Just wanted to post my Prime Speaker Deck to maybe get some opinions on it. There are two themes going on in the deck with a bit of interplay between them.
The second theme is much less important, but it's handsize matters/card draw. Psychosis Crawler, Overbeing of Myth, even Lorescale Coatl. These cards aren't crazy important for the flicker theme, but they all love Prime Speaker.
Looks very similar in theme to my Zegana deck, actually. *see sig*
Have a look at it, maybe you can find some ideas.
One thing I'd like to really recommend, though, is more ways to eliminate your max hand size. Praetor's Counsel and Tamiyo, the Moon Sage are both feasible options for this, if you can keep Tamiyo protected.
Looks very similar in theme to my Zegana deck, actually. *see sig*
Have a look at it, maybe you can find some ideas.
One thing I'd like to really recommend, though, is more ways to eliminate your max hand size. Praetor's Counsel and Tamiyo, the Moon Sage are both feasible options for this, if you can keep Tamiyo protected.
I actually looked over your list numerous times when putting mine together!
I'm really torn on ways to increase my hand size though. I feel like Tamiyo and Counsel are to slow overall. But I do have a few ideas that I'll get into further down this post!
Predator Ooze is cool, but it might take a bit too long for it to get going, and even then, it being indestructible isn't that much of an advantage in EDH with all the exiling going on.
How the heck did I forget Tolaria West? It's literally exactly what I was looking for! I'm not to keen on Venser's Journal though. I think it's just a bit to overcosted, but you did remind me of expedition map! I think it, along side Tolaria West and Fabricate (to tutor for the map if need be) should be enough ways to get Reliquary Tower. If not, I might consider running Sylvan Scrying also.
You might be right about Predator Ooze. I really want him to work though! He might come out for Sakashima the Imposter though. I originally didn't add her simply because I didn't want to load up with to many clone effects, but I guess it can't hurt.
I am curious why you would recommend Sphinx of Uthuun over Chancellor of the Spires. They don't really fill the same roll at all. Chancellor just has to many abusive things he can do with other people's graveyards if you flicker him. Now I will possibly consider Sphinx of Uthuun to replace Consecrated Sphinx once I play test him a bit (and once I get my hands on one!).
Thanks to both of you for all the advice! You actually helped me a ton! I will be updating the OP to reflect these changes! Argh now I really can't wait for the last few cards to come so I can play test this beast!
My Zegana deck is so different than most people's not sure if I can give you any advice. I aim to win with Tidespout Tyrant combo whenever possible, this looks aiming to win through creature or general damage. I use a lot of "cheat creatures into play" effects:
Finally tested the deck a bit more and made a few changes to it.
Cards Cut:
Overbeing of Myth: He felt a bit slow, often times being an easily killed Howling Mine. He works ok with Zegana, but nothing crazy. In the end if I wanted a big beasty I'd go for Simic Sky Swallower or something instead.
Lightning Greaves and Swiftfoot Boots: Both were kind of meh. With so many flicker effects it became a hassel to try and keep Swiftfoot boots on the priority targets. Overall I think they aren't needed. The game winning combos usually land all in the same turn and will get shut down in response to the equip activate either way.
Cards Added:
Phyrexian Ingester: I just wanted to try him out. I think more removal is needed, and he's great with the blink effects. He's at worse a big beater. Depending on how he works out I might try Duplicant as well, or in his place. Just have to wait and see.
Crop Rotation: I noticed I ran into 2 problems with Zegana. Some times I just didn't want to cast her and draw cards because I was just going to have to discard. Other times I would be comboing off and blinking her over and over and hoping and praying I'd get my Reliquary Tower before I was done, and just not finding it or not being able to get it into play to prevent a massive discard. This will hopefully go a good ways to preventing that. I might also try Sylvan Scrying at some point.
Rhystic Study: I wanted to try this out. It doesn't really fit any particular theme other than good stuff, but I'm hoping it will work as a good way to help speed me up and slow others down. We shall see.
-1 Phyrexian Ingester
+1 Draining Whelk
Ingester wasn't bad persay, I just think the Whelk gives more flexibility. If I'm going to play something that isn't anything more than an inherently big creature, I want as much versatility as possible.
-1 Predator ooze
+1 Farhaven Elf
The ooze never really fit, as others have said. I finally dropped him. Farhaven gives more ramp which I really want, more etb to abuse, another pod sac fodder, and can chump for a turn against some of the faster decks I play against.
-1 Deranged Hermit
+1 Venser, Shaper Savant
I really like the Hermit, he actually won me a few games with Craterhoof, and he was always good against faster aggro decks. But a lot of times he felt like a burden to play early, since it would eat up my whole next turn just to keep him around. Also, having to pay echo every upkeep just so I can keep him around to abuse his ETB effect wasn't very fun. Venser is taking his spot because I want something that can be blinked easier, but can be used for tempo if I need it.
I'm considering making room for Precursor Golem, as he really fits what I wanted Deranged Hermit to do, I just don't have one yet, and don't know if it would be worth cutting Venser for him. I'm going to give it a bit more testing and see if I really want the token producer in here.
Any help is still greatly appreciated guys! Thanks!
Perhaps a Tezzeret the Seeker or Trinket Mage toolbox can be added to speed up ramp or allow you to get maximum hand size alot quicker. Trinket Mage at least falls into the blinkable theme.
As for Sphinx of Uthuun arguement why not remove Diluvian Primordial I've always seen him as an finite blinking since he exiles, while Chancellor of the Spires can re-use them repeatedly.
I'm not sure what your budget is like, but I'm really liking Tawnos's Coffin in my list.
I have the same problem with needing Reliquary Tower and not being able to find it. I've been considering Library of Leng as a pseudo-second copy since it's fetchable with Trinket Mage and it does a little more than Spellbook.
Lastly, I'll suggest Thragtusk. It works with both your themes, and sets up a nice turn 6 Zegana even if it gets killed.
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The first theme is the major one, abusing EtB effects. Ghostly Flicker, Birthing Pod, Conjurer's Closet, and Deadeye Navigator all support the theme, but there are a few other smaller effects in their, with clone effects, Genesis, TnN, even Evacuation.
The second theme is much less important, but it's handsize matters/card draw. Psychosis Crawler, Overbeing of Myth, even Lorescale Coatl. These cards aren't crazy important for the flicker theme, but they all love Prime Speaker.
1 Prime Speaker Zegana
Creatures
1 Coiling Oracle
1 Phantasmal Image
1 Eternal Witness
1 Fierce Empath
1 Lorescale Coatl
1 Farhaven Elf
1 Wood Elves
1 Yavimaya Elder
1 Archaeomancer
1 Mystic Snake
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Wickerbough Elder
1 Wonder
1 Acidic Slime
1 Body Double
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Genesis
1 Mnemonic Wall
1 Draining Whelk
1 Psychosis Crawler
1 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
1 Brutalizer Exarch
1 Consecrated Sphinx
1 Deadeye Navigator
1 Avenger of Zendikar
1 Chancellor of the Spires
1 Diluvian Primordial
1 Sylvan Primordial
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
1 Crop Rotation
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Pongify
1 Rapid Hybridization
1 Worldly Tutor
1 Counterspell
1 Cyclonic Rift
1 Flash
1 Beast Within
1 Dissipate
1 Ghostly Flicker
1 Hinder
1 Krosan Grip
1 Spell Crumple
1 Cryptic Command
1 Evacuation
1 Spin into Myth
Sorcery
1 Cultivate
1 Fabricate
1 Kodama's Reach
1 Rite of Replication
1 Bribery
1 Boundless Realms
1 Tooth and Nail
Enchantment
1 Rhystic Study
1 Expedition Map
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Sol Ring
1 Mimic Vat
1 Birthing Pod
1 Conjurer's Closet
Planeswalker
1 Garruk, Primal Hunter
Land
1 Breeding Pool
1 Flooded Grove
12 Forest
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Hinterland Harbor
14 Island
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Yavimaya Coast
1 Tolaria West
Any advice would be greatly appreciated! I am still waiting on some of the cards, but I'll update once I get some play testing done. Thanks!
Change Log
3/23
-1 Deadwood Treefolk
-1 Island
+ 1 Expedition Map
+ 1 tolaria West
4/06
-1 Overbeing of Myth
-1 Swiftfoot Boots
-1 Lightning Greaves
+1 Rhystic Study
+1 Phyrexian Ingester
+1 Crop Rotation
4/15
-1 Phyrexian Ingester
-1 Deranged Hermit
-1 Predator Ooze
+1 Farhaven Elf
+1 Draining Whelk
+1 Venser, Shaper Savant
Have a look at it, maybe you can find some ideas.
One thing I'd like to really recommend, though, is more ways to eliminate your max hand size. Praetor's Counsel and Tamiyo, the Moon Sage are both feasible options for this, if you can keep Tamiyo protected.
I actually looked over your list numerous times when putting mine together!
I'm really torn on ways to increase my hand size though. I feel like Tamiyo and Counsel are to slow overall. But I do have a few ideas that I'll get into further down this post!
How the heck did I forget Tolaria West? It's literally exactly what I was looking for! I'm not to keen on Venser's Journal though. I think it's just a bit to overcosted, but you did remind me of expedition map! I think it, along side Tolaria West and Fabricate (to tutor for the map if need be) should be enough ways to get Reliquary Tower. If not, I might consider running Sylvan Scrying also.
You might be right about Predator Ooze. I really want him to work though! He might come out for Sakashima the Imposter though. I originally didn't add her simply because I didn't want to load up with to many clone effects, but I guess it can't hurt.
I am curious why you would recommend Sphinx of Uthuun over Chancellor of the Spires. They don't really fill the same roll at all. Chancellor just has to many abusive things he can do with other people's graveyards if you flicker him. Now I will possibly consider Sphinx of Uthuun to replace Consecrated Sphinx once I play test him a bit (and once I get my hands on one!).
Thanks to both of you for all the advice! You actually helped me a ton! I will be updating the OP to reflect these changes! Argh now I really can't wait for the last few cards to come so I can play test this beast!
For you I would add maybe Farseek and Sakura-Tribe Elder for a bit more ramp. I would also suggest Regrowth and Snapcaster Mage for reuse.
Cards Cut:
Overbeing of Myth: He felt a bit slow, often times being an easily killed Howling Mine. He works ok with Zegana, but nothing crazy. In the end if I wanted a big beasty I'd go for Simic Sky Swallower or something instead.
Lightning Greaves and Swiftfoot Boots: Both were kind of meh. With so many flicker effects it became a hassel to try and keep Swiftfoot boots on the priority targets. Overall I think they aren't needed. The game winning combos usually land all in the same turn and will get shut down in response to the equip activate either way.
Cards Added:
Phyrexian Ingester: I just wanted to try him out. I think more removal is needed, and he's great with the blink effects. He's at worse a big beater. Depending on how he works out I might try Duplicant as well, or in his place. Just have to wait and see.
Crop Rotation: I noticed I ran into 2 problems with Zegana. Some times I just didn't want to cast her and draw cards because I was just going to have to discard. Other times I would be comboing off and blinking her over and over and hoping and praying I'd get my Reliquary Tower before I was done, and just not finding it or not being able to get it into play to prevent a massive discard. This will hopefully go a good ways to preventing that. I might also try Sylvan Scrying at some point.
Rhystic Study: I wanted to try this out. It doesn't really fit any particular theme other than good stuff, but I'm hoping it will work as a good way to help speed me up and slow others down. We shall see.
-1 Phyrexian Ingester
+1 Draining Whelk
Ingester wasn't bad persay, I just think the Whelk gives more flexibility. If I'm going to play something that isn't anything more than an inherently big creature, I want as much versatility as possible.
-1 Predator ooze
+1 Farhaven Elf
The ooze never really fit, as others have said. I finally dropped him. Farhaven gives more ramp which I really want, more etb to abuse, another pod sac fodder, and can chump for a turn against some of the faster decks I play against.
-1 Deranged Hermit
+1 Venser, Shaper Savant
I really like the Hermit, he actually won me a few games with Craterhoof, and he was always good against faster aggro decks. But a lot of times he felt like a burden to play early, since it would eat up my whole next turn just to keep him around. Also, having to pay echo every upkeep just so I can keep him around to abuse his ETB effect wasn't very fun. Venser is taking his spot because I want something that can be blinked easier, but can be used for tempo if I need it.
I'm considering making room for Precursor Golem, as he really fits what I wanted Deranged Hermit to do, I just don't have one yet, and don't know if it would be worth cutting Venser for him. I'm going to give it a bit more testing and see if I really want the token producer in here.
Any help is still greatly appreciated guys! Thanks!
As for Sphinx of Uthuun arguement why not remove Diluvian Primordial I've always seen him as an finite blinking since he exiles, while Chancellor of the Spires can re-use them repeatedly.
Thanks to Rivenor at Miraculous Recovery Signatures for this sick sig.
UGMomir Vig, Simic VisionaryUG
URBNicol BolasURB
BGWGhave, Fungus TribalBGW
WUBSydri, Galvanic GeniusWUB
Horde
Hydra Horde
I have the same problem with needing Reliquary Tower and not being able to find it. I've been considering Library of Leng as a pseudo-second copy since it's fetchable with Trinket Mage and it does a little more than Spellbook.
Lastly, I'll suggest Thragtusk. It works with both your themes, and sets up a nice turn 6 Zegana even if it gets killed.