I almost put Kagemaro in, and I should just try him. I find myself emptying my hand at times though and I'm not sure I want to fuss with him. Experiences?
Reiver Demon not here is a meta call. Wydwen, Sharuum, Ghave, Lyzolda, and Ghost Council all make regular appearances.
I think my one copy of Disciple was in another deck. It needs to be here. Reforge next if I still need more.
I like Urza's Incubator more than Belbe's Portal for a tribal enabler, but I think I'm a little demon-lite for either one. Sneak Attack is my baby.
How are you liking Maga? I don't have one, but I'm tempted. Considering how big I've gotten Black Market before... someone would probably just die and then I'd have a huge beater. Such a cool card.
Maga, Traitor to Mortals is awesome. He can easily one-shot players, then turn around and kill another. Rakdos' Paincast reduces his X cost, so it is quite easy to play Maga for 10+.
I'd also suggest Knollspine Dragon for even more ways to draw cards. Rakdos really needs to refill his hand and frequently, because you need to keep putting pressure on the board. When they wipe, you need more bombs to drop down. Its balls to the walls as soon as they find out who you are playing.
Promise of Power is another on-theme card that draws you cards. Sure, you can't reduce the cost but it is invaluable to just Draw 5 after your army gets wiped, with or without the Demon token.
Pretty good. There's a lot of cards here that I haven't thought of. Staff of Nin looks particularly sweet. Also counting up your mana curve, it seems like a fairly safe approach. I count only 3 cards at 7cc plus. It's basically saying that you're not going to rely on Rakdos, but you still get a big boost from him when he does connect. That might be the best way. You can still hardcast your deck early enough with 7 mana rocks and plenty of land.
I suppose the fundamental question is how "all-in" you want your deck's plan to be. I'd be interested in hearing your experiences with Kaalia. It seems like you've played her a lot more than I have. My experience with Kaalia was that it led me to playing creatures that I would never play otherwise. Iona, Rune-Scarred, now Avacyn and Koko, maybe only a few others, and then Kaalia-only stuff like Rakdos the Defiler - I would have played those effects in a normal deck, but not really any of the other ADD's. So then the deck just often fails to close the deal even when it works, because the stuff you're playing isn't interactive. I guess my point is that the potential up-side of going for broke is a lot higher than that here. Rakdos can play Myojins, Blightsteel, Eldrazi, etc, which are the kinds of cards that break games when they're allowed to live for even one turn, and have lots of survivability besides. That considered, there's the popular observation that these decks only have one plan. You're either able to execute it and win, or you don't and lose. I'm not sure if that's true or not, but I would just naturally lean more toward the going for broke plan, just because I might as well. Of course, there are other avenues though.
That said, I'm not sure how many Rakdos enablers and direct damage dealers you should be running. Probably fewer. You're running a bit more than I do in my current version, which leans more heavily on Rakdos. My current theory on enablers is the fewer the better. I've found that only the ones that let you cast Rakdos are worth it, and those just designed to make the pre-combat discount better are best done away with. Rakdos' attack damage itself is usually enough to satisfy all of the mana my hand can eat. Basically, I don't run the mana-intensive direct damage anymore. Exsanguinate, Suffer the Past, Comet Storm, Rakdos' Return, Banefire, etc. You can cast all of these for X = 1, but it's hard to justify the card in that case. It's possible that Suffer the Past and Rakdos' return are worth it at X = 1, but I'm not sure. I do like Bitterblossom because it doubles as Forcefield, the Skeleton and Squee are ok for the same reason, and even Goblin Assault is fine if you're running Skullclamp, like you are. I run Pilgrim's Eye instead of a land, and then a couple others that draw me a card, my favorite of which is Dusk Urchins because its delay goes so well with the Wheel effects. I love Piranha Marsh and Geth's Verdict. Along their same vein, I really, really like Smallpox and [c]Pox[/x]. I can't see Smallpox as anything less than strictly better than Verdict in this deck. Some of these are good for one Rakdos play, others are good for through the course of the game. With tutors and draw, you usually get one, then there's the option of letting Rakdos go to the grave after that if nothing else is forthcoming.
On that point, I really like Diabolic Servitude, Coffin Queen, and Strands of Night on top of the Mimic Vat and others you already have. Options that put the creatures onto the battlefield allow you to bin or Vat Rakdos himself when convenient. Servitude is just premium, and this deck can survive through Strands as long as it's making creature plays, which it will as long as Strands is out. It is hard to keep it going though. But basically, it's hard to have too much reanimate in this deck, I've found. It basically works as your mana engine. For that matter, I have not been playing mana artifacts other than Gilded Lotus for quite some time in Rakdos, but on this I'm not entirely sure I should or not.
Another big point is whether Haste is good in this deck. I've been thinking more that it's not. It's good to give haste to Rakdos, but that's about all. Any other creature that benefits from haste cannot get the benefit from Rakdos' discount, unless there's some sort of non-creature, pre-combat enabler. And I'm not sure that a benefit that's at its best when your deck is on plan B is good enough in a deck whose plan B is not that good. There are varying opinions on that though. Hastey Rakdos himself is quite good, especially at 4 mana. It will probably lead to you being able to case at least one thing from you hand. And haste is quite good with Sorcery speed reanimation, of which there is some. Vedalken Orrery is in another category. It can.. sometimes work as an enabler for Rakdos. After all, people do have fetch lands. But, people will often save them until the end of your turn, giving everyone a shot at killing Rakdos with a Sorcery. And it definitely does have a huge chilling effect on play when it hits and Rakdos is in your command zone. It's a bit of a dream that players will attack each other and allow you to cast Rakdos and discounted creatures, since they will just attack you or do nothing.
Awesome analysis.... thank you very much for taking the time to write it up.
I never did get a rush Kaalia deck to work. Part of that is our playgroup plays too tightly to allow for it. They're used to land destruction and are prepared for it. My various iterations of Kaalia decks usually won late game, and usually with recursion working for me.
I've only played this Rakdos list twice, not expecting it to win, and both times I was surprised by how quickly I filled up the table with threats. I think I do want to play the vomit out demons game for plan A, and recur them for plan B, so tuning the deck to do that is where I want to go. The X spells are in there because I was expecting to have my creature base blown out and figured they would be flexible options to, yes, cast for 1 on probably turn 4 or 5, for more as removal since I'm pretty light on removal, and ultimately for the kill with Black Market or just lands when lives are low at the end. I've played enough games where the person who won only had 3 life left that even Lightning Bolt is worth having in hand later in the game.
So as written, I stocked the deck with direct damage in addition to creature damage. From playing it, I found what you suggested, which is that you need to inflict damage to play Rakdos, and then Rakdos does the rest for you as long as he sticks. I also found, as you mentioned, that I ended up with the potential to cast more creatures without more to cast. I'll probably sub in Maga for one of the X spells, as Rakdos makes him an X spell, and I just got my It That Betrays, which would make the Pox cards even better.
I appreciate your suggestion of Pilgrim's Eye. Such a good card. Flying blocker, replaces itself with whatever land you need, pings for one to activate Rakdos. Great.
I had Coffin Queen on the table when building the deck. I'm not sure why she didn't make it in. So good with Sneak Attack. You obviously like Diabolic Servitude. I have a copy I got with the Graveborn set and wasn't impressed on first reading. The cost with the exile clause makes me hesitate. Corpse Dance is more expensive with the buyback, but with a sac outlet you can keep up the dance.
Vedalken Orrery is probably the one haste-like card I'd keep after dumping the others. Whether it's Bitterblossom or someone not blocking a Solemn so someone else doesn't get a card, I rarely see a once around the table without someone paying life for something. And if they deliberately withhold play because of Orrery, then I'm ahead and I'll ping them another way. I'll probably keep the Greaves, but In the Web of War is just overkill, and probably Fervor as well.
The exile clause of Servitude can sometimes be played around with Tortured Existence, Phyrexian Reclamation, Doomed Necromancer, etc. The clause says "when X dies, exile it" rather than "exile it instead". Which means that the card will be in the grave when the trigger is on the stack, then it can be targeted and saved. Some of this reanimation goes really well with the rest, and with Sneak Attack. And a lot of it is good too against cards like Phyrexian Furnace because you can respond to abilities that target your cards. The big issues with Corpse Dance are that you don't get to choose (very critical for utility creatures), it's mana-intensive, and you might be shorter on sacrifice outlets than you are on Reclamation-type effects (matters for Dawn of the Dead too). I'm not sure that these synergize that well with the rest of the deck, which is probably why it's cut from your list.
On haste, a few cards I'm running make me think about it more. Doomed Necromancer and Coffin Queen specifically. Turning them in to a Torrent of Souls might be worthwhile, especially the Necromancer, which has been almost as good as Servitude for me, since it can be reanimated, Vatted or Sneak Attacked itself. The card I'd use for Haste would probably be Anger. Fetchable with Buried Alive, and it might sometimes enable your first Rakdos cast also. Greaves is solid as well, since having creatures messed with is something you want to avoid too.
Also, I wanted to suggest a few more enablers that maybe you haven't considered. One, Blind Zealot. It basically works as a telegraphed Geth's Verdict, but it is easier on mana when casting Rakdos since you won't have to wait until BBBBRR. Gatekeeper of Malakir and Nekrataal get honorable mention, but I've dropped them because of problems like not working with Sneak Attack and reanimate, not being able to target black, not having evasion, and not always being playable on time for value. Blind Zealot seems custom built for this deck though, good early, good late, and often worth reanimating. Filth is another one I have tried. It's fairly reliable for allowing Rakdos' first cast, and sometimes the later evasion is useful, especially when you drop Urborg. Stronghold Rats is also among my favorites. I'm always looking for good discard outlets when my deck is so high cc and reanimate-heavy, and this one is useful for everything it does. Unblockable for getting in that initial Rakdos cast, and it's quite pesky and disruptive otherwise.
For that matter, I continually waffle about how large of a place discard should have in this deck. I saw that you already have Squee and Goblin Matron as a tutor for him, adding Buried Alive makes the deck very resilient to symmetrical discard effects. And since they're already there, it's pretty clear that they're good otherwise. Symmetrical discard like Rats and Liliana of the Veil also allow good early use of Reanimation. Those two I am pretty sold on, but I continually waffle on whether Necrogen Mists, Cunning Lethemancer, Gibbering Descent and such should make the cut. On the one hand, they are excellent global disruption while enabling this deck rather than hurting it, but on the other they are decidedly anti-synergistic with Wheel effects. And Wheel effects are just so indispensable to this deck.
Yes. That card is ridiculous with the Welder. I think what I'll probably do is free up some slots by dropping a couple of X spells, and then have those be 'rotating fatty slots'. Then Wurmcoil can relieve It That Betrays when the eldrazi wants to take a breather.
"Some of the other guys dared me to go out, but I knew it weren't no ordinary giant giga-blasting blaze of unending flames that would scorch the whole world."
—Norin the Wary
I just wanted to point out that you should NEVER, EVER vat your commander as you run the risk of never seeing them again.
I wouldn't say never, ever. It kind of depends on the situation. Where you have creatures on the board and control a sacrifice outlet, there's no risk. It can depend on your hand also, how close you are to winning or losing the game, and what vatting your Commander allows you to do. I would still quite rarely Vat Rakdos, but if all I have in hand is fat, no more land, no draw and the game is close to being over, it's good to remember it as an option.
Besides, most decks in most games will only play their commander a few times at most, usually no more than twice. And Rakdos is much harder to cast than the normal Commander. I would most of the time rather Vat Rakdos when facing a situation where I can't cast him in the foreseeable future.
I wouldn't say never, ever. It kind of depends on the situation. Where you have creatures on the board and control a sacrifice outlet, there's no risk. It can depend on your hand also, how close you are to winning or losing the game, and what vatting your Commander allows you to do. I would still quite rarely Vat Rakdos, but if all I have in hand is fat, no more land, no draw and the game is close to being over, it's good to remember it as an option.
Besides, most decks in most games will only play their commander a few times at most, usually no more than twice. And Rakdos is much harder to cast than the normal Commander. I would most of the time rather Vat Rakdos when facing a situation where I can't cast him in the foreseeable future.
This is an interesting point. It IS a risky play, but in order to play Magic, you have to take risks anyways. One of the fun aspects of a deck like this is playing a little recklessly. People get so focused on value engines, getting the most out of a card, not risking/protecting their permanents. I think it's why pillowfort is so popular and people try to figure out an impermeable defense in EDH. I'd rather take risks, make plays that could potentially lose me the game, and then sit there and watch the rest of the game then just sit there and watch the entire game from behind my pillowfort. I'm not trying to turn this into a anti-pillowfort discussion, rather I'm riffing off the idea that abandoning the generally good strategy of not sticking your general in something like Mimic Vat could win you a game.
I think of a recent game where I had a Wheel of Fortune in hand and 6 other really good cards. A Ghave combo player had just tutored twice, and I knew he was looking for his combo, and I started trying to figure out how to disrupt the combo. When he played it, I wasn't able to. But I had the chance. Yeah I would've wheeled my awesome hand, but I was going to lose anyways.
The best play in most situations isn't necessarily the best play in a particular situation.
Nice Rakdos deck.. I'm trying to build one myself and I got some interesting ideas looking through your deck list. I'd suggest that you use Scuttlemut instead of Alloy Myr since Scuttlemut's color changing ability can avoid "protection from red/black" nasty cards (same CC, one extra ability). I'd also think about adding cards such as Honden of Infinite Rage and/or Lobber Crew (CC=3, right before you can play Rakdos), though these cards aren't generaly good they make sense in a Rakdos deck IMO. As for the rest, it looks pretty solid.
Nice Rakdos deck.. I'm trying to build one myself and I got some interesting ideas looking through your deck list. I'd suggest that you use Scuttlemut instead of Alloy Myr since Scuttlemut's color changing ability can avoid "protection from red/black" nasty cards (same CC, one extra ability). I'd also think about adding cards such as Honden of Infinite Rage and/or Lobber Crew (CC=3, right before you can play Rakdos), though these cards aren't generaly good they make sense in a Rakdos deck IMO. As for the rest, it looks pretty solid.
I actually need to update this list to the current build, which I'll do presently.
Scuttlemutt is an easy replacement. Nice suggestion.
I've had the red Honden and Lobber Crew in the maybe pile. I originally had a lot more ways to activate Rakdos, but haven't had as much trouble activating him as I initially though I would. There are just enough 3 CMC or less creatures and ways to deal 1 damage that it happens pretty consistently.
My favorite Rakdos enabler is actually Lightning Bolt. So flexible. Basically a 1 mana ritual after Rakdos is out. And the game where the +1/+1 counter guy plopped down a Spike Weaver was decided by me bolting his worm off the table.
As far as Cryptic Gateway and other cards that actually take advantage of tribal synergies, if I have two demons on the battlefield.... I'm probably swinging with them rather than tapping to cheat in a third, and most likely I'm playing my hand for free thanks to Rakdos or Sneak Attack. I keep thinking I should include some card that takes advantage of the tribaly synergy, but the real reason I have a bunch of demons in here is because they're fat flyers, and they're rad.
This deck has done surprisingly well. Sure it gets shut down sometimes, but it also plops down 4 to 5 6/6 or bigger flyers by turn 5 other times. I always have fun playing the deck, regardless of whether I'm winning or not.
My favorite play so far with this deck: I had played an It That Betrays for free after attacking with Rakdos and something else. Then I tapped Coffin Queen putting Prime Speaker Zegana into play from an opponents graveyard, drawing 13 cards.
If you're building a version of this deck, make card draw a priority. As soon as you actually get the deck working, your hand will be empty. Dragon Mage and Knollspine Dragon are almost autoincludes. Another brilliant include that I got from Justice1337 is Balthor the Defiled. Talk about a reanimation card made for this deck.
Focuses more on discard and disruption than mine, but is quite well-designed.
EDIT: One other thing.... looking to add Decree of Pain because last game I was wanting another wrath when I tutored and there wasn't one there. Might drop one of the tutors for it, but any suggestions for a cut?
1 Rakdos, Lord of Riots
Demons/On Theme
1 Blood Speaker
1 Desecration Demon
1 Ob Nixilis, the Fallen
1 Bloodgift Demon
1 Nefarox, Overlord of Grixis
1 Lord of the Void
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Dread Cacodemon
1 Master of Cruelties
Haste
1 Lightning Greaves
Little Value Dudes
1 Scuttlemutt
1 Leaden Myr
1 Iron Myr
1 Pilgrim’s Eye
1 Goblin Matron
1 Squee, Goblin Nabob
1 Rummaging Goblin
1 Blind Zealot
1 Viashino Heretic
1 Solemn Simulacrum
Other Utility Beaters
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Godo, Bandit Warlord
1 Mikaeus, the Unhallowed
1 Flayer of the Hatebound
1 It That Betrays
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
1 Necromancy
1 Living Death
1 Mimic Vat
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Coffin Queen
1 Balthor the Defiled
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
1 Artisan of Kozilek
Direct Damage/Sacrifice
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Bitterblossom
1 Geth's Verdict
1 Sign in Blood (also draw)
Draw
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Reforge the Soul
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Skullclamp
1 Dragon Mage
1 Knollspine Dragon
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Disciple of Bolas
1 Moriok Replica
Utility
1 Sneak Attack
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Chaos Warp
1 Liliana of the Dark Realms
1 Vandalblast
1 Decree of Pain
1 Black Market
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Expedition Map
1 Talisman of Indulgence
1 Rakdos Keyrune
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Gilded Lotus
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Dragonskull Summit
1 Badlands
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Blood Crypt
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Spinerock Knoll
1 Command Tower
1 Graven Cairns
1 Piranha Marsh
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Strip Mine
1 Arid Mesa
1 Marsh Flats
9 Mountain
10 Swamp
WUBRG Some of these decks can actually win games...WUBRG
How I know I should build a deck:
Some notable demons you left out: Kagemaro, First to Suffer and Reiver Demon. I personally like them over Nefarox for instance.
I also think any Rakdos deck has the tendency to overextend, so card draw is really important. If you ever feel light on cards you could add Memory Jar, Uba Mask, Reforge the Soul or Disciple of Bolas.
And you could add Belbe's Portal with all your demons.
BRGWTana and TymnaBRGW
RTeneb, the EternalR
UBRNekusar, Mind RazerUBR
Rakdos, Lord of Riots
BGWGhave, Guru of SporesBGW
Aurelia, the Warleader
BDrana, Kalastria BloodchiefB
WBROros, the AvengerWBR
I almost put Kagemaro in, and I should just try him. I find myself emptying my hand at times though and I'm not sure I want to fuss with him. Experiences?
Reiver Demon not here is a meta call. Wydwen, Sharuum, Ghave, Lyzolda, and Ghost Council all make regular appearances.
I think my one copy of Disciple was in another deck. It needs to be here. Reforge next if I still need more.
I like Urza's Incubator more than Belbe's Portal for a tribal enabler, but I think I'm a little demon-lite for either one. Sneak Attack is my baby.
How are you liking Maga? I don't have one, but I'm tempted. Considering how big I've gotten Black Market before... someone would probably just die and then I'd have a huge beater. Such a cool card.
As you know, Rakdos is just a blast to play.
WUBRG Some of these decks can actually win games...WUBRG
How I know I should build a deck:
I'd also suggest Knollspine Dragon for even more ways to draw cards. Rakdos really needs to refill his hand and frequently, because you need to keep putting pressure on the board. When they wipe, you need more bombs to drop down. Its balls to the walls as soon as they find out who you are playing.
Promise of Power is another on-theme card that draws you cards. Sure, you can't reduce the cost but it is invaluable to just Draw 5 after your army gets wiped, with or without the Demon token.
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs
I suppose the fundamental question is how "all-in" you want your deck's plan to be. I'd be interested in hearing your experiences with Kaalia. It seems like you've played her a lot more than I have. My experience with Kaalia was that it led me to playing creatures that I would never play otherwise. Iona, Rune-Scarred, now Avacyn and Koko, maybe only a few others, and then Kaalia-only stuff like Rakdos the Defiler - I would have played those effects in a normal deck, but not really any of the other ADD's. So then the deck just often fails to close the deal even when it works, because the stuff you're playing isn't interactive. I guess my point is that the potential up-side of going for broke is a lot higher than that here. Rakdos can play Myojins, Blightsteel, Eldrazi, etc, which are the kinds of cards that break games when they're allowed to live for even one turn, and have lots of survivability besides. That considered, there's the popular observation that these decks only have one plan. You're either able to execute it and win, or you don't and lose. I'm not sure if that's true or not, but I would just naturally lean more toward the going for broke plan, just because I might as well. Of course, there are other avenues though.
That said, I'm not sure how many Rakdos enablers and direct damage dealers you should be running. Probably fewer. You're running a bit more than I do in my current version, which leans more heavily on Rakdos. My current theory on enablers is the fewer the better. I've found that only the ones that let you cast Rakdos are worth it, and those just designed to make the pre-combat discount better are best done away with. Rakdos' attack damage itself is usually enough to satisfy all of the mana my hand can eat. Basically, I don't run the mana-intensive direct damage anymore. Exsanguinate, Suffer the Past, Comet Storm, Rakdos' Return, Banefire, etc. You can cast all of these for X = 1, but it's hard to justify the card in that case. It's possible that Suffer the Past and Rakdos' return are worth it at X = 1, but I'm not sure. I do like Bitterblossom because it doubles as Forcefield, the Skeleton and Squee are ok for the same reason, and even Goblin Assault is fine if you're running Skullclamp, like you are. I run Pilgrim's Eye instead of a land, and then a couple others that draw me a card, my favorite of which is Dusk Urchins because its delay goes so well with the Wheel effects. I love Piranha Marsh and Geth's Verdict. Along their same vein, I really, really like Smallpox and [c]Pox[/x]. I can't see Smallpox as anything less than strictly better than Verdict in this deck. Some of these are good for one Rakdos play, others are good for through the course of the game. With tutors and draw, you usually get one, then there's the option of letting Rakdos go to the grave after that if nothing else is forthcoming.
On that point, I really like Diabolic Servitude, Coffin Queen, and Strands of Night on top of the Mimic Vat and others you already have. Options that put the creatures onto the battlefield allow you to bin or Vat Rakdos himself when convenient. Servitude is just premium, and this deck can survive through Strands as long as it's making creature plays, which it will as long as Strands is out. It is hard to keep it going though. But basically, it's hard to have too much reanimate in this deck, I've found. It basically works as your mana engine. For that matter, I have not been playing mana artifacts other than Gilded Lotus for quite some time in Rakdos, but on this I'm not entirely sure I should or not.
Another big point is whether Haste is good in this deck. I've been thinking more that it's not. It's good to give haste to Rakdos, but that's about all. Any other creature that benefits from haste cannot get the benefit from Rakdos' discount, unless there's some sort of non-creature, pre-combat enabler. And I'm not sure that a benefit that's at its best when your deck is on plan B is good enough in a deck whose plan B is not that good. There are varying opinions on that though. Hastey Rakdos himself is quite good, especially at 4 mana. It will probably lead to you being able to case at least one thing from you hand. And haste is quite good with Sorcery speed reanimation, of which there is some. Vedalken Orrery is in another category. It can.. sometimes work as an enabler for Rakdos. After all, people do have fetch lands. But, people will often save them until the end of your turn, giving everyone a shot at killing Rakdos with a Sorcery. And it definitely does have a huge chilling effect on play when it hits and Rakdos is in your command zone. It's a bit of a dream that players will attack each other and allow you to cast Rakdos and discounted creatures, since they will just attack you or do nothing.
Anyway, I'll write a bit more later.
I never did get a rush Kaalia deck to work. Part of that is our playgroup plays too tightly to allow for it. They're used to land destruction and are prepared for it. My various iterations of Kaalia decks usually won late game, and usually with recursion working for me.
I've only played this Rakdos list twice, not expecting it to win, and both times I was surprised by how quickly I filled up the table with threats. I think I do want to play the vomit out demons game for plan A, and recur them for plan B, so tuning the deck to do that is where I want to go. The X spells are in there because I was expecting to have my creature base blown out and figured they would be flexible options to, yes, cast for 1 on probably turn 4 or 5, for more as removal since I'm pretty light on removal, and ultimately for the kill with Black Market or just lands when lives are low at the end. I've played enough games where the person who won only had 3 life left that even Lightning Bolt is worth having in hand later in the game.
So as written, I stocked the deck with direct damage in addition to creature damage. From playing it, I found what you suggested, which is that you need to inflict damage to play Rakdos, and then Rakdos does the rest for you as long as he sticks. I also found, as you mentioned, that I ended up with the potential to cast more creatures without more to cast. I'll probably sub in Maga for one of the X spells, as Rakdos makes him an X spell, and I just got my It That Betrays, which would make the Pox cards even better.
I appreciate your suggestion of Pilgrim's Eye. Such a good card. Flying blocker, replaces itself with whatever land you need, pings for one to activate Rakdos. Great.
I had Coffin Queen on the table when building the deck. I'm not sure why she didn't make it in. So good with Sneak Attack. You obviously like Diabolic Servitude. I have a copy I got with the Graveborn set and wasn't impressed on first reading. The cost with the exile clause makes me hesitate. Corpse Dance is more expensive with the buyback, but with a sac outlet you can keep up the dance.
Vedalken Orrery is probably the one haste-like card I'd keep after dumping the others. Whether it's Bitterblossom or someone not blocking a Solemn so someone else doesn't get a card, I rarely see a once around the table without someone paying life for something. And if they deliberately withhold play because of Orrery, then I'm ahead and I'll ping them another way. I'll probably keep the Greaves, but In the Web of War is just overkill, and probably Fervor as well.
Thanks again.
WUBRG Some of these decks can actually win games...WUBRG
How I know I should build a deck:
On haste, a few cards I'm running make me think about it more. Doomed Necromancer and Coffin Queen specifically. Turning them in to a Torrent of Souls might be worthwhile, especially the Necromancer, which has been almost as good as Servitude for me, since it can be reanimated, Vatted or Sneak Attacked itself. The card I'd use for Haste would probably be Anger. Fetchable with Buried Alive, and it might sometimes enable your first Rakdos cast also. Greaves is solid as well, since having creatures messed with is something you want to avoid too.
Also, I wanted to suggest a few more enablers that maybe you haven't considered. One, Blind Zealot. It basically works as a telegraphed Geth's Verdict, but it is easier on mana when casting Rakdos since you won't have to wait until BBBBRR. Gatekeeper of Malakir and Nekrataal get honorable mention, but I've dropped them because of problems like not working with Sneak Attack and reanimate, not being able to target black, not having evasion, and not always being playable on time for value. Blind Zealot seems custom built for this deck though, good early, good late, and often worth reanimating. Filth is another one I have tried. It's fairly reliable for allowing Rakdos' first cast, and sometimes the later evasion is useful, especially when you drop Urborg. Stronghold Rats is also among my favorites. I'm always looking for good discard outlets when my deck is so high cc and reanimate-heavy, and this one is useful for everything it does. Unblockable for getting in that initial Rakdos cast, and it's quite pesky and disruptive otherwise.
For that matter, I continually waffle about how large of a place discard should have in this deck. I saw that you already have Squee and Goblin Matron as a tutor for him, adding Buried Alive makes the deck very resilient to symmetrical discard effects. And since they're already there, it's pretty clear that they're good otherwise. Symmetrical discard like Rats and Liliana of the Veil also allow good early use of Reanimation. Those two I am pretty sold on, but I continually waffle on whether Necrogen Mists, Cunning Lethemancer, Gibbering Descent and such should make the cut. On the one hand, they are excellent global disruption while enabling this deck rather than hurting it, but on the other they are decidedly anti-synergistic with Wheel effects. And Wheel effects are just so indispensable to this deck.
Speaking of which, you should definitely run Reforge the Soul, Dragon Mage and Knollspine Dragon.
Play it for free when Rakdos swings. It gains you life so you can keep up with phyrexian arena, bloodgift demon and Phyrexian Reclamation.
and you're already playing goblin welder.
Thanks to Numotflame96 for avatar and sig!
At first I hurped, then I durped.
LOL, I got banned cause I'm a Pirate, yar the pirate life is for me!
Yes. That card is ridiculous with the Welder. I think what I'll probably do is free up some slots by dropping a couple of X spells, and then have those be 'rotating fatty slots'. Then Wurmcoil can relieve It That Betrays when the eldrazi wants to take a breather.
Thanks for the suggestion.
WUBRG Some of these decks can actually win games...WUBRG
How I know I should build a deck:
I just wanted to point out that you should NEVER, EVER vat your commander as you run the risk of never seeing them again.
Cockatrice Username: seriph0
I wouldn't say never, ever. It kind of depends on the situation. Where you have creatures on the board and control a sacrifice outlet, there's no risk. It can depend on your hand also, how close you are to winning or losing the game, and what vatting your Commander allows you to do. I would still quite rarely Vat Rakdos, but if all I have in hand is fat, no more land, no draw and the game is close to being over, it's good to remember it as an option.
Besides, most decks in most games will only play their commander a few times at most, usually no more than twice. And Rakdos is much harder to cast than the normal Commander. I would most of the time rather Vat Rakdos when facing a situation where I can't cast him in the foreseeable future.
This is an interesting point. It IS a risky play, but in order to play Magic, you have to take risks anyways. One of the fun aspects of a deck like this is playing a little recklessly. People get so focused on value engines, getting the most out of a card, not risking/protecting their permanents. I think it's why pillowfort is so popular and people try to figure out an impermeable defense in EDH. I'd rather take risks, make plays that could potentially lose me the game, and then sit there and watch the rest of the game then just sit there and watch the entire game from behind my pillowfort. I'm not trying to turn this into a anti-pillowfort discussion, rather I'm riffing off the idea that abandoning the generally good strategy of not sticking your general in something like Mimic Vat could win you a game.
I think of a recent game where I had a Wheel of Fortune in hand and 6 other really good cards. A Ghave combo player had just tutored twice, and I knew he was looking for his combo, and I started trying to figure out how to disrupt the combo. When he played it, I wasn't able to. But I had the chance. Yeah I would've wheeled my awesome hand, but I was going to lose anyways.
The best play in most situations isn't necessarily the best play in a particular situation.
WUBRG Some of these decks can actually win games...WUBRG
How I know I should build a deck:
Might want to consider Cryptic Gateway, it works like a champ in my Sliver EDH.
Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief
Sliver Overlord
The Mimeoplasm
Norin, the Wary as inspired by Gaka!
I actually need to update this list to the current build, which I'll do presently.
Scuttlemutt is an easy replacement. Nice suggestion.
I've had the red Honden and Lobber Crew in the maybe pile. I originally had a lot more ways to activate Rakdos, but haven't had as much trouble activating him as I initially though I would. There are just enough 3 CMC or less creatures and ways to deal 1 damage that it happens pretty consistently.
I might put Lobber Crew in though as I can find it with Goblin Matron.
My favorite Rakdos enabler is actually Lightning Bolt. So flexible. Basically a 1 mana ritual after Rakdos is out. And the game where the +1/+1 counter guy plopped down a Spike Weaver was decided by me bolting his worm off the table.
As far as Cryptic Gateway and other cards that actually take advantage of tribal synergies, if I have two demons on the battlefield.... I'm probably swinging with them rather than tapping to cheat in a third, and most likely I'm playing my hand for free thanks to Rakdos or Sneak Attack. I keep thinking I should include some card that takes advantage of the tribaly synergy, but the real reason I have a bunch of demons in here is because they're fat flyers, and they're rad.
This deck has done surprisingly well. Sure it gets shut down sometimes, but it also plops down 4 to 5 6/6 or bigger flyers by turn 5 other times. I always have fun playing the deck, regardless of whether I'm winning or not.
My favorite play so far with this deck: I had played an It That Betrays for free after attacking with Rakdos and something else. Then I tapped Coffin Queen putting Prime Speaker Zegana into play from an opponents graveyard, drawing 13 cards.
If you're building a version of this deck, make card draw a priority. As soon as you actually get the deck working, your hand will be empty. Dragon Mage and Knollspine Dragon are almost autoincludes. Another brilliant include that I got from Justice1337 is Balthor the Defiled. Talk about a reanimation card made for this deck.
You can check out his build here:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=448888
Focuses more on discard and disruption than mine, but is quite well-designed.
EDIT: One other thing.... looking to add Decree of Pain because last game I was wanting another wrath when I tutored and there wasn't one there. Might drop one of the tutors for it, but any suggestions for a cut?
WUBRG Some of these decks can actually win games...WUBRG
How I know I should build a deck: