorial is sorta a must here, since evasion is sorta super critical in the late game, since a lot of the best blockers do have evasion, but Pro Red/Black, first strike, flying, haste and trample are a lot more relevant then anything else here.
Hope it helps.
Also, another card to consider Vicious Shadows lots of stuff is going to be dying in EDH, this is sorta a must have, just saying, you can always get away with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker in the deck as one of the 99 as well, for value.
Yo, thanks for the advice. I'm thinking I'm gonna swap that Pyrewild Shaman for the sharpshooter and Caged Sun for Ruby Medallion; should make the deck a little faster. I may swap Zo-Zu the Punisher for Akroma's Memorial, he's definitely on my cutting block since he makes people target me, but Memorial is hard to cast for this deck so I'm not 100% on it.
Yo, thanks for the advice. I'm thinking I'm gonna swap that Pyrewild Shaman for the sharpshooter and Caged Sun for Ruby Medallion; should make the deck a little faster. I may swap Zo-Zu the Punisher for Akroma's Memorial, he's definitely on my cutting block since he makes people target me, but Memorial is hard to cast for this deck so I'm not 100% on it.
I'd actually consider Gauntlet of Might in Zo-Zu's place, it boosts you and you only, only problem is, it's super money intensive for a actual copy, so instead of Memorial, try Eldrazi Monument you can make enough creatures to support it without it being a hinderance.
Also, if you really want Kiki-Jiki in the 99, try cutting Manabarbs for it, that's also gonna get you targeted badly.
Is Marton Stromgald not a superior buff over this general? I see him in the deck, just curious why you passed on him as the commander.
Quote from dorino »
I was thinking the same thing, actually.
Stromgald's buff is way better, yes. I like Patron because he's more unassuming, nobody plays him, and he's nice to have when you're in post-wrath mode. I'm still fairly new to playing aggro, and I have a bit of a fear of overextending like heck so I can kil one dude fast, and then have the rest of the table wipe me out before I have time to stabilize.
My current cards I'm thinking about: Imperial Recruiter, since it can fetch so much stuff in this deck, it's not funny, and as I'm a judge it'll be easier to pick up than most "money" cards... Gauntlet of Might also great if I can find one at ~$60-$70, who knows, I might get lucky and I want an upgrade to Caged Sun.
Stromgald's buff is way better, yes. I like Patron because he's more unassuming, nobody plays him, and he's nice to have when you're in post-wrath mode. I'm still fairly new to playing aggro, and I have a bit of a fear of overextending like heck so I can kil one dude fast, and then have the rest of the table wipe me out before I have time to stabilize.
My current cards I'm thinking about: Imperial Recruiter, since it can fetch so much stuff in this deck, it's not funny, and as I'm a judge it'll be easier to pick up than most "money" cards... Gauntlet of Might also great if I can find one at ~$60-$70, who knows, I might get lucky and I want an upgrade to Caged Sun.
Two things: 1) Marton should kill the whole table if you have enough tokens out. 2) Recruiter is awesome in mono red, the caged sun and gauntlets have let me put out like 30 tokens a turn before.
The reason nobody plays Patron is because he's bad at what he does versus other options. I would definitely say Marton's better as the general.
Marton is crazy good. I might try running with him as a general for a bit. But I'm so attached to my awful, unpopular Kamigawa legend I would like to make him playable, if possible at all...
If you want to play Patron just because, nothing's stopping you.
Well, our meta has a surprising lack of red, which is weird, the only mono red deck besides Patron is Zirlian of the Claw, which another dude owns but hardly ever sees play so the lack of red is actually big, the majority of the meta we play at has BUG and Esper decks with Sharuum and Mimeoplasm being top tier as per the norm.
Well, our meta has a surprising lack of red, which is weird, the only mono red deck besides Patron is Zirlian of the Claw, which another dude owns but hardly ever sees play so the lack of red is actually big, the majority of the meta we play at has BUG and Esper decks with Sharuum and Mimeoplasm being top tier as per the norm.
Our regular players have multiple Ruhan decks, plus Stonebrow and Boborygmos, but yeah, red is the least played color and there are no frequently-played mono-red decks. I think that's pretty common in EDH metas, though.
I know Marton, Krenko, and Norin (ugh) decks have shown up at our store before, which is part of the reason I'd rather go for an underplayed general. But it actually is a good idea to swap Marton in as my general if I need more power, because I was actually thinking of doing the same with Krenko and using Marton makes more sense
So I played this a bit more for a while. Faster than I thought it would be -- I managed to win an entire game off two lands and a Brightstone Ritual at one point. I've noticed that I rarely cast the top of my curve, but I like the fast start so much, I would rather move the curve down.
The more I play with Patron of the Akki, the more I like him. His effect isn't as powerful as Krenko's or Marton's but being able to cheat in an early Siege-Gang Commander or Goblin Marshal and cast Patron off it is a sweet play.
Just got a Kiki-Jiki, seems sweet. Mana cost is a little high but with my lords, tutors, and token-creators it is a value card with anything in the deck. (Although I'm not doing combo with it since I would rather beat down with gobbos the old-fashioned way.)
Stuff I can't wait to get a hold of: Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx; Purphoros, God of the Forge; and judge foil Imperial Recruiter. I want to make Skirk Prospector work too, but I can't tell the feasibility of using it. Oh, and I reluctantly took my proxied Beetleback Chieftain out since it's the only proxy in my deck... it's a $1 card, but I can't seem to find a copy in the whole dang country.
1x Patron of the Akki
Beaters
1x Anger
1x Bloodmark Mentor
1x Countryside Crusher
1x Goblin Assault
1x Goblin Bushwhacker
1x Goblin Chieftain
1x Goblin General
1x Goblin King
1x Goblin Lackey
1x Goblin Marshal
1x Goblin Matron
1x Goblin Piledriver
1x Goblin Recruiter
1x Goblin Ringleader
1x Goblin Warchief
1x Goblin Wardriver
1x Hellraiser Goblin
1x Hellrider
1x Kiki-Jiki, Mirror-Breaker
1x Krenko, Mob Boss
1x Legion Loyalist
1x Marton Stromgald
1x Mogg War Marshal
1x Moggcatcher
1x Ogre Battledriver
1x Siege-Gang Commander
1x Taurean Mauler
1x Warren Instigator
1x Coat of Arms
1x Door of Destinies
1x Eldrazi Monument
1x Lightning Greaves
1x Mercadia's Downfall
1x Shared Animosity
Burn
1x Burning Earth
1x Manabarbs
1x Mass Mutiny
1x Price of Progress
Disruption/Removal
1x Blood Moon
1x Chaos Warp
1x Falter
1x Gempalm Incinerator
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
1x Magus of the Moon
1x Price of Glory
1x Stranglehold
1x Thran Foundry
1x Tuktuk Scrapper
Draw
1x Faithless Looting
1x Gamble
1x Memory Jar
1x Reforge the Soul
1x Sensation Gorger
1x Skullclamp
1x Wheel of Fortune
1x Battle Hymn
1x Brightstone Ritual
1x Fire Diamond
1x Gauntlet of Power
1x Mana Echoes
1x Mind Stone
1x Ruby Medallion
1x Sol Ring
34x Mountain
1x Cavern of Souls
1x Mutavault
The goal is to design a goblin deck that plays similar to legacy merfolk. Naturally, the sort of one-for-one tempo play typical of merfolk doesn't play well in EDH. Instead this deck uses disruptive elements to slow down the opponent. The deck is intended to have an explosive burst in the early game (often with Goblin Recruiter + Goblin Ringleader), gun down 1-2 opponents out of the gate, then use draw to refuel the hand and do it all again.
Card choice notes
Why Patron of the Akki instead of Krenko or Kiki-Jiki? I believe Patron gives the deck more longevity. Krenko and Kiki both scream "kill me or I'll combo off!" so Patron is a much less threatening general. Also, Krenko and Kiki are great when my board is fairly established, but often when my board is established I'm in a dominant position anyway. Post-wipe when my hand is empty, I like to drop Patron and have either a fat blocker or a three-turn clock. Plus, Patron makes it less risky to alpha strike because I can flash him in to block. That said, Kiki should probably be somewhere in the 99 but I can't figure out where to fit him in.
Thran Foundry: Both graveyard removal, and a way to get Goblin Recruiter and its targets back into my deck after use.
Lands and Curve: I'm running with a very low land count so I can keep up a density of threats. My curve is a bit higher than I'd like it to be but that's because I have so many quality 3- and 4-drops. Currently considering the cycling lands and Valakut, but since my deck is aggressive and full of wheel effects, CIPT is a big drawback for me.
Deck Weaknesses: The deck is very light on removal. Ideally I want removal that can double as threats and/or is tutorable off goblin tutors, but obviously that is rare. Also, lack of reach can be an issue and I'm currently considering ways to incorporate more burn.
Other card considerations
Winter Orb, Boom - to cement a dominant board state, but may be unpopular
Mass Mutiny - goodstuff inclusion, helps clear troublesome blockers; its big bro Insurrection is too high-CC and too easy-win for me
Ruby Medallion, Urza's Incubator - often better than mana rocks for explosiveness but doesn't help ramp into artifacts
Burn at the Stake, Lightning Crafter - reach
Goblin Sharpshooter - insane or useless depending on what the table looks like
Ward of Bones - keeps opponents stuck at 6 but doesn't help vs ramp, plus won't reliably come down t6
Scroll Rack - big draw, but mana-intensive & my deck is light on shuffle effects
Geosurge / Seething Song - for the Wheel or Recruiter turns
Goblin Lookout - insane with tokens, bad otherwise
This deck is currently early in the tuning stage, so any advice or suggestions are appreciated.
Pyrewild Shaman in this deck is OK at best, though it will be consistent, getting a minor bonus when say you have such effects like Caged Sun and Gauntlet of Power active pretty much just makes this a additional pump, I'd consider replacing it with either the ridculousness of Goblin Sharpshooter or just use Geosurge in it's place since you're lacking a bit on the curve, you've got a crazy start with 1/2/3 drops, then your 4 drop department looks a little weak here.
Another consideration for a mass MP game is probably Blasphemous Act since there's gonna be lots of great creatures to nuke, it pretty much does anything you want it to while giving your guys a great strike point, if you want to take the tokens route Eldrazi Monument or Akroma's Memorial is sorta a must here, since evasion is sorta super critical in the late game, since a lot of the best blockers do have evasion, but Pro Red/Black, first strike, flying, haste and trample are a lot more relevant then anything else here.
Hope it helps.
Also, another card to consider Vicious Shadows lots of stuff is going to be dying in EDH, this is sorta a must have, just saying, you can always get away with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker in the deck as one of the 99 as well, for value.
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I'd actually consider Gauntlet of Might in Zo-Zu's place, it boosts you and you only, only problem is, it's super money intensive for a actual copy, so instead of Memorial, try Eldrazi Monument you can make enough creatures to support it without it being a hinderance.
Also, if you really want Kiki-Jiki in the 99, try cutting Manabarbs for it, that's also gonna get you targeted badly.
EDH:1 vs 1
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It's not even that good with tokens.
I was thinking the same thing, actually.
Stromgald's buff is way better, yes. I like Patron because he's more unassuming, nobody plays him, and he's nice to have when you're in post-wrath mode. I'm still fairly new to playing aggro, and I have a bit of a fear of overextending like heck so I can kil one dude fast, and then have the rest of the table wipe me out before I have time to stabilize.
My current cards I'm thinking about: Imperial Recruiter, since it can fetch so much stuff in this deck, it's not funny, and as I'm a judge it'll be easier to pick up than most "money" cards... Gauntlet of Might also great if I can find one at ~$60-$70, who knows, I might get lucky and I want an upgrade to Caged Sun.
Two things: 1) Marton should kill the whole table if you have enough tokens out. 2) Recruiter is awesome in mono red, the caged sun and gauntlets have let me put out like 30 tokens a turn before.
Marton is crazy good. I might try running with him as a general for a bit. But I'm so attached to my awful, unpopular Kamigawa legend I would like to make him playable, if possible at all...
Well, our meta has a surprising lack of red, which is weird, the only mono red deck besides Patron is Zirlian of the Claw, which another dude owns but hardly ever sees play so the lack of red is actually big, the majority of the meta we play at has BUG and Esper decks with Sharuum and Mimeoplasm being top tier as per the norm.
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Our regular players have multiple Ruhan decks, plus Stonebrow and Boborygmos, but yeah, red is the least played color and there are no frequently-played mono-red decks. I think that's pretty common in EDH metas, though.
I know Marton, Krenko, and Norin (ugh) decks have shown up at our store before, which is part of the reason I'd rather go for an underplayed general. But it actually is a good idea to swap Marton in as my general if I need more power, because I was actually thinking of doing the same with Krenko and using Marton makes more sense
The more I play with Patron of the Akki, the more I like him. His effect isn't as powerful as Krenko's or Marton's but being able to cheat in an early Siege-Gang Commander or Goblin Marshal and cast Patron off it is a sweet play.
Just got a Kiki-Jiki, seems sweet. Mana cost is a little high but with my lords, tutors, and token-creators it is a value card with anything in the deck. (Although I'm not doing combo with it since I would rather beat down with gobbos the old-fashioned way.)
Stuff I can't wait to get a hold of: Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx; Purphoros, God of the Forge; and judge foil Imperial Recruiter. I want to make Skirk Prospector work too, but I can't tell the feasibility of using it. Oh, and I reluctantly took my proxied Beetleback Chieftain out since it's the only proxy in my deck... it's a $1 card, but I can't seem to find a copy in the whole dang country.
1 Beetleback Chieftain
1 Slate of Ancestry
1 Caged Sun
1 Zo-Zu the Punisher
1 Rage Reflection
1 Bottled Cloister
1 Pyrewild Shaman
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror-Breaker
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Battle Hymn
1 Eldrazi Monument
1 Ruby Medallion
1 Mass Mutiny
1 Goblin Lackey