I've been putting together a theoretical Teysa deck. I've played a few matches online with some friends, and it's done fairly well. It functions on two basic themes: sacrifice-recursion and token combos.
Liliana Vess: Too often, she acts as a 5 mana tutor that only puts the card on top of my library. Even Diabolic Tutor is much better than this, so we choose to run more hard tutors as opposed to a potential multi-tutor.
Wurmcoil Engine: Makes tokens, gains life, serves as a beatstick. However, the lack of evasion and real multiplayer board presence means he doesn't get a spot.
Altar of Dementia: Again, a card that I would like to put in for its combo potential. However, there are too many cards with replacement effects that would make this fairly useless (i.e. Progenitus, Guile, the Eldrazi Titans, just to name a few), so mill didn't seem as stable of a wincon as Blasting Station or Phyrexian Altar.
Necromancer's Covenant: While great graveyard hate, it only grabs the creatures. The main reason to run grave hate is for Graverobber, and it's not good enough unless we can steal it all.
Obviously, the main win conditions revolve around the Teysa + Darkest Hour combos. However, there is no shortage of beatsticks to win help us win the old-fashioned way.
Any suggestions? This is mostly a theoretical deck right now, but I'm looking to start putting together the pieces and making it a physical deck and my goto multiplayer EDH build.
Good mana curve/balance, plenty of removal for anything/everything, lots of tokens to abuse, good built-in game winning combo stuff that's useful on it's own, great manabase and utility lands, great beaters, card draw, sac outlets, recursion, you got it all covered, and I don't see a single card that I consider "sub-par".
Couple of considerations, just "maybe" stuff.
Reya - I ended up taking her out of mine (after a long time and some whining). She's so great as a game-ender with Debtor's Knell, but most of the time, the games were over before she ever came out.
Are you sure about leaving Angel of Despair out? I understand what you're saying, but I run her before Reya these days, especially since Mimic Vat hit the scene. She just destroys people with the vat.
You're very heavy on the sweepers, but I assume that's a justified meta-call. But with all you're other removal, you've got probably more than you'll ever need. You might look to making a little deck space in that area. and you've got pretty insane amounts of card draw, you could clear a little space there without losing anything, I think.
Tutors... You've got a pretty good tutoring suite anyway, but have you looked at Dimir House Guard? A sac outlet as a creature, or transmute him to fetch Grave Pact, or one of your sweepers. Or... looking at your list a little closer, Dimir Machinations might be a really good tutor in there. Doubles as disruption, fetches lots of your combo pieces, mimic vat, vindicate, or Teysa if she gets tucked. Those cards have done a lot better for me lately than Liliana.
One other thing you might consider is Necromancer's Covenant, great grave hate and lots of little black lifelinker zombies for Teysa to abuse. At this point though with the deck though, it's hard to find stuff to take out.
If you find you're wanting more mana, check out Eternal Dragon. He cycles early for land and recurs himself later as a beater (or more lands), and is a good self-recurring sac target to trigger grave pact. Darksteel Ingot and Coalition Relic are always good for extra mana accel/fixing that act as the occasional Armageddon insurance (mostly a meta call). Land Tax is always a mana bomb in multiplayer.
I'd probably sub these, and why: (but again, not that I see anything wrong with your build, it's great, this would just be my own personal prefs):
- Liliana - You can afford to trade the slow tutoring for faster and more versatile transmute cards.
- Reya - Semi wincon with others, but really late game and you've got plenty of others.
- Nevs Disk - Lots of sweepers already
- Syphon Mind - Lots of draw already, and new disruption options available.
- Conqueror's Pledge - Expensive tokens, you've got plenty of
- Day of Judgment - Lots of sweepers already
- Kjeldoran Outpost - Lots of token producers already, can use the spot to improve manabase
+ Angel of Despair - targeted anything removal, beater, wincon with vat
+ Dimir Machinations - tutoring for wincon pieces and disruption, plus Teysa recovery
+ Eternal Dragon - early mana help, beater, self-recurring sac target, armageddon insurance
+ Darksteel Ingot - accel/fixing, armageddon insurance
+ Coalition Relic - accel/fixing, armageddon insurance
+ Dimir House Guard - Sac outlet, tutor
+ Yawgmoth's Will - Game winning card advantage/recursion
+ maybe Land Tax - Massive mana ramp
I feel that this would give you much more mana and some armageddon insurance (and you do have some big mana bombs in there so lots of mana will always help), better tutoring for specific needs/answers, and another near auto-win, and even stronger beatdown options without noticeably harming your removal, draw, or token producing suites.
I have a feeling I might take out Reya for the Angel. Angel is just such a powerhouse, and I've been looking for a real way to get her back into the deck after ditching her for Archon of Justice. :/
The large amount of sweepers are mostly to make sure I hit one. This is meant to be a mass multiplayer deck (6 people or more), so I want to make sure that I hit my board wipes. While it can be detrimental to me, it's more detrimental to my opponents, oftentimes. However, I might take out some of them for a bit more mana acceleration through some artifacts.
I suppose my main reason for running board wipes is because I'm never quite sure about the meta. I want the deck to be powerful, yet flexible, since I like to take my decks to parties and play with new faces.
I might just have to cut Liliana for Machinations. That's going to do me a lot more good, since the game-winning combo revolves around Teysa, and I want to be able to dig for her, if necessary. Liliana is so often just a 5cc tutor, in which case I might as well run Diabolic. :/
I'm really like Necromancer's Covenant. Gives me yet another reason to run Graverobber in pursuit of grabbing Nighteyes and his shenanigans. However, on a second look at it, it's only creature cards. As much as I like the card, I think it's a no go.
As much as I like Yawgmoth's Will, I don't think I'll run it. I don't know that I agree with using such powerful cards against my friends. They tend to hate Spikes away from the table (though this deck has a lot of Spike cards in it). And I don't think Eternal Dragon is necessary. He recurs himself, yeah, but there's plenty of recursion already, along with plenty of beaters.
And I did consider Land Tax. But I didn't think it really had a place in the deck. This deck isn't THAT mana hungry.
My Teysa Deck packs more token producers and focuses more on her first ability. It includes Cloudstone Curio, and creatures like Marsh Flitter, Captain of the Watch, and Mobilization to keep a board presence with fewer cards invested.
I'd also consider running fewer nonbasics, and including Thawing Glaciers and Journeyer's Kite.
Note, my suggestions tend to assume a multiplayer environment, so your mileage may vary.
I've definitely considered Valor. The problem now is finding a place to stick it in.
Some of the lands you mentioned are interesting, but I don't think they're quite deserving of spots. Terrain Generator is nice in getting lands on the board, but this is EDH, where slow games reign supreme. If I have lands in hand, there's likely a problem as it is, anyways. Phyrexian Tower is a guaranteed sacrifice outlet. I'll probably try to see if I can squeeze it into the list. And Springjack Pasture feels too janky to really get a slot. :/
Spawning Pit is nice, but I don't think it would get a spot over any other sac outlet. Yeah, it makes more. So does Teysa, and in greater numbers.
I'm well aware of the power that Necropotence offers. However, I honestly like the feel of Phyrexian Arena much more. I actually like DRAWING cards, not waiting for them to come into my hand later. Necropotence just isn't my style of card, I guess.
Evangelize seems risky. However, it could be another win condition with Phyrexian Altar.
I am a big fan of Promise of Power. I've been trying to squeeze it into the list, but to no avail. I'm definitely still trying to find something to remove for it, though.
As for the mana artifacts you mentioned, I've also been looking for spots for those. And I'm assuming you meant Akroma's Vengeance, not Akroma's Wrath?
The biggest problem with Necropotence is mindslaver. I had to take it out because of this card. I also recommend playing nether traitor, since it combos with teysa and alter. I also suggest playing entomb. It has great synergy with Debtors knell, crucible of worlds, sun titan, or just to find bloodghast/traitor/reassembling skeleton.
I recently constructed this deck, with a few minor changes to take out any 40-50 some dollar cards. 90% of the cards are intact. I also purposefully added a card that whenever a player would gain life, they instead lose that much life. It is useful against a friend of mine who's deck is all about life-gain. Plus, it can be helpful in general as it stirs people away from life-link.
I played the deck physically five times, and won all five times. All five were 3 player EDH.
Game 1. Managed to draw a tutor I added that lets me search my library for X cards. I chose 2 for X and got Blasting Station and darkest hour. Did infinite damage around turn 6-7.
Game 2. Drew elspeth, controlled the game until I could make all my creatures indestructible, then won by purely beating him to death.
Game 3. (Personal favorite.) A friend on the board established himself as a threat early. It was apparent his deck was a near ramp blue deck with one of those mono-blue planeswalker commanders. He had a tutelage on the field, and solely targeted me. I had Teysa out turn 3 and put out a divinity of pride turn 5, and come my turn 6, I drew Sorin Markov, put him out, put his life total to 10, and then swung for 10 exactly. Then, against my other friend, I simply got Sun Titan to get my darkest hour back from my graveyard, and beat him to death.
Game 4. Infinite mana combo using phyrexian altar and darkest hour. I chose infinite for X on Exsanguinate and then my other friend quit. We had a good laugh about it, my friends don't get salty, and i'm very fortunate for that.
Game 5. My one friend has a commander that lets him gain 2 life a turn even while inside the command zone. He then had a card that doubles his life gain, with a divinity of pride on *his* field from his own deck. I played the card that whenever he would gain life, he loses that might life, few turns later used Sorin to put him to ten, and then used condemn on their divinity of pride.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Caves of Koilos
1 Dust Bowl
1 Fetid Heath
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Kjeldoran Outpost
1 Kor Haven
1 Marsh Flats
1 Miren, the Moaning Well
1 Mystifying Maze
1 Orzhov Basilica
7 Plains
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Scrubland
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Strip Mine
6 Swamp
1 Tainted Field
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Vesuva
1 Volrath's Stronghold
Artifacts (11):
1 Blasting Station
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Expedition Map
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Mimic Vat
1 Nevinyrral's Disk
1 Phyrexian Altar
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skullclamp
1 Sol Ring
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
Creatures (19):
1 Academy Rector
1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath
1 Angel of Despair
1 Archon of Justice
1 Bloodghast
1 Cloudgoat Ranger
1 Divinity of Pride
1 Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Geth, Lord of the Vault
1 Grave Titan
1 Karmic Guide
1 Knight-Captain of Eos
1 Necrotic Sliver
1 Nezumi Graverobber
1 Reveillark
1 Skeletal Vampire
1 Sun Titan
1 Yosei, the Morning Star
1 Bitterblossom
1 Darkest Hour
1 Debtors' Knell
1 Grave Pact
1 Mobilization
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Prison Term
Instants (5):
1 Condemn
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Mortify
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Vampiric Tutor
Planeswalkers (2):
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Sorin Markov
Sorceries (17):
1 Austere Command
1 Beacon of Unrest
1 Conqueror's Pledge
1 Decree of Pain
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Diabolic Intent
1 Dimir Machinations
1 Exsanguinate
1 Final Judgment
1 Identity Crisis
1 Martial Coup
1 Planar Cleansing
1 Profane Command
1 Spectral Procession
1 Syphon Mind
1 Vindicate
1 Wrath of God
1 Teysa, Orzhov Scion
Combos
Karmic Guide + Reveillark: I'm running White in a recursion deck. There's no reason to not run this combo.
Teysa, Orzhov Scion + Darkest Hour + Sac engine: Generates a couple combos. Darkest Hour makes all creatures Black, and sacrificing them creates more tokens to sacrifice. Cards to utilize this include Blasting Station (generates unbounded amounts of damage) and Phyrexian Altar (unbounded mana). Cards to utilize the Altar Combo include Nighteyes the Desecrator, Decree of Justice, Exsanguniate, Martial Coup, and Profane Command.
Sun Titan + Necrotic Sliver: Vindicate every turn? Yes please.
Mimic Vat: Has a few creatures that work really well with it:
And of course anything we might want to steal from our opponents.
Nezumi Graverobber + Identity Crisis/Bojuka Bog: Instant Nighteyes the Desecrator for some fun recursion effects.
Cards that didn't make the cut
Liliana Vess: Too often, she acts as a 5 mana tutor that only puts the card on top of my library. Even Diabolic Tutor is much better than this, so we choose to run more hard tutors as opposed to a potential multi-tutor.
Wurmcoil Engine: Makes tokens, gains life, serves as a beatstick. However, the lack of evasion and real multiplayer board presence means he doesn't get a spot.
Altar of Dementia: Again, a card that I would like to put in for its combo potential. However, there are too many cards with replacement effects that would make this fairly useless (i.e. Progenitus, Guile, the Eldrazi Titans, just to name a few), so mill didn't seem as stable of a wincon as Blasting Station or Phyrexian Altar.
Necromancer's Covenant: While great graveyard hate, it only grabs the creatures. The main reason to run grave hate is for Graverobber, and it's not good enough unless we can steal it all.
Changes History
-1 Reya Dawnbringer
-1 Liliana Vess
+1 Angel of Despair
+1 Dimir Machinations
Made a few changes to the deck. Reduced the number of board wipes and made the ones used more versatile (Decree of Pain, Final Judgment, Planar Cleansing).
Added Fleshbag Marauder as another Mimic Vat combo.
Added Phyrexian Tower as a land-based sac outlet.
Obviously, the main win conditions revolve around the Teysa + Darkest Hour combos. However, there is no shortage of beatsticks to win help us win the old-fashioned way.
Any suggestions? This is mostly a theoretical deck right now, but I'm looking to start putting together the pieces and making it a physical deck and my goto multiplayer EDH build.
Legacy: UB(R/G) Storm UB(R/G)
Vintage: UBG Gush Storm UBG
Good mana curve/balance, plenty of removal for anything/everything, lots of tokens to abuse, good built-in game winning combo stuff that's useful on it's own, great manabase and utility lands, great beaters, card draw, sac outlets, recursion, you got it all covered, and I don't see a single card that I consider "sub-par".
Couple of considerations, just "maybe" stuff.
Reya - I ended up taking her out of mine (after a long time and some whining). She's so great as a game-ender with Debtor's Knell, but most of the time, the games were over before she ever came out.
Are you sure about leaving Angel of Despair out? I understand what you're saying, but I run her before Reya these days, especially since Mimic Vat hit the scene. She just destroys people with the vat.
You're very heavy on the sweepers, but I assume that's a justified meta-call. But with all you're other removal, you've got probably more than you'll ever need. You might look to making a little deck space in that area. and you've got pretty insane amounts of card draw, you could clear a little space there without losing anything, I think.
Tutors... You've got a pretty good tutoring suite anyway, but have you looked at Dimir House Guard? A sac outlet as a creature, or transmute him to fetch Grave Pact, or one of your sweepers. Or... looking at your list a little closer, Dimir Machinations might be a really good tutor in there. Doubles as disruption, fetches lots of your combo pieces, mimic vat, vindicate, or Teysa if she gets tucked. Those cards have done a lot better for me lately than Liliana.
One other thing you might consider is Necromancer's Covenant, great grave hate and lots of little black lifelinker zombies for Teysa to abuse. At this point though with the deck though, it's hard to find stuff to take out.
And maybe Yawgmoth's Will.
If you find you're wanting more mana, check out Eternal Dragon. He cycles early for land and recurs himself later as a beater (or more lands), and is a good self-recurring sac target to trigger grave pact. Darksteel Ingot and Coalition Relic are always good for extra mana accel/fixing that act as the occasional Armageddon insurance (mostly a meta call). Land Tax is always a mana bomb in multiplayer.
I'd probably sub these, and why: (but again, not that I see anything wrong with your build, it's great, this would just be my own personal prefs):
- Liliana - You can afford to trade the slow tutoring for faster and more versatile transmute cards.
- Reya - Semi wincon with others, but really late game and you've got plenty of others.
- Nevs Disk - Lots of sweepers already
- Syphon Mind - Lots of draw already, and new disruption options available.
- Conqueror's Pledge - Expensive tokens, you've got plenty of
- Day of Judgment - Lots of sweepers already
- Kjeldoran Outpost - Lots of token producers already, can use the spot to improve manabase
+ Angel of Despair - targeted anything removal, beater, wincon with vat
+ Dimir Machinations - tutoring for wincon pieces and disruption, plus Teysa recovery
+ Eternal Dragon - early mana help, beater, self-recurring sac target, armageddon insurance
+ Darksteel Ingot - accel/fixing, armageddon insurance
+ Coalition Relic - accel/fixing, armageddon insurance
+ Dimir House Guard - Sac outlet, tutor
+ Yawgmoth's Will - Game winning card advantage/recursion
+ maybe Land Tax - Massive mana ramp
I feel that this would give you much more mana and some armageddon insurance (and you do have some big mana bombs in there so lots of mana will always help), better tutoring for specific needs/answers, and another near auto-win, and even stronger beatdown options without noticeably harming your removal, draw, or token producing suites.
Banner by Nakamura, Thanks!
EDH Math
EDH Decks:
Ghost Council: The Magic Mafia of Orzhova
BB Drana: Down with the Sickness
Rasputin: Reality is Broken
Vish Kal Bleeder: Bloody Kisses
Teysa, Orzhov Dominatrix
Stonebrow: Breaking Things
BWR Kaalia Punisher: Heaven's on Fire
Grimgrin: Dead Reckoning
The large amount of sweepers are mostly to make sure I hit one. This is meant to be a mass multiplayer deck (6 people or more), so I want to make sure that I hit my board wipes. While it can be detrimental to me, it's more detrimental to my opponents, oftentimes. However, I might take out some of them for a bit more mana acceleration through some artifacts.
I suppose my main reason for running board wipes is because I'm never quite sure about the meta. I want the deck to be powerful, yet flexible, since I like to take my decks to parties and play with new faces.
I might just have to cut Liliana for Machinations. That's going to do me a lot more good, since the game-winning combo revolves around Teysa, and I want to be able to dig for her, if necessary. Liliana is so often just a 5cc tutor, in which case I might as well run Diabolic. :/
I'm really like Necromancer's Covenant. Gives me yet another reason to run Graverobber in pursuit of grabbing Nighteyes and his shenanigans. However, on a second look at it, it's only creature cards. As much as I like the card, I think it's a no go.
As much as I like Yawgmoth's Will, I don't think I'll run it. I don't know that I agree with using such powerful cards against my friends. They tend to hate Spikes away from the table (though this deck has a lot of Spike cards in it). And I don't think Eternal Dragon is necessary. He recurs himself, yeah, but there's plenty of recursion already, along with plenty of beaters.
And I did consider Land Tax. But I didn't think it really had a place in the deck. This deck isn't THAT mana hungry.
I've made the following changes to the deck:
-1 Reya Dawnbringer
-1 Liliana Vess
+1 Angel of Despair
+1 Dimir Machinations
Legacy: UB(R/G) Storm UB(R/G)
Vintage: UBG Gush Storm UBG
My Teysa Deck packs more token producers and focuses more on her first ability. It includes Cloudstone Curio, and creatures like Marsh Flitter, Captain of the Watch, and Mobilization to keep a board presence with fewer cards invested.
I'd also consider running fewer nonbasics, and including Thawing Glaciers and Journeyer's Kite.
Note, my suggestions tend to assume a multiplayer environment, so your mileage may vary.
My Friend Code is: 0146-9645-8893
Some of the lands you mentioned are interesting, but I don't think they're quite deserving of spots. Terrain Generator is nice in getting lands on the board, but this is EDH, where slow games reign supreme. If I have lands in hand, there's likely a problem as it is, anyways. Phyrexian Tower is a guaranteed sacrifice outlet. I'll probably try to see if I can squeeze it into the list. And Springjack Pasture feels too janky to really get a slot. :/
Spawning Pit is nice, but I don't think it would get a spot over any other sac outlet. Yeah, it makes more. So does Teysa, and in greater numbers.
I'm well aware of the power that Necropotence offers. However, I honestly like the feel of Phyrexian Arena much more. I actually like DRAWING cards, not waiting for them to come into my hand later. Necropotence just isn't my style of card, I guess.
Evangelize seems risky. However, it could be another win condition with Phyrexian Altar.
I am a big fan of Promise of Power. I've been trying to squeeze it into the list, but to no avail. I'm definitely still trying to find something to remove for it, though.
As for the mana artifacts you mentioned, I've also been looking for spots for those. And I'm assuming you meant Akroma's Vengeance, not Akroma's Wrath?
Legacy: UB(R/G) Storm UB(R/G)
Vintage: UBG Gush Storm UBG
Legacy: UB(R/G) Storm UB(R/G)
Vintage: UBG Gush Storm UBG
RDW
:symb::symg::symw: Harvester Pod :symw::symg::symb:
~EDH/Commander~
:symb::symg::symw: Teneb, the Harvester :symw::symg::symb:
:symg::symw::symu: Rafiq of the Many :symu::symw::symg:
:symw::symu: Sygg, River Guide :symu::symw:
L1 Judge
Saffi
Eldric
Gogo Godo Voltron
Azusa 1v1 viable
Zedru the Greathearted
Reaper King
EDH 1v1:
Azami Lady of the CA
Momir Vig Combo
I played the deck physically five times, and won all five times. All five were 3 player EDH.
Game 1. Managed to draw a tutor I added that lets me search my library for X cards. I chose 2 for X and got Blasting Station and darkest hour. Did infinite damage around turn 6-7.
Game 2. Drew elspeth, controlled the game until I could make all my creatures indestructible, then won by purely beating him to death.
Game 3. (Personal favorite.) A friend on the board established himself as a threat early. It was apparent his deck was a near ramp blue deck with one of those mono-blue planeswalker commanders. He had a tutelage on the field, and solely targeted me. I had Teysa out turn 3 and put out a divinity of pride turn 5, and come my turn 6, I drew Sorin Markov, put him out, put his life total to 10, and then swung for 10 exactly. Then, against my other friend, I simply got Sun Titan to get my darkest hour back from my graveyard, and beat him to death.
Game 4. Infinite mana combo using phyrexian altar and darkest hour. I chose infinite for X on Exsanguinate and then my other friend quit. We had a good laugh about it, my friends don't get salty, and i'm very fortunate for that.
Game 5. My one friend has a commander that lets him gain 2 life a turn even while inside the command zone. He then had a card that doubles his life gain, with a divinity of pride on *his* field from his own deck. I played the card that whenever he would gain life, he loses that might life, few turns later used Sorin to put him to ten, and then used condemn on their divinity of pride.